Females being Assaulted by bouncers

sa2014

,

hullaballoo

Speak to a solicitor. If what you're saying is true, a solicitor will be able to advise you in terms of your options, whether through the Gardaí or otherwise.

Little CuChulainn

I hope the club was worth it. I don't understand why people don't just walk away when they are refused entry. For future reference, you can just note the security guards name and ID number, If they aren't wearing ID then they are breaking the rules set out by the PSA.

As to your predicament. Go to the Garda again and tell him you want to make a statement of complaint for assault. He may not take it there and then but if he doesn't at least make a date to take one then ask to speak to the sergeant. If the sergeant is no use then look for an Inspector. If that doesn't work then you can write to the local Superintendent and you can also make a complaint to GSOC. You can make a complaint to the PSA about the actions of the bouncers. You can make a complaint to the club management in relation to your treatment. You can consult a solicitor with regard to a civil suit against the club and security.

Afroshack

Hang on, so you were refused entry to a club and instead of walking away calmly you proceeded to

• question the bouncer
• argue with the bouncer
• take pictures of his face without his permission
• threaten complaints
• kick and scream
• try to bite him
• try to have him arrested

If I were you, I'd walk away from this and try not to act like such an insolent child ever again. I'm honestly not surprised he restrained you since you came up smelling of drink, arguing, being aggressive and started taking photos of him when you didn't get your way. You should be mortified!:rolleyes:

endacl

Sounds like a crap club. Why go there?

Yawns

I wonder what the other side to this story is....

MarkAnthony

Im going to open a club, refuse everyone initially and then let them in . In 3 weeks I'm going to retire on by millions and millions from all the people that come in because it seems to me all you have to do to is refuse entry and the place become like **** to flies.

OP if you're refused entry, just go somewhere else. If I turned up on your doorstep you've no obligation to let me in the door, neither has a club unless it's on one of the grounds of discrimination, which arguably this was - if that's the case even more reason not to give them money.

Also this as women bollocks. Nothing sets the course of feminism back more than women themselves. There are women I've met in my time that could floor half of the New Zealand Rugby team and men that are 5'0 and 7 stone.

Sorry for the rant but I really don't get this ridiculous mentality. If you'd walked away, wrote a letter and complained you'd have probably got somewhere, now you're going to be the two 'insert derogatory comment here' that where causing trouble and a bouncer that over reacted is probably going to get away with it yet again because the other side couldn't behave like adults.

OP on reflection I feel the need to add some legal content to my rant.

2.—(1) A person shall be guilty of the offence of assault who, without lawful excuse, intentionally or recklessly—

(a) directly or indirectly applies force to or causes an impact on the body of another, or

(b) causes another to believe on reasonable grounds that he or she is likely immediately to be subjected to any such force or impact,

without the consent of the other.

(2) In subsection (1) (a), “force” includes—

(a) application of heat, light, electric current, noise or any other form of energy, and

(b) application of matter in solid liquid or gaseous form.

(3) No such offence is committed if the force or impact, not being intended or likely to cause injury, is in the circumstances such as is generally acceptable in the ordinary conduct of daily life and the defendant does not know or believe that it is in fact unacceptable to the other person.

(4) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £1,500 or to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or to both.

You very probably assaulted the bouncer (or so he will claim) way before anyone touched anyone else. Speaking to a solicitor is a very wise move at this point.

coylemj

sa2014 wrote: »

If we were too drunk then the pub would not have kept serving us until closing.

What you appear to be saying is something along the lines of : 'The pub we were in earlier served us xxx number of drinks, therefore we weren't drunk.'

Not buying that, sorry. You can basically get p1ssed in one place but it does not mean that when you move on and show up on somebody else's doorstep that you are ipso facto fit to be served.

The test that's applied outside a nightclub is far stricter than what a busy barman applies when he's serving someone who has been on the premises for several hours. When you're going into a nightclub, they don't expect you to be cold stone sober but they also know that if you're too far gone, you're likely to start messing around and become a nuisance on the premises.

