Narrow passageway vs wide one

Muckit

whelan2 wrote: »

http://www.farmersjournal.ie/most-watched-irish-farmers-journal-videos-of-2014-170626/

Looking at that suckler slatted shed with the large toe space. I've been thinking about this for a while. I know wide passageways of 14foot+ have been the fashion for a while but feck it's a nuisance for having to fork silage back in.

So I was thinking of moving out barriers and bringing passageway down to 9'6"-10' and putting the space into pen. Have some sort of a barrier to stop them putting their heads out while filling the passage. Then they could reach from each side and very little extra forking in. There was an example of a lad up north in the dairy magazine a few issues back that had done it.

I pens could take 2 extra cattle, but headroom would be reduced. My toe pace would still be less than that in the pic after had it done. Can't see cattle being any dirtier.

What do lads think?

kowtow

Muckit wrote: »

There was an example of a lad up north in the dairy magazine a few issues back that had done it.


What do lads think?

I think I saw that one .. instead of a wide passage and pushing up all the time, have a narrow gap and let two sides of cattle push it to each other.

Brilliant.

trixi2011

Muckit wrote: »

Looking at that suckler slatted shed with the large toe space. I've been thinking about this for a while. I know wide passageways of 14foot+ have been the fashion for a while but feck it's a nuisance for having to fork silage back in.

So I was thinking of moving out barriers and bringing passageway down to 9'6"-10' and putting the space into pen. Have some sort of a barrier to stop them putting their heads out while filling the passage. Then they could reach from each side and very little extra forking in. There was an example of a lad up north in the dairy magazine a few issues back that had done it.

I pens could take 2 extra cattle, but headroom would be reduced. My toe pace would still be less than that in the pic after had it done. Can't see cattle being any dirtier.

What do lads think?

had the lad in the journal not got them moving barriers ?

blue5000

Prefer wide myself, using a sheargrab, just push in what's left of the silage blocks the next day with the grab. I reckon narrow passage+sheargrab+black cattle+dark would be a total disaster.

Could you feed at the outside of the shed, both sides with pens back to back?

Markcheese

What about those tyres that spin on a tine holder on the loader and push in the feed as you drive up the passage - easiest thing ever- ( some one else could probably describe it better)

trixi2011

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FubxVK7aeuo&feature=player_embedded#t=0
How about this

just do it

Angle the top half of your barriers so cattle have greater reach.

5live

Markcheese wrote: »

What about those tyres that spin on a tine holder on the loader and push in the feed as you drive up the passage - easiest thing ever- ( some one else could probably describe it better)

They are great yokes altogether.

I push in 200' of feed in in under 1 and a half minutes with one. The secret in getting a tall enough tire to mount the holder on.

Muckit, if you check Donedeal, there was a guy in Newcastle west making them and they may be making them for 3-point linkages too. I think the link below are the guys i bought from.

http://www.donedeal.ie/silagegrabs-for-sale/silage-pusher/8163800

Mine was c.300 euros a few years back so it would be a hell of a lot cheaper and simpler than moving barriers.

Daniel7740

Widened a passage way here from 9ft to 14ft here this year, only feeding from one side.

Can work the loader on the 7740 in comfort now, and the sprong is nearly made redundant

9ft was grand when we were using older smaller tractors but machinery aint getting smaller so I think you'd be foolish to go narrowing it, better off finding a quicker way of shoving it in imo.

Muckit

blue5000 wrote: »

Prefer wide myself, using a sheargrab, just push in what's left of the silage blocks the next day with the grab. I reckon narrow passage+sheargrab+black cattle+dark would be a total disaster.

Could you feed at the outside of the shed, both sides with pens back to back?

Haven't it fully planned yet but I would be able to have the barrier fully blanked off while I would be filling. Even if I wasn't using sheargrab (which I will be), I would catch heads with the tyres with the proposed narrow passage if it wasn't blanked off.

With my plan, cattle would be eating from the one block or bale from both sides. there would be no need to angle the tractor to get it closer to the barrier. The passageway would be basically like going back to the principles and basic design of the ring feeder. You never had to get into a ring feeder to fork the silage closer to the cattle. Now we have sheds with wide passageways and twice the work. It's madness the more I think about it.

