Smoking

dee_mc

I stopped smoking 67 days ago, although I'm still using an e-cig a couple of times a day to take the edge off (I'm planning to finish with the e-cig by the end of October).
I stopped because I realised I'd been smoking half my life, and while I'd cut down in recent months I was, realistically, no closer to stopping. I also wanted to support other smokers in the family who were trying to quit.
It's probably the best decision I ever made.
I can see how Gerry's story could bring people closer to the point of quitting, but the key to stopping and staying off them is actually wanting to quit.
I continued smoking throughout the cancer diagnosis and treatment of a close family member (one of the ones who quit just after I did) and even from this distance, I look back and think 'how selfish and stupid of me'. I don't mean it as a cop-out, but to me, that's the power of addiction.

Boskowski

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

I'd like to think that if I did still smoke, a family member dying would definitely get me off them.

Is the addiction that bad? Are you not worried about the consequences or do you just not care? Genuine question, I don't understand the reasoning behind it but I'd like to try

The addiction is pretty bad although the symptoms aren't all that terrible.
Its more of a psychological thing rather than a physical addiction. Bar those few occasions when you smoke too many and you feel them making you tired and drained or when you feel without energy in a footie match you actually think you like smoking. The thought of never being able to have again is the thing that puts you off. You're fooling yourself thinking you actually like them. Which is of course a fallacy but that's how devious an addiction they are.

So devious that even knowing all THIS and being able to write write about it on the interwebs in a rational manner won't stop me lighting one up in a minute.

And then of course you think ah well not everyone gets sick, chances are I'll be grand.

Magaggie

Magaggie wrote: »

I know cigarettes are extremely addictive but it's not like the lack of them gets people into the same state that heroin/crack do.

Exactly, and they're a lot more habitual than heroin. Heroin a few times a day, fags maybe 20 a day. The one after a meal. The one after a lecture. The one after a bus journey. The one with a lovely cold pint on a summer evening. It's all of those habits that have to be broken. It's difficult but even as someone who really enjoys smoking I look forward to not having them in those situations. :P

Gongoozler

NegativeCreep wrote: »

I switched to vaping, not because of that ad but around the same time it came out. People (usually normal-cigarette smoking people) love to tell me how much worse vaping is for you than smokes, it's annoying.

Huh? What kinda logic do they use there?

KERSPLAT!

Boskowski wrote: »

The addiction is pretty bad although the symptoms aren't all that terrible.
Its more of a psychological thing rather than a physical addiction. Bar those few occasions when you smoke too many and you feel them making you tired and drained or when you feel without energy in a footie match you actually think you like smoking. The thought of never being able to have again is the thing that puts you off. You're fooling yourself thinking you actually like them. Which is of course a fallacy but that's how devious an addiction they are.

So devious that even knowing all THIS and being able to write write about it on the interwebs in a rational manner won't stop me lighting one up in a minute.

And then of course you think ah well not everyone gets sick, chances are I'll be grand.

Chances are you'll be grand? I'd imagine that's what every smoker says... Every smoker isn't grand though

KERSPLAT!

Gongoozler wrote: »

Huh? What kinda logic do they use there?

I've heard that bandied around quite a bit. Vamping isn't regulated or something and no one knows what exactly is in it. How true or not that is, I've no idea

Boskowski

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

Chances are you'll be grand? I'd imagine that's what every smoker says... Every smoker isn't grand though

I know that of course. I'm not saying its logical but thats how smokers think.

KERSPLAT!

Boskowski wrote: »

I'm not saying its logical but thats how smokers think.

Ah ok, yeah I get ya.

RayM

My mum saw her 46-year-old brother die from lung cancer, but it wasn't enough to make her succeed in quitting. She died two years ago, also from lung cancer. It's not like she didn't try to give up. Over the years, she must have spent thousands on various different methods, from nicotine patches to hypnosis to laser therapy. Her addiction was just uncontrollably strong. She could quit for lengthy periods, but the craving never seemed to abate. Not even slightly. If e-cigarettes had been available twenty or thirty years ago, maybe she'd still be around today.

So I have a lot of sympathy for smokers. I've never smoked, but I think I have at least some idea of how difficult it can be to quit.

Lung cancer is a devastating illness, and nothing like I ever imagined it to be. I had always assumed that the main side-effect was a really bad cough. Throughout my mum's illness, I don't think I heard her coughing at all. The metastasis was the worst part. The awful pain when the cancer spreads to the bones - pain that even the strongest painkillers couldn't alleviate.

