Debt Collection - At what amount of money owed is it not worth pursuing a debt?

thehouses

Is it worth it for company to pursue a debt of €900?

Cabaal

Depends on the company,

thehouses

It's a phone company.

foggy_lad

thehouses wrote: »

Is it worth it for company to pursue a debt of €900?

Depends totally on the company and what their policy is on debt recovery and what message they want to send to defaulters.

also that is a lot of money to many smaller companies!

Gatling

Have you tried a repayment plan

thehouses

Gatling wrote: »

Have you tried a repayment plan

They refuse to co-operate and insist that the money is owed.

thehouses

foggy_lad wrote: »

also that is a lot of money to many smaller companies!

Agree - a larger company would not feel such a loss. Smaller companies seem to be fairer to deal with and the situation would not have arisen in the first case if it was a decent company.

foggy_lad

thehouses wrote: »

It's a phone company.

Always best to pay what you owe but if they have made a mistake or have not provided the service you paid for then you should have all the proofs and evidence from your complaints and troubleshooting with them etc so don't be bullied by their threats about courts and solicitors if they are in the wrong.

If you just can't pay anymore then best to set up a payment plan with them and pay as much as you can each week(€10-€20) without being stupidly silly about it(€1 a week).

If they refuse a payment plan you should pay as much as you can anyway!

Also DON'T deal with debt collectors, they have no legal standing here. Deal directly with the phone company!

thehouses

foggy_lad wrote: »

Always best to pay what you owe but if they have made a mistake or have not provided the service you paid for then you should have all the proofs and evidence from your complaints and troubleshooting with them etc so don't be bullied by their threats about courts and solicitors if they are in the wrong.

Also DON'T deal with debt collectors, they have no legal standing here. Deal directly with the phone company!

That is the impression I get with debt collectors. Just ignore them - the contract was with the phone company unless they sell the debt and that rarely happens in Ireland.

Thanks for the advice about a payment plan but I just can't do that. I always pay money that I owe but out of principle won't be paying this phone company.

I have moved house since and they have an old address so fail to see how they can follow up on it.

former legend

foggy_lad wrote: »

Also DON'T deal with debt collectors, they have no legal standing here. Deal directly with the phone company!

This is posted so often in this forum and it's completely wrong. If the T&C of phone contract says that they can pass your debt on (and most phone companies include it in the T&C), then of course they have legal standing.

thehouses

former legend wrote: »

This is posted so often in this forum and it's completely wrong. If the T&C of phone contract says that they can pass your debt on (and most phone companies include it in the T&C), then of course they have legal standing.

Would they pass it on for 900 euro though?

foggy_lad

former legend wrote: »

This is posted so often in this forum and it's completely wrong. If the T&C of phone contract says that they can pass your debt on (and most phone companies include it in the T&C), then of course they have legal standing.

The debt collectors have no legal powers to get money from you beyond asking you for it. They can not affect your credit rating unless they take you to court and get a judgement against you which you can stop by making a reasonable off of €XX a week/month. It would cost a lot more than €900 to recover €900 from you

foggy_lad

thehouses wrote: »

That is the impression I get with debt collectors. Just ignore them - the contract was with the phone company unless they sell the debt and that rarely happens in Ireland.

Thanks for the advice about a payment plan but I just can't do that. I always pay money that I owe but out of principle won't be paying this phone company.

I have moved house since and they have an old address so fail to see how they can follow up on it.

This is of course your choice but weakens your case somewhat because it paints you as unreasonable. if the company provided service than you pay for it.

Rogaine2

thehouses wrote: »

Would they pass it on for 900 euro though?

I've had a debt of 70 euros passed to a solicitor!

MagicMarker

thehouses wrote: »

Would they pass it on for 900 euro though?

Absolutely.

Icepick

A bigger company is actually more likely to go after you because it's about advertising and compliance as well for them. Plus they already have a contract with a legal company who enforce these in bulk.

thehouses

Icepick wrote: »

A bigger company is actually more likely to go after you because it's about advertising and compliance as well for them. Plus they already have a contract with a legal company who enforce these in bulk.

Can they get my current postal address? Can't see how they can enforce anything without that, but then again I could be wrong.

thehouses

MagicMarker wrote: »

Absolutely.

I know for a fact that VHI would not pursue a debt as of 2013 unless you claimed on the plan because a claim could cost thousands of euro. It only resulted in threatening letters being sent and then they would write it off.

MagicMarker

thehouses wrote: »

I know for a fact that VHI would not pursue a debt as of 2013 unless you claimed on the plan because a claim could cost thousands of euro. It only resulted in threatening letters being sent and then they would write it off.

This isn't vhi, it's a phone company.

thehouses

MagicMarker wrote: »

This isn't vhi, it's a phone company.

True but both know that you can't get blood from a stone and if one company views it as counter productive to pursue a debt, another may also. But I take your point on board.

L1011

former legend wrote: »

This is posted so often in this forum and it's completely wrong. If the T&C of phone contract says that they can pass your debt on (and most phone companies include it in the T&C), then of course they have legal standing.

