My build: i5-4690K & GTX 970, maybe M.2 SSD?

runswithascript

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/user/dusf/saved/nbrwrH

So it includes an unlocked CPU but no aftermarket cooler because it was (and remains) a few hundred over budget. To reduce costs without affecting the CPU and graphics card, I removed the after market cooler and reduced the PSU from 850W to 550W. I will just run the CPU at stock for the moment. I was going to go with an 850W as I might buy a second card for SLI at some point. When I have some extra cash after Christmas I will invest in an aftermarket cooler and only overclock then.

What do you think of the build?

I am most unsure about the RAM and PSU. Are they the best brand and model for the money? How about the RAM frequency, there are lower and higher, I have read it can affect overclocking?

My board supports M.2 SSD, which seem similarly priced, should I be going for one of these instead of the Samsung EVO SSD?

Ninjah Tigah

Problem is, I can't say if it's a good build or not because I'm not sure what components you already have/need. Going for an i7 if the purpose is for gaming isn't exactly beneficial, you're paying much more money for something that only gives a small fps increase. It's similar to going for a gtx 980 over a 970, you're paying a lot more just for a slight increase.

If you could fill out this form, I'll have a look at the build and then see if it's the best for your needs.

1. What is your budget? [€xxx]

2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? [Gaming/Video editing/3D Modelling/HTPC/Internet] (If gaming include which games)

3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [Yes/No]

4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? [Hard drive/DVD Drive/Case/PSU/etc.] (If possible state brand and model of the parts to ensure compatibility)

5. Do you need a monitor? [Yes/No]

5a. If yes, what size do you need. [19'/20'/22'/24'/etc.]

5b. If no, what resolution is your current monitor and do you plan to upgrade in the near future? [1920x1080/1440x900/etc.] [Yes/No]

6. Do you need any of these peripherals? [Keyboard/Mouse/Wireless Card/Card Reader/Speakers/etc.]

7. Are you willing to try overclocking? [Yes/No]

8. How can you pay? [Bank Transfer/Credit Card/Laser]

9. When are you purchasing? [In x days]

10. If you need help building it, where are you based? [South Dublin City/Cork City/Kerry/etc.]

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Problem is, I can't say if it's a good build or not because I'm not sure what components you already have/need. Going for an i7 if the purpose is for gaming isn't exactly beneficial, you're paying much more money for something that only gives a small fps increase. It's similar to going for a gtx 980 over a 970, you're paying a lot more just for a slight increase.

Did you not see the link to the parts at the beginning of the thread? Also, do you not agree that the i7-4790K is the best price to performance, or bang per buck CPU out there?

If you could fill out this form, I'll have a look at the build and then see if it's the best for your needs.

1. What is your budget? [€xxx]

€1200, absolute maximum.

2. What will be the main purpose of the computer? [Gaming/Video editing/3D Modelling/HTPC/Internet] (If gaming include which games)

Gaming and maybe some video editing at some point. All of the latest most popular games, I do not want to be limited.

3. Do you need a copy of Windows? [Yes/No]

Definitely not.

4. Can you use any parts from an old computer? [Hard drive/DVD Drive/Case/PSU/etc.] (If possible state brand and model of the parts to ensure compatibility)

I have some HDDs I could use if needs be, but the SSD should tide me over for the moment.

5. Do you need a monitor? [Yes/No]

No.

5a. If yes, what size do you need. [19'/20'/22'/24'/etc.]

5b. If no, what resolution is your current monitor and do you plan to upgrade in the near future? [1920x1080/1440x900/etc.] [Yes/No]

1920 x 1080. It will mainly be played on a TV but I would like to upgrade to a higher resolution at some point.

6. Do you need any of these peripherals? [Keyboard/Mouse/Wireless Card/Card Reader/Speakers/etc.]

No.

7. Are you willing to try overclocking? [Yes/No]

Yes, but as I have mentioned, to keep costs down I have left out the after market CPU cooler so I will not overclock until I pick one up at a later date.

8. How can you pay? [Bank Transfer/Credit Card/Laser]

CC, PayPal.

9. When are you purchasing? [In x days]

3 days.

10. If you need help building it, where are you based? [South Dublin City/Cork City/Kerry/etc.][/QUOTE]

No.

runswithascript

I think it might be a mistake running this CPU, even at stock, without an after market cooler. I would be interested in any recommendations.

Ninjah Tigah

Oh no, I saw the parts and the i7-4790k is most definitely not the best price/performance if it's for gaming. The i7 offers very little over the top i5 when it comes to gaming as Hyper-threading is not something that's taken advantage of very often in games. Video editing is a completely different, there is a significant advantage to having an i7 if you're doing a lot of video editing. If you're just doing the odd bit of video editing the i5 will still handle it appropriately it's just the i7 is a bit faster.