When the cancer spread to my mum's brain, I had to arrange her medication (over 25 tablets per day) and take note of whatever painkillers she took - especially for 'breakthrough pain'. Gradually, the tablets got stronger and stronger - Tramadol, OxyNorm, OxyContin, Effentora... She had an incredibly strong pain threshold, so it was quite shocking to see her in such agony.

The direct side-effects of the cancer in her brain were disturbing too. She could no longer remember people's names. Her balance and eyesight started to go. Her ability to speak was deteriorating. It's like having someone - a relatively young person - develop dementia really quickly right before your eyes.

I think those adverts are effective, but I'd like to see an anti-smoking advert that deals with all the lesser-known symptoms of smoking-related illnesses, and the effect they have on those who have to watch a person whom they love slowly fading away.

Boskowski

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

I've heard that bandied around quite a bit. Vamping isn't regulated or something and no one knows what exactly is in it. How true or not that is, I've no idea

Well nothing much really some sort of glycerine solution for the actual aroma and thats it. How good or bad it is is not scientifically proven yet. It is a pretty safe assumption that its nowhere near as bad as a cigarette though.

NegativeCreep

Gongoozler wrote: »

Huh? What kinda logic do they use there?

There was an article going around a while ago saying that someone allegedly found rat poison in e-liquid (it's always rat poison isn't it?) and my friends kept bringing it up in conversation and then you'll also get the people saying "sure you don't know what the hell you're smoking with them things." Like as if everyone knows what's in cigarettes :pac:

Calibos

Smoking is insidious in its psychological addiction because, "Its just the thing I need, cause I'm feeling down......just the thing cause Im feeling happy....just the thing because I'm bored, just the thing cause Im run off my feet and need to concentrate on this job....just the thing to have after that jog....just the thing cause I'm too sick to go out for a jog.....etc etc. ie. No matter your mood or feeling or energy level.....its just the thing you need"

Vaping myself for nearly two years. All the components of E-Cigs bar one have 70 years of studies showing no ill effects from vapourisation and inhalation (Propylene Glycol(Medical Inhalers, Fog machines), Vegetable Glycerine, Nicotine), The flavourings have decades of studies showing no problem with oral ingestion but no studies yet for inhalation) The fact that supposedly sane people and governments are trying to say that effectively "better the devil you know with 4000 chemicals and carcinagens (smokes) than the devil you don't with 3 safe chemicals and tiny quantities of some chemicals that are unlikely to be bad even when inhaled but we just aren't 100% sure yet. The negative e-cig propaganda just shows that governments trying to protect a massive revenue stream make cosy bedfellows with vested interests from the tobacco and pharmaceutical lobbies and the smokers that parrot the propaganda "Well I heard they're just as bad or worse than smokes" are just willfully latching onto any excuse not to make the switch.

Boskowski

Hey Calibos, have you tried going without the vape yet? And are you still on ciggie aroma or would strawberry for example work just as well for you? Have you put on weight?

Sorry if I'm too personal but I'm a smoker and very curious.

tommy2bad

Actually vaping is proven to be between 100 and 1000 times safer than smoking, if you smoke switch and if you don't, be glaad an stop hasling people who have switched.
I doubt the add gets anyone to quit but then again if it stops so.done fr starting. Job done.

2Mad2BeMad

wazky wrote: »

75% of all smokers will die.

What happens to the rest of us so? do we live forever?
If thats the case I will start smoking 60 a day at those odds of living forever

Boskowski

Boskowski wrote: »

ah the old 'not just right now'

Btw I'm smoking myself so this is only a friendly dig, in fact I have said the same to myself a few times. Have I quit, no.

All these measures with the grizzly pics on the boxes and the telling you how bad it is and that ad and so on are ridiculous. These things do not get people of the fags. All they do is ruin people's evenings. They all seem to be made by non-smokers who don't understand smokers and smoking.

Having said, they may stop a few people from taking it up fair enough.

Yep, the good aul 'soon but not right now' indeed!

My own smoking story in a nutshell, if anyone cares...

I started late enough, at 23, and am smoking about 8 years now. 2014 was the year that I finally decided to do something about it and it's what I'm in the process of doing. 'But how can you be in the process of it? You either quit or you don't, on or off, 1 or 0'.