It's far easier for a doorman to refuse a woman at the door than to attempt to eject her after she gets in, partly because woman tend not to go quietly and also because you'll always get the half-pissed (male) hero who will try to intervene on the woman's behalf and make an even bigger mess of things.

You were refused entry, you should have gone home or tried somewhere else.

Zambia

hullaballoo wrote: »

Speak to a solicitor. If what you're saying is true, a solicitor will be able to advise you in terms of your options, whether through the Gardaí or otherwise.

This hits the nail on the head.

On a non legal point, this is a tremendous waste of everyone's time .

Zyox

sa2014 wrote: »

Hi,
We approached the bouncer at the club and asked did he want to see our i.d

There's your issue right there.

YellowFeather

There was a thread in AH about misogyny recently. I read some of it with interest (not all - it was quite long..). I have never experienced misogyny on boards, but posts like this are quite an example of characterising an experience as a sexist issue:

"Females being Assaulted by bouncers"? That's an unusual thread title. Surely your issue is being assaulted by bouncers - not your gender?

And you can't go around biting people!?

sa2014 wrote: »

Two of the bouncer jammed us against a wall for atleast 20minutes.

That sounds very odd. Surely somebody would have noticed / intervened.

meathstevie

Not exactly legal advice but still advice, four simple words. Drink less, wise up.

Have you any idea how long twenty minutes is in a fight considering that a messy drunken confrontation seldom lasts longer than one to one and a half minutes.

If you were held in a tight arm lock for such an amount of time your muscles and tendons should still be rattling like the strings on Jimi Hendrix' guitar.

Zyox

sa2014 wrote: »

I've been to my doctor and have a haematoma on my arm and bruising etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hematoma#
A haematoma *and* a bruise?
You should be studied.

Luke92

Why take pictures saying you are going to complain? They have the right to refuse entry. Why not just move to the next club?

rubberdiddies

I don't give a rats how drunk someone is when approaching a nightclub.

If what the OP says is true and she was physically assaulted for taking a picture of the bouncer or even if the OP did give the bouncer verbal abuse he has no right whatsoever to physically attack or restrain her.

If however there is more to this story and the OP or her friend got physical first then that's a different story.

But being drunk or verbally abusive to a bouncer is no grounds for then to lay a finger on the OP.

OP if you feel you are 100% in the right then contact a solicitor.

If however there is even a tiny bit of doubt and you or your friend may have touched/attacked the bouncer first then think before you proceed.

Little CuChulainn

Nobody has defended the bouncers. Personally I think you and your partner aggravated the situation unnecessarily and suffered the consequences. By all means go ahead with a criminal and civil complaint but take a life lesson from it too. Don't pick fights with bouncers. You'll never get a good result.

knird evol

Do you see the changes in style of speech withing its posts.
At times successfully affecting the passive aggressive, self entitled, spoilt brat and then lazily losing form here and there. At one point going into Now please anyone that does not have more info on my rights etc jog on. You cannot say bouncers do not go on power trips. A bouncer in cork a few years ago murdered a young fella who had consumed 15 pints. He had him in a headlock for too long and suffocated him.

sa2014

knird evol wrote: »

Do you see the changes in style of speech withing its posts.
At times successfully affecting the passive aggressive, self entitled, spoilt brat and then lazily losing form here and there. At one point going into Now please anyone that does not have more info on my rights etc jog on. You cannot say bouncers do not go on power trips. A bouncer in cork a few years ago murdered a young fella who had consumed 15 pints. He had him in a headlock for too long and suffocated him.

When someome calls me a child and not help the issue, I will reply with a smart comment telling them to jog on.

sa2014

A haematoma *and* a bruise?
You should be studied.[/quote]

Did you ever hear of a mistake or are you perfect???. My knees are bruised and my arm has a more severe collection of blood cells where I had gotten a blood test. Doctor said that the bruising from a blood test would not be this severe and it was definately aggravated by the bouncer.

Homer

You claimed that there was cctv of the whole incident? If that's the case then why are you even looking for advice? If it happened exactly as you described you simply need to go to the guards and tell them you want to press charges and they will need the cctv as evidence. They will obtain the cctv evidence as part of the prosecution and a judge will decide? Simples

LionelNashe

The bouncer would have a completely different version of events if we could ask him. Without being able to hear both sides or see the CCTV this kind of thread is pointless.

