Leaving cert results

6thyearlife

Posting on behalf of a friend:
I am wondering if teachers of leaving certificate classes are expected to attend the school on the morning of results, 13th August

bearhugs

In my experience, teachers are not expected to attend. Some will, many won't. Class tutors and year heads would be more likely to be there. I think most would try to attend the days and times for their own subject exams first, it would be more beneficial providing support to students then than when they get results.

implausible

It's up to the teacher in my experience. I always go in, as the suspense kills me and I like to see the students.

The principal, vice principal and guidance counsellor more or less have to be there.

Millem

6thyearlife wrote: »

Posting on behalf of a friend:
I am wondering if teachers of leaving certificate classes are expected to attend the school on the morning of results, 13th August

Gosh no! In my school the guidance counsellor are always there. The students all come at different times and some even just wait to go online. If I have a class I usually go in 11/12 or sometimes in the afternoon. I always find the students need a few days to digest the info and will get in contact with us if they need us to view scripts.

lulu1

I dont think they have to attend but in our area they all do just to congratulate and offer support to pupils

Moody_mona

I was a tutor and had a LC class. I normally go in anyway, nice to see them, congratulate them, and offer advice. One of the rewarding teacher days too I think!

chases0102

What time would be a good time to go in?

doc_17

Results usually released at 9 and most kids will be in before 11. So if you want to see them that's the time to be there.

RealJohn

I usually go in if I'm around but I'm not under any obligation to. In my experience, most of the students don't care and management are fine with it either way. I mostly go in for my own curiosity, especially if I had one or two students I thought were borderline.

TheDriver

I advise against in,unless you really want to. Kid doesn't get a1 and either sees who they want to blame or else needs counseling. Remember most want to go,into a corner and digest them

evolving_doors

Holidays...teachers not expected to go in. Unless year head then maybe!

bearhugs

TheDriver wrote: »

I advise against in,unless you really want to. Kid doesn't get a1 and either sees who they want to blame or else needs counseling. Remember most want to go,into a corner and digest them

This is a very good point. I almost always go in myself, but never ask any of the students outright what they got. You'll find some want to share and others don't.

pandoraj09

No obligation on year heads/tutors to go in at all...its the holidays..if you want to go its up to you...

vamos!

pandoraj09 wrote: »

No obligation on year heads/tutors to go in at all...its the holidays..if you want to go its up to you...

I don't go in these days. I used to. The happy kids don't even see you. They want to ring home, talk to each other, jump around like hyper frogs and screech. They then want to get out of the building ASAP to get the hair done for the night out. The disappointed kids are hard to see. They may not have done badly in your subject but they feel conspicuous and upset and you are yet another adult there to see their disappointment. Finally, the fear of your subject going badly for someone and being in the firing line in front of management and students. I always run in the day after as I'm dying to know how everyone got on and show may face at the beginning of the debs to congratulate people.

TheDriver

When I was teacher, I didn't even bother going in to see the results, just waited until school started. Why? Because it always seemed to work out as predicted with no massive surprises

evolving_doors

vamos! wrote: »

I don't go in these days. I used to. The happy kids don't even see you. They want to ring home, talk to each other, jump around like hyper frogs and screech. They then want to get out of the building ASAP to get the hair done for the night out. The disappointed kids are hard to see. They may not have done badly in your subject but they feel conspicuous and upset and you are yet another adult there to see their disappointment. Finally, the fear of your subject going badly for someone and being in the firing line in front of management and students. I always run in the day after as I'm dying to know how everyone got on and show may face at the beginning of the debs to congratulate people.

Ya I'd agree with Vamos! I think that on the day of the results it only would become a bit if a circus with the teachers piling on to interact with students.. Peruse the results the day after at your leisure. The best day to say your goodbyes is if you mosey on in just after the exam in June.. little bit of chit chat then byebye..

If they need support then I think it should be there in the form of the career guidance/Year Head/DP or principal... At the very most I'd happily make myself available for consultation if the question of a recheck arose ... other than that it's their moment and I'd just let em have it while I'm enjoying the last few days of my holidays.. reflecting....

vamos! wrote: »

show may face at the beginning of the debs to congratulate people.