An argument that's quite common for the i7 is "I'm trying to future proof my computer and I want to have the hyper-threading options." However, that statement is wrong on many levels. First of all, hyper-threading will most likely not become mainstream for games, if games required a six core processor that doesn't mean that a four core processor with hyper-threading will be able to handle that effectively.

Keep in mind also that you'd be paying about 100 euro more for the i7 when you could easily get an after-market cpu cooler to overclock that 4690k like a bat out of hell.

My suggestion for the build would be:

Processor: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Sockel+1150/170310/Intel+Core+i5-4690K+Box%2C+LGA1150.article

Motherboard: http://www.hardwareversand.de/DDR3/166596/ASRock+Z97+Extreme4%2C+Sockel+1150%2C+ATX.article?pvid=4q56m9r7g_i2x7og00&ref=13

Powersupply: http://www.hardwareversand.de/700+-+800+Watt/161173/EVGA+SuperNOVA+750+G2+750W+ATX+2.3%2C+80%2B+Gold.article?pvid=4q078uark_i2x7og00&ref=13

Cpu Cooler: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Intel+AMD/169139/NOCTUA+NH-D15.article?pvid=4q7iqcbrx_i2x7og00&ref=13

Case: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Midi/63729/FRACTAL+DESIGN+Define+R4+Black+Pearl.article?basket.changed=1

RAM: http://www.hardwareversand.de/1600+Low+Voltage/125974/8GB-Kit+Crucial+Ballistix+Sport+Series+DDR3-1600%2C+CL9.article?pvid=4p3uzorcy_i2x7og00&ref=13

SSD: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Solid-State-Disk/169179/Crucial+MX100+SSD+256GB+%282%2C5%2C+7mm%29.article?pvid=4q7k1z0ch_i2x7og00&ref=13

I would recommend buying the Graphics card from Amazon. They're cheaper than hardwareversand.

Link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B00NOP536Y/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1416924109&sr=8-1&keywords=gtx+970&condition=new

To save some money from your purchase I'd put it all through Geizhals and use the vouchers.

Link for Geizhals: www.geizhals.de
How to use: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056907965
Voucher topic: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=90158981

Reasoning behind part-choice.

Processor: As I have said above, the i5-4690k is the best price/performance by far for gaming and it can overclock like a beast if you're lucky.

RAM: As you asked in your OP, Crucial is very reliable.

Graphics card: Gtx 970 should definitely be apart of a build for this price and the Twin Frozr is cheaper than the Gaming G1 atm. However, if you were thinking of overclocking your graphics card, the Gaming G1 is the best for that from what I've heard. - I haven't had a chance to test this.

SSD: The Crucial MX100 is the cheapest from the other options and offers performance extremely close to the more expensive SSD's like the Samsung Evo.

Power-supply: The reason I went for the 750watt is that it fits the budget and you mentioned you were thinking about going for an sli setup. In which case this power-supply will do that for you. Not to mention the cables that come with the power-supply look pretty nice.

Motherboard: I noticed you chose the Extreme6 in the original part list. The reason I went for the Extreme 4 is that unless you need the features of the Extreme6 then there's no point paying for a board with less PCIe lanes(Extreme6 has only 2 PCIe x3.0 lanes), whereas the Extreme4 has 3.

Case: I'm not going to modify that obviously as that's entirely down to your choice.

CPU Cooler: The NH-D15 absolutely demolishes Closed Loop AIO coolers left right and center. Unless you're looking for Aesthetics then the NH-D15 wins for it's amazing price/performance. Even then, I sorta like the look of the NH-D15... Don't ask me why... :P

I realise that buying an expensive cooler is sort of contradictory and makes up the price when you could just get the i7-4790k for a similar price but you mentioned you would be buying a CPU-Cooler anyway.

Also, another thing since you asked it.

I think it might be a mistake running this CPU, even at stock, without an after market cooler. I would be interested in any recommendations.

Well, I say this:

1. Why would you get an overclockable CPU if you're going to be running it at stock anyway. - Different in your situation as it's just a matter of waiting until you can get an aftermarket cooler.
2. Why would they bother giving out cpu coolers if they were useless?

A stock cooler will be able to handle a cpu at stock speeds just fine, so don't worry about that.

If you have any further questions, I'll be happy to answer them. I'm aware you've probably seen a lot of "CHOOSE AN I7, IT'S NEWER SO BETTER FOR GAMING" but you only do that if you are doing video editing everyday or if have more money than sense. :P

runswithascript

Firstly, thanks for the in depth reply.

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Oh no, I saw the parts and the i7-4790k is most definitely not the best price/performance if it's for gaming. The i7 offers very little over the top i5 when it comes to gaming as Hyper-threading is not something that's taken advantage of very often in games. Video editing is a completely different, there is a significant advantage to having an i7 if you're doing a lot of video editing. If you're just doing the odd bit of video editing the i5 will still handle it appropriately it's just the i7 is a bit faster.