Zyox

sa2014 wrote: »

Ok I may have escalated the situation by taking a photo, but it is not illegal to do so and the bouncer is only legally allowed remove me from the area after an attempt to ask me to leave. I didnt aggravate the situation. He is going forward against both of us so why shouldnt we back up for ourselves when we have injuries.
My partner didnt touch anybody at all and cannot even work over her injuries I really dont think we should take this lying down. I dont have a criminal record and need a clear record for work so I dont want to take this lying down. Ill just get a solicitor and ask gardai to check CCTV that is proof in itself

Maybe that's the best idea yet. Whatever you do though please keep us updated with the progress. Quite a few of us interested into how this escalated and what the repercussions are.

masonchat

I could be wrong , but it sounds like ye got what ye deserved , i would love to see the cctv to judge, the 20min part especially sounds like a load of shi#e.

I have been going to clubs for 20 years i have been in most situations and seen the rest , attitude is everything and sorry but it sounds like you have a bad one, i see more bruises and trips to a+e in your future if you dont lick your wounds and learn your lessons

Tigger

Why did you ask the bouncers if they wanted to see id

droidman123

sa2014 wrote: »

Because he would not let us in.

Theres too many details in your story, no way anyone could remember all those things. I put it to you that your a liar and a fantasiser!

Zyox

sa2014 wrote: »

Because he would not let us in.

So he wouldn't let you in before you asked if he wanted to see I.D.?

Tigger

sa2014 wrote: »

Because he would not let us in.

After the pub We approached the bouncer at the club and asked did he want to see our i.d. He said no

You are confusing me
Did he say you can't come in and then ye proffered the id
Or did ye turn up and offer id

droidman123

Why would a 27 yr old need I'd?

masonchat

sa2014 wrote: »

I dont have an attitude, sorry now but I couldn't check my phone for the actual amount of time as I was restained! but I know it was long enough nd that I shouldn't have been restrained in the first place..

From reading YOUR side of the story it comes across that you do, i would hate to hear the bouncers side.

If it happened as you say, then its a bizzar incident, why would they restrain ye for 20 min.

If i was to read between the lines , i would guess you are exaggerating the lenght of time to justify you biting him
, also the only reason you were restrained at all is because you tried to haul him off your friend , commendable but you can see why you were restrained ?

thats me just reading between the lines

Tigger

sa2014 wrote: »

He said we cant come in its student night and i said we are students does he want to see I.d.

He was being tactful

Zyox

They shouldn't need I.d.

To let a person into a club,

Jezek

Zyox wrote: »

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hematoma#
A haematoma *and* a bruise?
You should be studied.

these two are not the same things. In fact, someone could have a haematoma and a bruise at the same time. I know this is getting off topic but I come on, if you're gonna be pedantic be right. As for the OP's case, I have to say

1. If everything is as you say it then you're right, too much force was used against you with no reason ( at least initially)

2. Even in your own story you come off pretty badly - you escalated and were in the wrong - taking pictures and arguing with bouncers

3. Your story sounds implausible or perhaps not only one side of the story. especially things like being held in a armlock for 20 mins. even the bouncer would be very tired after 10.

Sam Harts

This is why I hate bouncers. There's one club in Dublin 2, I won't say it's name but the bouncers there are rude as hell and often love to abuse their authority. I was there once and a male bouncer, well over 6 foot told me to move out of his way and just pushed me, despite their being stairs near by, I nearly fell down them, and when I told him I could have nearly fell his response was sarcastic.

Sometimes I have gone to this club straight from home and I'm not a huge drinker, yet some of the bouncers are almost about to give me the breathalyser, yet people who are half legless get in no problem.

The final straw came when I had my brand new phone stolen and I waited for everyone to leave and I then went to the hotel which is also part of the club, I asked the receptionist could he ring my number, and the answer I got was NO and a nasty grin, and when I said please he asked a bouncer to get me out and told me to F Off, the bouncer went to grab me but I just walked out and told him not to touch me, I had had two drinks that night, was not aggressive and was simply upset because I had lost an expensive brand new phone.