....Teenage discos....Shudder

Powerhouse

I think the notion of teachers being there to "support " students is massively exaggerated. From my observations teachers are there primarily out of their own curiosity. There's nothing they can do for students at that point anyway even with the best of intentions. When I was a student the last people I'd have wanted to see on LC day were my teachers. I think it's good not to be in the students' faces at what is essentially a private time. In my school the results are there for teachers' perusal in the afternoon and I went in last year for a look but don't automatically do so. If a teacher genuinely wants only to see the results and not indulge in voyeurism they can ramble in the day after anyway. Mind you it does psychologically shorten the holidays!

linguist

In answer to the OP, I don't go in on results day for a number of reasons.

Firstly, there is nothing I can actually do on that day other than congratulate, commiserate etc. Without access to the candidates' scripts, there is nothing I can add to the provisional results as issued. Also, I have generally been marking until well into the summer and so am sometimes away on holidays and quite deservedly so in the middle of August!

However, I really would take issue with the sentiments expressed below:

Powerhouse wrote: »

I think the notion of teachers being there to "support " students is massively exaggerated. From my observations teachers are there primarily out of their own curiosity.

That might be your relationship with your students, Powerhouse, but I think a great many of your colleagues would take issue with theirs being described in such a manner. When you've gone well beyond ticking the boxes with your Leaving Certs they matter far more than your assertion suggests.

Again, in answer to the OP, I will go through all my results on my return to work and often phone most or all of the students. I then do the viewing of the scripts with them at the end of August and advise on appeals to the best of my ability. That's the added value you can't provide on results day.

RH149

I used to go in but found like a previous poster said, the successful students are so excited they don't even notice you (I don't blame them either! its friends and family they want to see) and the disappointed ones seem to shrink away and while you want to offer support they just want to get out of there.....If I'm really anxious to see the results I'd go in late in the afternoon but to be honest these days we go back so much earlier in August than we used to that you have barely a week to wait anyway and I can handle that suspense.
I do go in whatever days the exams are on in June and go to view any scripts if I'm asked that last weekend in August which is really when they need support, not on Results day.

paddybarry

Interesting to see that teachers go in and view scripts with students.

I use to always do this, together with extra mocks etc. However, once Croke Park hours were introduced, I knocked it all on it's head.

To me, there is little or no recognition of the considerable amount of goodwill that teachers give day in day out.

I honestly think that a form of industrial action in the shape of a work to rule is the only way to address this.

Millem

paddybarry wrote: »

Interesting to see that teachers go in and view scripts with students.

I use to always do this, together with extra mocks etc. However, once Croke Park hours were introduced, I knocked it all on it's head.

To me, there is little or no recognition of the considerable amount of goodwill that teachers give day in day out.

I honestly think that a form of industrial action in the shape of a work to rule is the only way to address this.

I am dreading all those Croke park hours when we go back I have to say if there was a question mark over one of my students grades I would go and view it with them even though I hate Croke park.

implausible

I have no patience and the curiosity gets to me, so I always go in.

As regards viewing scripts, CP or no CP, if a student wants me to view his/her paper, I'll be there. I have been known to contact students who I knew were unhappy and got them in to view scripts. I object to lots of the silly things we have been roped into doing, but this is directly helping students.

Powerhouse

However, I really would take issue with the sentiments expressed below:


That might be your relationship with your students, Powerhouse, but I think a great many of your colleagues would take issue with theirs being described in such a manner. When you've gone well beyond ticking the boxes with your Leaving Certs they matter far more than your assertion suggests.

.[/quote]

I never mentioned relationships with students and perhaps you would desist from speculating on mine. Teachers, in my experience, go in largely out of curiosity. Only the delusional, in my view, think that a student after getting their results needs their "support" when they have friends and family around. It is also paradoxical that you assume this to be about relationships with students but will not be going in yourself. And it is downright contradictory that you clearly agree (from your post)with me that there is diddley squat a teacher can do on that day but still feel the need to invent something I didn't say and "take issue" with it.