An argument that's quite common for the i7 is "I'm trying to future proof my computer and I want to have the hyper-threading options." However, that statement is wrong on many levels. First of all, hyper-threading will most likely not become mainstream for games, if games required a six core processor that doesn't mean that a four core processor with hyper-threading will be able to handle that effectively.

Keep in mind also that you'd be paying about 100 euro more for the i7 when you could easily get an after-market cpu cooler to overclock that 4690k like a bat out of hell.

I just read http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-cpu-review-overclock,3106-6.html and the last line recommends the same as you. I am sold on the i5

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

My suggestion for the build would be:

Processor: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Sockel+1150/170310/Intel+Core+i5-4690K+Box%2C+LGA1150.article

Processor: As I have said above, the i5-4690k is the best price/performance by far for gaming and it can overclock like a beast if you're lucky.

Yes.

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Motherboard: http://www.hardwareversand.de/DDR3/166596/ASRock+Z97+Extreme4%2C+Sockel+1150%2C+ATX.article?pvid=4q56m9r7g_i2x7og00&ref=13

Motherboard: I noticed you chose the Extreme6 in the original part list. The reason I went for the Extreme 4 is that unless you need the features of the Extreme6 then there's no point paying for a board with less PCIe lanes(Extreme6 has only 2 PCIe x3.0 lanes), whereas the Extreme4 has 3.

I am confused on this one. The Extreme 6 is Tomshardware's 'smart buy' of November 2014.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-intel-amd-motherboard,3902.html

To quote the article:

$195.00On Amazon
2014 Smart Buy

Now available for as little as $145, ASRock's Z97-Extreme6 added four SATA 6Gb/s ports, four USB 3.0 ports, dual GbE controllers and selectable dual socketed firmware ROMs to justify entry into its previous $160+ enthusiast class. A low price and trouble-free operation were key factors in its selection for Tom's Hardware Smart Buy status.

This is the only board in its class to offer PCIe 3.0-based Ultra M.2, though using that feature pits Nvidia's eight-lane minimum for SLI against the 16-pathway limit of Intel's LGA 1150-based processors. Then again, it's not like you're actually paying extra to get a faster SSD interface, and it may be more important than SLI to some enthusiasts.

The Extreme 4 was awarded a 2014 approved by Tomshardware's:

Currently priced at $145, our recommendation for ASRock's budget-minded LGA 1150 enthusiast motherboard falls victim to the temporary discount of its features-added Extreme6 sibling this month. The Z97 Extreme4 attempts to compensate for a reduced feature set with exceptional overclocking and broad availability of the platform's integrated features (such as three-way CrossFire and two-way SLI), and those are the things that originally earned it our stamp of approval.

How good was the Z97 Extreme4's overclock? How does 4.6GHz at 1.25V on a Core i7-4770K sound? Or DDR3-2933 with two memory slots populated? Even a full load of four modules reached DDR3-2800 without crashing, so money saved on this product could potentially be put towards better RAM.

I would like the option to SLI at some point and also use M.2 SSDs, if that is best, perhaps even on this build. Can you please explain more why one of the boards is better than the other? You said I would have more PCIe lanes with the Extreme 4, how does this affect me exactly?

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Powersupply: http://www.hardwareversand.de/700+-+800+Watt/161173/EVGA+SuperNOVA+750+G2+750W+ATX+2.3%2C+80%2B+Gold.article?pvid=4q078uark_i2x7og00&ref=13

Power-supply: The reason I went for the 750watt is that it fits the budget and you mentioned you were thinking about going for an sli setup. In which case this power-supply will do that for you. Not to mention the cables that come with the power-supply look pretty nice.

Okay cool, if you are sure it is quality and will do the job if I go SLI in the future. You are sure I would not need 850W? I saw that recommending somewhere, maybe more overkill?

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Cpu Cooler: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Intel+AMD/169139/NOCTUA+NH-D15.article?pvid=4q7iqcbrx_i2x7og00&ref=13

CPU Cooler: The NH-D15 absolutely demolishes Closed Loop AIO coolers left right and center. Unless you're looking for Aesthetics then the NH-D15 wins for it's amazing price/performance. Even then, I sorta like the look of the NH-D15... Don't ask me why... :P

I realise that buying an expensive cooler is sort of contradictory and makes up the price when you could just get the i7-4790k for a similar price but you mentioned you would be buying a CPU-Cooler anyway.

Cool. Is this better than say a Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler or a Seasonic? I see there are some WC coolers, are they much better, and would I need a whole separate WC system to run them? It is always something I could look at in the future too...

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Case: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Midi/63729/FRACTAL+DESIGN+Define+R4+Black+Pearl.article?basket.changed=1

Case: I'm not going to modify that obviously as that's entirely down to your choice.

