Profit from sheep

Kevin the sheep

Hi all does anyone here know what profit they are making from there sheep let it be per hectare or per ewe was in grange yesterday and just wondering how they compare to cattle/cows per hectare have fifty meself but wouldn't know the profit I achieve because ewes and lambs just run around after cattle at the moment but half thinking of filling the place with them

ganmo

http://www.teagasc.ie/publications/2014/3179/NFS_2013_final.pdf

Page 6

Last year was shockin, this year might be ok.

Kevin the sheep

ganmo wrote: »

http://www.teagasc.ie/publications/2014/3179/NFS_2013_final.pdf

Page 6

Last year was shockin, this year might be ok.

€18006 farm payments is this included in the profit of €11160 so you would have lost a lot of money maybe I have that asrsways

MayoSalmon

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

€18006 farm payments is this included in the profit of €11160 so you would have lost a lot of money maybe I have that asrsways

Yes, without direct payments Sheep farmers would be operating at a loss. Same goes for cattle to be fair.

Kevin the sheep

MayoSalmon wrote: »

Yes, without direct payments Sheep farmers would be operating at a loss. Same goes for cattle to be fair.

Ya true taught sheep would cover themselves with there Being less input but sure I sappose there is less output to we used to have five hundred ewes here ten years ago and used to make a good living from them back that time sappose different time

moy83

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

Ya true taught sheep would cover themselves with there Being less input but sure I sappose there is less output to we used to have five hundred ewes here ten years ago and used to make a good living from them back that time sappose different time

Whay did ye cut back in sheep numbers ?

Kevin the sheep

moy83 wrote: »

Whay did ye cut back in sheep numbers ?

Ha I laugh now there was more in sucklers (not) so the uncle taught but I always said if there was 15 lambs every week of the year to sell we wouldn't be to bad maybe that's a stupid way to look at it but it makes sence to me

rangler1

Kevin the sheep wrote: »

Ha I laugh now there was more in sucklers (not) so the uncle taught but I always said if there was 15 lambs every week of the year to sell we wouldn't be to bad maybe that's a stupid way to look at it but it makes sence to me

I'd agree with you, there is more in sheep, I'd be very disappointed to have to use my SFP to subsidise them, the last too years were rubbish profit, but there was a profit and what sector wasn't affected,
On saying that, the farm is developed here, fenced,etc here but I wouldn't like to be developing and trying to get an income out of it

Kevin the sheep

rangler1 wrote: »

I'd agree with you, there is more in sheep, I'd be very disappointed to have to use my SFP to subsidise them, the last too years were rubbish profit, but there was a profit and what sector wasn't affected,
On saying that, the farm is developed here, fenced,etc here but I wouldn't like to be developing and trying to get an income out of it

Same with me all fenced own dip tub thirty foot long block wall sheep race with dose rail over head also she footpath same length drafting gate at end of each all straw bed still no slats also still have all penning from befor small/big so the only real cost is sheep themselves but sure sucklers would cover and more

Dickie10

what would peoples views be on the profitability of the sheep sector in the last few years, i have made a nice profit from them. i breed my own replacements from lleyn ram and the place is now totally fenced. they very rarely see a vet or need much vetinary costs. compared to the weanlings and suckers and beef enterprise in general with dosing, pneumonia and tb testing vet bills add up. im seriously thinking of upping the numbers of ewes llambing and not bothering with store lambs perhaps have a group of april lambing ewes and these would ,ake up my store lamb and winter sold lambs, to be honest i see very little profit in beef of any system, it just seems to hold money together, take for instance this month i have sold or slaughtered nearly 30 cattle but now will prob need a stocking loan to restock in cattle. then again i see lads beside me doing heifer finshing well on 30 acres but no sheep competeing for spring grass.

ganmo

So are ya trying to figure which one to throw your lot in with?

Ya know the answer, sheep are leaving you a few bob but the cattle aren't.

I don't know what the answer is about the store lambs though

Dickie10

yeah set up well for sheep and consistently get 1.7 weaning so im getting there with that although trying to keep improving, the ewe lambs lambing from april 10 on, worked well last year, took very little feed to produce nice lambs that are coming finshed from september on. the teagasc advisor told me the other day that a lot of part time lads are buying angus bulls and puting them to decent limoxfresian and simmentalx frisan cows and getting decent lenghty angus x calves. very easy calved for farmers who arent around all day and no dehorning, keep it simple maybe the way forward.

tomwaterford

Go with the sheep,...I'm haunted with luck...any I bought I always made money on...store lambs,culled ewes,ram lambs etc....found buying ewe lambs to sell as hoggets the least profitable enterprise if I'm honest
(None done on a huge scale)

Dickie10

well sheep are supposed to be the next most profitable enterprise after dairying.

Username John

When one says 'most profitable' what does this mean?
Most money left over after tax bill, or most money per hour worked?

tomwaterford

Username John wrote: »

When one says 'most profitable' what does this mean?
Most money left over after tax bill, or most money per hour worked?

After tax bill....though some of hours put In on dairy farms and falling profitability in that sector could equalise out

Username John

tomwaterford wrote: »

After tax bill....though some of hours put In on dairy farms and falling profitability in that sector could equalise out

I thought so...

