Traffickers 'made $3m' on Italy ship

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30669136

Police in Italy believe traffickers made some $3m (£1.9m; €2.5m) from 359 illegal migrants found abandoned on a cargo ship in the Mediterranean.

OK 3,000,000/359=8356.545 if the passengers have managed to save up that much money, why are they still taking such a risk when you consider that $8000 is a lot of money where they come from and can provide for a comfortable living.

Are they just greedy or what?

The Peanut

I would have considered traffickers to be far more morally sound than that.

Atlantic Dawn

I have doubts on the €8k figure too, if they had that kind of cash would they not just get a tourist visa, fly in and stay in Italy with the cash being used as proof they have money for their holiday.

RobYourBuilder

EU residency and eventually citizenship is the jackpot.

●Free movement throughout the 28 member states.
●Easier visa processes for non EU western countries(America, Canada, Australia etc.)
●Free or heavily subsidised education.
●Child benefit.
●Much more job opportunities and the chance to earn a much higher wage.
●Social housing.
●Free medical care.
●A much higher standard of living for you and your family.
●If you get status, then you can bring over your family through EU family reunification directives.
●Welfare.

If they get in, it's the best risk they will ever take and best eight large they will ever spend.

Tail Docker

Everyone knows Police fiscal estimates are hugely optimistic. They base them on their own past experiences of guaranteed return for their efforts. That's the Public Sector for you.

hfallada

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

I have doubts on the €8k figure too, if they had that kind of cash would they not just get a tourist visa, fly in and stay in Italy with the cash being used as proof they have money for their holiday.

But they wont be allowed in Italy with a tourist visa. They would have to apply for it, unlike Europeans who can get visas no problem. No embassy official is going to give most of these people a holiday visa, as the risk of them staying is too high.

I have meet some Eastern Europeans in Ireland who have gotten passports from the Russian Mafia to enter Ireland. As they know they wont get a tourist visa to Ireland. They were given the passports and in return they would have to repay €6k to the Russian mafia at home.

The Peanut

The Peanut wrote: »

I would have considered traffickers to be far more morally sound than that.

I'm sure that you omitted the /sarc from that.


The sad fact is that the traffickers are only there because people are willing to risk everything for "a better life".

The real dilemma is for Europe to decide what to do with the migrants when they arrive.

Let them in, only to be followed by boatloads more.
or....?

RobYourBuilder

170,000 entered Italy by boat in the last 14 months. Italy has a youth unemployment rate of 43%. Obviously, this cannot continue. Time to take a leaf out of the Australians book and stop the boats.

keith16

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

EU residency and eventually citizenship is the jackpot.

●Free movement throughout the 28 member states.
●Easier visa processes for non EU western countries(America, Canada, Australia etc.)
●Free or heavily subsidised education.
●Child benefit.
●Much more job opportunities and the chance to earn a much higher wage.
●Social housing.
●Free medical care.
●A much higher standard of living for you and your family.
●If you get status, then you can bring over your family through EU family reunification directives.
●Welfare.

If they get in, it's the best risk they will ever take and best eight large they will ever spend.

You forgot free buggies at every bus stop.

jaymcg91

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

170,000 entered Italy by boat in the last 14 months. Italy has a youth unemployment rate of 43%. Obviously, this cannot continue. Time to take a leaf out of the Australians book and stop the boats.

I agree, they seem to be arriving in Italy and Greece literally by the boatload. I understand the humanitarian arguments but at the same time, those two countries and the EU as a whole is starting to buckle under the weight of mass migration.

I'm just curious to know when and if someone will do something about this rapidly escalating situation, or if we'll continue this trend of being accused of being racist when someone makes a valid argument about already scarce resources etc (I don't have a racist bone in my body, if you're here legally i couldn't give a **** what color you are or where you're from, you deserve a chance like everybody else).

RobYourBuilder

keith16 wrote: »

You forgot free buggies at every bus stop.

Nice attempt at trying to be funny to gain a few internet points. Nothing in what I said was untrue. Nothing. The things I mentioned are available.

