Graduate positions in the Civil Service and Local Authorities

Zipppy

AO jobs in Civil Service and something weird going on in Local Authorities ...

http://www.publicjobs.ie/publicjobs/campaignAdvert/13895/booklet.htm

gazzer

"Graduates will be able to compete for
permanent positions, during the currency of their contract"

Just read this on the Information form. WTF. Is it going to be some kind of Hunger Games thing

Meathlass

I've read through this all this morning but need some clarification.

The Local Authority openings seem only for those who have completed very specific courses and you must have at least a 2.1 at Level 8.

I couldn't find any info on the AO positions in terms of qualifications needed.

Questions

1. Do you have to be a recent graduate?
I graduated in 2001 with a Masters (2.2) in a Humanitites subject. I'm currently doing a Masters in Business and will finish this year.

I don't think I can apply to the Local Authorities one but what about the AO position?




I think I may have answered my own questions. The criteria is a "first or second class primary honours degree" so my BA 2.2 should be fine according to google.

I still think I can't apply for the Local Authority positions as they want specific subject qualifications.

Zipppy

Meathlass wrote: »

I've read through this all this morning but need some clarification.

The Local Authority openings seem only for those who have completed very specific courses and you must have at least a 2.1 at Level 8.

I couldn't find any info on the AO positions in terms of qualifications needed.

Questions

1. Do you have to be a recent graduate?
I graduated in 2001 with a Masters (2.2) in a Humanitites subject. I'm currently doing a Masters in Business and will finish this year.

I don't think I can apply to the Local Authorities one but what about the AO position?




I think I may have answered my own questions. The criteria is a "first or second class primary honours degree" so my BA 2.2 should be fine according to google.

I still think I can't apply for the Local Authority positions as they want specific subject qualifications.

Yeah it's a strange one...

Local Authority roles seek RECENT graduates but AO in Civil Service doesn't mention RECENT...

Meathlass

Zipppy wrote: »

Yeah it's a strange one...

Local Authority roles seek RECENT graduates but AO in Civil Service doesn't mention RECENT...

Yes, this is what I'm worried about. I really don't want to waste my time if you needed to have graduated in the last 2 years or so.

Zipppy

gazzer wrote: »

"Graduates will be able to compete for
permanent positions, during the currency of their contract"

Just read this on the Information form. WTF. Is it going to be some kind of Hunger Games thing

2 year contract for Local Authorities?
I wouldn't bother TBH...local authorities full of people with third level qualifications and dying for a promotion after many many years of zero progression opportunities...

DoctorDre

Application form looks a little more complicated than the CO one...

tannytantans

Very confused by the application form - so if I'm not qualified for the Local Authority jobs do I just totally skip Section B?
Also what are people writing in under additional information? I'm not really sure what they're looking for there!

DoctorDre

tannytantans wrote: »

Very confused by the application form - so if I'm not qualified for the Local Authority jobs do I just totally skip Section B?
Also what are people writing in under additional information? I'm not really sure what they're looking for there!

I plan to skip Section B! Not a clue what I'll write for additional information though!

The_Conductor

Additional information- whatever you put there will probably be photocopied for the interview board- should you progress that far- and you would then be presumably questioned on it. Aka- if you've done something in your life- doesn't necessarily have to be work related- that you feel adds to your stature as a candidate- you could put it in here........

The_Conductor

gazzer wrote: »

"Graduates will be able to compete for
permanent positions, during the currency of their contract"

Just read this on the Information form. WTF. Is it going to be some kind of Hunger Games thing

Local Authorities do not have sanction to recruit for permanent contracts (especially as many of their current functions are being centralised and merged with the functions of other Authorities). You would typically be given a 2 year non-renewable contract- in some cases a 5 year non-renewable contract. During the course of this tenure- if permanent positions arise- you are eligible to go for them. This includes permanent positions that are solely for internal candidates- and may in limited circumstances include internal competitions elsewhere in the public sector.

delricyo

tannytantans wrote: »

Very confused by the application form - so if I'm not qualified for the Local Authority jobs do I just totally skip Section B?
Also what are people writing in under additional information? I'm not really sure what they're looking for there!

