Otter or Mink?

TopTec

http://omg.wthax.org/85U3fE.jpg

Caught this glimpse on my Wildlife Cam.... Any experts out there?

TT

Eddie B

Mink! No doubt!

magicbastarder

out of curiosity, how can you tell?

Half-cocked

I'm not so sure, I've captured both frequently on my trail cams and I wouldn't rule out otter. The whiskers are more otter-like than mink, but I don't think we can see enough of the animal to be sure either way.

Eddie B

When I look at that picture, I just see mink! Shape of the head, the look of the wet coat! Mink and Otter don't really look that similar, especially in the head region!

Half-cocked

I'm still not convinced. Below are some pics from my trail cams of both Mink and Otter.

Otter:


Mink:


Don't have a shot of a wet mink but the otters coat looks very similar to that in the OP's photo - I'd imagine a wet mink coat looks pretty much the same too. Pity there is nothing for scale in the OP's pic, the Otter is a much larger animal.

Top Tec: Both Mink and Otters are territorial, if you leave the camera set up in the same place you may get more shots that could better ID it. Let us know if you have any luck.

Eddie B

I don't think the head is broad enough to be an Otter, and that boulder in the background would have to be very big if indeed it was an Otter!

The problem with getting more pictures is that both Mink and Otter share territory's, so you can't be sure its the same animal in each shot!

I'm sure we'll get some more opinions as the day goes on!

TopTec

Appreciate the responses..

These are the two other pics taken - didn't include them as I didn't think they added anything... I have left them in their original size.





TT

Bonedigger

I agree with Half-Cocked here and believe it's an Otter.The thickness of the fur and the shape of the ears clinches it for me!
Just saw your other images and it definitely looks like an Otter.

Half-cocked

While I think it is an Otter, I wouldn't be betting a large sum of money on it!

Mickeroo

My gut reaction was otter too, but I also would not be betting on it.

Bonedigger

Half-cocked wrote: »

While I think it is an Otter, I wouldn't be betting a large sum of money on it!

If you look at the very last image it shows the back and tail,and the tail looks too broad to be that of a mink.

Eddie B

See how large the ferns look to the animal in the last photo! Seems to be a small animal IMO!

Bonedigger

The fur colour screams Otter to me too.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Otter definitely

Joeseph Balls

Its an otter

Desmo

I think with 100% certainty that it might be an otter but would be reluctant to bet more than €2.50 on it.

Desmo

I also think this thread is an otter disgrace. I will see if I can get Luke Mink Flanagan to get involved; he'll sort it out quick as a polecat up yer granny's dresser.

TopTec

Desmo wrote: »

I also think this thread is an otter disgrace.

That is awful.....:rolleyes:

Many thanks to all... I think its about 6 - 1 in favour or it being an otter. If it is then it has pushed their known territory up the Ox mountains a few miles further than has been previously thought.

I was interested, as in a planning application for a wind farm up on the mountain it was claimed there were no otters within a good few miles of the site and I was sure I had seen one a year ago a lot closer than that.

The cam is now out in the same spot long term, (I hope to win over Eddie B!), the same place as I got this pic...

[IMG]http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/<a href=http://omg.wthax.org/7CMB2v.jpg target=_blank>[/img]

Cheers

TT

swifts need our help!

I say otter also

Half-cocked

TopTec wrote: »

The cam is now out in the same spot long term,
[IMG]http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/<a href=http://omg.wthax.org/7CMB2v.jpg target=_blank>[/img]

Cheers

TT

Keep us all posted, would love to see more photos.

Strawberry HillBilly

^^^^ this. Keep the pictures coming, excellent stuff.

Day Lewin

Looks otterish to me too, broader and heavier build than the mink. But not conclusive, I think - need a better full-body shot to be absolutely certain.
Bear in mind that both otter and mink wander considerable distances overland. It might be territorial OR transient.

Desmo

Bear in mind? Boom boom.

TopTec

Went through the last 3 days of pictures and the first one was this -



Does this help confirm whether it is an otter or not.... Have I won over EddyB? Surprised at the time as well.. just after midday.

TT

Bonedigger

TopTec wrote: »

Went through the last 3 days of pictures and the first one was this -



Does this help confirm whether it is an otter or not.... Have I won over EddyB? Surprised at the time as well.. just after midday.

TT

That looks like an Otter to me!

Eddie B

When I seen the first picture I was sure it was a mink I was looking at! But have to admit it does look more like an Otter with each new photo!