As for buggies;

Deputy Joan Burton:  ] Persons who consider they have an entitlement to a special needs payment should contact the local social welfare officers administering the scheme.

I have set out a table that shows the total amount spent in the past two years on adult and child clothing, religious ceremonies, prams, buggies and cots. The table may be helpful to the Deputy. It also shows the average payments.

http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/Debates%20Authoring/DebatesWebPack.nsf/takes/dail2013030500012

10,942 got money towards buggies in 2011 and 9,413 did so in 2012. You can add to that to the list if you want, but I'd file it under welfare. If you think anything I've posted on that list is factually incorrect, point it out.

jaymcg91

jaymcg91 wrote: »

I'm just curious to know when and if someone will do something about this rapidly escalating situation, or if we'll continue this trend of being accused of being racist when someone makes a valid argument about already scarce resources etc (I don't have a racist bone in my body, if you're here legally i couldn't give a **** what colour you are or where you're from, you deserve a chance like everybody else).

That's one of the dilemmas that we'll all have to face, soon we'll have more and more illegal migrants arriving and when do you say STOP!.

It's not being racist or anything like it, it's more a case of preserving your own lifestyle that would be impoverished if you have to share with too many others.

Paco Rodriguez

[Deleted User] wrote: »

That's one of the dilemmas that we'll all have to face, soon we'll have more and more illegal migrants arriving and when do you say STOP!.

It's not being racist or anything like it, it's more a case of preserving your own lifestyle that would be impoverished if you have to share with too many others.

But they are just undocumented so it's ok

nokia69

Deleted User wrote: »

That's one of the dilemmas that we'll all have to face, soon we'll have more and more illegal migrants arriving and when do you say STOP!.

It's not being racist or anything like it, it's more a case of preserving your own lifestyle that would be impoverished if you have to share with too many others.

this problem is only going to get worse

I read this quote by Gore Vidal the other day and I think we will see Europe reach the same conclusion in a few years

A characteristic of our present chaos is the dramatic migration of tribes. They are on the move from east to west, from south to north. Liberal tradition requires that borders must always be open to those in search of safety, or even the pursuit of happiness. But now, with so many millions of people on the move, even the great-hearted are becoming edgy. Norway is large enough and empty enough to take in 40 to 50 million homeless Bengalis. If the Norwegians say that, all in all, they would rather not take them in, is this to be considered racism? I think not. It is simply self-preservation, the first law of species

the social justice warriors will never admit it, but the number of people from the middle east and Africa who want to live in Europe is just to many

efb

Some people here probably see Nigel Farage as a hero

efb

Deleted User wrote: »

That's one of the dilemmas that we'll all have to face, soon we'll have more and more illegal migrants arriving and when do you say STOP!.

It's not being racist or anything like it, it's more a case of preserving your own lifestyle that would be impoverished if you have to share with too many others.

Impoverished or slightly diminished???

Where would we be as a nation without the billions the EU gave us in aid??? Imagine if Germany had said no?
Waiting for bailed out German banks argument

Rhys Essien

RobYourBuilder wrote: »

170,000 entered Italy by boat in the last 14 months. Italy has a youth unemployment rate of 43%. Obviously, this cannot continue. Time to take a leaf out of the Australians book and stop the boats.

Thats a bit ironic from Australia considering there would be no Australia without boat loads of immigrants.

Dont forget the millions of Irish who left on boats over the last few hundred years for Canada,US,Britain and Aus.Who the fcuk are we to tell any population in desperation that they shouldnt be left in nowhere.

nokia69

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Thats a bit ironic from Australia considering there would be no Australia without boat loads of immigrants.

Dont forget the millions of boatloads of Irish over the last few hundred years left for Canada,US,Britain and Aus.Who the fcuk are we to tell any population in desperation that they shouldnt be left in nowhere.

who are we ?

we are the people who have lived in this part of the world for thousands of years, it belongs to us, and if we decide for any reason that we want to close the door then thats our right

FloatingVoter

PM me €5000 and I will sail you to the Aran Island of your choice. Swimming gear is optional but advisable.