Well one thing I needed to sort out first was my weed intake. In recent years it had gone from recreational to habitual. At the end of April I took the plunge and knocked the weed on the head. It wasn't easy, not one bit, and I knew almost straight away that I wouldn't be able to quit the weed and the cigarettes at the same time. I did try, but by the end of the 2nd day I ran for a box of smokes. Yes, both are important to give up, but for me the weed was number 1 priority at the time because I didn't like the control it had come to have over me. Cigarettes have control over me of course, but the weed was a whole different beast.

I won't lie, since I quit the weed, my cigarette smoking has gone up to 10-12 per day where as before quitting the green, I'd smoke 5-7 cigs a day. I now have the weed issue well under control, in that I don't smoke it at all, don't long for it, and it is now behind me.

As for the cigarettes, I have admitted to myself that it will be mid-September by the time I try to quit them/go on the electronics. Although ideally, I won't be going near the electronics or any other substitute. The reason for my timeline isn't just a case of 'kicking the can down the road', but because I have a litter of weddings to attend in August, and the first 2 weeks of September will see me in a work environment where it will be a living hell to not be smoking due to the environment of the work.

To add to that, I am weary about the thought of putting on a few pounds in weight due to smoking. Part of my 'process' in quitting has seen me increase my exercise levels by 40-50% in recent months in anticipation of quitting the smokes.

Smoking is a curse, and one that I am confident of lifting. I understand that there are countless smokers out there who are totally comfortable with their habit, I am not one of them though. Of those 10-12 i smoke a day now, I'd say I might genuinely enjoy 2 of those; The first of the day and the one after dinner. I'm looking forward to becoming a non-smoker soon, but know that it won't be easy at all.

Calibos

Australia have had the nasty pictures on fag packets for a long time now. Certainly long enough to feature in the Late Great Bill Hicks' standup routines from back in the day. He satirised it by saying that when touring in Oz he would refuse the diseased lung packets and ask for a pack of 'Low Birth Weights' or 'Low Motility Sperms' because he didn't plan to have kids anyway.

I've actually had this happen now that Ireland has brought in the same labels. Actually had people refuse the Guy Fawlks throat cancer guy and diseased lung packs and they've made a selection from the Impotence, Low Sperm Motility and Low Birth weights packets instead.

Nothing as queer as folk as the saying goes.

Galwayguy35

I smoked a fag once just to try it, it tasted terrible, I would imagine it was the same for everyone the very first time they smoked.

I know they are addictive but it must take time to get to like the feeling and taste of smoking.

NegativeCreep

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I smoked a fag once just to try it, it tasted terrible, I would imagine it was the same for everyone the very first time they smoked.

I know they are addictive but it must take time to get to like the feeling and taste of smoking.

I started smoking while drinking over the course of a few months and that's when the habit started. When drunk the taste isn't so bad and then you start to enjoy it. I'd say that's how a lot of people start.

2Mad2BeMad

Shiraz 4.99 wrote: »

I gave up around Jan of this year, not sure it was his ad but I've no cravings at all.
Lots of my friends who smoked in their 20's & 30's have all given up.
You couldn't justify a 70 quid a week habit when the recession started.
I can see smoking becoming more & more a fringe activity in the future.

I spend 15e a week on smokes
3 boxes of amber leaf and sorted (I call it a poor mans cancer, I know its a sick joke)

15e a week aint expensive and I'd say I smoke about 15 a day, you could get 30-35 out of a box easily.
So really its not an expensive habbit, and to be quite honest I love it most times, nothing like a cig with a cuppa tea, or straight after food.

Smoking can be quite affordable, and even though I really do love it, if I had the choice to go back in time and not start I most likely would.

But basicly, you only live once, sure may as well eat, drink, smoke and do the things you enjoy. Assuming were all adults in here, we are responsible for our own bodys, if I want to eat 4000 calories a day and be like a beach whale and die from a heart attack, thats my choice, if I want to drink coke all day everyday until I get diabetes, thats my choice.
If I want to smoke 40 a day I shouldnt need an ad in my face telling me I am going to get cancer, I know the risks as do most people who smoke. ITS MY CHOICE.

Now apart from that, I know alot of people who do smoke, throw theirs butts on the ground, I find that disgusting, should be a law against it.
I also always agreed about the smoking ban in pubs etc...

regards to the smell, I obviously don't notice it. But if you find it that bad, breath through your mouth.:pac:

Boskowski

@stankratz

I'm similar. I know I have to do it because even if I won't die from it (and even if it only was a 5% chance of dying that would still be a pretty big if, wouldn't it, and I know its more than 5%) it will reduce my quality of life.
I can even feel it now. I play a nice soccer game once a week and the difference in energy levels if I just don't smoke on that very day is unbelievable. Sometimes I play like a fkn zombie and I know its the smokes.

