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The gift of land.

  • 20-10-2014 8:09pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭


    Evening lads,

    please bear with me on this one it could get lenghty.

    I have a handy sized farm at the moment, was wrecked when i took it over three years ago and is now starting to turn for the better. Its been a struggle financially and emotionally with all the usual crap that goes with taking on the family farm. At the moment I have 170 ewes and 60 hoggets, very little in entitlements and this year joined Aeos so the income is modest to say the least. We ploughed a lot of money into the farm the last few years and I still haven't drawn a penny for myself. Clown !!

    Now the father in law wants me to take over his farm next year or 2016 . Ill health is forcing his hand, not his fondness for me!!

    Its set up for beef, 70 acres of reasonable land, few fields need drainage all need reseeding, slatted unit,new crush,new meal bin , a clean tidy farmer in fairness to him. Also has a tractor and a few bits to go with it.

    lads are wondering what s my problem. Well firstly i know very little about beef and nothing about the running of a beef farm. Would be rode bareback and sideways if i went buying in the mart.

    Was hoping to fatten my lambs instead of selling as stores but to fence even half the place would break me. Don't get me wrong this is a good problem to have,getting land and having to decide what to do with it i know some lads would love to farm but can't. At the moment i haven't enough land to be a full time farmer and this opportunity could now bring something I've always wanted,full time farming.

    so its not a pipe dream or anything it will happen. So give me your thoughts lads please. What's the future for beef coz all i hear is negativity, is your system profitable any one ever jumped in at the deep end like this?

    I would like to have a crack off of this and am pretty determined and stubborn. Would be nice to build it up for the next generation too.

    Right lads I'll leave it at that for the moment, thanks for reading. Now hit me....


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 461 ✭✭mikefoxo


    You could fence it with electric wire. Three strands powered by a solar generator and stick to the sheep??


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    first things first, stick to what you know, experiment when you can afford to.
    the ould probably won;t like this but find someone who wants to rent it for 5 years and work with the renter to improve the boundary fencing and some of the other bits. then take it back over, you can then populate it with sheep from your own flock rather than buyin in loads of them


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,029 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    I suppose you could kind of carry on the same sort of system as is there currently till you find your feet... If you can mix sheep and beef it'd be better again.. And keep your options open- while beef mightn't be Flavour of the month at the moment , fellas still seem to make a living at it... If you can keep your costs down ..

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,326 ✭✭✭Farmer Pudsey


    There is a grant for fencing for sheep. On good land you should make a profit. The Father-in-law may be able to give you a hand buying and selling stock. &70 acres would be a substandical sheep farm. 300+ ewe's. However with 230 of your own you be at over 500 ewes. You might be right to consider fattening your own lambs. Fence 15-30 acre of his land. and carry your sheep to finish. Start with 20-30 bullocks. stocking it will be an issue if you go down the contenintal route. However goodish Fresian store can be got for 600/head.

    You cannot really rent it if he want you to take it over. As a matter of interest are you and if you have a better half is she working as well. Remember farm losses can be written off again tax.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Thanks lads,

    wife works full-time have two children two and almost five . I look after them for the morning then nana granny and an aunt mind em until herself comes home while i do a bit of sheep farming. Days are hectic to say the least. I would prefer not to rent it but maybe that's just pride and unhelpful!

    half beef half sheep sounds good but stocking with beef might get expensive again my inexperience shines


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭Genghis Cant


    foxylock wrote: »
    Now the father in law wants me to take over his farm next year or 2016 . Ill health is forcing his hand, not his fondness for me!!

    Could you do it on a phased basis with some help/involvement from the FIL?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Could you do it on a phased basis with some help/involvement from the FIL?

    health is a big issue if he could keep going he would work it. Be there for advice, etc but not hands on. This could literally happen in a week or 18 months. I need to have a clear plan in place and not be arsing around too much....... Always a bit of arsing going on here!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,566 ✭✭✭J.O. Farmer


    Without going into the ill health of your FIL perhaps he could act in an advisory capacity to you. Maybe he could help pick out cattle in the mart or advise you on stock and husbandry.
    Long term perhaps having some of your farm in beef could be good as in not all your eggs in one basket.
    What sort of beef stock is currently on the farm. Also if it's a year or so before you take over you can learn from the FIL. You were hardly born an expert in sheep either.
    Maybe you can fence a few fields rather than the entire boundary. Also you know you're sheep and the land there might be some which will stay with the fencing as it is or a few spots better fenced. We run sheep in land in a similar situation only fenced for cattle but we're careful of what we put in and have had to improve on parts. Long term I intend to fence it right but for now we're getting away with it.
    You have options and while it might take a few years to be farming full time it's hard to see a stranger farming the family land.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,241 ✭✭✭✭Kovu


    Would you put any thought to B&B or rearing dairy heifers foxylock? Just until you have a bit of cashflow to stock it with your own.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,493 ✭✭✭Greengrass1


    Kovu wrote: »
    Would you put any thought to B&B or rearing dairy heifers foxylock? Just until you have a bit of cashflow to stock it with your own.