Legal standing to write to you with ever more ludicrously written demands; not to enforce anything or affect your actual ICB credit rating. That is always going to require the courts.

We now have the private credit rating firms operating in Ireland although I question how legally as the ICB is a statutory body. These are not generally used by the banks but it does mean that defaulting on a contract with one phone company / mailorder firm means you're not going to get any service off the others if they match up details.

joeguevara

MYOB wrote: »

Legal standing to write to you with ever more ludicrously written demands; not to enforce anything or affect your actual ICB credit rating. That is always going to require the courts.

We now have the private credit rating firms operating in Ireland although I question how legally as the ICB is a statutory body. These are not generally used by the banks but it does mean that defaulting on a contract with one phone company / mailorder firm means you're not going to get any service off the others if they match up details.

ICB is not a statutory body. It was set up by its members who are mainly financial institutions. Nothing to do with the government and has no statutory force. It is just a credit reference agency, same as the others you mentioned.

alie

My ex mobile phone company continued to charge me after my contract was finished
I got a bill of 400 euro from them. I paid 250 off and am struggling to pay the rest due to my job hours being cut. They sold the debt on and the company is now ringing me up to 4 times a day and posting threatening letters. Is there anything i can do?

thehouses

Rogaine2 wrote: »

I've had a debt of 70 euros passed to a solicitor!

This article may interest you:
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-abroad/woman-90-pursued-by-debt-collectors-for-14-council-bin-fine-30285941.html

thehouses

alie wrote: »

My ex mobile phone company continued to charge me after my contract was finished
I got a bill of 400 euro from them. I paid 250 off and am struggling to pay the rest due to my job hours being cut. They sold the debt on and the company is now ringing me up to 4 times a day and posting threatening letters. Is there anything i can do?

That seems to be harassment:
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/personal_finance/debt/debt_collection.html

joeguevara

thehouses wrote: »

That seems to be harassment:
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/personal_finance/debt/debt_collection.html

The link that you provided is for lenders who provide credit agreements under the Consumer Credit Act. Essentially financially regulated loans. This would not apply to mobile phone companies who are not financially regulated. Also ( a small point I know) is that harassment is legally defined under the Equality Act 9 grounds. For example were they contacting them incessantly because they were a woman, or because of their ethnicity or family status etc. If not, it cannot be considered harassment.

Cabaal

thehouses, I'm curious whats the point of this thread exactly?

You've just posted a link that a council went after somebody over a 14e debt, but yet here you are asking can you get out of a 900e debt.

This seems less of a consumer issue and more so about you trying to avoid a debt, the response you appear to want is "yes, they won't chase you for the debt"

Gatling

Seems to be a lot of I want a service for absolutely nothing lately

thehouses

Cabaal wrote: »

thehouses, I'm curious whats the point of this thread exactly?

You've just posted a link that a council went after somebody over a 14e debt, but yet here you are asking can you get out of a 900e debt.

This seems less of a consumer issue and more so about you trying to avoid a debt, the response you appear to want is "yes, they won't chase you for the debt"

Nope not true at all. I taught it was an interesting read.

thehouses

Gatling wrote: »

Seems to be a lot of I want a service for absolutely nothing lately

No, I always pay what I owe, the thing is that in this case they are trying to scam me.

Nuttzz

thehouses wrote: »

Would they pass it on for 900 euro though?

upc sold the debt belong to my dementia suffering great aunt for 90 to intrum justitia, took hard work but they settled for 30 in the end

if they register a judgement against you for the debt this will have an impact on your ability to get loans, mortgages and future telephone contracts

work out a settlement with them, better for you in the long term

magicmushroom

Different companies have different policies.

Where I work, we will persue all debt, even 30e, through a 3rd part debt agency who are paid commission only. They will send letters and make phone calls but that is all. This is normally enough though, most people pay at this stage.

If they are unsuccessful in obtaining payment, debts under 500e get written off and anything over 500e gets sent to our solicitors where we go the whole way - trace, judgement, sheriff, examination etc.

In my previous job no debt was persued via legal action, no matter how much they owed.

I had a debt of 850e with a phone company last year, I had one solicitors letter and never heard any more about it after that. Funny thing was, I actually responded to the letter with an email and a phone call to offer 20e per week repayment plan and they never got back to me!

thehouses

OSI wrote: »

Did you actually end the contract, or did you just stop paying after the fixed term?

The contract is ongoing, but they are charging incredible data fees and will not cap these even if it runs into the thousands of euro. They cap these fees in the E.U., but won't in Ireland because they are not compelled to do so by legislation. While it may not be seen under law as a scam it sure feels like one. Though there are two acts I believe they are in breach of.

DulchieLaois

I owed a debt collection a huge sum, however they are willing to take a reduce sum of one lump sum ?

Has anybody tried this before and if so, does it affect your ICB

Secondly, can I reduce it further ?