I am not really pushed on the case, I would prefer a HTPC style case but I don't think the system will fit that form factor. If it has to be an ATX tower I am happy enough once it has good air flow, it is black, and has no Window. I am not adverse to considering other cases, this just seems to be a very popular one. If there is another you think might be better or I might like more please advise.

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

RAM: http://www.hardwareversand.de/1600+Low+Voltage/125974/8GB-Kit+Crucial+Ballistix+Sport+Series+DDR3-1600%2C+CL9.article?pvid=4p3uzorcy_i2x7og00&ref=13

RAM: As you asked in your OP, Crucial is very reliable.

So is 1600 the best speed for me, considering I would like to overclock and SLI at some point? I am not sure if it effects one or both of those. Also, is the Ballistix Sport RAM better than what I have chosen or say Corsair Vengeance? Also, am I better off running dual channel 4GB and 4GB rather than a single 8GB? I was thinking I could get 8GB for now and upgrade with another 8GB when the time comes?

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

SSD: http://www.hardwareversand.de/Solid-State-Disk/169179/Crucial+MX100+SSD+256GB+%282%2C5%2C+7mm%29.article?pvid=4q7k1z0ch_i2x7og00&ref=13

SSD: The Crucial MX100 is the cheapest from the other options and offers performance extremely close to the more expensive SSD's like the Samsung Evo.

Yeah I had come across the MX100 when researching this but the Samsung EVO seemed better. Tomshardware best SSD for the Money November 2014 have the MX100 as the best budget pick, the Evo as the best performance pick. So I guess this is like the choice with the processors, the i7 and Evo are not enough better to justify the extra cost?

What about an M.2 SSD, it is out there and available for similar prices?

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

I would recommend buying the Graphics card from Amazon. They're cheaper than hardwareversand.

Link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B00NOP536Y/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1416924109&sr=8-1&keywords=gtx+970&condition=new

Graphics card: Gtx 970 should definitely be apart of a build for this price and the Twin Frozr is cheaper than the Gaming G1 atm. However, if you were thinking of overclocking your graphics card, the Gaming G1 is the best for that from what I've heard. - I haven't had a chance to test this.

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2014/09/19/nvidia-geforce-gtx-970-review/14

Bit-Tech are recommending the MSI, though they do not even include the G1 in their comparison, if you have something to the contrary please link.

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

To save some money from your purchase I'd put it all through Geizhals and use the vouchers.

Link for Geizhals: www.geizhals.de
How to use: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056907965
Voucher topic: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=90158981

Sweet, thanks for that. I am looking forward to sitting down later this evening and seeing how much can be saved!

Ninjah Tigah

My face when I saw that post. I'll read it in a little bit... Lol

Luck100

All good recommendations above. Tom's is fine for info but don't get hung up on their 'best of' picks. Price plays a big role in their value recommendations so their 'best value' picks don't mean much if prices go up or down due to sales, supply, whatever.

Ninjah Tigah

Luck100 wrote: »

All good recommendations above. Tom's is fine for info but don't get hung up on their 'best of' picks. Price plays a big role in their value recommendations so their 'best value' picks don't mean much if prices go up or down due to sales, supply, whatever.

Thank you for summing up all I was about to say in fewer words.

RAM Question: The crucial ram is great ram, I'd recommend it highly. Having two sticks vs one offers no benefit for gaming. I'll have to go find that link about the whole 'Dual Channel' thing.
- I'll edit my post to include it here:

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

As you'll notice, buying 2x4 is cheaper so it's up to you.

There's no performance increase for your use, it just means if you go for 1x8 that you'll have a free slot but if you add higher frequency ram in the future it'll lower itself to the lowest frequency so there's pretty much no benefit to trying to future proof in that regard.

Also, as I said I'd provide it:



http://www.gamersnexus.net/guides/1349-ram-how-dual-channel-works-vs-single-channel

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nSX2taw-Y4

Case question: A case is entirely the choice of someones appeal. If you were to have a look through the cases and list out the ones you like then I'll have a look through them and pick out the ones with best airflow, space etc.

Motherboard: The Extreme6 is nearly 50 euro more expensive. That is not a value buy in my opinion when you can get the same performance from the Extreme4. The benefits for the Extreme6 are things like thunderbolt port. The Extreme4 offers a m.2 interface too. Unless you're worried about Space I don't really see much of a benefit of using that interface.

