Landlord wants cash

deadwood85

landlord wants to be paid cash in hand.

am i protected if i do this?

we will have a lease,any info will help thanks

The_Morrigan

If the landlord wants cash then insist on a rent book to show rent paid.

Mrs OBumble

Protected from what?

From thugs who watch you withdrawing a month's rent from the ATM and mug you? No.

gaius c

deadwood85 wrote: »

landlord wants to be paid cash in hand.

am i protected if i do this?

we will have a lease,any info will help thanks

Nothing really wrong with it as such. I pay our rent in cash. Just get receipts.

JustAddWater

Eldarion wrote: »

And to be fair to Mrs O B it is a very valid warning.

Anybody dealing in cash in those kind of volumes is running a risky game. No reason at all not to be using bank transfers or standing orders in this day and age.

My last landlord asked for cash every month. The only 'good' thing is that he came around every month and any issues were brought up
However, having to be in some evening when he was calling was a pain as I pretty much like to keep my own schedule

One time I was going away and rent fell due while away. So I had to before going away run around trying to get rent from the ATM before heading to the airport as my rent exceeded my daily withdrawal limit

Other problem is from a bank statement perspective it looks like I went to the bank every pay day and withdrew large amounts of cash. Very hard to prove if you need to that it was for rent

whupdedo

Eldarion wrote: »

And to be fair to Mrs O B it is a very valid warning.

Anybody dealing in cash in those kind of volumes is running a risky game. No reason at all not to be using bank transfers or standing orders in this day and age.

But that's not for you to say, if the landlord wants cash and the o p is happy with the arrangement then what's the problem.

Her post is nonsense, how many people have you ever heard of getting mugged at a cash machine, very few I'd wager

If your happy with the arrangement op them theirs no problem, I get paid cash by my tenants and it helps pay the bills easier as I don't have to go to the bank as much or set up direct debits to pay the smaller bills

Mick Murdock

Cash isn't that uncommon depending on how rent is collected. If it's 500-600 a month I wouldn't be too concerned. Some landlords take weekly payment. If it's €1400 or something it's ridiculous and a massive pain in the arse.

ted1

deadwood85 wrote: »

landlord wants to be paid cash in hand.

am i protected if i do this?

we will have a lease,any info will help thanks

Get a receipt, or proof of payments

usernamegoes

I have heard of banks not being too keen on rent books as proof of payment for rent when applying for a mortgage.

gaius c

usernamegoes wrote: »

I have heard of banks not being too keen on rent books as proof of payment for rent when applying for a mortgage.

If you can show a corresponding withdrawal from your back account and it happens at the same time every month, it helps a lot.

hfallada

A lot of LLs like cash as it saves them hassle. I know plenty of LLs, that constantly are chasing tenants for rents with excuses like I made a lodgement into your account(the LL then has to wait for the lodgement to show into their account and only a few days later realise the tenant was lying and still hasnt paid). Where as you cant say the money is on the way, when you know the LL is at your house at first day of the month. I also saves them having to deal with bounced cheques or tenants post dating cheques(something you only realise when the bank teller says it to you).

Plus what kills most LLs is that no matter how many times you ask tenants to put their name onto lodgements. You still get several lodgements of "Rent" with no name. Its just easier for a LL to deal with cash.

And before any goes on about LLs and their tax evasion. There is tens of thousands of LLs in this country. But you are far more likely to see Doctors and Dentists on Revenues list of tax evaders than LLs.

firestarter51

i paid cash for five years, the landlord was sick at one stage and didnt collect for 9 weeks, he then said i owed him 13 weeks
thankfully i had a rent book he used to sign when he collected
i nearly sh!t a brick when he asked me for 1700 yoyo
i was doubting myself then and a big panic was on to find the rent book

drumswan

whupdedo wrote: »

I get paid cash by my tenants and it helps pay the bills easier as I don't have to go to the bank as much or set up direct debits to pay the smaller bills

Its not up to tenants to save their landlords hassle at the expense of their own convenience - the tenant is paying for a professional service.

Imagine another service provider suggesting you go to the bank to withdraw cash and they'd call over to your house to collect it - you would laugh at them.

Theres no excuse not to accept electronic transfer in this day and age. If a landlord expects payment in cash its a strong indicator you are dealing with a cowboy.