    That's a good suggestion kovu. Theres not much to rearing heifers. Any stock even.
    Just good grass good dosing/vaccination routine


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Mad4simmental


    Kovu wrote: »
    Would you put any thought to B&B or rearing dairy heifers foxylock? Just until you have a bit of cashflow to stock it with your own.

    +1 might be perfect for sumone like yourself. Work with a local dairy lad for a few years contract raring heifers and learn as you go.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Didn't consider the dairy heifers, tell me more. How do you get paid, time on farm or weight gain? Would like to increase sheep numbers too.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,241 ✭✭✭✭Kovu


    I only know the basics as regards daily gains/targets/vacc etc but I'm sure the dairy lads can fill you in!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,315 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    foxylock wrote: »
    Now the father in law wants me to take over his farm next year or 2016 . Ill health is forcing his hand, not his fondness for me!!
    What do you get out of it?
    Do you get anything out of it?
    Will the land be sold and the proceeds split between his children, or will you get the land?
    If the land is sold, does the livestock also get sold, and if so, do you get any money from it, or will the livestock be seen as his farm, and thus you don't have any right to a portion of it?

    If he gives you the land, how much tax will you have to pay for it?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,396 ✭✭✭✭Timmaay


    the_syco wrote: »
    What do you get out of it?
    Do you get anything out of it?
    Will the land be sold and the proceeds split between his children, or will you get the land?
    If the land is sold, does the livestock also get sold, and if so, do you get any money from it, or will the livestock be seen as his farm, and thus you don't have any right to a portion of it?

    If he gives you the land, how much tax will you have to pay for it?

    Some very useful questions above. I know you only got the one family and all that, but by the sounds of it you are stretched as is, I'd suggest you do what's best for you rather than what you think the FIL wants. If you said the FIL isn't too fond of you, you taking over it could be a totally poisoned chalice, with him consistently on your back about any changes you make!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    the_syco wrote: »
    What do you get out of it?
    Do you get anything out of it?
    Will the land be sold and the proceeds split between his children, or will you get the land?
    If the land is sold, does the livestock also get sold, and if so, do you get any money from it, or will the livestock be seen as his farm, and thus you don't have any right to a portion of it?

    If he gives you the land, how much tax will you have to pay for it?

    its not a will this will be done before he dies. The land will be passed to the next generation (seemingly that's a big thing with these lads). Tax wise a few grand will take care of it have looked into that already. Stock will be sold before i take over. They're his animals. If you got a free car would you demand a full tank of petrol.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,580 ✭✭✭Mad4simmental


    foxylock wrote: »
    Didn't consider the dairy heifers, tell me more. How do you get paid, time on farm or weight gain? Would like to increase sheep numbers too.

    http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057168325/1/#post89447187

    http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056633224/1/#post78558587

    http://touch.boards.ie/thread/2056030819/1/#post67986486

    Sum light reading. See what you think. You don't need big money to stock the land and the few quid you make you could reseed & fence a field a year. Roam wasn't built in a day. Best of luck whatever you go at.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Timmaay wrote: »
    Some very useful questions above. I know you only got the one family and all that, but by the sounds of it you are stretched as is, I'd suggest you do what's best for you rather than what you think the FIL wants. If you said the FIL isn't too fond of you, you taking over it could be a totally poisoned chalice, with him consistently on your back about any changes you make!

    that's a worry but would you look a gift horse in the mouth ?? No one wants a lad on their back,but I need to think of my own kids too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,315 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    foxylock wrote: »
    its not a will this will be done before he dies. The land will be passed to the next generation (seemingly that's a big thing with these lads). Tax wise a few grand will take care of it have looked into that already. Stock will be sold before i take over. They're his animals. If you got a free car would you demand a full tank of petrol.
    I'm trying to figure out why is he giving you the land if he doesn't like you? Are you the only farmer in his extended family, and if not, try to find out why he picked you, or more to the point, why his own siblings aren't touching it.
    foxylock wrote: »
    that's a worry but would you look a gift horse in the mouth ??
    As per my above point, ensure it's a gift horse, and not one foot into pool of quicksand.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    the_syco wrote: »
    I'm trying to figure out why is he giving you the land if he doesn't like you? Are you the only farmer in his extended family, and if not, try to find out why he picked you, or more to the point, why his own siblings aren't touching it.