SSD: You would notice very very little improvement from going from a Samsung Evo to a MX100. If the Evo was cheaper, yeah, but not until then. :P

Graphics card: The Windforce cooler is better than the Twin Frozr from what I know and I've seen some people get insane overclocks on their Gaming g1 graphics card and comes with a sexy backplate and is binned so offers better overclocking potential. However, it's one big ass card and clearance issues can arise. So for your build I would recommend the Twin frozr since it's cheaper and avoids all of the clearance issues.

runswithascript

So using the vouchers the system works out at a grand total of €1123, which this close to Christmas I can just about afford - I may even have stick to stock CPU speeds and get the Noctua-NHD15 in the new year.

The price quoted from Amazon for the SMI GTX 970 also seems off:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B00NOP536Y/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1416924109&sr=8-1&keywords=gtx+970&condition=new

...that £267 (€337.29) price is under 'offers for this product' which are offers from the Amazon Marketplace, where Amazon acts as an agent, although sometimes strangely for themselves. The main problem here is that it says beside it 'Usually dispatched within 1 to 2 months'. It would seem they are offering this cheaper price but only if prepared to wait.

If you do a regular search for the same string of text:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/MSI-GTX-970-Graphics-Express/dp/B00NOP536Y/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1417005316&sr=8-1&keywords=MSI+NVIDIA+GTX+970+Gaming+Twin+Frozr+HDMI+DVI-I+DP+Graphics+Card+%284GB%2C+PCI+Express%2C+DDR5%2C+256+Bit%29

£287 (€362.53). Same card is €359.90 from Hardwareversand, and seems not to be discounted from Geizhals.

On the card I have been research it and it would seem the G1 is slightly more powerful, the Asus is the most silent, and the MSI is the sweet spot between. I think I would be happy with either the G1 or MSI.

I have a few more questions and I would appreciate if you could help with them.

1) Is there a particular reason you went for Crucial Ballistix Sport over regular Ballistix, Ballistix Tactical, or even Corsair Vengeance, and do you know it to be the best bang for buck RAM at the moment? Also, does what I was saying about opting not to receive dual channel benefits immediately by opting for a single 8GB stick for now, and adding a second later make sense?

2) Is SLI worth it? Regarding 4K, if that is the main or only factor to consider, Initially this box will be hooked up to the main 32" Samsung LED in the living room and/or perhaps an old 720p smaller TV in the bedroom. Some time in the new year I will invest in a 32" or so display for it in the bedroom, maybe €300 - €500. I read last night where someone mentioned that by the time it comes to SLI it will be time to invest in a new card etc. What are you thoughts?

3) I measured last night, and the height of the Fractal Design Define R4 is > 520mm. The only place in the bedroom this could possibly fit is on top of a wooden wardrobe and the clearance is a few millimetres off. There will be a new room available for the box, and the new display, later in the new year, so would I risk damaging air flow etc if for the moment I were to put the case on its side on top of the wardrobe resting on some secured pieces of wood to allow air beneath it?

4) What would you think about this system in a different form factor like Micro ATX or even Mini ATX? I know a new board would be needed and SLI will definitely not work in Mini ITX due to the lack of a second PCI-Express slot and may only just about work in Micro ATX considering heat issues. Is SLI feasible in Micro ATX? Gigabyte have released a Mini ITX GTX 970 though if going the Mini ITX route if I could fit a full sized card I would prefer that.

Ninjah Tigah

Well if you can't afford it, that's completely understandable of course, just use the stock cooler but please don't try to overclock.

If you check you'll notice that the price you linked is also under "offers for this product."
Price: £290.55
Check the third option:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B00NOP536Y/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new

You're best to get it from Amazon instead of another company. There's no strange thing happening. Just economies of scale and such.

1) The others are more expensive and they offer nothing of benefit. :P Also, makes perfect sense. Just make sure you by the same ram.
2) The price of the gtx 970 is so cheap in comparison to the Gtx 980 that it makes 970 sli far more appealing than a single 980. However, if you're playing on a tv then I would be thinking it's time to upgrade to a monitor before you go for SLI. Unless you're going to be playing on a monitor that's at 120hz/144hz there isn't much point in going for SLI. At 720p it would be the same as just burning your money as you wouldn't see the benefits over a single card.
3) Well, if you were putting the case on it's side, you would need to make sure that as you said, it has sufficient air-flow. Another concern would be the weight of the graphics card hanging from the PCIe slot. - Maybe I'm being overly sensitive.
4) Could go for a case like: http://www.hardwareversand.de/en/Midi/57761/Corsair+Carbide+Series+300R%2C+ATX%2C+ohne+Netzteil.article

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Well if you can't afford it, that's completely understandable of course, just use the stock cooler but please don't try to overclock.

I will know exactly how much I can afford tomorrow Definitely will not overclock without a cooler!

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

If you check you'll notice that the price you linked is also under "offers for this product."
Price: £290.55
Check the third option:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B00NOP536Y/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&condition=new

You're best to get it from Amazon instead of another company. There's no strange thing happening. Just economies of scale and such.