My story is in so far similar that I actually also started very late kinda like yourself in a around 22, 23 and it was through smoking doobeys. Couldn't find anything interesting in cigarettes but loved my pollen, not a big drinker I might add. Eventually the doobeys became a problem because it became a daily thing rather than the odd one so I knocked that on the head. Since then I only smoke a joint very very occasionally, maybe a couple of times a year at a party or concert or so.
But the cigarettes stayed with me until now (20 years) which is very annoying.
I promised myself I will give them up before they really get to me but unfortunately this is now and I have to sh1t or get off the pot as they say.

Gongoozler

2Mad2BeMad wrote: »

But basicly, you only live once, sure may as well eat, drink, smoke and do the things you enjoy. Assuming were all adults in here, we are responsible for our own bodys, if I want to eat 4000 calories a day and be like a beach whale and die from a heart attack, thats my choice, if I want to drink coke all day everyday until I get diabetes, thats my choice.
If I want to smoke 40 a day I shouldnt need an ad in my face telling me I am going to get cancer, I know the risks as do most people who smoke. ITS MY CHOICE.

All I would say to that is think about what you dying in the next three years would do to those who care about you

Shakespeare's Sister

If you have a family/other people in your life who care about you, "It's my choice" is a stupid, selfish attitude. If you don't though, fire away I guess.

Calibos

Boskowski wrote: »

Hey Calibos, have you tried going without the vape yet? And are you still on ciggie aroma or would strawberry for example work just as well for you? Have you put on weight?

Sorry if I'm too personal but I'm a smoker and very curious.

My Vaping story is as follows:

Smoked Silk Cut Silver (The fag that others refer to as sucking air) for years. Worked up to a 40 a day habit. Tried cutting to a 20 a day habit by smoking a higher nicotine cigarette (SCB) but just ended up smoking 40 of them instead. Went back to Silvers no problem. When I say I smoked 40 I really smoked about 25-30 but work/home life meant a lot of burnt out cigarettes. Thus still needed to buy 40 a day.

Tried the cigalike e-cigarettes for a few weeks and just about managed to hold my real cig habit down to about 5 a day in conjunction with the e-cig. I then moved to a real e-cig with ego battery and clearomiser which meant I could use the much cheaper bottles of e-juice that came in higher nicotine levels than the cigalikes. 24mg as opposed to 16mg max with the cigalikes. This turned out to be my nicotine sweetspot. I was able to knock the 5 real cigs a day on the head.

I tried all the sweet fancy flavours but quickly tired of them and settled back on one particular cig flavour which I've now vaped the bulk of my 2 years of vaping.

I guess I have been lucky in that I didn't become like a lot of vapers chasing the 'perfect vape'. I quickly found found a cheap battery and clearo combination that worked for me and a flavour that worked for me. Lots of vapers seem to almost become like foodies,coffee or wine connessuers, waxing lyrical about the subtle oaky note and full texture blah blah and spending as much on fancy vaping gear as they would on a fancy coffee machine or indeed as much as they used to spend on cigarettes. It almost becomes a hobby to them. IMHO these vapers would be the least likely to try to or want to give up vaping. Each to their own. For me I was happy just to get off the smokes and save a fcuk tonne of money in the process. Put it this way. I paid more in Tax on my fag habit than I did in income tax!!!

I actually do feel as if I am reaching the end of my vaping period and will probably try and knock it totally on the head soon. Whether or not I succeed in the long run, What I do know is that I will never smoke a real cigarette again. At worst I'll just go back to vaping.

Anecdotal evidence with some scientific analysis back up is that its easier to give up an e-cig than a real cig habit. Apparently studies on rats showed that they showed addictive behaviours after inhaling cigarette smoke but not pure nicotine. ie. that maybe nicotine wasn't the main chemical driver of addiction in cigs after all. Turned out that cigs actually have cannaboids and chemicals with similar effects to benzo's in them!! No wonder a fag was so relaxing!!

So if you are a vaper, you've already gone through and dealt with the withdrawl from the cannaboids and benzos from a real cigarette and when giving up vaping one is only left to deal with the nicotine withdrawl which isn't as bad as we all thought it was.