I agree. The form is laid out in a strange fashion. If you are not going for the LA jobs it leaves a small and unstructured area to dump everything into. Previous forms had specific areas for competencies. I can only guess that the interviews will be slightly different in format. Perhaps asking you detailed questions about your experience and they will be listening out for competencies in your answers.
Which I sort of agree with. Pure competency based interviews are a bit odd IMO.

delricyo

The_Conductor wrote: »

Additional information- whatever you put there will probably be photocopied for the interview board- should you progress that far- and you would then be presumably questioned on it. Aka- if you've done something in your life- doesn't necessarily have to be work related- that you feel adds to your stature as a candidate- you could put it in here........

That's correct. I was always told that absolutely everything on your form is up for discussion. I remember I had an interview where the board skipped over the competency I had neatly put down in the relevant box and went straight to the miscellaneous section. He went into detail about an example I had briefly mentioned there - and decided to use that to mark that competency

Carraway

Any idea if they are only looking for people who have degrees in business or economics? I'm asking because I have a Masters in English and a Diploma in Education.

Meathlass

Carraway wrote: »

Any idea if they are only looking for people who have degrees in business or economics? I'm asking because I have a Masters in English and a Diploma in Education.

For the Local Authority positions you need to have a degree in specific subjects but for the civil service it doesn't matter - just a level 8 degree.

jobseekr1

Hi folks,
If you want to apply for both the local authority and the civil/public service, how would it work in terms of after the aptitudes and your score?
Would the local authority and the civil/public service have separate HR departments etc?
If the local authority roles are not permanent, and the civil/public service ones are, and that was a candidates preferred employer if successful etc, could you prioritise the civil/public service one, while still being in contention in the local authority one.
Also, can you apply for more than one stream in the local authority section?
I presume the aptitude tests will be even tougher than the CO ones?

francozola

Very confusing layout to the application form. Printed it off this morning to read through it. So if I don't want to apply for a LA job I leave section B blank?

Fooker

Are all the AO positions based in Dublin? Any idea of how many are being hired?

Tasden

delricyo wrote: »

I agree. The form is laid out in a strange fashion. If you are not going for the LA jobs it leaves a small and unstructured area to dump everything into. Previous forms had specific areas for competencies. I can only guess that the interviews will be slightly different in format. Perhaps asking you detailed questions about your experience and they will be listening out for competencies in your answers.
Which I sort of agree with. Pure competency based interviews are a bit odd IMO.

It said on the form that anything put on the form would/may be asked about in the interview so I just dumped in a sentence or two about everything and anything I felt would stand to me and then they can ask more about it at a later date if needs be.
Very badly laid out form imo.
Good luck

Meathlass

Fooker wrote: »

Are all the AO positions based in Dublin? Any idea of how many are being hired?

It says Nationwide on the advertisement but I'd say 90% of the positions are in Dublin with only the Local Authority positions being outside the capital.

barneystinson

Meathlass wrote: »

It says Nationwide on the advertisement but I'd say 90% of the positions are in Dublin with only the Local Authority positions being outside the capital.

Why would you say that? 90% of the civil service head count isn't in Dublin, and 90% of the people who have / will retire aren't in Dublin.

Meathlass

barneystinson wrote: »

Why would you say that? 90% of the civil service head count isn't in Dublin, and 90% of the people who have / will retire aren't in Dublin.

Well the information leaflet says While it is likely that a greater number of vacancies will occur in Dublin, opportunities may arise in other locations particularly in the Local Authority areas. so I think it's reasonable to assume that these Junior Management positions will be mostly based in Dublin.

Cakewheels

I'm as confused by the layout of the pdf form as everyone else, it seems to be very focused on the Local Authority jobs so not sure what to put in the supplementary information section if only want to go for the AO role.