The problem with bouncers is that they get this thrill out of having a bit of power and authority, and they pick on anyone who they consider to be weak, you can just imagine they were probably bullies at school, well the ones in the club I was going to anyway, also female bouncers can be nasty pieces of work too.

I don't got there anymore, despite my friends thinking it is the best club in Dublin.

Anyway I think you and your partner should definitely press charges against those bouncers, but most of the guards probably love their power trips too so they might just give those bouncers who assaulted you a high five and a fist pump.

Jezek

Sam Harts wrote: »

This is why I hate bouncers. There's one club in Dublin 2, I won't say it's name but the bouncers there are rude as hell and often love to abuse their authority. I was there once and a male bouncer, well over 6 foot told me to move out of his way and just pushed me, despite their being stairs near by, I nearly fell down them, and when I told him I could have nearly fell his response was sarcastic.

Sometimes I have gone to this club straight from home and I'm not a huge drinker, yet some of the bouncers are almost about to give me the breathalyser, yet people who are half legless get in no problem.

The final straw came when I had my brand new phone stolen and I waited for everyone to leave and I then went to the hotel which is also part of the club, I asked the receptionist could he ring my number, and the answer I got was NO and a nasty grin, and when I said please he asked a bouncer to get me out and told me to F Off, the bouncer went to grab me but I just walked out and told him not to touch me, I had had two drinks that night, was not aggressive and was simply upset because I had lost an expensive brand new phone.

The problem with bouncers is that they get this thrill out of having a bit of power and authority, and they pick on anyone who they consider to be weak, you can just imagine they were probably bullies at school, well the ones in the club I was going to anyway, also female bouncers can be nasty pieces of work too.

I don't got there anymore, despite my friends thinking it is the best club in Dublin.

Anyway I think you and your partner should definitely press charges against those bouncers, but most of the guards probably love their power trips too so they might just give those bouncers who assaulted you a high five and a fist pump.

nasty pieces of work? bullies? lumping all guards in for good measure?
Also your story of the hotel receptionists not calling your number is missing parts or otherwise sounds fake

Sam Harts

Jezek wrote: »

nasty pieces of work? bullies? lumping all guards in for good measure?
Also your story of the hotel receptionists not calling your number is missing parts or otherwise sounds fake

You where there, were you??

I said that the ones I have seen bully people probably were bullies at school, I have met a lot of bouncers who simply just do a job and don't abuse their authority like the ones at that club I went to were all I saw was abuse from them to people, yet the other clubs on that street were not abusing customers.

And as for the receptionist, I told him I lost my phone, he said there was nothing he could do and I said it might be in the club and would it be possible if he could ring it and he shouted no, and all I did in response was say please as I was desperate to find it and then he treated me like some criminal.

It's up to you what you believe as far as I am concerned I don't know you, have never met you, and don't come on Internet forums that much, so I don't need to score points from anyone online, so don't lump me into the same category as yourself.

Zambia

sa2014 wrote: »

When someome calls me a child and not help the issue, I will reply with a smart comment telling them to jog on.

I assume you have told your story on this site for a impartial third eye view.

Sadly some posters have been a bit insulting and that is going to far.

However on reading of your story and having worked on doors once upon a time the tale is an old one.

In my impartial third view you mucked this up. Doormen are employees and not gods (all though some do like to think they are). Their behaviour should be dealt with like you deal with any other service employee.

Approach the door on refusal politely ask for the doormans number or name along with a reason and make a note (written) of their refusal and response.

The next day write a letter to the management

Dear ()

On the evening of the 7/7/14 I attended your premises at 21.30. With my partner Eve.

On trying to enter I was refused by doorman (name number or description). The reason he gave was / he refused to tell us why.

We attended your venue due to (reason you went there). This refusal as you can imagine spoiled our evening. I will not be returning to your venue in future but feel I should at least inform you of the impression your door staff leave on the patrons your advertising revenue leads to your door.

The old adage of a good experience leads to a patron telling one person and a bad experience leads to a patron telling 10 is one that predates social media.

Regards
You


If you follow the above the Gardais time and energy is not wasted in piontless investigations of bruises caused by conflicting stories. (its a dog af a case that you actions have muddied the waters in).

The above letter if circulated properly would have been the best outcome

rubberdiddies

I can't really understand how one or two posters here are saying the OP got what she deserved.

So you are saying she deserved to be physically assaulted despite not laying a finger on the bouncer?

Strange attitude to have to advocate illegal assault

Timberrrrrrrr

Sam Harts wrote: »

This is why I hate bouncers. There's one club in Dublin 2, I won't say it's name but the bouncers there are rude as hell and often love to abuse their authority. I was there once and a male bouncer, well over 6 foot told me to move out of his way and just pushed me, despite their being stairs near by, I nearly fell down them, and when I told him I could have nearly fell his response was sarcastic.

Sometimes I have gone to this club straight from home and I'm not a huge drinker, yet some of the bouncers are almost about to give me the breathalyser, yet people who are half legless get in no problem.

The final straw came when I had my brand new phone stolen and I waited for everyone to leave and I then went to the hotel which is also part of the club, I asked the receptionist could he ring my number, and the answer I got was NO and a nasty grin, and when I said please he asked a bouncer to get me out and told me to F Off, the bouncer went to grab me but I just walked out and told him not to touch me, I had had two drinks that night, was not aggressive and was simply upset because I had lost an expensive brand new phone.

The problem with bouncers is that they get this thrill out of having a bit of power and authority, and they pick on anyone who they consider to be weak, you can just imagine they were probably bullies at school, well the ones in the club I was going to anyway, also female bouncers can be nasty pieces of work too.

I don't got there anymore, despite my friends thinking it is the best club in Dublin.

Anyway I think you and your partner should definitely press charges against those bouncers, but most of the guards probably love their power trips too so they might just give those bouncers who assaulted you a high five and a fist pump.

Funny


I worked as a doorman for almost 20 years and never looked for trouble and in fact my motto was "A quiet boring night is a successful night" . I worked with many great people and made friends for life both from staff and customers. Fact is there are arseholes in EVERY profession. Fwiw i think op is giving a VERY watered down pro her side version of the events that happened.

mrsbyrne

OP I think that you've heard that the bouncer who you bit is taking sn action against you (quite right too) snd your panicking.
If this is the case you will simply have to engage s solicitor.
The beauty of CCTV is that the case should be cut and dried because the camera never lies.
If nothing else I hope you have learned that you don't have a "right" to be admitted to a privately owned venue and being belligerent about it might land you in hot water.

MarkAnthony

sa2014 wrote: »

Thanks for input by some people, I will be doing what I said I would. Someonene is entitled to take a photo , its not aggressive. He didnt have a right to lay his hands on anyone. He got aggressive towards someone who didnt touch him, so no matter what happened after this, he still got physical unnecessarily first. Thats all my point was. I wanted to know was it acceptable for him to act this way. But nobody here knows the law like the back of their hand so im going to stop commenting now and delete previous posts. Dont want anymore people giving out saying I deserved it as I had enough of that off one member of gardai who would not listen to my side of story, only heard one side. I believe gardai should be impartial until both sides are discussed. Only person ill be discussing this further with is a solicitor.

OP I'm afraid that all the way up you are going to find people predisposed, as I am, to believing that you had a large measure of responsibility for this, whether you did or did not. That's why you need to be completely beyond reproach in dealing with bouncers in future.

I hope it all blows over with no adverse repercussions for you. In the future the most effective way to hit a business that you don't like is in the pockets.

masonchat

sa2014 wrote: »

Thanks for input by some people, I will be doing what I said I would. Someonene is entitled to take a photo , its not aggressive. He didnt have a right to lay his hands on anyone. He got aggressive towards someone who didnt touch him, so no matter what happened after this, he still got physical unnecessarily first. Thats all my point was. I wanted to know was it acceptable for him to act this way. But nobody here knows the law like the back of their hand so im going to stop commenting now and delete previous posts. Dont want anymore people giving out saying I deserved it as I had enough of that off one member of gardai who would not listen to my side of story, only heard one side. I believe gardai should be impartial until both sides are discussed. Only person ill be discussing this further with is a solicitor.

Maybe on your friends part at best , but you actually attacked him first by your own account and bit him when he restrained you, you might not have got what you deserve just yet hopefully a judge will see to that

MarkAnthony

sa2014 wrote: »

Thanks, I Definately wont be returning there again. I'll be walking away in future, I did not realise some bouncers were like this.

I say this having done security work here and on the basis that it's a small minority but bouncers here can be a nightmare. Comparing Dublin to Edinburgh both where I've caused a fair amount of (minor, drunken) nuisance it's stunning how quickly Dublin bouncers go off one one.

hfallada

rubberdiddies wrote: »

I can't really understand how one or two posters here are saying the OP got what she deserved.

So you are saying she deserved to be physically assaulted despite not laying a finger on the bouncer?

Strange attitude to have to advocate illegal assault

The way she spoke and treated the bouncers before they even touched her was not acceptable. If you are working in any customer service job and someone is being nasty and snappy, you dont smile and take.

I find it interesting that the OP hasnt mentioned, what other people outside the club, had to say about the OPs behaviour. I have yet to see altercation outside of a club without some other people going to the club getting involved. If the OP story is true, I cant see why someone that was "20 mins" in a headlock, didnt have someone walking by questioning what the bouncer did. Also most club know have two sets of bouncers. One for the women and others for men. I dont know why it wasnt the case here.

I remember the only complaint I had working retail for 9 months. It was from a customer that was incredibly nasty and difficult to deal with. All I was doing was serving them at the till. That same day the company I worked for got an email saying I was rude, did X,Y and Z. Like I didnt say hello or thank you. I worked there so long, that when friend said bye, that I automatically said thank you, bye. My manager told me a majority of complaints in retail are from customers who treated the staff like **** and try to justify what they did with a complaint that is far from the truth. This can be seen in the retail thread in "ranting and raving".

I wonder is this the case here.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Pat Mustard

It has been mentioned several times on this thread that it's not illegal to take a photo. However, that doesn't exactly describe what happened here.

The OP could pursue this matter, asking Gardai to bring charges against the bouncers for assault or false imprisonment. However, if you're no angel yourself, sometimes involving Gardai can be a two-edged sword. The possibility that the OP could be prosecuted for disorderly conduct (depending on whether it was after midnight) or harassment can't be completely discounted. There is also the issue of biting the bouncer. I wouldn't like to put my house on self-defence here.

It would certainly be worth taking advice in relation to an Injuries Board application, etc.

whippet

A bite is a serious thing .. The victim of a bite has to go through fairly scary blood tests and a long wait for an all clear. I know as a mate of mine got bitten on a football pitch .. Only a couple of weeks before his wedding and it ruined his wedding and honeymoon as he had the possibility of terrible news when the results were made clear.

conorh91

droidman123 wrote: »

Why would a 27 yr old need I'd?

For buying alcohol in Lidl. Flattering bastards.

Timberrrrrrrr

whippet wrote: »

A bite is a serious thing .. The victim of a bite has to go through fairly scary blood tests and a long wait for an all clear. I know as a mate of mine got bitten on a football pitch .. Only a couple of weeks before his wedding and it ruined his wedding and honeymoon as he had the possibility of terrible news when the results were made clear.

I got bit on the bicep, this was a guy in a suit/shirt and tie so very little risk of catching anything but i still had to visit the mater hospital every few weeks for blood tests, this went on for 6 months until i got the all clear. Biting someone is one of the scummiest things you can do to anyone.

Little CuChulainn

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I got bit on the bicep, this was a guy in a suit/shirt and tie so very little risk of catching anything but i still had to visit the mater hospital every few weeks for blood tests, this went on for 6 months until i got the all clear. Biting someone is one of the scummiest things you can do to anyone.

Don't think I'd be lowering the risk for a well dressed man. I'd consider them just as high risk from having something sexually transmitted.