I don't want to be using a grape or a tractor at all on the second day. If they get looked at that's about it. It's a time and efficiency measure more than anything else. Also will make the most use of the shed without having to build a new shed.

A wide passage is dead space as far as I'm concerned. If you park a tractor in it it gets covered in brown film of sh*t and is only helping it rot.

Muckit

Daniel7740 wrote: »

9ft was grand when we were using older smaller tractors but machinery aint getting smaller so I think you'd be foolish to go narrowing it, better off finding a quicker way of shoving it in imo.

You've gave me another excellent idea there. If I cut out the blocks and left them side by side at the door, I could use the 135 (is she even 6'?) with a link box to shove them back along a narrow passage as I think they would get it tight to reach one from both sides.

More than one way to skin a cat!!

Zr105

Muckit wrote: »

You've gave me another excellent idea there. If I cut out the blocks and left them side by side at the door, I could use the 135 (is she even 6'?) with a link box to shove them back along a narrow passage as I think they would get it tight to reach one from both sides.

More than one way to skin a cat!!

That to me would be 1 step forwards 2steps back... Cut 2 blocks, get off one tractor into the other, shove them back, back out and into other tractor.... That would get old quick...

howdee

Forget about narrow passageways, they are a thing of the past designed around a 135 Massey. I have 3 passageways here a 14ft one feeding a both sides, a 12ft one feeding at one side and a 16ft one feeding at both sides. To be honest I think they are all to narrow and at a minimum you would want 14-16 foot to comfortably drive down through the passageway with a block of silage at either side.

Morris Moss

We've a 7.5 foot passage here with cows on both sides and it's a disaster, tractor has inches to spare on either side, when the cows eat the silage they can reach I've to come along with a folk and throw it into them, we put in a wide passage earlier this year and we find it a lot easier, just push in silage with the grab when they need it, hopefully in a few years we'll change the narrow one to a wide one.

lefthooker

Sounds to me like a retrograde step to give yourself hardship. The cost of a silage pusher/tyre yoke (€300-400) vs altering pens or feed passage€??????

Widened the passage at home 3yr ago from 9ft to 14ft, max I could go. Got a local chap to make me a wedge for the loader,€400. Drive up the 100ft passage pushing silage to both sides in 30 seconds. No spronging at all.

Give up the sprong and buy a pusher for the tractor

Fuxake

What do lads be thinking of!!! Whats all this spronging? Use the loader to push in the silage. If you're any way able to drive a loader at all you should be able to put precision silage in as good as if it was done by a diet feeder. Come back in the evening and give it a quick push in, again with loader. Ideal option for shoving in silage is a wide bucket on a loader (eg 8ft) but smaller will do. And it can be used for loads of other things unlike the tyres gizmo which I just can't fathom. Total time to do 4 bays both sides 1-2 minutes in the evening. Morning time can put in enough precision chop for 200 head in less than an hour with no diet feeder and no bollixing with a fork. But here's the thing- our passages are 14 foot and I can work them, but another 1-2 feet would be a deluxe job altogether. 9 foot passage is a recipe for disaster and a crocked back by the age of 40. Please please don't go there.

eric prydz

blue5000 wrote: »

Prefer wide myself, using a sheargrab, just push in what's left of the silage blocks the next day with the grab. I reckon narrow passage+sheargrab+black cattle+dark would be a total disaster.

Could you feed at the outside of the shed, both sides with pens back to back?

The next shed I build il be feeding that way and just have a overhang over to silage instead of having to roof a expensive passageway.
I wouldn't be inclined either to narrow a passageway just make up something like a snow plough and push in the 2 sides at once.

Muckit

At least I provoked a bit of debate with my hair-brained idea!!

Milked out

Have a 11.5 ft feed passage feeding both sides and to be honest this a bollix of a job, can't drive past bales til they are half ate and if you want to go thru it for any other reason you end up driving on silage. If you wanted a narrow passage it would have to be barely the width of the tractor and then put in those moving barriers but I'd stay well clear and have em 16 ft min if I could

just do it

Muckit wrote: »

At least I provoked a bit of debate with my hair-brained idea!!

Are you thinking of building opposite am existing passage?

Muckit

No if I was building again it would be a separate shed. But that will be a few years down the road.