Gone West

drumswan wrote: »

Its not up to tenants to save their landlords hassle at the expense of their own convenience - the tenant is paying for a professional service.

Imagine another service provider suggesting you go to the bank to withdraw cash and they'd call over to your house to collect it - you would laugh at them.

Theres no excuse not to accept electronic transfer in this day and age.

Yes but how else can the landlord hide the cash from revenue?
What do you expect him to do? Start paying tax on it? What next, register with the PRTB?

Lux23

usernamegoes wrote: »

I have heard of banks not being too keen on rent books as proof of payment for rent when applying for a mortgage.

Very true, I work in a mortgage brokers and one of the first things they tell prospective first time buyers is that no matter who they pay their rent to (landlord, parents, siblings), that they should have an electronic record. A rent book is very easy to falsify.

I would be highly suspicious of any landlord who demands cash, I have never had it happen to me though.

drumswan

Fuzzy wrote: »

Yes but how else can the landlord hide the cash from revenue?
What do you expect him to do? Start paying tax on it? What next, register with the PRTB?

I wouldnt even go so far as to say they are tax dodging and unregistered, though obviously some are. It just screams unprofessionalism and would cause any decent professional renter to want to run a mile. Unfortunately in todays environment many dont have a choice with who they have to deal with when renting.

runawaybishop

drumswan wrote: »

Its not up to tenants to save their landlords hassle at the expense of their own convenience - the tenant is paying for a professional service.

Imagine another service provider suggesting you go to the bank to withdraw cash and they'd call over to your house to collect it - you would laugh at them.

Theres no excuse not to accept electronic transfer in this day and age. If a landlord expects payment in cash its a strong indicator you are dealing with a cowboy.

There is a perfect excuse, it suits the landlord to get paid in cash and they dictate the terms of payment. There are plenty of valid reasons to want cash, and plenty not to. Its not the tenants place to dictate though.

Lux23

runawaybishop wrote: »

There is a perfect excuse, it suits the landlord to get paid in cash and they dictate the terms of payment. There are plenty of valid reasons to want cash, and plenty not to. Its not the tenants place to dictate though.

What if the tenant compromised and gave the landlord a bank draft every month? I honestly wouldn't keep that kind of cash in my flat every month.

runawaybishop

Lux23 wrote: »

What if the tenant compromised and gave the landlord a bank draft every month? I honestly wouldn't keep that kind of cash in my flat every month.

Only the LL can answer that.

Starscream25

It could mean the landlord isn't registered, in that case look elsewhere.

drumswan

runawaybishop wrote: »

There is a perfect excuse, it suits the landlord to get paid in cash and they dictate the terms of payment. There are plenty of valid reasons to want cash, and plenty not to. Its not the tenants place to dictate though.

Fair enough. I wouldnt rent from a landlord who demanded cash, its smacks of unprofessionalism and marks them out as the sort of cowboy to be avoided. In a way its a helpful indicator for a prospective tenant.

runawaybishop

drumswan wrote: »

Fair enough. I wouldnt rent from a landlord who demanded cash, its smacks of unprofessionalism and marks them out as the sort of cowboy to be avoided. In a way its a helpful indicator for a prospective tenant.

Whats wrong with asking for cash? Its instant and liquid. Cash is the best way to be paid for a lot of people.

Alf Veedersane

Back in college, I paid a landlord in cash. There wasn't a hope he was declaring it but the room in the house was nice and the people I lived with were nice and it was a damn sight better than the sh*tholes I had looked at for the same price even if it didn't have the multi-tasking option of cooking as you took a dump.

It doesn't always have to be an 'avoid at all costs' situation.

drumswan

runawaybishop wrote: »

Whats wrong with asking for cash? Its instant and liquid. Cash is the best way to be paid for a lot of people.

Im not concerned about it being the best way to get paid - its far from the best way to pay. Professional people are used to paying for services via electronic bank transfer managed from an online account, not by bunging envelops full of cash at some clown at the door every month.

Its inconvenient - I would have to take time out of my day each month to withdraw cash and again to be somewhere to pay it over.
There is no electronic payment trail - no use for a mortgage, in a dispute scenario etc.
There is a safety element to handling large sums of cash.

Like I said, its another handy indicator that the landlord doesnt understand that he is providing a professional service to the renter and a marker on who to avoid. Unfortunately for the landlord it will leave him with the sort of tenant who doesnt expect a professional standard and as a consequence will likely be less aware of their obligations.

runawaybishop

drumswan wrote: »

Im not concerned about it being the best way to get paid - its far from the best way to pay. Professional people are used to paying for services via electronic bank transfer managed from an online account, not by bunging envelops full of cash at some clown at the door every month.

Its inconvenient - I would have to take time out of my day each month to withdraw cash and again to be somewhere to pay it over.
There is no electronic payment trail - no use for a mortgage, in a dispute scenario etc.
There is a safety element to handling large sums of cash.

Like I said, its another handy indicator that the landlord doesnt understand that he is providing a professional service to the renter and a marker on who to avoid. Unfortunately for the landlord it will leave him with the sort of tenant who doesnt expect a professional standard and as a consequence will likely be less aware of their obligations.

Then said professional people should have made the acceptable payment terms known before the tenancy.

There is a perfectly acceptable paper trail, you get a receipt and rent book. There is nothing really unprofessional about cash, its just handy to have and doesn't get delayed by bank holidays, issue with online banking etc.

debabyjesus

I would simply walk away as soon as cash was mentioned, someone calling to your door every month or even every week looking for cash... no thanks.

Phonecalls, waiting in, then they're late, more phonecalls.... joke.

superman28

I'm amazed that posters here seem to think to paying cash is acceptable or normal practice..


This goes against you for any mortgage application as you have no electronic proof of regular payment for rent,, a major part of applying for a mortgage..

This promotes illegal tax evasion and the idea that you should withdraw over 1000 euro cash and keep it in a drawer for a landlord to collect is not smart..

This also means the landlord will visit your property each month to collect payment as mentioned this is inconvenient for you as you have to hang around for him to call around..

If you are going to help the landlord engage in criminality I would at least look for a 20% reduction in your rent per month.. as you are paying cash..

drumswan

runawaybishop wrote: »

Then said professional people should have made the acceptable payment terms known before the tenancy.

Like I said, I wouldnt take such a tenancy, nor would many other professional people who choose to rent I imagine. The cash cowboys can stick with the students and confused foreign nationals.

runawaybishop

superman28 wrote: »

I'm amazed that posters here seem to think to paying cash is acceptable or normal practice..


This goes against you for any mortgage application as you have no electronic proof of regular payment for rent,, a major part of applying for a mortgage..

This promotes illegal tax evasion and the idea that you should withdraw over 1000 euro cash and keep it in a drawer for a landlord to collect is not smart..

This also means the landlord will visit your property each month to collect payment as mentioned this is inconvenient for you as you have to hang around for him to call around..

If you are going to help the landlord engage in criminality I would at least look for a 20% reduction in your rent per month.. as you are paying cash..

This is largely incorrect and just speculation. A rent book and financial records of withdrawals is all you need for your mortgage application.

If you think your landlord is engaging in illegal activity you shoudl report them.

runawaybishop

drumswan wrote: »

Like I said, I wouldnt take such a tenancy, nor would many other professional people who choose to rent I imagine. The cash cowboys can stick with the students and confused foreign nationals.

What's with branding them cowboys? Have you never dealt with a landlord of a single property who pays all his bills in the local post office?

El_Duderino 09

runawaybishop wrote: »

Then said professional people should have made the acceptable payment terms known before the tenancy.

There is a perfectly acceptable paper trail, you get a receipt and rent book. There is nothing really unprofessional about cash, its just handy to have and doesn't get delayed by bank holidays, issue with online banking etc.

Lol at the idea that there are less potential problems with making a cash handoff than with standing order.

One party is on holidays on rent day.
One party gets stuck in traffic and the other has to wait around.
One party has to work late.
One party can't get all the cash out of an ATM on one day.
One party has bank card lost/stolen.
One party has to take their child/friend/pet goldfish/child's friend's pet goldfish to doctor.
One party forgot.

In each of those circumstances a standing order would go through regardless and takes no communication or planning. Sure a Bank holiday might delay the payment. With 8 bank holidays a year and 30 days per month, a bank holiday is likely to fall on rent day about once every 3.75 Years so your point stands but it is very weak.