I deserve a good back hander for that one! :-)

DBB

In the first photo, I thought immediately that it's an otter. In the middle set of photos, I thought otter. And then in that last photo, I thought otter!
:-)
Nailing my colours to the mast here, but for me, it's an otter without any doubt!

Zoo4m8

For crying out loud, it's a feckin' OTTER ! Now that Eddie B is on side can we all move on !

Vivisectus

I would guess otter too due to the white whiskers and the shape of the head. But in the other shots it looks small for an otter... tough one!

Mickeroo

I'm starting to lean towards Duck-billed Platypus myself

mecksimay

My money is on Otter too!

axe2grind

Mickeroo wrote: »

I'm starting to lean towards Duck-billed Platypus myself

I think the first shot without the duck-bill rules that out
Is it native here?

Vivisectus

axe2grind wrote: »

I think the first shot without the duck-bill rules that out
Is it native here?

It is only ever seen at night after the pubs close...

Rubberchikken

definitely think it's an otter.
have seen a mink up close on a beach some years ago. beautiful little thing.
saw what i think was a stoat crossing a rural road last week. would i be right? small, long, brownish.( for small read long and thin.)

petertgtt

Im 99% sure thats an otter. Big head, big whiskers, big tail.

dodderangler

Clearly it's an R.U.S

Obliq

Otter. In the first shot it's really clear (to me!) that the muzzle is much too rounded and downward sloped to be a mink. Also, the set of the ears and the bushy and coarse whiskers in more of a neat clump than on mink.

my3cents

I won't post a new thread as we have this current otter or notter thread already.

What I am interested in is mink, I thought for a while I was watching an otter on a fairly regular bases but now I think it might have been a mink. So how likely are to you to see a mink swimming in the sea as opposed to any other environment?

For about 3 or more months I've been seeing the odd flash of black running along the beach and then into the sea, I know we have otters in the area as I can spot (and smell) the spraint from yards away so assumed what I saw was an otter. Last night I watched as what I thought looked like a mink on the same route as I assumed the otter was taking across the sand (keeping near to rocks) and out to sea. Most of my "otter" sightings had been of it fishing out at sea, even seen it catch and eat fish on its back but now I'm wondering if any of my otter sightings were otter?

On the other hand have I been watching a very skinny otter? While the profile I saw last night was classic mink the tail was miles to long but still very thin. Looking at the comparison chart on this web page http://www.scottishmink.org.uk/american-mink/ the tail I'd say was the thickness of the minks but scale wise it was the length of the animals body plus the critter seemed just too big to be a mink.

Then to throw in a bit more confusion I have spotted otter tracks (5 toes) along this particular route into the sea but not found any spraint around the area where I think it might be sleeping during the day (a big pile of boulders).

So how big does a mink get and can a young otter be mistaken for a mink? What I've been watching is a good 2ft (60cm) long and possibly longer.

Saw it again tonight just before dusk for a few seconds but at a far greater distance and no chance of being sure of it being an otter or mink.

Its really quite annoying as I've seen mink close up (a long story and it was very very close) but still can't always tell them apart from otters.

Nearly forgot, I have also heard the screaming noise that mink make recently near the beach at night.

Eddie B

O.k first off, mink also have five toe's on the hind foot so could be mink tracks! Next time your there, check with your tumb nail! Mink print, about the size, or smaller than nail, otter much larger thanto nail! Your whole tumb nearly fits inside print!

Now you've seen otters playing and eating fish out in open water! Mink won't do that! Mink bring their food back to shore to eat! Mink usually use the water to get from A to B, or to hunt!

You will have mink and otter hunting the same area, especially on the coast, where there is plenty of food!
Two foot long you say! Probably a buck mink! I think young otters stay with their mother for a good few months, till their well grown! Someone else on here might have more info on the otter side of things!
Hope this helps!

Eddie B

Here are couple a prints for comparison! They're not the best prints, but they show size difference!

my3cents

Thanks, prints would have been the size of the top ones. One of the reasons I'm confused is that all these sightings are within 200 yards of each other? The one thing thats making me think its mink other than one really good look at it the other night is that their aren't currently any otter spraints in the area but I'm not sure if otters mark their territory/presence in an area year round. The critter has also been laying up during the day in the same spot for months and afaik otters move around a good bit.

I think I'm going to put it down to seeing both in the area at different times.

If I get a chance I'll take a look tonight where they lay up and see what spraint I can find nearby.

TopTec

A picture paints a 1,000 words, my3cents.

Please, please........