That third seller in the list, Lambatek, only has 93% positive feedback. Would it not be better to pay the €2 or €3 more to get it together with everything else from Hardwareversand?

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

1) The others are more expensive and they offer nothing of benefit. :P Also, makes perfect sense. Just make sure you by the same ram.

Okay, cool!

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

2) The price of the gtx 970 is so cheap in comparison to the Gtx 980 that it makes 970 sli far more appealing than a single 980. However, if you're playing on a tv then I would be thinking it's time to upgrade to a monitor before you go for SLI. Unless you're going to be playing on a monitor that's at 120hz/144hz there isn't much point in going for SLI. At 720p it would be the same as just burning your money as you wouldn't see the benefits over a single card.

I think I will set it up on the 32" 1080p Samsung in the living room initially though as this a shared television I do have the option to mount a wall bracket for smaller screen old dusty 720p in the bedroom. I know it would be a shame to use that display but like I said, it is just an option and in the new year I am going to invest a few hundred in a nice 4K display for the bedroom and eventually a study. Sticking with ATX for SLI then!

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

3) Well, if you were putting the case on it's side, you would need to make sure that as you said, it has sufficient air-flow. Another concern would be the weight of the graphics card hanging from the PCIe slot. - Maybe I'm being overly sensitive.

4) Could go for a case like: http://www.hardwareversand.de/en/Midi/57761/Corsair+Carbide+Series+300R%2C+ATX%2C+ohne+Netzteil.article

If the graphics card was hanging I could always turn it on the other side so the graphics card is resting vertically!

That Corsair is a nice case but after searching YouTube I have found what I consider a beautiful HTPC one that even takes a full ATX motherboard:


Sale: FRACTAL DESIGN Node 605

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSLXgk0qCEo

That listing there is for €97 but it is marked 'single piece - dispatch only', any idea what that means exactly? They have it listed separately with the availability bars green although at the price of €122.

If you know of a similar case you think might suit best please advise.

The drive bays are removable to fix full sized graphics cards, I will do some research on this just in case anyway. One definite problem is that it will not fit the Noctua NH-D15. A video review I watched said that allowing for 30mm clearance above any top flow fan, the fan itself can only be 100mm in height. From Fractal's website sideflow fans can be up to 125mm. I think there is a small Noctua CPU cooler.

Which between the GTX 970 MSI and G1 would you personally go for? I have read the MSI turns itself down/off when not in use, nice feature.

Ninjah Tigah

Aye but then there's no point for it to be raised as it doesn't have a fan on the other side. That's what I was assuming you were doing lol. :P

Having a Noctua NH-L12 would easily fit. I have one and the thing is tiny.

Well, between the Gtx 970's, I'd go with G1 since that's the one I went with. I have two in SLI. The only issue is that they're massive. I wasn't prepared for how large they are as I went from a g210>gtx 660>gtx 970 in the space of about 3 months. I thought the gtx 660 was big but sweet f*ck, the gtx 970... Lol

P.S, that case looks pretty nice.

Also: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OAahjdwfbRw That's what he thinks of the card. He's not the most... Informative but he still does pretty nice video's. :P

Oh, I should include too that in light of the price different, the MSI is definitely the winner. At the time where I got my sli, the gigabyte 970's were a lot cheaper.

runswithascript

Cool, thanks for adding that update, I had started thinking about the G1 but now I am set on the MSI

Do you think the MSI would fit? I can find not Fractal Design Node 605 builds on PC Partpicker including one. Not one but two of the dual (each, total 4 bays) HDD enclosures snap out to make more room if required...

Ninjah Tigah

Supports graphic cards up to 280mm in length (180mm with all hard drives in place)

Hmm.

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Supports graphic cards up to 280mm in length (180mm with all hard drives in place)

Hmm.

MSI GTX 970 dimensions: 26.9 x 14.1 x 3.5 cm.

So it will fit but I will have to discard the HDD bays. This does not seem so bad, could I not just stick a HDD in it somewhere?

runswithascript

CAN WE NOT JUST BANG IT IN THERE SOMEWHERE!!!

Ninjah Tigah

dusf wrote: »

MSI GTX 970 dimensions: 26.9 x 14.1 x 3.5 cm.

So it will fit but I will have to discard the HDD bays. This does not seem so bad, could I not just stick a HDD in it somewhere?

Yeah, you'd have to get rid of them.

dusf wrote: »

CAN WE NOT JUST BANG IT IN THERE SOMEWHERE!!!

If you saw my current setup you would say "Okay, yes I can." :P

runswithascript

Haha then it can be done! We will engineer it some how!

OR!

I do love the brushed steal of the Fractal 605 but I am just researching now Silverstone GD09 or GD10.

Ninjah Tigah

The Silverstone GD09 looks like it'll meet your needs just fine. Plenty of graphics card space, no HDD cages to worry about removing and decent airflow.