    As per my above point, ensure it's a gift horse, and not one foot into pool of quicksand.

    nothing sinister there his children have no interest in it. The auctioneer would be called straight away. I would do my best to work it, just looking for options and advice.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,855 ✭✭✭I said


    What's wrong with a new challenge at least try it and regret it after


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,497 ✭✭✭rangler1


    It'll be very hard for you to finance the second farm when you're struggling in your own farm, but in order to get this farm, I would consider renting out my own and using the proceeds to develop the new farm.
    This is a huge opportunity for you to increase the viability of your farming, yet you have to ensure your family doesn't suffer for it financially. You mightn't like my suggestion, but you have the chance of a gift worth probably €500k, it would be foolish not to take the chance


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,029 ✭✭✭Markcheese


    rangler1 wrote: »
    It'll be very hard for you to finance the second farm when you're struggling in your own farm, but in order to get this farm, I would consider renting out my own and using the proceeds to develop the new farm.
    This is a huge opportunity for you to increase the viability of your farming, yet you have to ensure your family doesn't suffer for it financially. You mightn't like my suggestion, but you have the chance of a gift worth probably €500k, it would be foolish not to take the chance

    That may not be a terrible idea ... Depending a bit on how far apart the two blocks are and where you're living ...

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    rangler1 wrote: »
    It'll be very hard for you to finance the second farm when you're struggling in your own farm, but in order to get this farm, I would consider renting out my own and using the proceeds to develop the new farm.
    This is a huge opportunity for you to increase the viability of your farming, yet you have to ensure your family doesn't suffer for it financially. You mightn't like my suggestion, but you have the chance of a gift worth probably €500k, it would be foolish not to take the chance

    have worked like a dog to get my own place up to scratch, if i let some lad in i can almost guarantee you it will go backwards again.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 206 ✭✭ford 5600


    foxylock wrote: »
    have worked like a dog to get my own place up to scratch, if i let some lad in i can almost guarantee you it will go backwards again.

    Maybe it's the fact that your FIL has seen the love you have for land and the improvements for the better made to your own place. Setting his place would be a kick in the teeth to him, after giving it to you. He seems to think you have what it takes to farm it. Where does your wife, his daughter, stand on any of this ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    ford 5600 wrote: »
    Maybe it's the fact that your FIL has seen the love you have for land and the improvements for the better made to your own place. Setting his place would be a kick in the teeth to him, after giving it to you. He seems to think you have what it takes to farm it. Where does your wife, his daughter, stand on any of this ?

    she has no big emotional tie to the place actually more attached to my few acres! But land comes up with the possibility of an income from it and with the hope of keeping it. Selling doesn't come into it to be honest and maybe that's my influence. Worst case scenario for me is having to lease it long-term and watch it slowly die. Would prefer to get it up and running ourselves however that brings its own set of problems.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,168 ✭✭✭milkprofit


    the_syco wrote: »
    What do you get out of it?
    Do you get anything out of it?
    Will the land be sold and the proceeds split between his children, or will you get the land?
    If the land is sold, does the livestock also get sold, and if so, do you get any money from it, or will the livestock be seen as his farm, and thus you don't have any right to a portion of it?

    If he gives you the land, how much tax will you have to pay for it?

    Now the father in law wants me to take over his farm next year or 2016 . Ill health is forcing his hand, not his fondness for me
    !What does this mean Is it transfered to u
    Clarifiy all above first


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    milkprofit wrote: »
    Now the father in law wants me to take over his farm next year or 2016 . Ill health is forcing his hand, not his fondness for me
    !What does this mean Is it transfered to u
    Clarifiy all above first

    i think its clear enough, his health is deteriorating so he needs someone to step in , has no son daughters will sell, so its me by default ! Its willed already but he wants to hand over sooner rather than later


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,497 ✭✭✭rangler1


    foxylock wrote: »
    have worked like a dog to get my own place up to scratch, if i let some lad in i can almost guarantee you it will go backwards again.