I did have a blip in July of 2013 where I ended up smoking for a month. Within days the annoying sore cough, coughing up gick and disturbed sleep etc was back . When I switched back to vaping the reverse was true and within days the cough was gone again, no disturbed sleep. Lungs cleared themselves out again.

For beginner vapers I recommend you skip the cigalikes and go straight to an ego battery and clearo or carto. Vaping is the closest thing to the feeling of smoking but it will feel a little bit different for the first day or two. Don't inhale in one go like some do. Inhale into the mouth and then inhale from the mouth to the lungs. The throathit will be a little bit different and tickly for the first day or two but after that it feels just like smoking after your throat gets used to it. Pick a high enough nicotine level to deal with the physical cravings. You can move down nicotine levels after you have fully made the transition. By all means ease yourself into it by smoking a real cigarette after the main trigger times like your morning coffee or after dinner etc but stick to your e-cig for the rest of the time. You'll feel like you're still craving real cigarettes but your not. You are craving the nicotine. Your brain has been primed 20 times a day 365 days a year for god knows how many years to picture a real cigarette in your minds eye every time its dopamine receptors sent the craving signal. It'll take a week or two to re-programme the brain to have you automatically picturing and reaching for your vaping gear instead of instinctually patting down your trouser pocket for your packet of fags and lighter. A real fag appearing in your minds eye is not your body demanding a real cig, its simply demanding nicotine. It just needs re-programming to picture the new nicotine delivery system instead of the old.

As for weight gain and Vaping. Doesn't happen afaik and didn't happen to me, It makes sense tbh. Weight gain from giving up the fags is because one snacks and nibbles more when dealing with the hand to mouth phsychological addiction aspects of the physical act of smoking. The weight gain is nothing to do with the chemical properties of a cigarette or nicotine. With vaping, you've still got the hand mouth and inhalation things going on, so one doesn't need to substitute snacking and nibbles. Thus no weight gain.

christy c

I think the problem with smoking ads is that there's none aimed at children/teens. Young people know that if they smoke a fag that they won't die from that particular one but they don't realise how easy it is to get addicted. Ask any smoker when they decided to get addicted? The truth is no one ever did decide, it happened to them (including me).

I don't see that in any ads

KERSPLAT!

christy c wrote: »

I think the problem with smoking ads is that there's none aimed at children/teens. Young people know that if they smoke a fag that they won't die from that particular one but they don't realise how easy it is to get addicted. Ask any smoker when they decided to get addicted? The truth is no one ever did decide, it happened to them (including me).

I don't see that in any ads

Teens don't see the addiction as a problem IMO. I don't know if the ads out now work or the pics on the boxes but I'd be fairly certain teens won't listen to ads warning about addiction

misslt

I'm a smoker for 5 years now, I started when I was 19.

I still love it and I'm terrified of giving up. I know I will (within the next year hopefully) but it scares me. I did 2 courses of patches in 2012 and was off them for 3 months both times, I loved it. Loved not being a smoker. But then I had that one when drunk and lo and behold I was back on them.

I've recently started trying to lose a substantial amount of weight which is why I'm postponing the quit date - cop out I know but I'm just not strong enough to do both at once.

christy c

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

Teens don't see the addiction as a problem IMO. I don't know if the ads out now work or the pics on the boxes but I'd be fairly certain teens won't listen to ads warning about addiction

I know they don't see addiction as a problem, that's the issue. Something should be tried on the addiction side of things though

Fr_Dougal

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

I do. Gerry was my neighbour.

Gerry was an absolute gent, met him a couple of times. He was telling me all about how he beat cancer and that he was fighting fit now. On our second scheduled meeting he didn't turn up at his office, no call nothing. Met up with him afterwards and he told me that he had to go to hospital out of the blue. That was back in 2012, I'm not 100% sure but I think it was around then that his health started to deteriorate again, after initially beating throat cancer. He worked in recruitment and went above and beyond in his dealings with me, he talked about his family and was immensely proud of his children.

I smoke 10 to 12 a day. I once gave up for 3 years, there wasn't a day in those 3 years I didn't think about smoking. Was a bit of a nightmare. Eventually caved in.
I do enjoy smoking and the ads or the Fag packet pics have no effect at all. I can't read Irish and since the warning is in Irish first on the packet, I don't notice it anymore.
I look at my parents who have been much heavier smokers all their lives and they are still physically in good health well into their seventies.
I know it's not good but I couldn't face those non stop cravings for the rest of my life.