Has anyone actually clicked through all the sections of the online form yet? I'm wondering if there are further sections in that with more detailed competency questions or something.

Tasden

loughgill wrote: »

I'm as confused by the layout of the pdf form as everyone else, it seems to be very focused on the Local Authority jobs so not sure what to put in the supplementary information section if only want to go for the AO role.

Has anyone actually clicked through all the sections of the online form yet? I'm wondering if there are further sections in that with more detailed competency questions or something.

What do you mean about the online form? The first one with education details?

I was assuming there will be an additional questionnaire and aptitude test prior to interview stage

Meathlass

loughgill wrote: »

I'm as confused by the layout of the pdf form as everyone else, it seems to be very focused on the Local Authority jobs so not sure what to put in the supplementary information section if only want to go for the AO role.

Has anyone actually clicked through all the sections of the online form yet? I'm wondering if there are further sections in that with more detailed competency questions or something.

I seem to be alone in thinking it was fairly standard. I'm not going for the LA jobs so leaving that completely blank.

Under description of duties/salaries for each job I will put in all the elements of each role phrasing them so they hit the competencies they're looking for. My current job I've done out in draft and it's almost a page long!

For the supplementary information bit I usually put in a bit about other activities I do and tie them into the competencies. I had also thought about listing out the competencies and giving examples under them but not sure about this approach.

They're using these forms to shortlist so I want to make it as clear as possible at a single glance that I have all the skills and expertise they require :pac:

They received 28,000 applications for the clerical officer positions so you really need to stand out from the crowd with this form.

Tasden

Yeah I just left LA section blank as it was N/A and then detailed any info I felt relevant in the end section

beenhad

Can you apply for AO if you have a third class honours degree? Very confusing altogether?

Meathlass

beenhad wrote: »

Can you apply for AO if you have a third class honours degree? Very confusing altogether?

"on or before the 31 December, 2014 have achieved a first or second class primary honours degree (at least level 8 on the National Framework of Qualifications)"

You could give them a call but this from the information document seems to say no.

DoctorDre

So we have to put down every job and every period of unemployment since leaving school? Gonna be a very long application form!

Tasden

DoctorDre wrote: »

So we have to put down every job and every period of unemployment since leaving school? Gonna be a very long application form!

Mine was pretty short

DoctorDre

Tasden wrote: »

Mine was pretty short

Did you put in periods of unemployment? I'd really rather not :pac:

Tasden

DoctorDre wrote: »

Did you put in periods of unemployment? I'd really rather not :pac:

How do you mean?

I was volunteering and studying while unemployed so I just put that in the additional info section

destiny6

It says on the document which you can download in relation to the AO position that:

8. Assignment/Location:
The successful candidate will be based in the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform.

So I get the impression there won't be as many positions if it is only one department?

GalwayGirl26

Hi all!
Just want to clarify something; You can only apply for the Local Authority positions if you have a degree directly in Business, Project Management, Strategy, H.R/ Communications/Marketing?

No point applying if your degree isn't specifically in one of these I take it?

Thanks!

Meathlass

GalwayGirl26 wrote: »

Hi all!
Just want to clarify something; You can only apply for the Local Authority positions if you have a degree directly in Business, Project Management, Strategy, H.R/ Communications/Marketing?

No point applying if your degree isn't specifically in one of these I take it?

Thanks!

That was my reading of it. You have to specifically say which streams you're going for and then on what basis you qualify for it.

Tasden

Meathlass wrote: »

That was my reading of it. You have to specifically say which streams you're going for and then on what basis you qualify for it.

I took it up the same so left that section blank

fiachr_a

destiny6 wrote: »

It says on the document which you can download in relation to the AO position that:

8. Assignment/Location:
The successful candidate will be based in the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform.

So I get the impression there won't be as many positions if it is only one department?

They're the Department supposed to be trying to save us money but are advertising lots of competitions for few staff!

GalwayGirl26

Ok, sorry about this, but another question!
I've just finished college this year, so the section on employment says to list all jobs since you left school/college, which was only a few months ago- should I leave it blank only accounting for the summer, or list part times jobs I had in the summers/weekends etc??
Thanks!

