Irish schools don't teach evolution!

johnnyruane40

In primary school, kids "learn" about Adam and Eve and how God "created the world in 7 days". However, they never even glance at the scientific fact of evolution. This continues in Secondary School where Evolution is omitted from the Junior Cert Science course. Only a select few of Leaving Cert higher level Biology students get to learn about evolution within a school building.

Most would agree that this is not acceptable in the 21st Century. It sadly causes many people to never understand Evolution and the mechanisms within it, while most can recite the story of Adam and Eve. Even the view among some Bishops is that Evolution is fact.

Why is it that our education system omits this important topic from the curriculum? The only conclusion that I can come to is that the Church still has a huge influence on our education.

Lyaiera

I thought the Catholic position on evolution is that it's scientific fact and they support it?

I don't know about the curriculum but I was definitely taught evolution in primary school, and secondary.

dirtyden

johnnyruane40 wrote: »

In primary school, kids "learn" about Adam and Eve and how God "created the world in 7 days". However, they never even glance at the scientific fact of evolution. This continues in Secondary School where Evolution is omitted from the Junior Cert Science course. Only a select few of Leaving Cert higher level Biology students get to learn about evolution within a school building.

Most would agree that this is not acceptable in the 21st Century. It sadly causes many people to never understand Evolution and the mechanisms within it, while most can recite the story of Adam and Eve. Even the view among some Bishops is that Evolution is fact.

Why is it that our education system omits this important topic from the curriculum? The only conclusion that I can come to is that the Church still has a huge influence on our education.

They don't teach string theory either. No-one ever cares about string theory though.

shruikan2553

Anyone thick enough to believe in creationism by the time they do their LC should probably go back to junior infants and try it all again.

johnnyruane40

dirtyden wrote: »

They don't teach string theory either. No-one ever cares about string theory though.

They teach creationism so they should teach opposing views. Or else just teach none of the views.

Deranged96

Oh for god's sake!
Its not like they're withholding the truth from primary school children because of the big bad overbearing Catholic Church.

Most primary schools don't have science as a subject because it isn't enforced as a core subject at that level.

As for the JC thing its common knowledge to all at that stage

renegademaster

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Anyone thick enough to believe in creationism by the time they do their LC should probably go back to junior infants and try it all again.

that's hardly the issue here. i'd be far more concerned with kids being brainwashed into believing some imaginary dude in the sky, of which there are 3, but a holy 3 in 1 kinda guy pieced the universe together and everything in it in 7 days!

johnnyruane40

Deranged96 wrote: »

Oh for god's sake!
Its not like they're withholding the truth from primary school children because of the big bad overbearing Catholic Church.

Most primary schools don't have science as a subject because it isn't enforced as a core subject at that level.

As for the JC thing its common knowledge to all at that stage

No it isn't. People might say "Oh I believe in Evolution" but loads don't have a clue how it works.

wazky

johnnyruane40 wrote: »

No it isn't. People might say "Oh I believe in Evolution" but loads don't have a clue how it works.

We all used to be monkeys isn't it?

faceman

I was taught evolution in school. Christian brothers schooling too. Not sure where the OP is getting his facts from.

jimgoose

wazky wrote: »

We all used to be monkeys isn't it?

It's great being a monkey, Ted!

johnnyruane40

faceman wrote: »

I was taught evolution in school. Christian brothers schooling too. Not sure where the OP is getting his facts from.

If a school wants to teach it they can, it isn't on the curriculum or on the Science course though, thats the problem.

thegreatgonzo

Lyaiera wrote: »

I thought the Catholic position on evolution is that it's scientific fact and they support it?

I don't know about the curriculum but I was definitely taught evolution in primary school, and secondary.

Me too. I went to a secondary school with a strong Catholic ethos in the 90's. I remember somebody asking about this in religion class and my teacher saying that the book of genesis is not scientific fact.
I know this isn't the thread topic but in our school which would be a pretty traditional and conservative place by any standards, they also provided a lot of sex education in 2nd and 4th year. I'm always surprised when I hear people saying they never got sex ed because they went to a religious school because I had the opposite experience.

partyatmygaff

johnnyruane40 wrote: »

In primary school, kids "learn" about Adam and Eve and how God "created the world in 7 days". However, they never even glance at the scientific fact of evolution. This continues in Secondary School where Evolution is omitted from the Junior Cert Science course. Only a select few of Leaving Cert higher level Biology students get to learn about evolution within a school building.

