Are lazy people using strength workouts

Blackpanther95

A lot of gym-goers are lifting heavier and working through less sets and reps. From personal experience I know that when I wasn't in the right mindset I used to justify not working hard enough by claiming "oh its strength, its 5*5". 5 reps on any weight isn't tough, you fail or you don't either way its over in under 10 seconds.

On the other hand, drop setting from one rep max till there's nothing on the bar- tears painfully and burns hard. Plus it lasts like 1-2 mins of shear pain.

What ya think?

Try doing 5 by 5 back squats with your 5-rep max and tell me it's easy. If it's taking you less than 10 seconds to do 5 tough reps then something isn't quite right.

long range shooter

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

A lot of gym-goers are lifting heavier and working through less sets and reps. From personal experience I know that when I wasn't in the right mindset I used to justify not working hard enough by claiming "oh its strength, its 5*5". 5 reps on any weight isn't tough, you fail or you don't either way its over in under 10 seconds.

On the other hand, drop setting from one rep max till there's nothing on the bar- tears painfully and burns hard. Plus it lasts like 1-2 mins of shear pain.

What ya think?

Depends on your goal,for strenght it's best with the 1-5 reps,and lift 80-90% of max.
For building mass and muscle 8-12 reps and 75-80% of max.

Blackpanther95

gvn wrote: »

Try doing 5 by 5 back squats with your 5-rep max and tell me it's easy. If it's taking you less than 10 seconds to do 5 tough reps then something isn't quite right.

I used to do that (still do once a week), its hard but it would be harder if you supersetted all the way down. When I do strenght I get sore, I'm a bit afraid to train legs (supersetting and machines) again, the cramps are ridiculous and total pain and burning. Heavy squats are hard but its over pretty quick. Also my flexibility is terrible so I can't squat ass to grass which could be a factor too.

Greenmachine

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

I used to do that (still do once a week), its hard but it would be harder if you supersetted all the way down. When I do strenght I get sore, I'm a bit afraid to train legs (supersetting and machines) again, the cramps are ridiculous and total pain and burning. Heavy squats are hard but its over pretty quick. Also my flexibility is terrible so I can't squat ass to grass which could be a factor too.

You are afraid to train legs but you feel comfortable criticizing others with different workout goals. A little strange, me thinks.

Mellor

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

A lot of gym-goers are lifting heavier and working through less sets and reps. From personal experience I know that when I wasn't in the right mindset I used to justify not working hard enough by claiming "oh its strength, its 5*5". 5 reps on any weight isn't tough, you fail or you don't either way its over in under 10 seconds.

If your 5 reps sets were always under 10 seconds then your weren't pushing anything close to your max. So yeah, you probably were being lazy. But hat doesn't mean everyone else is.

Saying 5 reps is never tough is ridiculous. Also smacks of being lazy and "failing" to avoid a hard grind to close out the reps.

On the other hand, drop setting from one rep max till there's nothing on the bar- tears painfully and burns hard. Plus it lasts like 1-2 mins of shear pain.

What ya think?

It'll last longer, but that doesn't mean it requires more effort. It's uncomfortable sure, it burns more. But that doesn't mean it's tougher.

There's no target with a drop set. You don't really try to match your previous. There's no guarantee that the person is pushing themselves and progressing just because it burns a lot.

Hanley

gvn wrote: »

Try doing 5 by 5 back squats with your 5-rep max and tell me it's easy. If it's taking you less than 10 seconds to do 5 tough reps then something isn't quite right.

You can't do 5x5 with a 5rm.

But yeah I agree with the op. Most people are pussies when it comes to training and volume.

colossus-x

Funny, cause I think drop sets are really easy and look/seem more impressive than they really are.

Im really impressed by ppl who do 5*5. I don't think I could do it day in day out.

Blackpanther95

colossus-x wrote: »

Funny, cause I think drop sets are really easy and look/seem more impressive than they really are.

Im really pressed by ppl who do 5*5. I don't think I could do it day in day out.

you honestly think that. Me and my training partner did 5 sets of dropsets. We were curling and we just loaded the straight bar with 1.25 kgs (9) on each side and took the weights of each side after we couldn't do a rep (with good form) all the way to the empty bar. I thought my biceps were gonna explode. It took one hour, and that was just one exercise done. If we were doing strength (strict curl) then we would be done in 20 mins max, and no-way would it feel half as bad. I know because I used to do it.