I spent 400 hours with my studenrs over the past two years between regulation class, holiday classes, a weekend trip away, and after-school classes. I will go in on 13th August because I am curious and I am around. I will go in later when students are gone so that they can proces their results in peace. As far as I am concerned they have received exceptional support from me when it mattered. For you to imply otherwise is pathetic.

linguist

Oh Powerhouse, I hit a nerve did I? Just read back over what you wrote and you'll see that yours was the post which called into question teachers' motivations and I was perfectly within my rights to highlight my disagreement. The reaction to my post would suggest I wasn't alone in my view. Talk about being defensive feeling that you have to tell me all the stuff you've done - not that I can verify it anyway. It doesn't surprise me. Whatever your views here, I'm sure you're an excellent teacher and guide to your students as is almost every colleague I've ever worked with.

I don't see anything paradoxical in what I said. If I went in on the morning of the results, of course it would be to see the marks AND the students and to 'finish the job' with them as such. However, with the opportunity to view the scripts and more importantly to talk matters over with students after their CAO offers, I can add value to my input as I said in a previous post. As regards what my students think of me, I'm pretty satisfied it's more positive than negative but I'll keep my ego in check lest you want to add to delusional and pathetic. Boy you don't hold back.

paddybarry: The key point for me is that students haven't imposed one thing on us in recent years and I'm damned if I'll ever take matters out on them.

paddybarry

Our ex minister was someone's student once aswell. I'm sure he benefited from the goodwill of his teachers as did his children. Did not stop him eroding said teachers pay and conditions.

Too many stakeholders are oblivious to the generous amount of goodwill bestowed upon them by teachers. Maybe if this goodwill was made explicitly obvious, we as a profession would receive far more support and respect from other stakeholders.

If we continue down the road we are on, teaching in this country will be destroyed.

Sometimes, hard choices have to be made for the greater good. Short term pain for the long term benefit of all.

Powerhouse

linguist wrote: »

Oh Powerhouse, I hit a nerve did I?

.

Certainly did. You seem pleased with yourself. Anyone who (in complete ignorance of my circumstances) is arrogant enough to imply that my Leaving Certs don't really matter a whole lot to me because I have concluded that eachers go in to see LC results primarily out of curiosity would hit a nerve (leaving aside the fact that it is a blatant non sequiter). The same nerve that presumably I hit in others when I originally suggested that teachers went in on LC results day primarily to satisfy their own curiosity?

Now I see you are SURE I'm a "brilliant teacher" even though you "can't verify anything" - WTF? (Like I'm really just making stuff up to try to impress you!) Best of luck with keeping that ego in check!

linguist

Wow, talk about being able to dish it out but not being able to take it! Again, you wrote something that was downright dismissive of the motivations of the significant number of teachers who go in for the results. Notwithstanding, as you have pointed out, the fact that I actually agree that the practical help one can give on that day is limited, I absolutely stand by my conviction that what gets teachers out of bed that morning as with virtually every morning of their careers is the desire to make a difference for their students.

You wouldn't be in this job if you didn't care, let's face it. But this is a point of contention of your making and if you stepped back you'd see how you made it and how you've embellished it. And since you seem so determined to have your fun, I think you're accusing me more of a contradiction than a paradox and that would be a 'non-sequitor'. Is the troll full?

Rosita

linguist wrote: »

You wouldn't be in this job if you didn't care, let's face it. But this is a point of contention of your making and if you stepped back you'd see how you made it and how you've embellished it.

Linguist,

From my reading of this the point of contention is in fact of your making. In his initial post Powerhouse claimed that the level of support a teacher could give on results day is greatly exaggerated. He did not say that a teacher can give no support - just that the levels possible are exaggerated. There's a morsel of comfort there for everyone to be fair, both those who show up and those who wouldn't dream of going in. Hardly something worth going off the deep end over.

You must be very unsecure to have taken umbrage at that opinion especially when you acknowledged it indirectly several times in your own posts by highlighting the support you apparently give at other times as distinct from results day when you clearly don't feel the need to go in (no harm in that but worth noting in the context of the discussion all the same).