Did you go to school in Ireland? Nearly everyone I know was taught about evolution in Primary School and JC Science and in LC Biology for anyone who took it as a subject. To your surprise i'm sure, it was even discussed in JC Religion.

Most would agree that this is not acceptable in the 21st Century. It sadly causes many people to never understand Evolution and the mechanisms within it, while most can recite the story of Adam and Eve. Even the view among some Bishops is that Evolution is fact.

Why is it that our education system omits this important topic from the curriculum? The only conclusion that I can come to is that the Church still has a huge influence on our education.

You don't actually know what schools teach and don't teach. Pointless thread.

Nodin

...been years since I was at school, but I'm reasonably sure the OP is way way off.

johnnyruane40

partyatmygaff wrote: »

You don't actually know what schools teach. Pointless thread.

You don't actually know whats on the curriculum. Pointless post

Sky King

OP, If I don't believe in evolution then maybe you could explain why I am attracted to primates.

No. Thought not.

Evolution me hoop.

Inspector Coptoor

Evolution isn't directly on the JC science syllabus but the majority of teachers would cover it during the topic on genetics.

It is a part of the LC biology syllabus.

The OP is going a little OTT.
We're not like some of the Bible Belt states in the ya where creationism gets the same weighting as evolution,

There is one theory in town in Irish schools and it's evolution

rorrissey

I did the Leaving Cert this year, my Bio book covers the meaning of the term Evolution, who Darwin & Wallace are, the theory of natural selection and evidence for evolution. There's a good 4 pages about it in my textbook under "Variation & Evolution". Mind you, most of it never comes up in the exam. Usually it would be a short question like: Give evidence for evolution or who came up with the theory, etc.

MS.ing

thats what google is for. "evolution explained idiots guide"

simple all in the click of a mouse

PizzamanIRL

What's evolution?

juneg

PizzamanIRL wrote: »

What's evolution?

We usually do that lesson before quantum theory

SpaceTime

While there's a lot wrong with the Irish school 'system' (I use that term loosely), it definitely doesn't avoid evolution and doesn't have any particular religious input into science.

The schools are way to religious though and there's a complete lack of science in primary which is another issue entirely.

I think the science courses in secondary could do with being made more interesting too. They're very dull.

Herb Powell

What school did you go to, OP?

I was definitely taught evolution in school, even remember the priest talking about it on one of his visits. In fact we were explicity taught that the whole story of creation was just a metaphor used by people way back when they didn't understand how the universe was created.

catallus

I think creationism has got a bad reputation by being used as a whipping-boy by the liberal media.

endacl

johnnyruane40 wrote: »

They teach creationism so they should teach opposing views. Or else just teach none of the views.

But they're not 'opposing views', although creationists would love folks to think they are. One is blind belief, the other is demonstrable, observable and verifiable process.

catallus

endacl wrote: »

But they're not 'opposing views', although the media would like us to think that creationists would love folks to think they are. One is blind belief, the other is demonstrable, observable and verifiable process.

FYP

efb

Wait tip they are teaching them about Adam & Steve...

_Redzer_

I wasn't taught evolution in primary school, and that wasn't even long ago. I was from secondary school onwards, though.


I remember all we used to do was English, Irish, maths and religion every single day, with history once a week.

Fun times you can imagine.

The Adversary

Was taught about evolution in primary school.

Was taught in junior cert religion that the genesis myth is an allegorical account and should not be taken as fact.

Was taught about evolution, natural selection and genetics in fifth year biology.

Keep in mind these are schools with a strong Catholic ethos with the parish priest and nuns etc on the board of management. I explained I was atheist and from a secular background and was allowed to not participate in mass and prayers no problem. Believe me I love a chance to bash the church as much as anyone but this is simply untrue.

Lux23

I learned it in school, in Junior Cert Science and Leaving Cert biology.

shruikan2553

renegademaster wrote: »

that's hardly the issue here. i'd be far more concerned with kids being brainwashed into believing some imaginary dude in the sky, of which there are 3, but a holy 3 in 1 kinda guy pieced the universe together and everything in it in 7 days!

Sadly that is something we are stuck with for awhile longer. At least with creationism it tends to share more in common with Santa and they grow out of it.

catallus

All the schools in the country are teaching evolution as scientific fact, and thankfully also educating young minds in the tenets of religion, and so it should be!

Dravokivich

fúck evolution, i'd be happy if more people knew how to wire up a plug.

The Adversary

Dravokivich wrote: »

fúck evolution, i'd be happy if more people knew how to wire up a plug.

That's part of the English curriculum actually.

SpaceTime

To be perfectly honest, no main stream European Christian denominations seem to treat the bible as absolute fact (even if they may talk about "gospel" etc) it seems to be a very definitely North American thing.

There's generally a post-enlightement vibe to all of them, including the Catholic Church.

Some of these creationists are basically just trying to drag things back literally to the dark ages.

The only thing I've heard in terms of a clash with science was from people who were in a convent school in the 1960s and they were told to glue the 'filthy pages' together in the biology book i.e. the bits on reproduction.

I think that's more a prudishness that came from Victorian society and lasted in Ireland than it is anything to do with Catholicism tbh.

The Adversary

I think there should definitely be atleast one chapter on Richard Dawkins in all modern religion textbooks.

everdead.ie

I was never taught creationism in my primary school or secondary I was taught evolution in JC Science though.

Also I don't think we even did religion once a week and the local catholic church were big supporters of my school.

SpaceTime

I don't remember doing anything that even touched on creationism in primary school and I did go to Catholic primary schools.

Most of the religious content was rather 'wishy washy'. There was very little about rules, regulations or doctrine.

I know they did learn catechism off by heart for confirmation preparation though!

SpaceTime

Dravokivich wrote: »

fúck evolution, i'd be happy if more people knew how to wire up a plug.

That's becoming very unnecessary as a skill as EU directives mandated that all appliances sold were fitted with an appropriate plug for the market they're being sold in.

Wiring a plug on the continent or in the US is something most people wouldn't encounter as there have been moulded on plugs since the 1950s. Here and in England that's more a 1990s thing.

I'd like to see people being able to change a light bulb though! A mate of mine actually didn't know how to put a new bulb in!!?!

KwackerJack

Evolution in a Catholic country :eek:

Not a mention of Adam and Eve...whats all this monkey talk!!

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Creationism is not the opposite of evolution, and it's not taught in schools here in the way it is in some parts of the states. It comes up in religion class but it's never taught as being an equally viable alternative to evolution.

Under the circumstances I don't see what the big deal is, not knowing the details of evolution doesn't matter when the general theory is being presented as fact. I was taught about transubstantiation, and I don't recall them going too much into molecular biology in the JC science curriculum. But that doesn't mean I've come out of school with the notion that transubstantiation is literally real, because the entire broader framework of my education and common sense comes into play.

Manach

Another knocking threat bashing figments of imaginary straw-man on religious matters. Perhaps a more urgent need is to have trolling 101 taught instead in Irish schools to raise the level of the game.

Young Blood

Philosophy is thought in schools in most western countries. When I was in school they still thought religion but nobody ever took it seriously and it was seen more as a free class rather than anything else.
nonsense

catallus

Young Blood wrote: »

Philosophy is thought in schools in most western countries.

That's news to me.

It should be.

efb

We were shown a video in religion class "disproving" evolution. Their evidence: The Loch Ness Monster, I shyt you not

catallus

I think you're imagining that

upfrontwithit

I was taught evolution as fact in a catholic school by clergy.
I was also taught by the same priest about George Lemaitre and that true religion and true science are not against one another. At our school we were always encouraged to learn as much about science as possible.
You've been spending too long on American websites.
Look up theistic evolution.

takamichinoku

catallus wrote: »

I think you're imagining that

I dunno, I remember some very dubious ones about how Noah's Ark definitely was a real thing and the science behind stigmata.


That one prick showed an ancient video of a third trimester abortion to a bunch of twelve year olds during religion class too. This was 2002, surely that was a sackable offense by that stage?

The Adversary

upfrontwithit wrote: »

I was taught evolution as fact in a catholic school by clergy.
I was also taught by the same priest about George lematre and that true religion and true science are not against one another.
You've been spending too long on American websites.
Look up theistic evolution.

This, if anything the clergy will read up on the subject to gain a greater understanding of it and see where God fits in etc. etc.

Of course there are the few who will take it literally, as is a given. But the majority accept it as is the official line of the RCC.

upfrontwithit

Manach wrote: »

Another knocking threat bashing figments of imaginary straw-man on religious matters. Perhaps a more urgent need is to have trolling 101 taught instead in Irish schools to raise the level of the game.

Meh, if you feed em they will come