Dunedin

lefthooker wrote: »

Widened the passage at home 3yr ago from 9ft to 14ft, max I could go.

How do you widen an existing passage?

Mine is 9 foot and what a disaster, so would love any ideas as to how I could widen.

howdee

Dunedin wrote: »

How do you widen an existing passage?

Mine is 9 foot and what a disaster, so would love any ideas as to how I could widen.

Turn it into a bedded area and run a feed passage on the outside?

lefthooker

Dunedin wrote: »

How do you widen an existing passage?

Mine is 9 foot and what a disaster, so would love any ideas as to how I could widen.

I had about 3ft from the butt of the feed barrier to the edge of the slat. So dug out the passage and barrier and concrete behind and poured new pads by the tank wall. The trusses were acrowed and the pillars were unbolted and cut off at the ground and moved in around 30 inches to the new pads and bolted down. New passage and barriers poured and all other concrete work. Sounds complicated easy really.

farawaygrass

[quote="Widened the passage at home 3yr ago from 9ft to 14ft, max I could go.[/quote]

How could you wide a passage? Is it a back to back shed? Wouldn't the girders need moving?

cjpm

lefthooker wrote: »

I had about 3ft from the butt of the feed barrier to the edge of the slat. So dug out the passage and barrier and concrete behind and poured new pads by the tank wall. The trusses were acrowed and the pillars were unbolted and cut off at the ground and moved in around 30 inches to the new pads and bolted down. New passage and barriers poured and all other concrete work. Sounds complicated easy really.

farawaygrass wrote: »

How could you wide a passage? Is it a back to back shed? Wouldn't the girders need moving?

You missed the section in bold

st1979

Have 20' passage here. I never feel it's a waste of space. Never use a fork always use tractor with shear grab to push in. 5' grab either side which seems to take up 6' leaves only about the width of tractor clear

ford 5600

st1979 wrote: »

Have 20' passage here. I never feel it's a waste of space. Never use a fork always use tractor with shear grab to push in. 5' grab either side which seems to take up 6' leaves only about the width of tractor clear

I have a 20 ft passage as well between two sheds, 1 4 span slatted other 4 span bedded but only 2 span used for cattle not a bit sorry for leaving it that wide, but you will always regret it if you do the narrow one. A friend called one night when the 2nd shed was at the "back of a fag packet " planning stage and he persuaded me to leave it that wide.plenty of room for turnig tractor to nudge in silage with the grab. I actually welded a piece of 3 inch x 3/8 steel across the front of the top barrel of the tine grab. I run that on the concrete to tighten in the silage. Buy one of those wheel things if you want , but whatever you do , make the passage at least 16 ft, preferably 20 ft.

Count Mondego

We're going to turn into a fat lump of a generation of farmers. Spending 20 minutes forking silage morning and evening is better than the gym. Save yourselves 600 quid a year and fork the fuxkin thing.

Markcheese

Count Mondego wrote: »

We're going to turn into a fat lump of a generation of farmers. Spending 20 minutes forking silage morning and evening is better than the gym. Save yourselves 600 quid a year and fork the fuxkin thing.

You're kinda right - but how many farmers out there have wrecked backs -replaced hips ect - from general pulling and hauling and drudgery -often when there's an easier cheap way ,
If you want exercise, walk the farm to check your grass,and stock . Improve your paddocks (nothing like a fencing sledge to get you fit)

just do it

Count Mondego wrote: »

We're going to turn into a fat lump of a generation of farmers. Spending 20 minutes forking silage morning and evening is better than the gym. Save yourselves 600 quid a year and fork the fuxkin thing.

I would have agreed a year ago but forking silage last winter badly aggravated an injury I picked up playing football the previous May that had settled down. Ended up having an op in September to rectify it.

lefthooker

Spronging is ok when you know no better. Might have cost the price of 10 Darby's but best money ever spent.;););)

Nekarsulm

Cheap pusher I saw on a farm in Holland. Only cost was a few disks, welding rods and a half a dozen bolts.

Bullocks

Count Mondego wrote: »

We're going to turn into a fat lump of a generation of farmers. Spending 20 minutes forking silage morning and evening is better than the gym. Save yourselves 600 quid a year and fork the fuxkin thing.