The broader stuff about "caring" is a non-argument that you have introduced as a straw man position. Caring about students is like world peace, everyone's in favour of it........so what? You yourself say that "you wouldn't be in this job if you didn't care". In other words (according to you) ever teacher cares (apparently). Then why is it that attendance on results day is a minority activity? Because (if we accept your contention that it is impossible to be a teacher without caring) teachers are voting with their feet and clearly deciding in a large majority that Powerhouse's basic thesis is solid i.e. that as an occasion of support results day is indeed exaggerated. Otherwise these caring souls would show up in their droves.

To get so ratty as to call Powerhouse, one of the most effective, genuine, clear-thinking and lucid posters on the forum over several years, a 'troll' for simply having a different opinion reflects poorly on you.

linguist

Rosita,

I can see where you're coming from and if there's something I can do to defuse this I will. People are entitled to their views of course. It's interesting how a number of other regulars expressed thanks for the totality of my original post, despite your overall appreciation of Powerhouse.

If I could express my view in a positive manner it would be this. Teaching can be a tough station and I can't say what sustains you or anyone else. However, I'm pretty sure that many of us are sustained by a belief that what we do matters and a commitment to providing a holistic approach for our students that includes going as far as we can to support them. I accept that there is a more nuanced way of reading what Powerhouse said, however I don't think that teachers' belief in the worth of what they do or in their potential to be a force for good should be dismissed lightly. Each teacher cultivates their own relationship with their students. I'm not really a fan of inspirational quotes but the one that comes to mind is that they mightn't remember what you said but they will remember how you made them feel.

To me, trolling frequently involves posting inflammatory or provocative material. To throw around words such as delusional in the context of whether one should be there for one's students seems a bit much - as you might say it doesn't reflect well. I don't appreciate your suggestion of insecurity by the way. There have been a lot of strong or potentially offensive words thrown around here and I suggest that's the first thing that should stop.

Powerhouse is of course entitled to his/her opinion. I acknowledge that my response caused him/her upset in the same way as I dislike seeing people considering what they see as a decent course of action deterred using some of the language that Powerhouse has. My view is that any teacher who feels that they would like to be there should do so and not worry about these issues. If the intentions are good, it will show. I apologise for any offence that my words have caused and perhaps he/she could reflect also.

seavill

Jesus....tough going on this thread... its still the holidays lads, chill:p

Anyway, I go in any year I'm around, my presence makes no differnce to the students overall. I go in to the staffroom to look at the results, say hello and well done to anywone I see and if anyone has any questions I will answer and help if I can.

I think the word 'curiosity' is possibly the wrong word or comes across the wrong way. I go in every year I can because I see the results as my results also. I am interested to see how my class got on. It's not some form of idle curiosity which I think possibly is how the word got taken, if not intended that way.
I believe that I have worked hard fro these results as the kids have so I have an interest in finding out.
I am a very impatient person so I like to go in at the earliest convenience, I was a couple of days late last eyar but usually go in the morning when I wake up (I live very close also so its no big deal). I don't see me going in being nosy or being the savior to the kids but look if they have a question I'm there if not I'm interested in how my class got on anyway.

As others have said most don't even notice you there anyway but it is great to see kids that you have known since they were small or even spent a massive amount of time with over a couple of years getting the results and seeing the joy on their faces. It is probably one of the few enjoyable occasions left in teaching where overall there are smiles all round.

Rosita

linguist wrote: »

Rosita,

I can see where you're coming from and if there's something I can do to defuse this I will. People are entitled to their views. .

The point is that it shouldn't need to be "defused". It is possible to disagree with an opinion without creating a scene by impugning (whether intentional or not) a poster's commitment to their students - and then sneering at their response as if their response indicates weakness - and then name-calling them. To regard Powerhouse's comments as provocative to the point of trolling suggests a seriously short fuse. Not much point in declaring that peole are entitled to their views (which goes without saying anyway) and then going ballistic when they offer them. Anyway I've said my piece and won't be getting getting dragged into a tit for tat arguing about some peripheral point.