Just was interested to see if anyone had ideas of profit / hour from store lambs vs profit / hour from lambing ewes...

farawaygrass

An old boy beside me, who would be considered a very good sheep farmer, told me before that he reckons every sheep should leave about 150e after costs of raring lamb and feeding ewe. That prob wouldn't include tax, Esb water but All feed, bedding and diesel for tractor. He has his farm set up for sheep, nothing too fancy but that's a big help and is very crafty with his money. If he's right then it wouldn't be a bad return

Username John

farawaygrass wrote: »

An old boy beside me, who would be considered a very good sheep farmer, told me before that he reckons every sheep should leave about 150e after costs of raring lamb and feeding ewe. That prob wouldn't include tax, Esb water but All feed, bedding and diesel for tractor. He has his farm set up for sheep, nothing too fancy but that's a big help and is very crafty with his money. If he's right then it wouldn't be a bad return

I dunno...

Scanning 1.7 and selling all lambs at €100, that's €170
Which only leaves €20 left over... No costs for replacements in that either, plus all the other costs - ESB, insurance, fencing, repairs, etc... Not to mind any investment back into the farm...

ganmo

Username John wrote: »

I dunno...

Scanning 1.7 and selling all lambs at €100, that's €170
Which only leaves €20 left over... No costs for replacements in that either, plus all the other costs - ESB, insurance, fencing, repairs, etc... Not to mind any investment back into the farm...

Ya I think there's more explaining on that 150
I think it's more of a target for revenue minus ewe cost.
There are farmers that reckon they make no money on ewes that rear single lambs

farawaygrass

ganmo wrote: »

Ya I think there's more explaining on that 150
I think it's more of a target for revenue minus ewe cost.
There are farmers that reckon they make no money on ewes that rear single lambs

Well I did say it was without alot of expenses, maybe I should have phrased it as gross profit. I suppose he has two things going for him, good set up and not overly stocked. Maybe he was way off but that's what he said anyhow.

roosky

The issue i see with the NFS or e profit monitor figures are that they are national average and on average an irish sheep farmer is weaning 1.3 lambs and stocked at 7 ewes per ha and feeding meal to finish lambs. At that craic your break even at best but if your a good opperator at 10 or more ewes per ha and weaning 1.6 or more lambs youll soon make money

farawaygrass

At stocking at 10 ewes to the ha, you would have to put out alot more fertilizer and have good grass management. Dies anyone find with richer grass from fertilizer that Sheep scour a lot more? This goes for cattle too.

IH784man

I lamb my small flock at Christmas for Easter lamb sale for extra 30/40+ a lamb at selling time

tomwaterford

IH784man wrote: »

I lamb my small flock at Christmas for Easter lamb sale for extra 30/40+ a lamb at selling time

All of them lambed at Xmas??

roosky

farawaygrass wrote:

At stocking at 10 ewes to the ha, you would have to put out alot more fertilizer and have good grass management. Dies anyone find with richer grass from fertilizer that Sheep scour a lot more? This goes for cattle too.

Of course it means more fert and more management but you say it like thats a bad thing. If your growing more grass by putting out fertiliser its a very cheap thing to buy

farawaygrass

roosky wrote: »

Of course it means more fert and more management but you say it like thats a bad thing. If your growing more grass by putting out fertiliser its a very cheap thing to buy

Sorry but you assumed I was saying it was a bad thing. All I was asking is does grass that's fertilised more cause sheep to have more scour

IH784man

tomwaterford wrote: »

All of them lambed at Xmas??

Yea I'm only starting out with 5

Green farmer

ganmo wrote: »

There are farmers that reckon they make no money on ewes that rear single lambs

I often heard that as well. The single lamb just covers the costs and the twin is your profit. Its the unexpected costs that really hurt. Repairs to machinery etc that you hadn't budgeted for.

rangler1

Green farmer wrote: »

I often heard that as well. The single lamb just covers the costs and the twin is your profit. Its the unexpected costs that really hurt. Repairs to machinery etc that you hadn't budgeted for.

Have you not done your own figures, our costs would be around €100/ ewe, so that's around a lamb per ewe

razor8

Costs here vary from €85 to €100 per ewe and lower or upper limit usually depends on what meal is used in the year

Green farmer

rangler1 wrote: »

Have you not done your own figures,

/QUOTE]

:pac: I'm still in the "establishing" phase, so my figures wouldn't be setting the world alight. Going pouring concrete in the lambing shed over the next few weeks here, so the sales figures don't be long getting eaten up by one off capital items. id go along with the twin lamb is your profit alright.

Willfarman

farawaygrass wrote: »

At stocking at 10 ewes to the ha, you would have to put out alot more fertilizer and have good grass management. Dies anyone find with richer grass from fertilizer that Sheep scour a lot more? This goes for cattle too.

Sheep scutter there brains out here on nitrogen rich grass.

roosky

Willfarman wrote:

Sheep scutter there brains out here on nitrogen rich grass.

I am at 10 ewes per had put out 2 rounds of urea in spring (1/2 bag per acre) then prob 3 rounds of can over summer at same rate and then i go with a bad of 18.6.12 at end of year which is a lot of fert but i wouldnt see scour as an issue here. If the sheep get highly digestible grass they will be soft in the dung but thats what they need to get the meat on their backs in my opinion