I don't know , time is too precious to me to be forking unnecessary silage I would prefer to spend these winter evenings inside getting exercised with herself !☺

manjou

Passegeway in old shed is 7foot wide and cattle both sides cows able to reach the middle havent graped silage in years drop line of bales middle and cows clean to middle .Think its a great idea .New shed has wide passageway and end up pushing silage in all the time

delaney001

Count Mondego wrote: »

We're going to turn into a fat lump of a generation of farmers. Spending 20 minutes forking silage morning and evening is better than the gym. Save yourselves 600 quid a year and fork the fuxkin thing.

I never really understand this kind of post. Firstly I'm not sure where 600 comes from. Those wheel pushers are about 300-400, and should if minded, last about 10 years. That's about tops of €50 a year (grease once a year). Secondly, it takes you 40 minutes a day forking, while the tractor man can do it in probably 6 mins max. That's forty minutes your spending on the silage without getting any different return than the man who spends 6. You both end up with the same silage, and both end up with it eaten the very same. Your not getting any special value add for your 40 minutes. Whereas the 6 minutes guy, can go on and do a bit fencing, clean a shed or if he wants go in and sit at the fire.
In my opinion the great farming inventions do the following: save hardship, save time, save your back and do all this relatively inexpensively, with an uncomplicated process. The silage wheel ticks everyone of these boxes.

Count Mondego

delaney001 wrote: »

I never really understand this kind of post. Firstly I'm not sure where 600 comes from. Those wheel pushers are about 300-400, and should if minded, last about 10 years. That's about tops of €50 a year (grease once a year). Secondly, it takes you 40 minutes a day forking, while the tractor man can do it in probably 6 mins max. That's forty minutes your spending on the silage without getting any different return than the man who spends 6. You both end up with the same silage, and both end up with it eaten the very same. Your not getting any special value add for your 40 minutes. Whereas the 6 minutes guy, can go on and do a bit fencing, clean a shed or if he wants go in and sit at the fire.
In my opinion the great farming inventions do the following: save hardship, save time, save your back and do all this relatively inexpensively, with an uncomplicated process. The silage wheel ticks everyone of these boxes.

The 600 quid was gym membership. I wasn't having at anyone here and not a fan of hardship either. If you had a few hundred head to feed then fair enough.

I was digging out a few foundations with for concrete piers in the last two days with my 67 year old father and he's twice as fit as me, which is a disgrace. Working in an office all week doesn't help and small kids means no chance for any kind of fitness. I look forward to forking the silage, building a few walls etc as it's the only exercise I get. Plenty of lads around me never get down off the tractor and I can't understand it, and it's not that the extra efficiency leads to more work from them.

Bitten & Hisses

Having spent my adult life widening 8-foot gaps, replacing 1/2" water pipe and installing more lights and power sockets in sheds, I believe that a narrow feed passage is a step backwards. Narrow passages were fine in the past, but machinery is getting bigger and even with small tractors, you may still find yourself tiptoeing around.
I built a one-sided slatted house a few years back, with the option to add the other side at a later date. My feed passage is 5 metres wide and even now feeding one side only, I don't find it over generous.
As for pikeing in silage by hand, I just don't get it. I can shove in the bales with the bale grab and only need to pike in the last bit on the last day by hand, a 10-minute job for 5 bays.

delaney001

Count Mondego wrote: »

The 600 quid was gym membership. I wasn't having at anyone here and not a fan of hardship either. If you had a few hundred head to feed then fair enough.

I was digging out a few foundations with for concrete piers in the last two days with my 67 year old father and he's twice as fit as me, which is a disgrace. Working in an office all week doesn't help and small kids means no chance for any kind of fitness. I look forward to forking the silage, building a few walls etc as it's the only exercise I get. Plenty of lads around me never get down off the tractor and I can't understand it, and it's not that the extra efficiency leads to more work from them.

Apologies, I misinterpreted what you were saying. And from reading the rest of your reply, there is a lot of logic to what you were saying. Horses for courses is prob the best way to close.

Tail painter

Morris Moss wrote: »

We've a 7.5 foot passage here with cows on both sides and it's a disaster, tractor has inches to spare on either side, when the cows eat the silage they can reach I've to come along with a folk and throw it into them, we put in a wide passage earlier this year and we find it a lot easier, just push in silage with the grab when they need it, hopefully in a few years we'll change the narrow one to a wide one.