    I understand very well, as I'm coming to the stage that I'll have to do the same and it is hard to get a good tenant.
    But you'll have to bury yourself in debt to develop the two places, you'll be selling your soul to the bank


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    rangler1 wrote: »
    I understand very well, as I'm coming to the stage that I'll have to do the same and it is hard to get a good tenant.
    But you'll have to bury yourself in debt to develop the two places, you'll be selling your soul to the bank

    don't like the sound of that either, but i appreciate the sentiment.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,917 ✭✭✭BarryD


    I'm not a farmer but I'm self employed. I think there's a lot to be said for developing slowly - living within your means etc. The income from one project supports the family but also provides the cash needed to develop the next. That way, you keep in control of your situation and take the pressure off. I'm sure I don't need to tell you that no one owes you a living and markets/ people can be fickle etc.

    Maybe you can manage this in some way so as to keep your in laws happy but minimise your initial investment and workload. Then as things improve over time and the bank balance improves, develop things further.

    Would some of the land on either farm be suited to forestry? Maybe the grants are gone now but this might be a way to put aside some ground into a longer term project.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    BarryD wrote: »
    I'm not a farmer but I'm self employed. I think there's a lot to be said for developing slowly - living within your means etc. The income from one project supports the family but also provides the cash needed to develop the next. That way, you keep in control of your situation and take the pressure off. I'm sure I don't need to tell you that no one owes you a living and markets/ people can be fickle etc.

    Maybe you can manage this in some way so as to keep your in laws happy but minimise your initial investment and workload. Then as things improve over time and the bank balance improves, develop things further.

    Would some of the land on either farm be suited to forestry? Maybe the grants are gone now but this might be a way to put aside some ground into a longer term project.

    i have a small piece of forestry already but it really is for land that can't be farmed. The rest would be better for grazing


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,282 ✭✭✭Deepsouthwest


    An awful lot of negativity in this thread, if I was offered the opportunity to farm another 70 acres plus housing and machinery for free I'd feel like I'd just won the lotto. If someone can't make a go of this then he shouldn't be farming. Most people pay €600,000 or more for this opportunity and still make it work. I'm not aiming this at u foxylocks, but in general. This is a gift horse.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    An awful lot of negativity in this thread, if I was offered the opportunity to farm another 70 acres plus housing and machinery for free I'd feel like I'd just won the lotto. If someone can't make a go of this then he shouldn't be farming. Most people pay €600,000 or more for this opportunity and still make it work. I'm not aiming this at u foxylocks, but in general. This is a gift horse.

    i agree with you wholeheartedly. I suppose the original idea of the thread was to get lads ideas on different systems and pick one that works. It has slightly gone into a should i stay or go scenario. i will stay, i will farm it but the system is the main question.

    if i was reading this and not involved I would probably think " poxy f****r what's the problem"


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,326 ✭✭✭Farmer Pudsey


    rangler1 wrote: »
    I understand very well, as I'm coming to the stage that I'll have to do the same and it is hard to get a good tenant.
    But you'll have to bury yourself in debt to develop the two places, you'll be selling your soul to the bank

    Go for it and worry about it after. I bought 60 acres 10 years ago best decision I ever made. Good land is easier to handle than poorish land. Keep away from sucklers. You have the bones of 250 sheep already, as you have a skilset in them building up another 200+ over 3-5 year may be a struggle but you got this this stage you will manage.

    Goo with bullocks forget about meal make good silage and house over the winter. You buy 200kg frsian weanlings at present for 300-330 euro good one's at that. 20K would go a long way in stocking at the start price of a car. Forget about jeeps and big tractors. Low cost low i/p ( and yes it will be low profit) operation. Build up grass banks for auntumn and close as you go along for spring. 100 pig tales and a few reels of fence string goes a long way in paddocking. Join a btap dicussion group.

    If Fresian calves are cheap next spring (50ish euro) buy 20 rear and a bit of ration will give you goodish calves next autunm.

    You are one of those caught by the way SFP is distributed you may qualify throught the National Reserve. Are you in a DA if so between two farms you will gave 4.5K. GLAS another 5K.