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

The Silverstone GD09 looks like it'll meet your needs just fine. Plenty of graphics card space, no HDD cages to worry about removing and decent airflow.

The thing easy I watched a video and the HDD cages literally pop right out, so removal is not a factor. Since I prefer the Fractal aesthetically, if there is the same amount of space in each I will probably go with that. Will look closer at the Silverstone after dinner.

By the way, do I need any cables etc or is everything I need included in what I am ordering?

I have a toolbox etc.

Ninjah Tigah

Everything should be included. ^^

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Everything should be included. ^^

Cool thanks.

On having to remove both HDD cages in the Fractal 605, in this video it seems to be suggested nothing needs to be removed for graphics cards, only if you are putting in other extra cards? It is just after about 5 minutes. Am I understanding this wrong?

Direct link to 5 minutes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VeFRfWaqZsM&t=5m0s

Ninjah Tigah

Well, the problem with the Gtx 970 is it takes two slots. So you'd be moving into another slot below the PCIe 8x_2 slot on the motherboard which would mean removing the drive trays.

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Well, the problem with the Gtx 970 is it takes two slots. So you'd be moving into another slot below the PCIe 8x_2 slot on the motherboard which would mean removing the drive trays.

Ah sh!te.

You mentioned something about the way you have your drives secured, or just fit in somewhere. How have you done this and have you any pictures? Maybe there are some low profile single SSD and HDD mounts I could secure somewhere with an adhesive... I am just worried I will not be able to fit the SSD and/or HDD in somewhere if I have initially one large Graphics card and then a second. I have been looking for someone who has done this but not been able to find.

runswithascript

Also, I have discovered that if I want to use the low profile optical drive bay in this case I would have to use a Micro ATX motherboard instead of an ATX. I rarely use optical drives, even for installing operating systems so I am not too pushed but it might be a nice option to have.

What do you think yourself, and is there one of these Z97 Micro ATX boards you would recommend if I want to leave myself a Bluray option etc?

http://uk.pcpartpicker.com/parts/motherboard/#f=7&c=99

Ninjah Tigah

dusf wrote: »

Ah sh!te.

You mentioned something about the way you have your drives secured, or just fit in somewhere. How have you done this and have you any pictures? Maybe there are some low profile single SSD and HDD mounts I could secure somewhere with an adhesive... I am just worried I will not be able to fit the SSD and/or HDD in somewhere if I have initially one large Graphics card and then a second. I have been looking for someone who has done this but not been able to find.

Believe me, if I posted a picture of that on here, I'd be banned. :P They're just hanging in the case. Don't have them secured. They're plugged in and left in any small gap that fits them. Lol, it's terrible but I've given up on this computer... :P

Maybe the guys on LinusTechTips would have more of an idea? They have an entire case section: http://linustechtips.com/main/forum/21-cases-and-power-supplies/

I'm sure they have far more knowledge of cases that would suit your needs. I will continue to help of course but I'm afraid I don't know too much about cases for this as I haven't seen anyone do a gtx 970 sli in a case other than a medium tower but as I said, the guys on that forums would have a lot of knowledge on cases etc.

runswithascript

Done, thanks, Will update with progress. Thanks for all the help!

runswithascript

Do you think the optical drive option would be worth having? If so I would have to choose one of the Z97 SLI capable boards out of:

MSI Z97M Gaming

Gigabyte GA-Z97MX-Gaming

ASRock Z97M OC Formula

Asus GRYPHON Z97 ARMOR EDITION

Asus MAXIMUS VII GENE

Do any of these stand out? As ever I am on a budget for this build

Ninjah Tigah

dusf wrote: »

Do you think the optical drive option would be worth having? If so I would have to choose one of the Z97 SLI capable boards out of:

MSI Z97M Gaming

Gigabyte GA-Z97MX-Gaming

ASRock Z97M OC Formula

Asus GRYPHON Z97 ARMOR EDITION

Asus MAXIMUS VII GENE

Do any of these stand out? As ever I am on a budget for this build

Gigabyte GA-Z97MX-Gaming is a great motherboard.

runswithascript

Ninjah Tigah wrote: »

Gigabyte GA-Z97MX-Gaming is a great motherboard.

Just added that to my basket on hardwareversand before looking at your response

Using the Micro ATX will also free up some room for drives!

runswithascript

Any idea 'what single' piece means for the Fractal 605 on hardwareversand? The cheaper one says single piece, maybe simply that they only have one remaining?

Ninjah Tigah

dusf wrote: »

Any idea 'what single' piece means for the Fractal 605 on hardwareversand? The cheaper one says single piece, maybe simply that they only have one remaining?

Exactly that.

runswithascript

€1070, saved about €25 with vouchers

Will order tomorrow or Friday, whenever paid! Thanks again, we got there in the end!

