Water leak on my property? Advice

Cuttlefish

OK so a water meter was installed on Sept 3rd - 46 days (roughly 7 weeks)

I have been lifting the lid and checking the readings and I "seemed" quite high.

Rang Irish Water to clarify how to read properly and asked for someone to call and check all is OK, They called when I was out of the country, rang me afterwards and said that their fitting is OK and there is no leak 200mm up from the stop cock.

Dring the course of the conversation the call person didn't have a reading from the engineer who called and had to clarify if my 17yr old daughter is entitled to an allowance (she is of 21,000litres).

So I told her that I read the meter on Wednesday it was 26xxx (xxx being red digits), this equates to 26,000 litres. So she said you may well have a leak, Great I say to myself.

I arrived home yesterday to an empty house and I checked and yes the dial is moving, it looks like a litre every 1min 40sec

Round this up to 2mins a litre this means 30litres per hour and on to 720 litres per day!!

So Irish Water rang yesterday as I was checking and I said there may be a leak and what do I do, he says call a plumber!

I said I thought there was a first fix free policy announced and he says not until 2015.

So we both conclude that I do one of the following…

1) call plumber and fix it now off my own bat, no reimbursement from Irish Water
or
2) wait for the first fix free policy to start and allow water to leak,if it is a leak.

Questions..
1) anyone else come across this? Having a meter installed and the meter indicating that there is a leak

2) What do I do? fix now or wait

3) anyone have suggestions as to identifying where the leak is?

my3cents

Any chance your meter is connected to more than one house?

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

Any chance your meter is connected to more than one house?

I wish LOL!

my3cents

Cuttlefish wrote: »

I wish LOL!

Next step is to switch the water off where it comes into the house and check the meter again. Often the main stop tap is under the sink but not always.

martinr5232

Turn off the water at the meter and see does it still clock up maybe its a faulty meter.

Cuttlefish

martinr5232 wrote: »

Turn off the water at the meter and see does it still clock up maybe its a faulty meter.

How do I do that?

my3cents

Cuttlefish wrote: »

How do I do that?

http://www.leaksireland.ie/blog/2014/5/22/5-steps-to-knowing-your-irish-water-meter.html .

martinr5232

Cuttlefish wrote: »

How do I do that?

Open the lid and there is a blue lever beside the meter.

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

Next step is to switch the water off where it comes into the house and check the meter again. Often the main stop tap is under the sink but not always.

So I turned off the water supply coming into the house, the meter kept running.


I then turned off the at the meter itself, meter stopped so it is not a faulty meter itself.

So it seems as though the leak is between the meter and the entry into the house though how it gets into the house I am not sure, for example is it a direct line from the stop cock/ meter into the house? If so it is under a imprinted concrete drive and under my old garage which is now my kitchen/ downstairs bathroom

my3cents

If there is any route that would allow you to put in a new pipe without disturbing too much concrete?

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

If there is any route that would allow you to put in a new pipe without disturbing too much concrete?

Didn't think of that, there would be disturbance alright. I need to get advice from neighbours perhaps to see what route the original plumbing takes

my3cents

Cuttlefish wrote: »

Didn't think of that, there would be disturbance alright. I need to get advice from neighbours perhaps to see what route the original plumbing takes

I know you laughed at my first response but still worth turning off the water at the meter and then checking if your neighbors still have mains water

Probably as easy to replace the whole pipe as try and find the leak even with the right gear a small leak like that would be difficult to find. I've had the professionals with a van load of electronic equipment say dig here and be 50m out :rolleyes:

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

I know you laughed at my first response but still worth turning off the water at the meter and then checking if your neighbors still have mains water

Probably as easy to replace the whole pipe as try and find the leak even with the right gear a small leak like that would be difficult to find. I've had the professionals with a van load of electronic equipment say dig here and be 50m out :rolleyes:

I know imagine if people were on the same meter BUT I did turn off the water at the meter and the flow stopped so it is between the meter and the stop value in the house.

Need to find out where the pipe is and the route it takes and then determine where the leak it

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

I know you laughed at my first response but still worth turning off the water at the meter and then checking if your neighbors still have mains water

Probably as easy to replace the whole pipe as try and find the leak even with the right gear a small leak like that would be difficult to find. I've had the professionals with a van load of electronic equipment say dig here and be 50m out :rolleyes:

Question: Do you think a loss of 1litre every 2minutes - roughly is a small leak?

my3cents

Cuttlefish wrote: »

Question: Do you think a loss of 1litre every 2minutes - roughly is a small leak?

Stand at the sink with an empty liter bottle and adjust the tap so it takes 2 minutes to fill it then you'll see.

my3cents

Cuttlefish wrote: »

I know imagine if people were on the same meter BUT I did turn off the water at the meter and the flow stopped so it is between the meter and the stop value in the house.

Need to find out where the pipe is and the route it takes and then determine where the leak it

Forgot to say that when the meter stopped going around how did you know for sure that your neighbors water didn't also go off?

Cuttlefish

my3cents wrote: »

Forgot to say that when the meter stopped going around how did you know for sure that your neighbors water didn't also go off?

True and I didn't.

lgk

Cuttlefish wrote: »

I said I thought there was a first fix free policy announced and he says not until 2015.

Looks like the first fix free policy will only apply to the supply pipe from the boundary to within 1m of the building, see here.

Cuttlefish wrote: »

2) What do I do? fix now or wait

3) anyone have suggestions as to identifying where the leak is?

Now you know the rate, you can calculate what this will cost you once the capped price period ends.