In response to the people saying 5*5 squats are tough, how long does it take you to do five reps? Certainly not longer than 20-30 secs, still a quater of what a dropset would be. I agree with you that people can prematurely give up on a dropset, but equivalently someone might not put exactly the right amount on the bar to challenge themselves in 5 by fives.

I agree with 5*5 squats (I do it but mainly for the stress), but 5*5 bench and 5*5 strict curl etc are just cop-outs IMO. Also it looks like people who do strength love low-volume. Surely for max gains you want to tear and hypertrophy and 5*5 don't hypertrophy.

Alf Veedersane

If you're copping out, you're copping out whether that's on a 5-rep set or a drop set.

colossus-x

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

you honestly think that. Me and my training partner did 5 sets of dropsets. We were curling and we just loaded the straight bar with 1.25 kgs (9) on each side and took the weights of each side after we couldn't do a rep (with good form) all the way to the empty bar. I thought my biceps were gonna explode. It took one hour, and that was just one exercise done. If we were doing strength (strict curl) then we would be done in 20 mins max, and no-way would it feel half as bad. I know because I used to do it.

1 hour to do 5 sets of drop sets

Nervous Wreck

My program is better than all your programs and my dad could beat up all your dads.

Hanley

Wait... did he just said strict curls without a drop set are a strength exercise?

TimeToShine

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

you honestly think that. Me and my training partner did 5 sets of dropsets. We were curling and we just loaded the straight bar with 1.25 kgs (9) on each side and took the weights of each side after we couldn't do a rep (with good form) all the way to the empty bar. I thought my biceps were gonna explode. It took one hour, and that was just one exercise done. If we were doing strength (strict curl) then we would be done in 20 mins max, and no-way would it feel half as bad. I know because I used to do it.

1 hour doing the same exercise for your biceps.

lol.

Wood

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

you honestly think that. Me and my training partner did 5 sets of dropsets. We were curling and we just loaded the straight bar with 1.25 kgs (9) on each side and took the weights of each side after we couldn't do a rep (with good form) all the way to the empty bar. I thought my biceps were gonna explode. It took one hour, and that was just one exercise done. If we were doing strength (strict curl) then we would be done in 20 mins max, and no-way would it feel half as bad. I know because I used to do it.

Wow. You must be so swole. An hour on biceps? Afraid to train legs and cant squat?

generic2012

A workout made up of drop sets for one exercise for one muscle is a lot easier on the brain than a well structured strength plan anyway....

Mellor

Hanley wrote: »

Wait... did he just said strict curls without a drop set are a strength exercise?

You're the one who agreed with him

Mellor

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

you honestly think that. Me and my training partner did 5 sets of dropsets. We were curling and we just loaded the straight bar with 1.25 kgs (9) on each side and took the weights of each side after we couldn't do a rep (with good form) all the way to the empty bar. I thought my biceps were gonna explode. It took one hour, and that was just one exercise done. If we were doing strength (strict curl) then we would be done in 20 mins max, and no-way would it feel half as bad. I know because I used to do it.

You are comparing apples and oranges cabbages here.

Why would you compare your whole hour in the gym, with a single 5x5 exercise.
In an hour, I'll do 5x5 on 3 main lifts, plus 2 accessory lifts. Personally, I think an hour of curls is ridiculous. Btw, strict curls aren't trained 5x5 or for strength.

In response to the people saying 5*5 squats are tough, how long does it take you to do five reps? Certainly not longer than 20-30 secs, still a quater of what a dropset would be.

It would be less time than a long drop set. Relevance?
It's also a lot lighter than the squat.

I agree with you that people can prematurely give up on a dropset, but equivalently someone might not put exactly the right amount on the bar to challenge themselves in 5 by fives.

A 5x5 might not be a challange, then you add weight to the bar, again and again.
I doubt you are increasing you weight in the drop set every week.

Surely for max gains you want to tear and hypertrophy and 5*5 don't hypertrophy.

Poor hypertrophy is a strange criticsm for a strength program. It makes as much sense as saying an hour of drops sets are the begs for strength.

Hanley

Mellor wrote: »

You're the one who agreed with him

I agree with the other points. Most people do 3-5 reps per set because they're pussies. And it's why they move semi reasonable weight but are fat and don't have any muscle.

long range shooter

Hanley wrote: »

I agree with the other points. Most people do 3-5 reps per set because they're pussies. And it's why they move semi reasonable weight but are fat and don't have any muscle.