Rosita

seavill wrote: »

Anyway, I go in any year I'm around, my presence makes no differnce to the students overall.

That was the essential point being made earlier wasn't it?

seavill

No idea I only glanced at the last number of posts

I was simply offering my experience of the results which is what this thread was supposed to be about. I didn't comment one way or the other on the disagreement as I have no interest in getting involved

implausible

seavill wrote: »

I think the word 'curiosity' is possibly the wrong word or comes across the wrong way. I go in every year I can because I see the results as my results also. I am interested to see how my class got on. It's not some form of idle curiosity which I think possibly is how the word got taken, if not intended that way.
I believe that I have worked hard fro these results as the kids have so I have an interest in finding out.

In a nutshell, what I was trying to say myself!

linguist

Well Rosita, I tried to take on board the points you made and, perhaps more importantly, to make amends for offence caused in the throws of a discussion. It's a pity you feel I need a further dressing down from the teacher's desk whilst I had attempted to react to your contribution as a mature adult capable of revisiting my actions. More fool me it would seem.

evolving_doors

OK OK we'll leave the off topic crossfire for another day. I'm still on holidays but had to duck a few times with the chairs flying across the room here.
Consider the matter closed Rosita/Powerhouse/Linguist:)


sooo..
Anyone else going in?

Meangadh

Aaaaaanyway, back to the OP- no, totally up to the teachers themselves if they want to go in, and people don't really care either way whether you go in or not.

Sometimes I just ring the school and find out how did they get on and then call in the following week to see a full breakdown of the results. I actually don't like being around the students when they're getting their results, I feel like I'm adding to their nerves. But I can completely understand why other teachers want to be there for support and/or to see the results (we've worked for the results too of course!) so whatever each individual teacher decides is fine.

Naoko

I've been asked in all my interviews this year about how my past Leaving Certificate classes got on. I didn't look for the information before for various reasons (only had the classes on one day a week / they were fifth years when I had them rather than sixth years / only taught the class for a few weeks at the beginning or end of term / moved school or location long before they did their exams). This year I had a long stint (maternity leave) with a great bunch of sixth years and I'd really like to see their results. Since principals keep asking me about previous classes, I take it it wouldn't be unusual to find out. Do most ex-subs call to the school after results day? Is it considered okay to do that or would I be better off contacting their main teacher for the results?

implausible

Naoko wrote: »

Since principals keep asking me about previous classes, I take it it wouldn't be unusual to find out. Do most ex-subs call to the school after results day? Is it considered okay to do that or would I be better off contacting their main teacher for the results?

It depends on the teacher you were covering for, I know I wouldn't have minded, but some teachers might be a bit territorial about their students. You could contact the main teacher to see if it's ok/get results or turn up later in the afternoon when there'd be no students about. It'd look good that you cared enough to check.

rainbowtrout

Naoko wrote: »

I've been asked in all my interviews this year about how my past Leaving Certificate classes got on. I didn't look for the information before for various reasons (only had the classes on one day a week / they were fifth years when I had them rather than sixth years / only taught the class for a few weeks at the beginning or end of term / moved school or location long before they did their exams). This year I had a long stint (maternity leave) with a great bunch of sixth years and I'd really like to see their results. Since principals keep asking me about previous classes, I take it it wouldn't be unusual to find out. Do most ex-subs call to the school after results day? Is it considered okay to do that or would I be better off contacting their main teacher for the results?

Well I'm going in tomorrow and a good few teachers in my school normally come in. We had two subs covering for most of the year (right up to the exams) for LC this year and they are coming over tomorrow to see the results and then we're going for lunch and a catch up.

In my school a copy of the results are left in our staffroom so we can have a look at the them and avoid the students and any potential awkwardness, especially if they are not happy with the outcome. The secretary usually puts them in on eportal as well so we can have a look at them from home if we want.

I wouldn't see why there would be a problem in you looking at the results. You brought them to the exam, why shouldn't you be able to find out how they got on?

rainbowtrout

implausible wrote: »

It depends on the teacher you were covering for, I know I wouldn't have minded, but some teachers might be a bit territorial about their students. You could contact the main teacher to see if it's ok/get results or turn up later in the afternoon when there'd be no students about. It'd look good that you cared enough to check.

Why would the teacher have a say? It's the sub that had them in the run up to the exam, surely they should be able to see how the class got on without needing permission??

implausible

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Why would the teacher have a say? It's the sub that had them in the run up to the exam, surely they should be able to see how the class got on without needing permission??

Well, the teacher wouldn't have a say, but it could look like good manners to tell/ask her, especially when the poster mentioned contacting her. I just know teachers in my place who that would go down well with, but you're right, the sub doesn't need permission, and should head on in.

Naoko

Their main teacher had them in April and May so I had 'given them back' to her before the exam, if that makes a difference.

rainbowtrout

Naoko wrote: »

Their main teacher had them in April and May so I had 'given them back' to her before the exam, if that makes a difference.

Not really, I'd assume you had them for at least 6 months if it was maternity leave, go on in and have a look.

rainbowtrout

implausible wrote: »

Well, the teacher wouldn't have a say, but it could look like good manners to tell/ask her, especially when the poster mentioned contacting her. I just know teachers in my place who that would go down well with, but you're right, the sub doesn't need permission, and should head on in.

The mind boggles.....

Millem

implausible wrote: »

Well, the teacher wouldn't have a say, but it could look like good manners to tell/ask her, especially when the poster mentioned contacting her. I just know teachers in my place who that would go down well with, but you're right, the sub doesn't need permission, and should head on in.

I have to agree implausible I would be more inclined to ask the the teacher rather than go in. Some teachers are very territorial!!! Now in fairness not in my school but some of the stories I hear from my friends are just mad!

vamos!

Well results day is here. Hope all went well for the teachers who went in and that management, year heads and guidance are dealing with smiles rather than tears. Had decided not to go in this year. Was going to go in tomorrow but I've gotten a better offer and am heading away for a week.Can I ring the school today or will they be too busy dealing with the students? Do the people who don't go in generally wait until back to school time? I am curious but also not CID and don't want to look like I don't care!

RealJohn

I went in about eleven, thus avoiding the scrum. A few students were still around but they had little interest in talking to me (which was fine by me). Everyone seemed happy enough and there were no surprises in the results (or at least, nothing that surprised me).

evolving_doors

Millem wrote: »

I have to agree implausible I would be more inclined to ask the the teacher rather than go in. Some teachers are very territorial!!! Now in fairness not in my school but some of the stories I hear from my friends are just mad!

Defo agree, have you not heard about the battle that ensued after Grendel touched a teacher's Man. United cup in Beowulf... epic.

All jokes aside best of luck to all the teachers today. Its the one day of the year they might get some kind of a positive mention.

solerina

I never go in...I always go in the day they do the exam however, as they want to talk to you then. I feel once you step foot inside the gate that the holidays are over so I wait until the last possible minute. I genuinely care about how my students get on but my curiosity an wait for another week or so....I find that you generally can predict their results anyway !!

acequion

I only came back into the country last night and could not in any way relax today until I found out how my students had got on. So in I went,was able to get my own results very quickly and met nobody. Which was perfect, because a] we're still on holidays and b] I completely agree with the posters who say that it's a private moment for the student and the presence of teachers can actually be intrusive.

Today is not a day to vent our many reasons for resentment at the general state of our profession and is indeed a day for a teacher to privately savour the sweet taste of rewarding satisfaction. However those posters who point out that we should not be rushing in to view scripts with students when we are heading back to many unpaid and unrewarded hours are completely right. While my heart might want to comply with this last request from a student,my head tells me to be more circumspect. It's one thing to view the scripts of students we feel may have been hard done by,it's quite another when it's a student who just can't accept the grade. Anyway,viewing of scripts should be part of CP hours and if not,teachers should collectively refuse to do them.

Remember folks,at the end of the day,we are a means to an end for most of our students,despite how bonded to them we become on that journey. The fact that the teacher is neither wanted nor needed by many students on results day, should make that clear.

So,congrats to all teachers on the LC results and enjoy the last days of the hols!:)