    Farming is about a bit of money here and a bit there.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 206 ✭✭ford 5600


    You don't need to have a 2014 tractor, half an acre of concrete, ditches cut to the scut, fields reseeded and post and rail fencing all around the farm. Most contractors and merchants collecting accounts owed, will tell you places with all of the above are the hard places to get money out of. If it's spent on those things , someone will have to go short. Walk before you can run, don't go mad spending. Spread two bags to the acre of 18 6 12 to the acre, lime if you need it. Get a bit of heart into the land first. Reseeding is all well and good, but a waste of money if fertility is poor, and will cost hundreds per acre to do. Go for it and do your best, you will be rewarded.
    Ps, do any of the wife's sisters have to be paid off ? Not being nosey, but you mentioned that they would sell the farm the minute they got it. If so, they will hardly let you get it for free , and they get nothing. You could do worse than see your account ant and your solicitor before getting too deep.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,348 ✭✭✭razor8


    First thing I would do is soil sample all ground and put out lime if required, no point throwing out fertiliser if soil fertility isn't right

    Stocking it I would Personally buy broken mouthed horn ewes at €50/€60 from high up the mountain and put the best blue Leicester you can buy with them. If your concerned with them roaming put them on your own farm and put your existing stock on the new farm. Kill ewes following year and repeat. Cheap option IMO. Thrive will be fantastic for first few years as ground will be clean from sheep worms
    Any spare money I would use on fencing and do a little each year


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,222 ✭✭✭Kevhog1988


    As someone who reads the farming & forestry section religiously whilst saving to buy some land i would look at what you have been offered as a serious opportunity.
    A lot of the guys have made very valid points already that you would need to have any chance of your wife's siblings trying to claim land etc put to bed before commencing. As bad as it sounds a consultation with a solicitor would be a good idea.

    With regards to stocking the land etc the b&b for dairy heifers does seem like an excellent source of income which can then be put towards upgrading of facilities for your own needs. You could start off with x amount of other peoples cattle and then downgrade the numbers as you slowly increase your own animals.

    If your father in law is still going to farm the land for the moment could you possibly shadow him in the mornings whilst you usually mind the kids. (possibly a relative will help out with looking after them). This would allow you to see how he runs things, what you would do similar/different and i suppose get a feel for the place also.

    It's a serious opportunity and I'm sure if you put in the hard graft you have put in on your own farm you will be justly rewarded. Best of luck and dont forget to keep us updated as to your progress.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Thanks again lads, a few things that have come up.

    No pay off the house and a couple of sites sorted that and all in writing.

    Not a fan of the shiny jeeps and tractors what's there is adequate.

    Have accountant on board so again we know what's coming there.

    I like the idea of breeding mules but maybe that's the die hard sheep man in me ! Again fencing would be the cost.

    €50 calves would they break my balls ?

    what about the health implications of keeping stock from someone else 's holding with your own. Is it even possible.?

    Bank loans, i have a strong dislike of borrowing but maybe its a necessary evil again that would need careful consideration.

    And yes we do realise and appreciate such a huge opportunity, that's why I'm here.

    thanks for reading.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,326 ✭✭✭Farmer Pudsey


    foxylock wrote: »
    Thanks again lads, a few things that have come up.

    No pay off the house and a couple of sites sorted that and all in writing.

    Not a fan of the shiny jeeps and tractors what's there is adequate.

    Have accountant on board so again we know what's coming there.

    I like the idea of breeding mules but maybe that's the die hard sheep man in me ! Again fencing would be the cost.

    €50 calves would they break my balls ?

    what about the health implications of keeping stock from someone else 's holding with your own. Is it even possible.?

    Bank loans, i have a strong dislike of borrowing but maybe its a necessary evil again that would need careful consideration.

    And yes we do realise and appreciate such a huge opportunity, that's why I'm here.

    thanks for reading.

    Friesian can be cheap and cheerful. I prefer to lose a 50 euro Friesian rather than a 300 euro HE bull. They both be much the same age when you buy. Other option is buying the older friesian calf but he will cost extra. If you are unsure of rearing calves go the weanling route. But I was looking at a fast cheap stocking option.

    Biggest disadvantage of Friesians is that you will have to finish. If heifer rearing you may be able to do a deal with dairy farmer to throw in a few Friesian bull calves he will have plenty of them . But try to get square ones


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,326 ✭✭✭Farmer Pudsey


    On health with dairy rearing the cattle you get in will be young so less chance of disease. Most dairy farmers go to great effort with there heifers vacinating them and checking them would not worry about that.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 429 ✭✭foxylock


    Hypothetically speaking,if a fella bought 20 dairy bull calves at roughly €50 each, what would you put into them cost wise until they were finished? How long to keep them? And what would they sell for average price? And if it went tits up halfway through would there be a market for them.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,326 ✭✭✭Farmer Pudsey


    foxylock wrote: »
    Hypothetically speaking,if a fella bought 20 dairy bull calves at roughly €50 each, what would you put into them cost wise until they were finished? How long to keep them? And what would they sell for average price? And if it went tits up halfway through would there be a market for them.