Depends on the excersise.Compound its used 3-5 reps and isolation probably 8-12 reps.
Most powerlifters use 3-5 reps in training.

Mellor

Hanley wrote: »

I agree with the other points. Most people do 3-5 reps per set because they're pussies. And it's why they move semi reasonable weight but are fat and don't have any muscle.

Ah I knew what you meant, was just pulling your chain.
I don't disagree with that part, it's not endemic to 5x5ers though. The majority of people in the gym aren't really trying. Just going through the motions of mediocrity.

long range shooter wrote: »

Depends on the excersise.Compound its used 3-5 reps and isolation probably 8-12 reps.
Most powerlifters use 3-5 reps in training.

Well I'm glad we cleared that up

Alf Veedersane

Mellor wrote: »

The majority of people in the gym aren't really trying. Just going through the motions of mediocrity.

That's across the board in any physical pursuit.

People are content to stay in their comfort zone and tick the 'Did <insert exercise> today' box.

Hanley

long range shooter wrote: »

Depends on the excersise.Compound its used 3-5 reps and isolation probably 8-12 reps.
Most powerlifters use 3-5 reps in training.

Oh yeah? Cool. Thanks for clearing that one up.

Your view of training is quite myopic.

long range shooter

Hanley wrote: »

Oh yeah? Cool. Thanks for clearing that one up.

Your view of training is quite myopic.

Your welcome.
Just ask if you wondering about something.;)
Then again are we talking beginner or advanced?.

Blackpanther95

So strict curls aren't strength? I thought they were part of powerlifting competitions. Good point, a structured strength plan might require more (out-of-the-gym) work. No, the 1 hour curl 6 dropset thing was just one exercise, we usually do 3 exercises of biceps. The rest are usually supersets though rather than true dropsets. After which I feel the skin around my arms is what stopping them from growing (super-pump haha). Also it seems that the key to growing with strength is to eat like 10,000+ calories a day, most of the record holders are 100+ kg and the guys I see don't put that work in. I guess you could say that strength done properly isn't laziness at all, but I'm talking about the people who claim they want to look 'swole' and then just do this quick strength workout (and not seasoned powerlifters).

Also just to clarify, I do train legs, I just drink saltwater or peanuts (salted) beforehand to stop the cramps. I never got cramps when I was doing strength though. Also I usually train legs for around two hours (3 times a week) so I don't skip on that department anyways!

Caliden

You shouldn't be coming out of the gym every single day in tears, you'll never get anywhere.

Plan out your goals (for some it's a few months, others 6 weeks, etc.) and work up towards a new 1RM, then go on a de-load and repeat for a new 1RM.

Have a listen to this fella or Jonnie Candito:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jch51C-hCjU

Blackpanther95

Caliden wrote: »

You shouldn't be coming out of the gym every single day in tears, you'll never get anywhere.

Plan out your goals (for some it's a few months, others 6 weeks, etc.) and work up towards a new 1RM, then go on a de-load and repeat for a new 1RM.

Have a listen to this fella or Jonnie Candito:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jch51C-hCjU

I honestly believed thats nonsense. Be training like this for almost 18 months now and put on 16 kg (and I'm 5'7''). If you wanna be big listen to Rich Piana and Arnie. The old-schoolers may not have been as massive as the modern BBuilders but they were practically natural (test only). I think people are getting conned with they're 4 sessions of an hour a week. And all because they don't wanna eat they're 6000 calories a day.

Hanley

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

they were practically natural (test only).

Is there a post of the day award? Cos that wins it!!

Blackpanther95

Hanley wrote: »

Is there a post of the day award? Cos that wins it!!

hehehe by todays standards -most certainly!

Caliden

Blackpanther95 wrote: »

I honestly believed thats nonsense. Be training like this for almost 18 months now and put on 16 kg (and I'm 5'7''). If you wanna be big listen to Rich Piana and Arnie. The old-schoolers may not have been as massive as the modern BBuilders but they were practically natural (test only). I think people are getting conned with they're 4 sessions of an hour a week. And all because they don't wanna eat they're 6000 calories a day.

No matter how much you train and how many calories you eat there's still a limit to the amount of actual muscle you can gain (without steroids).

Blackpanther95

Caliden wrote: »

No matter how much you train and how many calories you eat there's still a limit to the amount of actual muscle you can gain (without steroids).

I disagree, even there is a limit NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO!