Winter approaching.

Tanya30

It is nearly Winter so I am looking for some advice on how to get my 8yr old daughter Lily to fasten up her Trespass Jacket in order to stay warm/dry in the bitter Winter cold?

She only wears her jacket when its windy, rainy or snowy outside and its a struggle to get her to fasten it during rain during Summer or during strong winds in Autumn. But during Winter, I do ask her to fasten her jacket and end up doing it for her if she ignores my request but, this year I want her fastening it herself when told because she CAN fasten her own jacket!

So, what advice have you got for me and do you insist that your child fasten their jackets in winter?

pwurple

I don't make them. I vividly remember being TOO HOT all winter, every winter as a child. If they are cold they know what to do.

December2012

I only make them close their coats if it's raining. It's their choice - children self regulate their body temperature and are so active they don't need to be closed up all the time.

Tanya30

She gets cold though and then complains at getting cold.

Just today, she came out of School with her jacket wide open and complained that she was soaking (it is pouring with rain today) during playtime and at that moment, so I said to her "was your jacket done up?", her reply was a soft "no" so next I said "well thats why you got soaked, if you'd done up zip on your jacket you would have stayed dry", then I waited a minute and then said "its raining, please do up zip on your jacket", she ignored me so I done it up and said "when I ask you to do up your jacket, you do it up!".

December2012

So let her complain then. Or did she only say it because you brought it up?

If it really bothered her then she'd close it.

If you don't make a deal out of it then she won't.

She's old enough to be responsible for that decision herself

Tanya30

No, she came out of School and straight away said to me "I am too cold/wet".

She struggles to connect zip so would rather I close it up for her but I do ask her to at least try before I do it up.

Sunny Dayz

Tanya30 wrote: »

No, she came out of School and straight away said to me "I am too cold/wet".

She struggles to connect zip so would rather I close it up for her but I do ask her to at least try before I do it up.

Maybe you should get her a coat that she can manage herself. Or get her to practice closing it before you send her out in it.
As others have said, if she's cold enough she'll close it up. Maybe make sure she wears a hat to keep some of the heat in.

Tanya30

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

Maybe you should get her a coat that she can manage herself. Or get her to practice closing it before you send her out in it.
As others have said, if she's cold enough she'll close it up. Maybe make sure she wears a hat to keep some of the heat in.

That is ok for daily life but not for School because she HAS to wear the School uniform jacket (which is one she struggles with, her daily life one is easier for her to do up). Plus, School don't let her out for recess/playtime during wet weather until she closes up zip on her jacket, so now teachers asking for my help but, what can I do because all I can think of is remind her that rule for School is: if weather is unpleasant, coats must be on and fully closed up (by that they mean zip and velcro, they don't let them only close velcro, zip has to be closed right to top), hats on or hoods up, scarf and gloves also.

What are your opinions on that rule?

Deenie123

Does she struggle with other fine motor tasks? Maybe take the laces out of her shoes (or someone else's shoes) under the guise of washing them and when the laces are washed and dry, ask her to put them back in. Can she do it or does she struggle? Can she tie her own shoe laces yet? What about doing her doll's hair? Can she plait it, put it in pony tails, put the hair tie on correctly? What's her writing like compared to her classmates? Is it particularly messy? If she struggles with these tasks you might want to consider having her motor skills more comprehensively assessed. Not zipping up her coat could be a symptom of a genuine problem she has with fine motor tasks and she might genuinely need a bit more support in school when she puts on her coat.

Generally if kids are cold they'll zip up their coat! She's 8 years old, that's well old enough to close her coat properly especially as the zips on kids' coats are designed with kids in mind. I'd be inclined to talk to her teacher on this one. Her teacher may have noticed that she struggles with certain things (or is reluctant to do certain things), or will at least be alerted that it's a possibility and can look out for any signs of motor planning issues.

If the child is genuinely consistently coming out of school cold and wet at 8 years old because she didn't close her coat I would be first trying to rule out motor planning problems. Either she's not grasping ahead of time that closing her coat before she's cold and wet will prevent her from ending up cold and wet, or she knows this but finds it too difficult to actually close it and it's easier to just be cold and wet. Either way, to be fair to your little girl I think you need to first rule out the possibility that she genuinely has problems with carrying out this task.

If you rule out any problems and she's still arriving home cold and wet I suppose it's just a case of wait for her to grow up a bit and close her coat.

By the way, it has been unseasonably warm lately even during rain. Have you considered that it could just be that even though it's raining it's just too hot to zip up a warm winter coat? Can you try sending her in with a lighter jacket? Run it by the teacher if you need to - you should already be talking to her teacher about this anyway.

implausible

^^
Kinda what I was thinking too. Not zipping up the coat could be her trying to hide a difficulty with doing it.

Tanya30

Deenie123 wrote: »

Does she struggle with other fine motor tasks? Maybe take the laces out of her shoes (or someone else's shoes) under the guise of washing them and when the laces are washed and dry, ask her to put them back in. Can she do it or does she struggle? Can she tie her own shoe laces yet? What about doing her doll's hair? Can she plait it, put it in pony tails, put the hair tie on correctly? What's her writing like compared to her classmates? Is it particularly messy? If she struggles with these tasks you might want to consider having her motor skills more comprehensively assessed. Not zipping up her coat could be a symptom of a genuine problem she has with fine motor tasks and she might genuinely need a bit more support in school when she puts on her coat.

Generally if kids are cold they'll zip up their coat! She's 8 years old, that's well old enough to close her coat properly especially as the zips on kids' coats are designed with kids in mind. I'd be inclined to talk to her teacher on this one. Her teacher may have noticed that she struggles with certain things (or is reluctant to do certain things), or will at least be alerted that it's a possibility and can look out for any signs of motor planning issues.

If the child is genuinely consistently coming out of school cold and wet at 8 years old because she didn't close her coat I would be first trying to rule out motor planning problems. Either she's not grasping ahead of time that closing her coat before she's cold and wet will prevent her from ending up cold and wet, or she knows this but finds it too difficult to actually close it and it's easier to just be cold and wet. Either way, to be fair to your little girl I think you need to first rule out the possibility that she genuinely has problems with carrying out this task.

If you rule out any problems and she's still arriving home cold and wet I suppose it's just a case of wait for her to grow up a bit and close her coat.

By the way, it has been unseasonably warm lately even during rain. Have you considered that it could just be that even though it's raining it's just too hot to zip up a warm winter coat? Can you try sending her in with a lighter jacket? Run it by the teacher if you need to - you should already be talking to her teacher about this anyway.

First of all, she can do all these other tasks so motor skills issues ruled out straight away. She actually has the best writing of all her classmates which she is so proud of :-). She can tie jacket if she puts her mind to it, it takes her a few seconds to get zip connected and due to wanting to play with her friends, she asks teacher "can you tie my jacket please miss" but teacher knows that she can do it so says "you have plenty of time to play with friends, try and see if you can tie it yourself, if you struggle then I will connect it ok sweetheart" but dd has her mind on her friends that she isn't concentrating and then struggles to connect it, so teacher connects it for her and gets her to pull zip up and then reassuringly tells dd "you can do it if you put your mind to it, I know you can because I have seen you tying your jacket many times.

Secondly, you ask if I can send her in a lighter coat. Well, I have asked but teacher said "no, ALL kids MUST come to School with jacket issued by School which is a waterproof Trespass.

Chocolate fiend

I am kind of lost, you say they are not allowed out if the jackets are not tied up, and then you said she was out yesterday without it tied up and she got wet.

She is 8, if she can do it then leave her to it. Get her to practice at the weekend, and make sure she can do it. A few days of missing playtime with her friends will probably make her hurry up and get it done. I wouldn't bother making an 8 year old (or even a 7 or 6 year old for that matter) tie up their jacket, they know if they are cold and they can join the dots regarding the jacket helping them with that.

implausible

Chocolate fiend wrote: »

A few days of missing playtime with her friends will probably make her hurry up and get it done.

This. If it's such a big deal, don't let her out until she zips up. But really, an 8 year old needs to figure this out for herself: jacket open = cold and wet. Fussing about it will make it worse as will everyone doing it for her.

Tanya30

Where did my thread titled "school over-protective" go, is it merged into this one?

Tanya30

Chocolate fiend wrote: »

I am kind of lost, you say they are not allowed out if the jackets are not tied up, and then you said she was out yesterday without it tied up and she got wet.

She is 8, if she can do it then leave her to it. Get her to practice at the weekend, and make sure she can do it. A few days of missing playtime with her friends will probably make her hurry up and get it done. I wouldn't bother making an 8 year old (or even a 7 or 6 year old for that matter) tie up their jacket, they know if they are cold and they can join the dots regarding the jacket helping them with that.

This was after School, only at School before going out for recess/playtimes does she need her jacket tied up, after School, teacher leaves it to the parents of child to ask their kids to tie up jacket which lots of parents do, ammount of times you hear "tie up your jacket" at school gate is unreal, nearly every parent is saying it.

You say that you wouldn't make a 6-8yr old tie their jacket but if its a schoolrule then does that change your view?

byhookorbycrook

Tanya30 wrote: »

Where did my thread titled "school over-protective" go, is it merged into this one?

* Mod Note* Please don't post the same query in different fora.

implausible

This is mental!

The school are covering their asses by getting the kids to zip up their jackets, so she should zip it up. The rest of the time if she won't do it herself, it's not a big deal. She'll learn eventually.

indigo twist

I'd say let the school do what they want - if they want to enforce the rule, fine, if not ... whatever.

Outside of school, either don't let her out to play until she has zipped it up - or else just let her figure out how to regulate her body temperature herself, and personally I'd be leaning towards the latter.

She's eight years old, she's not a toddler. If she's feeling cold, she knows how to fix it ... So let her decide herself if she wants to continue to freeze, or go through the quick minor inconvenience of zipping up her coat. She'll soon figure it all out.

By the way, if the zip is a bit stiff/sticky, rub the stiff area well with a lead pencil. This acts as a dry lubricant and should help. You could also try Vaseline, but only a really tiny amount, as it can clog it up and make the problem worse.

Tanya30

In my opinion, it is common sense and necessary to tie up her jacket when its raining, snowing or windy especially with fact that she feels cold more than other kids.

Surely that isn't wrong?

Deenie123

Tanya30 wrote: »

In my opinion, it is common sense and necessary to tie up her jacket when its raining, snowing or windy especially with fact that she feels cold more than other kids.

Surely that isn't wrong?

So let her figure that out.

It it's only outside of school hours she's getting cold and wet either have a word with whoever is supervising the activities or just let her grow up and figure the coat business out herself. If she comes in frozen don't show her any special attention, just say she should have zipped her coat up and then dismiss the issue. If her clothes are all soaked and she needs to change them, let her pick out fresh clothes herself, change into them and bring her wet clothes either to the laundry hamper or to a radiator/drying rack to dry out by herself. She'll soon learn that a second spent zipping her coat up is easier than getting cold and wet.

Tanya30

She is lazy so I think her not tying jacket when asked is her way of trying to get it done for her.

Even at School she is asking teacher or friends to tie the jacket up for her.

Tanya30

Deenie123 wrote: »

So let her figure that out.

It it's only outside of school hours she's getting cold and wet either have a word with whoever is supervising the activities or just let her grow up and figure the coat business out herself. If she comes in frozen don't show her any special attention, just say she should have zipped her coat up and then dismiss the issue. If her clothes are all soaked and she needs to change them, let her pick out fresh clothes herself, change into them and bring her wet clothes either to the laundry hamper or to a radiator/drying rack to dry out by herself. She'll soon learn that a second spent zipping her coat up is easier than getting cold and wet.

She was on a guides camp a few weeks ago and learnt lesson about getting soaked/frozen but that didn't make her see that on certain days, jackets need to be worn and tied up.

One day the girls went on a mile or so hike but dd "forgot" to take her jacket that day as it was nice weather but, suddenly weather took turn for worse, it turned really cold/chucked down with rain. One of adults said to her "I think you better put on your jacket", dd complained at being cold and then very softly said "I didn't bring it because it was nice when we left" so adult said "you silly girl, you should still bring it just incase, well, if you freeze its your own fault!". She was out in pouring rain with no jacket for a very long time so when they got back to camp she was told to change her clothes.

After that incident, the adult kept an eye on her and made sure she was prepared, she "made sure" that anytime that they were outside of the tent for activities, she had her jacket on and fully tied up.

Once she had got back from camp the adult told me about incident so I explained that she feels cold more than others so needed jacket on, but I did agree with adult that she should face natural consequence of not wearing her jacket.

Poor adult felt so bad that she had made dd stay out in pouring rain with no jacket.

cyning

But she's 8. If she really felt the cold that much she's wear her jacket. Like my two year old will often throw off her jacket running around in the park but wouldn't if she was sitting in buggy. Wind isn't a reason to wear a jacket if she's not cold. Honestly I would stop making such a deal out of it. Let her get cold. Let her get wet: but make her put her own clothes in wash and dry them if she does it frequently. As long as you are certain there are no other reasons she's not tying it up.

Big Bag of Chips

The guides are great for teaching kids personal responsibility. There will be no long term damage from her not bringing her jacket and then getting cold or wet.. But, the longer people follow her around doing things for her the more she will depend on people to always make sure she has everything she needs.

Is she your first by any chance? My first is useless, and the same age! I have spent almost 9 years doing everything for him to the point that EVERY morning I have to tell him to put on shoes, tie, brush teeth, get coat, get bag.. Etc. Whereas No3 in the family is able to do all that unprompted!

Hard as it is to not follow her around reminding her to do things that is what you are going to have to start doing. She will eventually learn to make sure she is prepared before going anywhere... At least that's what I hope for my lad!

Tanya30

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

The guides are great for teaching kids personal responsibility. There will be no long term damage from her not bringing her jacket and then getting cold or wet.. But, the longer people follow her around doing things for her the more she will depend on people to always make sure she has everything she needs.

Is she your first by any chance? My first is useless, and the same age! I have spent almost 9 years doing everything for him to the point that EVERY morning I have to tell him to put on shoes, tie, brush teeth, get coat, get bag.. Etc. Whereas No3 in the family is able to do all that unprompted!

Hard as it is to not follow her around reminding her to do things that is what you are going to have to start doing. She will eventually learn to make sure she is prepared before going anywhere... At least that's what I hope for my lad!

She is my only child yeah.

After that day, adult from guides did make sure she had her jacket on and fully tied because they knew dd feels cold more than others. They had a few activities during night when weather was colder than morning so adult wanted her warm so asked dd to tie zip right to top.

Chocolate fiend

The school rule is the school rule, they have to get her to close it, during time away from school I would not make her close it, if she is cold she will close it herself.

Chocolate fiend

What makes you think she feels the cold more than others? That seems a strange point to continue making. If she really did, and if it was possible to quantify that then I think she would wear and close her coat.

Tanya30

I know that she feels cold more than others because I am parent and can see she shivers, anytime it is cold and especially in Winter. I think reason she doesn't tie jacket is because she doesn't want to spend a few seconds tying it up or is due to laziness, she is same at home, she wants me to; make her drinks, choose her clothes, brush her teeth/hair plus when we go out, she *always* holds my hand.

Also, at home, before School and after School once she has done homework, she is watching cartoons or playing xbox.

December2012

Nothing wrong with holding your hand, but do you give her proper opportunity to do things for herself like picking her own clothes?

Tanya30

Yes, I usually say to her "you can pick out your own clothes, I am not going to be moaned at for "picking wrong clothes".

To be honest, I am very worried about her wanting things done for her, is it a sign of laziness?

I too, don't mind holding her hand, nor do I mind giving out lots of hugs and kisses or her sitting on my lap from time to time. I kiss her, before she goes into school, when she gets out of school and before tucking her into bed plus, she only sits on my knee if she is bored or when she is looking for affection.

Chocolate fiend

Tanya30 wrote: »

I know that she feels cold more than others because I am parent and can see she shivers, anytime it is cold and especially in Winter. I think reason she doesn't tie jacket is because she doesn't want to spend a few seconds tying it up or is due to laziness, she is same at home, she wants me to; make her drinks, choose her clothes, brush her teeth/hair plus when we go out, she *always* holds my hand.

Also, at home, before School and after School once she has done homework, she is watching cartoons or playing xbox.

I have three children and they all shiver at times. They feel the cold as much or as little as other children.

Big Bag of Chips

Tanya30 wrote: »

To be honest, I am very worried about her wanting things done for her, is it a sign of laziness?

Yes it is! She knows if she doesn't do it, you will. So she just stalls a bit and then you step in and do whatever needs to be done. It's a learning curve for both of you. But she hasn't moved on from the baby stage where you had to do everything for her because she wasn't able. It is frustrating at this stage because you know she is at an age where she should be doing these things for herself. She's a bit behind her friends in terms of independence. But, and this is the important bit, she WILL catch up... Eventually. She is not going to be 19 heading out to college and still needing you to zip up her coat for her!

It's up to you when you want her to start becoming more independent and responsible for herself. Up to now, you doing everything for her was never really a problem. Now it is a problem. So now things have to change. Bit you will have to teach her. All she's ever known is you doing everything for her. So stepping up and doing things for herself isn't going to come naturally.

Btw, most kids shiver when it's cold, and they are not properly wrapped up. Depending on how cold it is anyone can shiver despite being wrapped up!

Tanya30

She was better today, she made her own bteakfast and brushed her own teeth/hair and even picked out clothes for later on :-).

Also, I let her watch t.v whilst eating but as soon as she was finished, I got her to get ready for School so she put on her shoes and jacket but came up to me and said "can you tie it up" but, I very calmly said "no, reason I got you to get ready early is so you can spend time with zip" so she tried very hard but kept losing patience, eventually after numerous attempts, she had managed to tie her own school jacket and was so proud :-). I then said to her "see, you can do it if you concentrate hard enough, now you can get longer time with friends".

She walked to School with friends but still wanted me there so she could hold my hand.

Tanya30

Why is it some kids don't want to fasten up their jackets when needed?

DD is really bad, it can be pouring down yet she leaves it wide open but on these days I just tell her that it needs fastened.

Nearly every parent at School gate during winter is saying to their child "it is raining, fasten your jacket please".

braddun

velcro