How much would be involved in digging along the run of the pipe to the point where it enters the building?

ifeelstupid

Had the same problem OP, leak was brought to my attention by Irish Water who called to my house one day and told me I had the leak. I rang Irish Water re: first fix and got same response as yourself saying no policies/procedures in place until 2015. The guy from IW however was able to pretty much pinpoint where my leak was. As it happens it was under footpath just outside my back door. I decided to go ahead and get it sorted, only involved digging out about 1 sq.m. of the footpath, turned out that the original connection was damaged so I guess I have had leak since I moved into the house over 6 yrs ago. Luckily for me I had a friend that was able to do the work and reinstate footpath so cost was minimal.

RainyDay

ifeelstupid wrote: »

Had the same problem OP, leak was brought to my attention by Irish Water who called to my house one day and told me I had the leak. I rang Irish Water re: first fix and got same response as yourself saying no policies/procedures in place until 2015. The guy from IW however was able to pretty much pinpoint where my leak was. As it happens it was under footpath just outside my back door. I decided to go ahead and get it sorted, only involved digging out about 1 sq.m. of the footpath, turned out that the original connection was damaged so I guess I have had leak since I moved into the house over 6 yrs ago. Luckily for me I had a friend that was able to do the work and reinstate footpath so cost was minimal.

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but is it legal to dig up a footpath? I though the Council would want to do this themselves.

Wearb

RainyDay wrote: »

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but is it legal to dig up a footpath? I though the Council would want to do this themselves.

You need permission.

phester28

you need more than permission. You need to pay for a road closing license must have public liability insurance etc

GarIT

RainyDay wrote: »

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but is it legal to dig up a footpath? I though the Council would want to do this themselves.

Outside his back door; I'd imagine it's a private path.

phester28

Correct: if you own the footpath you can do as you please. I assumed he was referring to a public footpath. I.E to access the stop cock.

I can see alot of issues with leaks as a result of poorly fitted meters (freezing) compression fittings not fully tightened etc and a good frost will bring them home to roost.

Of course Irish water will not be to blame and you will still have to foot the bill for the work done.

lgk

phester28 wrote: »

I can see alot of issues with leaks as a result of poorly fitted meters (freezing) compression fittings not fully tightened etc and a good frost will bring them home to roost.

Of course Irish water will not be to blame and you will still have to foot the bill for the work done.

Why do you think Irish Water will require householders to repair poorly fitted meters?

phester28

well it will indicate a leak, I.E you will be paying for water leaked on the customer side. YOu are right you can continue to pay for this water but I assume if you have a leak anywhere it will be up to you to remedy

If you call them out to repair then they charge you and they are hardly going to own up to shoddy workmanship so it wont be their fault or the fault of Denis O Brien's companies

punisher5112

I thought loads and I mean loads are not paying or is that myth?

I woukld say there are some amount of leaks out there.

lgk

phester28 wrote: »

well it will indicate a leak, I.E you will be paying for water leaked on the customer side. YOu are right you can continue to pay for this water but I assume if you have a leak anywhere it will be up to you to remedy

If you call them out to repair then they charge you and they are hardly going to own up to shoddy workmanship so it wont be their fault or the fault of Denis O Brien's companies

Not true at all, if the leak is around the meter, Irish Water are responsible for repairing.

If there is a leak within the boundary of your property, up to within 1m of the building, they will also pay for a first fix (if they ever get the First Fix Free process in place!).

Otherwise, if the leak is on your property, it's up to you to pay.

It's not like they can turn up, fix a poor connection on the meter and then pretend the leak was at our kitchen sink!

ifeelstupid

GarIT wrote: »

Outside his back door; I'd imagine it's a private path.

Sorry - just to clarify, footpath outside my back door and on my property:D

Easy Rider

Hi all. Just wondering what the situation is with this as of today. Had the meter installed and since then a leak has appeared just inside the driveway, on my property, around 6 metres from my door.

Are Irish water still doing a first leak free fix? What I got from them is they will have a look but I know they will just say it had nothing to do with the installation of the meter, that it's just coincidence. They said once on private property nothing they can/will do.

Spoke to the installer who phoned me and said after installing metres they have caused leaks to appear on peoples properties but nothing they can do, which found an odd statement.

ifeelstupid

First fix policy still quite vague. I went ahead and fixed my own leak but apparently Irish Water are now fixing some leaks. This article was in the Irish Independent yesterday http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/water/irish-water-crisis/irish-water-pledges-to-fix-25000-leaks-under-scheme-31050960.html

Easy Rider

Thanks for that.

Did you get someone to fix it or fix it yourself? What was the kind of damage if so?

I am sure they will not take responsability but everything was fine until the meter was put in, if it was just a leak out of the blue before the meter etc, fair enough, but it started to appear a week after the thing was out in.

ifeelstupid

Guy from Irish Water pretty was fairly accurate on the location of the leak and it was him who told me about first fix policy. Rang the number he gave me and got the run around for couple of months about when fix policy would be finalised
In the end I decided to bite the bullet myself - had to get about 1.5 sq.m. of my footpath at back of house dug out, put new fixing on pipe and close it up again. I got away light as my friend did the work and I just paid materials and pints:-)

Easy Rider

Thanks. They (Irish Water) phoned back and asked if the contractor had been in contact, which they had initially and they were to inspect. The file was updated that they had phoned me back since (which they had not) to tell me the leak was on the private side of the property, which I already knew and told them.

In fairness the guy from Irish Water was very nice about it all and said that they will most likely have someone out from Irish Water to look at it....fingers crossed they can see it is within a meter of the border and just fix the thing.

ifeelstupid

I also contacted my insurance company back when leak was first discovered to see if I could claim for work to repair. they (allianz) give cover for up to €500 in any 1 claim, my excess is €350 so could have had a net claim/payout of "up to" €150 and lose any bonus I have earned in the past 10 claim free years!!