Rhys Essien

nokia69 wrote: »

who are we ?

we are the people who have lived in this part of the world for thousands of years, it belongs to us, and if we decide for any reason that we want to close the door then thats our right

My point is that if we the Irish had nowhere to go throughout the centuries then we were fcuked.Its estimated that during the year of 1847 alone (black 47 as it is known) there were 250,000 people left Ireland.

People have every right to head for a better safer life.

nokia69

Rhys Essien wrote: »

People have every right to head for a better safer life.

they do

and we have every right to say go somewhere else

COYVB

nokia69 wrote: »

we are the people who have lived in this part of the world for thousands of years, it belongs to us

No, we're people who happened to be born in a certain place at a certain time. It's not ours, it's a bit of rock on a big ball floating in space. Borders should be closed to none but criminals

RobYourBuilder

Rhys Essien wrote:

Thats a bit ironic from Australia considering there would be no Australia without boat loads of immigrants.

Do you think that Australia should allow in anyone and everyond who reaches their shores?

Rhys Essien wrote: »

My point is that if we the Irish had nowhere to go throughout the centuries then we were fcuked.Its estimated that during the year of 1847 alone (black 47 as it is known) there were 250,000 people left Ireland.

Do you think that we should take in anyone and everyone because of what happened in the past? Basing modern day immigration policy on what happened 170 years ago isn't very practical.

Rhys Essien wrote:

People have every right to head for a better safer life.

And the natives have every right to protect their borders. Do you think Western and Northern European countries have an infinite capacity to absorb immigrants from Africa and the Middle East?

Rhys Essien

Off the top of my head,I would like to see countries like Saudi Arabia,Kuwait,UAE and Qatar who would be fairly under populated and dripping in gold,take in Syrians,Afghans and maybe Palestinian refugees.This would take away the need for them to come to Europe but I suppose with the Islam branch differences (Shia,Sunni etc.) it might not work out.

RobYourBuilder

And Europeans and Islam get on just famously.

nokia69

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Off the top of my head,I would like to see countries like Saudi Arabia,Kuwait,UAE and Qatar who would be fairly under populated and dripping in gold,take in Syrians,Afghans and maybe Palestinian refugees.This would take away the need for them to come to Europe but I suppose with the Islam sect differences (Shia,Sunni etc.) it might not work out.

well the sunnis could go to saudi arabia

and the shia/alawites could go to iran

let the ummah fix the problem

Guy:Incognito

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Thats a bit ironic from Australia considering there would be no Australia without boat loads of immigrants.

.

Yeah, sure they even had to send over a few boats full of little black lads so the settlers had someone to kill and evict from the land.

It's such a joyous thing the Europeans did, bringing life to the uninhabited Mars like continent at the bottom of the world.

Rhys Essien

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Yeah, sure they even had to send over a few boats full of little black lads so the settlers had someone to kill and evict from the land.

It's such a joyous thing the Europeans did, bringing life to the uninhabited Mars like continent at the bottom of the world.

Surely Aus has space for another 100 million.Leave them off with a fishing rod.Plenty kangaroo meat aswell.wheres the problem?.

biko

I don't doubt lefties and righties both want people to be happy.
But since EU cannot handle all the disadvantaged peoples of the world and it seems to be a bad idea to only take the strong or healthy that can make it here, leaving behind no-one to rebuild or fix whatever is wrong in the first place.
Shouldn't the EU focus be on fixing what's wrong in the countries they flee from, and the camps in Jordan/Lebanon etc?

General focus seems to be on refugees fleeing here while no focus is on the fact that foreign aid is reduced to be able to pay for immigration.
For instance asylum offices in Sweden, like West Gotaland, gets more money (from Swedish Aid) than the entire country of Moçambique!
Just imagine what could be done in the 3rd world with all of that money (where everything is a fraction of the price it is in Sweden).

I think the left are more concerned with the feel-good factor of a small immigration rather than the cold economics of it all (which in essence helps more people in their countries).

efb

nokia69 wrote: »

they do

and we have every right to say go somewhere else

Why?

nokia69

efb wrote: »

Why?

because thats how the real world works