Nino Brown

thehouses wrote: »

The contract is ongoing, but they are charging incredible data fees and will not cap these even if it runs into the thousands of euro. They cap these fees in the E.U., but won't in Ireland because they are not compelled to do so by legislation. While it may not be seen under law as a scam it sure feels like one. Though there are two acts I believe they are in breach of.

Charging for what you use is hardly a scam, you know the fee's, if you use the data, you owe the money. If you can't control how much data you use then turn it off.
A friend of mine was refused a bank loan for not paying a phone bill, I don't know the details of how the bank knew about this, but they found out somehow, so I would be reluctant to refuse to pay a debt based on people saying it can't affect your credit rating.

former legend

thehouses wrote: »

The contract is ongoing, but they are charging incredible data fees and will not cap these even if it runs into the thousands of euro. They cap these fees in the E.U., but won't in Ireland because they are not compelled to do so by legislation. While it may not be seen under law as a scam it sure feels like one. Though there are two acts I believe they are in breach of.

Hang on; you're still availing of the service??

KERSPLAT!

"They are scamming me!"

How?

"Well they aren't actually scamming me but it feels like they are!!!"

The terms and conditions/tariff prices are easily available on all phone sites. If you've ran up a huge data bill it's your own fault, pay the bill.

I would imagine €900 would be well over the point at which they'll come after you

thehouses

Nino Brown wrote: »

Charging for what you use is hardly a scam, you know the fee's, if you use the data, you owe the money. If you can't control how much data you use then turn it off.
A friend of mine was refused a bank loan for not paying a phone bill, I don't know the details of how the bank knew about this, but they found out somehow, so I would be reluctant to refuse to pay a debt based on people saying it can't affect your credit rating.

I know, some will agree with me others will disagree. This thread shows that:http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=86814272

alie

OSI wrote: »

Did you actually end the contract, or did you just stop paying after the fixed term?

I never had a contract before so i stopped paying. I rang the the company and asked to go back to pay as you go. I paid what was outstanding on my account. The guy said as soon as payment is received he would change my phone over. 2 days later i fell on the way to work and smashed my phone. I went into the local phone shop and the guy gave me a number to ring the head office which i did. Explained the situation . Meanwhile i got a new phone from a differenent company. No contract. 6 months later i got this massive bill.

Nino Brown

thehouses wrote: »

I don't think it is moral for a company to be able to allow bills to escalate for customers without limit when they can easily put a cap on the amount customers will run up. They do when data roaming in the E.U. for other customers.

I agree, but if you don't like a company's terms then you don't do business with them, availing of the service then refusing to pay after the fact isn't exactly moral either.

Cabaal

thehouses wrote: »

No, I always pay what I owe, the thing is that in this case they are trying to scam me.

by demanding that you pay them?

I don't think it is moral for a company to be able to allow bills to escalate for customers without limit when they can easily put a cap on the amount customers will run up.

But the customer also has a responsibility here,

Your posts are very lacking in details, over how long was the 900e racked up, what does the 900e relate? (data, calls, texts, canceling a contract early etc).

You claim its a scam but yet you give next to no details.

alie

I started to pay the bill because i accepted it was my fault , even though i wasnt told that i had to ring the company just before 18 months was up.

dudara

The morality or immorality is irrelevant here. You are consuming the service, knowingly, and therefore are liable for it. If you don't like their way of charging you, then stop using the data service, or change supplier.

thehouses

former legend wrote: »

Hang on; you're still availing of the service??

No it's switched off with direct debits cancelled.

thehouses

I won't give the full details because there is a lot to this story. My query is regarding debt collection. I do appreciate everyone's replies at the same time.

Peanut2011

The answer to your first question is YES. Especially in consumer business. The problem they have is that if they get relaxed and don't go after people imagine how many will not pay....

So yes, it is worth chasing €900!

ghogie91

They can indeed I was threatened by a company and solicitor for 400 quid

as they say:
"Owe 400 and you will be taken to court,
Owe 4 million and you will be brought to dinner"

former legend

I'd have thought that, for a phone company, €900 would be at the upper end of their outstanding balances so they would be more likely to pursue it.

You might get away without paying but don't be shocked if your credit rating ends up in the toilet.

thehouses

former legend wrote: »

I'd have thought that, for a phone company, €900 would be at the upper end of their outstanding balances so they would be more likely to pursue it.

You might get away without paying but don't be shocked if your credit rating ends up in the toilet.

Credit rating is only affected if it goes to court.

billy111

'not worth pursuing a dept'? My opinion on this is pay the money you owe and don't be worrying about them pursuing a dept. It amazes me the amount of people how ask this question. Use a service then pay for that service. If you have an opinion that the amount due is incorrect then communicate with the company involved and try resolve the issue.

dudara

It can be expensive to persue debt, but large companies can have teams of people in house, or outsourced to someone else. The large volume and bulk discounts makes it affordable for them to chase debt. Plus, it's also about reputation and making sure that you're not a "soft touch".

So, it's possible for a company to persue for any amount of debt. How much cost and effort they want to put into it is up to them.