Ninjah Tigah

dusf wrote: »

€1070, saved about €25 with vouchers

Will order tomorrow or Friday, whenever paid! Thanks again, we got there in the end!

No problem what so ever, best of luck with the build, hope it all goes smoothly.

runswithascript

Balls! MSI GTX 970 and RAM gone out of stock from Hardwareversand, probably because of black Friday! Just going to double check prices once more against British suppliers, then order everything including Noctua NH-L12 from Hardwareversand, and then GTX 970, RAM, and an extra 120mm fan and two extra 80mm fans somewhere else.

runswithascript

I see that Gigabyte card also has no WiFI, would there be room for some sort of internal wifi card somewhere if it had two GTX 970s in it?

runswithascript

So we are mid build right now. I was very worried last night as I could not get the motherboard to fit onto the stand offs with the I/O plate and the antistatic cushion on the back of the plate. Then today I discovered it takes significant force to get the plate to snap/click onto the hole for it in the case, I had been trying to fit everything in with the plate on the hole but not secured to it.

I have the processor in already, and I am next going to fit the RAM, cooler, graphics card and the solid state drives.

From what I can see there are three PCIExpress slots, one labelled PCIE4, another PCIE8, and another PCIE16. Does it matter which slot I use or is it just whichever one leaves enough room for the other components etc?

game4it70

Thise i/o plates can be a right pita sometimes.Use the top pcie slot (x16).

runswithascript

Thanks graphics card is in the PCIE16 slot which would be top if this were a tower.

For the front panel cables, I looked at the schematic in the manual and at the markings on the board, and I have the Power LED - and + cables connected but there is a pin between them, that appears to do nothing, is this not strange?

Also, for the Power Switch, I have it connected also, there are two pins marked - and + for it on the board but the cables are connected as one cable and there are no markings which is which, best way to know just to see if it works?

The case came with two 120mm fans but I bought an extra one and two 80mm. The two fans that came with the case were already connected up to the fan controller and there was a spare cable from the controller so I plugged the extra 120mm into that. Is there anyway to connect them all up to the controller, maybe with two Y cables? Would I be better off with all fans connected to the board for automatic control?

I now have the two 80mm cables connected up to the board, but the connectors on them are only for three pins and all of the fan ports on the board are 4 pins so there is an extra pin free where I have made the connections, is this okay?

Any idea where the connector in the picture below goes? It comes from the front panel and I have not been able to find anywhere on the board or power supply to connect it?

Luck100

dusf wrote: »

For the front panel cables, I looked at the schematic in the manual and at the markings on the board, and I have the Power LED - and + cables connected but there is a pin between them, that appears to do nothing, is this not strange?

Nope, they are often in an irregular pattern with some pins missing. For LED make sure you connect + and - to the correct pins, don't get them switched around. You case manual will tell you which wires are which, and you motherboard manual will tell you which pins are which. Usually black/white wires are negative and colored wires are positive.

dusf wrote: »

Also, for the Power Switch, I have it connected also, there are two pins marked - and + for it on the board but the cables are connected as one cable and there are no markings which is which, best way to know just to see if it works?

Again, check your case manual to be sure. Usually + and - for the power switch doesn't matter.

dusf wrote: »

The case came with two 120mm fans but I bought an extra one and two 80mm. The two fans that came with the case were already connected up to the fan controller and there was a spare cable from the controller so I plugged the extra 120mm into that. Is there anyway to connect them all up to the controller, maybe with two Y cables? Would I be better off with all fans connected to the board for automatic control?

I now have the two 80mm cables connected up to the board, but the connectors on them are only for three pins and all of the fan ports on the board are 4 pins so there is an extra pin free where I have made the connections, is this okay?

If you have spare case fan connections on the motherboard, you can just use those. It's ok to plug a 3-pin fan into a 4-pin fan connector. 4-pin fans are PWM fans - they use the fourth pin to control the fan speed via a control signal. A 3-pin fan fill just run at full speed when plugged in to a 4-pin connector. You need a voltage control to change the speed on a 3-pin fan - I think some motherboards can do that but many don't. If your case fan control has speed adjustments it will do voltage control.

dusf wrote: »

Any idea where the connector in the picture below goes? It comes from the front panel and I have not been able to find anywhere on the board or power supply to connect it?

That's a molex power connector, it's the older style of PC power connector. If it's part of your case it may be used to supply power to your case fan controller. Anyway it connects directly to your power supply - just look for the PSU cable that fits.

runswithascript

Thanks, the fans only started working with the molex connected.

Thanks to all who helped, build completed and powered on first time, albeit without the fans initially

I am creating a new overclocking thread for the build which will contain pictures.

runswithascript

That thread is now located here: First time overclock: i5-4690K, MSI GTX 970, Gigabyte Z97MX Gaming 5?