TT

my3cents

TopTec wrote: »

A picture paints a 1,000 words, my3cents.

Please, please........

TT

If only :mad: little "b4$tard" only shows himself when I don't have one handy and when I do all I see is a little black head through binoculars out at sea.

In three months I've only had a few seconds when I could have got a really good photograph which is no time to get a camera out. I also have two dogs with me and when its on the land I'm trying to spot it and scare it off before they see it and give chase. I really don't want to post a picture of a corpse unless I'm 110% sure its a mink. Neither do a want a big vets bill.

Actually that sort of reminds me, I've noticed two different types of behaviour when I've seen what I think is the otter in the sea. Sometime its close in (25 yards or less) and even follows me along the coast thats how I watched it dive and come back up with a fish and eat it. The otter even seems interested in whats going on and has never swam away when I've got closer. The dogs don't seem interested in it either. Then there is the black blob I see that disappears as soon as I see it that will get the dogs swimming out in the direction of where it was if I don't stop them, so think that also points to seeing both otter and mink in the same area.

On the off chance I will take the camera out I might get lucky.

my3cents

Just got in, made the effort and was out from about 9pm till gone 10:15pm when it was dark here and not a sign of anything. The tide is wrong to see much I tend to see the otter when its a high tide as the sea is right up alongside where I walk.

I checked around the boulders up on the beach (where I think they lay up) while it was still light and found a good load of fresh otter spraint. Some was still slightly damp and had a very strong fresh smell, in this weather it would have dried out quite quickly so I guess it was less than 24 hours old. I can check the same spot tomorrow night if I remember and see if there is any more.

Also spent ten minutes checking the sand and no sign of any tracks. One obvious sign there was nothing around was that the dogs weren't bothered and didn't pick up a scent.

WildIreland

The trailcam pics at the start of this thread are almost certainly an otter. Head shape, robust build, shape of the tail and stance / gait all scream otter.

The two animals are actually quite different once you get to know them -- although with a trailcam snapshot from funny angles it can occasionally be a challenge to separate them, with any sort of reasonable view it's a pretty straightforward process.

Seems you've found a great spot for the trail camera.

TopTec

Did a download today and apart from 200 pictures of a heifer got lots of the Sparrow Hawk and one glimpse of the Otter... I have moved the Cam slightly as the Otter seemed to like the deeper pool...



and this in the bottom left hand corner....



Only ever have pictures of it going up stream so it must be going cross country at some point.

TT

my3cents

Have you checked where the otter is marking its territory? If you can walk the stream and find where some of the spraints are you can often spot that the otter has a system. On our river (trickle at this time of year) its easy to spot favorite rocks that get marked and when you follow up stream it soon becomes obvious which rocks to check. Here every obvious rock that sticks out of the bank or the river more than the others thats about 25m from the last similar location that gets marked.

Anyway what I was going to suggest is trying your camera pointed at a spot where the otter marks his territory.

I didn't see anything last night but night before the otter was out at sea in his usual spot, but still to far out to photograph.

TopTec

The stream comes down off the mountain along a gulley for a couple of miles before going into a local lake. Most of the length of the gulley is virtually unwalkable/crawlable due to low trees, bushes and brambles. There are several marking boulders for the 500m stretch I walk.

I have seen foxes, herons, badgers and a pine marten all marking these rocks and I can't work out if the Otter is one of them. You are right about the rocks though - they are obvious ones every 30 - 50m or so.

I am going to move the cam next week 100m upstream at a point I can cover head on. My problem is sheep and cows that use these points to drink and I have 1000's of pics to go through. I also have to be careful of the water level as a storm can raise the stream 12" over night.

I shall persevere.

TT

TopTec

Been in the UK for a while and had a disaster with the camera the first day I was back. I was looking forward to carrying on the filming but I stupidly dropped the camera in the stream fumbling to change the SD card.... :(:mad:

Anyway, replacement cam arrived last week and has been out on the stream about 200 metres downstream from the last sighting of the otter. The first activation was....



This is a favourite point on the stream for marking, not just the otter but mink, marten and fox. I would like to find out where the otter is joining 'my' stream so will gradually move it downstream. I have only ever had pictures of it moving upstream.

and some of the other selected pictures over the past weeks before the dunking....





I think this is a Pine Marten. All the trees here are hazel and in some sheltered spots there are still some nuts lying around...




Beautiful plumage.....



The search continues for Mr O.

TT

Eddie B

Some nice photo's there, ya done well to get the Otter, and Marten! Well done!