I have seen a narrow passageway like yours. The farmer had built a concrete mound running the length of the passageway. When most of the silage was eaten, the remainder just fell down to the cows. No forking. It also kept the tractor in line during feeding, so you couldn't veer off course. He had an old tractor fork with a V shape cut out of it for cleaning out the passage. The only downside was that cows had to be moved out of the shed during feeding to prevent injuries.

Farrell

Tail painter wrote: »

I have seen a narrow passageway like yours. The farmer had built a concrete mound running the length of the passageway. When most of the silage was eaten, the remainder just fell down to the cows. No forking. It also kept the tractor in line during feeding, so you couldn't veer off course. He had an old tractor fork with a V shape cut out of it for cleaning out the passage. The only downside was that cows had to be moved out of the shed during feeding to prevent injuries.

Could always go lockable barriers or some sort of fixture to prevent cows putting out their heads

Deepsouthwest

Farrell wrote: »

Could always go lockable barriers or some sort of fixture to prevent cows putting out their heads

You'd have it piked in the time you'd be opening and closing all lockable barriers!

just do it

You know Muckit I still think the narrow passage is a runner. Sure tractors are getting bigger but ultimately they can only go so wide if they want to be suitable for the road. The main problem with narrow passages that lads are complaining about is they are neither narrow or wide e.g. 9ft to 12ft. The example of one of the posters above with the sloped narrow passage seems solid. And just to give you an idea of the time it takes to lock 4 bays of lockable barriers I timed it earlier - 40secs. Time it took to fluke dose 28 animals locked in with the hook gun - 12 mins. The concrete saved would easily cover the extra cost of the locking barriers. I always have them locked when dropping the silage.

ford 5600

Would you get yourself 4 or 5 45 gallon barrels , position them roughly where the pillars would be, (width of proposed passage). Now drive in and out foddering for a week. See what you think then.

I think you will have most of the barrels 2 inches high....., but at least it will give you an idea , before you make a concrete mistake, and waste money doing it.

just do it

You'd want to make sure the shed is well ventilated

Miname

ive a 12' passage in one of the older sheds. i just drop the blocks tight to the gates but angled backwards on both sides and then on the second day just drive up through them with the loader and they push in each side, without any hassle. never have to fork any major amount bar a bit of bad that builds up along the feed rails every couple of weeks.
In saying that there is nothing as easy as feeding straight in along the barriers of the lean too style sheds. for this i have a lenght of an old telegraph pole that i catch with the teeth of the grab and use it to push in the silage. it takes no time at all and for that reason alone any future sheds will all be lean too style.

just do it

Miname wrote: »

ive a 12' passage in one of the older sheds. i just drop the blocks tight to the gates but angled backwards on both sides and then on the second day just drive up through them with the loader and they push in each side, without any hassle. never have to fork any major amount bar a bit of bad that builds up along the feed rails every couple of weeks.
In saying that there is nothing as easy as feeding straight in along the barriers of the lean too style sheds. for this i have a lenght of an old telegraph pole that i catch with the teeth of the grab and use it to push in the silage. it takes no time at all and for that reason alone any future sheds will all be lean too style.

Lean to here as well as well. Like your idea worth the telegraph pole but a loader for the tractor is way down the priority list at the minute :rolleyes:

Muckit

just do it wrote: »

Lean to here as well as well. Like your idea worth the telegraph pole but a loader for the tractor is way down the priority list at the minute :rolleyes:

Meant to ask you how you stack your bales and is it a nuisance in the winter having to lassoo them?

just do it

Muckit wrote: »

Meant to ask you how you stack your bales and is it a nuisance in the winter having to lassoo them?

Stacked 2 and 3 high. I don't lassoo them, just pull out the edge ones and the top ones topple down.

Farrell

just do it wrote: »

Stacked 2 and 3 high. I don't lassoo them, just pull out the edge ones and the top ones topple down.

Would you not lift the bottom 1 for a bit fun!

just do it

Farrell wrote: »

Would you not lift the bottom 1 for a bit fun!

It was more fun when I'd the 165