There's no reason to assume it's dodgy and if there are receipts then it would seem above board, but it is notmore convenient for either party and could suggest an "old school" Irish LL, which I would be wary of.

cob1

maybe he'd take BitCoins instead?

drumswan

runawaybishop wrote: »

What's with branding them cowboys? Have you never dealt with a landlord of a single property who pays all his bills in the local post office?

I dealt with the chaps who came around collecting cash when I was a young fella renting in doss houses in Rathmines. they were all cowboys to a man. Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Im older now and expect a professional service from someone with whom I am in a ~15k a year contract with. I dont give a toss where he pays his bills, thats none of my concern. All of my previous three landlords have been reasonably professional, there was never any question of cash payment.

El_Duderino 09

cob1 wrote: »

maybe he'd take BitCoins instead?

BitCoins? Whah are dem? and can you use them at the post office?

Rob Thomas

Every situation is different and there are plenty of reasons, good and bad, why the landlord would look to collect the rent in cash in person.

There is plenty of speculation around motives but the tenant should only really be concerned about their end of the agreement. If they are happy to be payng in cash and it does not negatively affect their own position, then it's a solution which suits everyone.

The only issue which everyone would have to accept is around the receipts and rent book. It's obvious that a rent book stamped with receipts is not going to be quite as strong as an electronic transfer for proving rent payments, when you are dealing with a bank for a mortgage. In marginal cases, it may be the difference between getting it or not. You can have all the back up you think you need, but it's the least common way nowadays to pay rent (cash) and the Irish psyche is always to be suspicious.

With regard to tenancy rights, declaring the money or not, cash or transfer... None of that makes any difference to your rights in the event of a dispute.

Not2Good

usernamegoes wrote: »

I have heard of banks not being too keen on rent books as proof of payment for rent when applying for a mortgage.

Yeah, having regular full monthly rent showing on your statements can help a lot if thinking of going for mortgage soon ….

Mick Murdock

The best landlord I ever had (when I was a student) took cash payment. I think it was €600pm. There is a big difference between someone paying 15K a year and somebody living in a flat and paying 150 quid a week. If it's a significant sum there's no way I'd pay in cash but a bedsit and I don't see the problem.

runawaybishop

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Lol at the idea that there are less potential problems with making a cash handoff than with standing order.

One party is on holidays on rent day.
One party gets stuck in traffic and the other has to wait around.
One party has to work late.
One party can't get all the cash out of an ATM on one day.
One party has bank card lost/stolen.
One party has to take their child/friend/pet goldfish/child's friend's pet goldfish to doctor.
One party forgot.

In each of those circumstances a standing order would go through regardless and takes no communication or planning. Sure a Bank holiday might delay the payment. With 8 bank holidays a year and 30 days per month, a bank holiday is likely to fall on rent day about once every 3.75 Years so your point stands but it is very weak.

There's no reason to assume it's dodgy and if there are receipts then it would seem above board, but it is notmore convenient for either party and could suggest an "old school" Irish LL, which I would be wary of.

All of those things are easy to arrange with the ll/tenant though, arranging stuff with the bank can be trickier. It may not even be easier, but the ll finds it handier and they dictate the payment terms. You don't really get to decide if its convenient for the LL, they decide that themselves.

runawaybishop

drumswan wrote: »

I dealt with the chaps who came around collecting cash when I was a young fella renting in doss houses in Rathmines. they were all cowboys to a man. Maybe a coincidence, maybe not.

Im older now and expect a professional service from someone with whom I am in a ~15k a year contract with. I dont give a toss where he pays his bills, thats none of my concern. All of my previous three landlords have been reasonably professional, there was never any question of cash payment.

So you had a bad experience, fair enough. I've had a good experience with a LL that wouldnt know what a computer was if it hit him in the face. I paid him in cash, got a receipt and he was totally professional, any issues were fixed the next day or within 2 days.

You mightn't give a toss where the LL pays his bills, similarly the LL doesn't need to give a toss if you don't like cash.