    The only time you could sell before finish is as 2 year old stores after second winter lads usually pay well if they are 500+kgs.

    TBH you would want to be going to the mart a lot to get them for 50 yoyo but 100 would buy good calves. First year they be expensive in money terms. A bag of milk replacer 40 euro and 100kgs calf ration 28 euro and 200kgs of a good rearer ration 48 euro( mix your own Barley and soya bean meal, mortality vet and dosing 40 euro( I being pessimistic here). Hay/good silage and straw 20/head After that grass 60 euro for first year. Total including 100 for calf about 350/calf.

    You be able to graze outside by building up a bank of grass until Christmas. 100 day winter good silage and kg of ration 120 euro. Second summer grass only herd test dosing 150 euro. Again keep out unti lmid/late November 120 day winter 200 euro silage minerals and 100kgs of ration. 350 euro for second year.

    As 2yolds get to grass as early as possible. Finish August-October feeding 250kgs of ration each 100 for grazing, ration 55 and 40 euro for transport, slaughter fees, dozing herd test etc. 200 euro. About 900 euro to bring to slaughter.

    What will they make this year is a disaster not just because beef prices but stores are expensive as well. But in general over the last 3 years I have average about 3.8/kg. If they average about 355kgs they come into 1350 each.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    Would the neighbours work with you to fence the boundry? not always possible but a big help if they can


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,984 ✭✭✭Miname


    What's all the crack with fencing? The existing farm is set up for beef , go with some suggestions here on calves and weanlings, it's not rocket science, you can partly stock it with sheep if you want, the majority of beef farms will hold in sheep, it's Ireland not the little house on the prairie. Head into the bank and sort out a stocking loan, a renovation loan or whatever it takes to get the working capital rolling, buy on merchant credit or whatever it takes to get moving and stop looking at it as a problem, it's about as close to winning the lotto as a lad could get.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,090 ✭✭✭AP2014


    Miname wrote: »
    What's all the crack with fencing? The existing farm is set up for beef , go with some suggestions here on calves and weanlings, it's not rocket science, you can partly stock it with sheep if you want, the majority of beef farms will hold in sheep, it's Ireland not the little house on the prairie. Head into the bank and sort out a stocking loan, a renovation loan or whatever it takes to get the working capital rolling, buy on merchant credit or whatever it takes to get moving and stop looking at it as a problem, it's about as close to winning the lotto as a lad could get.

    Exactly, a strand of wire and a battery fencer will sort ya. It's not guantanamo bay.

    Is he going to sign it over fully? If he does, sell a field to get yourself some money and go on a holiday. Save ya having them around for the Xmas dinner as well.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,748 ✭✭✭ganmo


    Miname wrote: »
    What's all the crack with fencing? The existing farm is set up for beef , go with some suggestions here on calves and weanlings, it's not rocket science, you can partly stock it with sheep if you want, the majority of beef farms will hold in sheep, it's Ireland not the little house on the prairie. Head into the bank and sort out a stocking loan, a renovation loan or whatever it takes to get the working capital rolling, buy on merchant credit or whatever it takes to get moving and stop looking at it as a problem, it's about as close to winning the lotto as a lad could get.

    OP is a sheep enthusiast and sheep management and good fencing go hand in hand.
    a loan might be needed but op said he didn't like loans


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,599 ✭✭✭threeball


    Why not sell a couple of acres of either yours or his and use the proceeds to fence and stock. Not a farmer but from the background and from a business point of view I think that would be the prudent thing to do in terms of cashflow etc. You'll lose 2-3 to gain 70. Seems like a simple equation to me. No point in paupering yourself and dying of stress when it can be a lot simpler.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,984 ✭✭✭Miname


    Is a loan seriously going to be thrown aside because someone doesn't like them. Nobody likes loans but sometimes they are needed . If the farm is ran anyway half right a loan would be easily serviceable. I get the impression the seventy acres are already up and running properly so hopefully they won't need that much work. And even if they did it could be done over a few years. It's a matter of getting it running and simple low cost is his best option to get rolling, of course it's going to increase his workload but that's a sacrifice the op will have to accept if he's serious about it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,278 ✭✭✭frazzledhome


    foxylock wrote: »
    i think its clear enough, his health is deteriorating so he needs someone to step in , has no son daughters will sell, so its me by default ! Its willed already but he wants to hand over sooner rather than later

    Does he want to hand on to you?
    Does he want someone to keep it going till he hands to someone else so they can sell?


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