Meathlass

GalwayGirl26 wrote: »

Ok, sorry about this, but another question!
I've just finished college this year, so the section on employment says to list all jobs since you left school/college, which was only a few months ago- should I leave it blank only accounting for the summer, or list part times jobs I had in the summers/weekends etc??
Thanks!

I may be getting this mixed up with the Clerical Officer competition but doesn't it mention to list all relevant employment.

If the part time positions have something relevant to this position I'd put them down. I have lots of jobs from my 20s where I moved from company to company every few months doing very similar jobs - I'm not listing all these positions. I'll pick a few representative ones.

Zipppy

The AO competition doesn't mention 'recent' graduates...
So do you think that anyone with a relevant degree will be considered no matter age nor when degree(s) were obtained?
Thoughts?

Meathlass

Zipppy wrote: »

The AO competition doesn't mention 'recent' graduates...
So do you think that anyone with a relevant degree will be considered no matter age nor when degree(s) were obtained?
Thoughts?

Yeah, that's my take on it. My degree is from 13 years ago!

The LA one looks for recent graduates probably because they want to hire policy advisors. They probably don't want someone who graduated 20 years ago with what is now an out of date degree for the up to date policies they are implementing - if that makes sense.

SONIC2008

For the section on education it asks for subjects taken in final examination.
Did you write down just the subjects that you did in the summer exams? Or should I write down all the modules I was examined in for my final year?

DuchessduJour

SONIC2008 wrote: »

For the section on education it asks for subjects taken in final examination.
Did you write down just the subjects that you did in the summer exams? Or should I write down all the modules I was examined in for my final year?

Final examination usually means the subjects/exams that contributed to the calculation of your overall degree result, so if your degree was calculated on the basis of two sets of exams in your final year I'd put both of them in. Mine was on the basis of my last two years, with the penultimate year spent studying abroad, so it's looking like it'll be a lengthy entry!

SONIC2008

Thanks,

I had about 24 exams over 2 years contributing to my final result. I was writing down the list of subjects but they didn't fit. I ran out of characters after about 6 subjects. In the end I just wrote down what major and minor subjects I did rather than the actual modules.

Tasden

SONIC2008 wrote: »

Thanks,

I had about 24 exams over 2 years contributing to my final result. I was writing down the list of subjects but they didn't fit. I ran out of characters after about 6 subjects. In the end I just wrote down what major and minor subjects I did rather than the actual modules.

This is what I did. Assumed they could ask if needed at a later stage for specific subjects

Mycroft H

I've a third class degree (NFQ level 8). Is it worth even applying? Computer says no or will someone actually look at the applications in some depth afterwords?

eoghan101

Any one know where these jobs are available? Would you start in 2014/2015?

Meathlass

eoghan101 wrote: »

Any one know where these jobs are available? Would you start in 2014/2015?

Well the closing date for applications is the 30th October. Then there's going to be online tests, supervised tests, possibly a group exercise/presentation and finally a competitive interview.

I'd say 2015 most definitely for a start date.

To compare with the clerical officer campaign. They advertised in July and they're only holding interviews now.

Meathlass

Mycroft H wrote: »

I've a third class degree (NFQ level 8). Is it worth even applying? Computer says no or will someone actually look at the applications in some depth afterwords?

Generally if they specify a certain level of degree as a requirement anyone not matching this will go straight to the No pile regardless of what else is in their cv.

You could give them a call and see if it would be worth your while to put in a cv but I wouldn't be too hopeful.

sillysocks

Did people generally leave the supplementary information section blank or put in any extra information about yourself in that?

Tasden

sillysocks wrote: »

Did people generally leave the supplementary information section blank or put in any extra information about yourself in that?

I put a little bit in because a lot of my previous employment/experience was irrelevant tbh and I had some qualifications other than the degree that were applicable so put them in there. Otherwise it would've been left blank