Paying in cash isn't the end of the world

drumswan

runawaybishop wrote: »

Paying in cash isn't the end of the world

Never said it was the end of the world, just not something I am interested in doing. Ive better things to be doing than organising my time around someone I am paying large amounts of money for a service. Maybe others value their time less I suppose.

laurenhiggins

Just have a rent book and get receipts

El_Duderino 09

runawaybishop wrote: »

All of those things are easy to arrange with the ll/tenant though, arranging stuff with the bank can be trickier. It may not even be easier, but the ll finds it handier and they dictate the payment terms. You don't really get to decide if its convenient for the LL, they decide that themselves.

The circumstances I outlined above are emergencies or events with short notice. Bank Holidays are known years in advance allowing time to arrange an alternative. Be serious. If you wanted payment before a bank holiday you would put it in the contract and a single phone call once in 3.75 years would tell the tenant to pay the money early. I understand your point. It's valid once every 3.75 years and its really weak.

In the 21st century relying on cash is a sign of a moron who cant use the computer machines, or a very unprofessional landlord or a very professional cowboy. This behaviour will become extinct in the very near future.

kristian12

Whatever happens make sure cash is never handed over without a receipt. We had a landlord who insisted on cash and it was ok for a long time. Then he forgot his receipt book but having a good relationship we weren't worried and said we'd get it the following month. We forgot all about it, this happened twice in 6 yrs.

No problems at all until we came to leave and he said we owed him 2 months rent and demanding it back. We had no proof we'd paid him. He turned up on our new doorstep, my partners job and told our former neighbours we owed him thousands. Foolishly but out of desperation to stop him we paid him the 2 months again.

I am not saying for one minute that all landlords would do this and I'm pretty sure the majority wouldn't but it's worth remembering that it's not a friendship but a business arrangement which can sour quickly once it's no longer beneficial to both parties.

Tigger

hfallada wrote: »

And before any goes on about LLs and their tax evasion. There is tens of thousands of LLs in this country. But you are far more likely to see Doctors and Dentists on Revenues list of tax evaders than LLs.

Revenue list defaulters by occupation
So doctor landlords and dentist landlords are what is show
Landlord isnt an occupation

REXER

gaius c wrote: »

Nothing really wrong with it as such. I pay our rent in cash. Just get receipts.

it's just that 19th century inconvenience of having to go to the bank, withdraw the money, go to another location to hand over the cash. (With the added risk of carrying a large amount of cash monthly)

In this day and age it is unnecessary and quite uncalled for.
It would be just so simple to do a bank transfer, but then the transaction would be visible, documented and trackable to all parties, possibly including revenue commissioners.

REXER

runawaybishop wrote: »

There is a perfect excuse, it suits the landlord to get paid in cash and they dictate the terms of payment. There are plenty of valid reasons to want cash, and plenty not to. Its not the tenants place to dictate though.

Ever heard of voting with your feet???

I know that LLs think they can do as they please at the moment, but the situation will swing back again!

REXER

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

The circumstances I outlined above are emergencies or events with short notice. Bank Holidays are known years in advance allowing time to arrange an alternative. Be serious. If you wanted payment before a bank holiday you would put it in the contract and a single phone call once in 3.75 years would tell the tenant to pay the money early. I understand your point. It's valid once every 3.75 years and its really weak.

In the 21st century relying on cash is a sign of a moron who cant use the computer machines, or a very unprofessional landlord or a very professional cowboy. This behaviour will become extinct in the very near future.

I really, really hope so!!!

gaius c

Starscream25 wrote: »

It could mean the landlord isn't registered, in that case look elsewhere.

In the current market, you don't really have a lot of choice.

gaius c

REXER wrote: »

it's just that 19th century inconvenience of having to go to the bank, withdraw the money, go to another location to hand over the cash. (With the added risk of carrying a large amount of cash monthly)

In this day and age it is unnecessary and quite uncalled for.
It would be just so simple to do a bank transfer, but then the transaction would be visible, documented and trackable to all parties, possibly including revenue commissioners.

Basically I agree but the rental market is borked so a lot of compromises have to be made.

stateofflux

I pay cash monthly to my landlord. id prefer a direct debit but he is pretty sound. i have no doubt that a lot of landlords that insist on cash do it to avoid tax.

Mrs OBumble

runawaybishop wrote: »

There are plenty of valid reasons to want cash

Can you name a few?

Frankly, any business transactions need to be auditable, which means not made in cash.