100 out of 180 babies dead in one home in the 1950s

crockholm

My father worked for the Southern Health board for a while during the 70s and into the 80s,his patricular role was administration in a "mental hospital" and he told me that a very high % of the patients there were sound of mind,they had just mistakenly passed on the deeds of the farm/house/business too soon and found themselves personae non gratae.

Ireland can be/was a Cold country in many ways,so while I am saddened by the breaking news, neither am I surprised,unfortunately.

Gambas

crockholm wrote: »

My father worked for the Southern Health board for a while during the 70s and into the 80s,his patricular role was administration in a "mental hospital" and he told me that a very high % of the patients there were sound of mind,they had just mistakenly passed on the deeds of the farm/house/business too soon and found themselves personae non gratae.

Ireland can be/was a Cold country in many ways,so while I am saddened by the breaking news, neither am I surprised,unfortunately.

Ireland is no different than any other country in this or virtually any other regard. Human nature is human nature - we can be great to one another and we can be heartless an ruthless, none of which are distinctly Irish traits.

It is only in the way that we humans organise society that caused these problems. If you put structures in place that allow these things to happen easier than a good outcome to happen, they will. This is how anomalies appear from country to country.

Look at it learn from it and move on. And probably most importantly look around our current country and try and see our current blind spots, the stuff we shrug our shoulders at that our grandkids will ask how we let that go on.

Spring Onion

I looked up the meaning of "Bon Secours". A few definitions come up;

Good Help
Safe Harbour
Good Comfort

None of these mother and baby homes offered any of these.

Tail Docker

"No abortion for Ireland, we're a Holy Catholic country, we'll just let them be born and then kill them with neglect/sell them/experiment on them - a much better way to do things..".

If this was coming out about some other european country, like for example, Belgium, there would be outrage on here and calls for people to be held to account. We are a right sh1tty little country tbh, we have so many skeletons in our closet, it's a wonder the closet hasn't burst. No doubt the churches were packed today,as always. Feck me.

ticklebelly7

1930s - a great aunt fell pregnant having been raped by her cousin. Nothing happened to him but she was sent miles away to Sean Ross Abbey. Spends a 'long time' there according to me Ma - probably working to pay off her guilt. Came home without child, which had died. Never married. Spent the rest of her life joining every Legion / Sodality going and trying to pray her way into Heaven.

1950s - an aunt was abused by a much older brother - a vile bully who terrorised his younger siblings with the overt approval of his mother. My granny knew there was sexual activity but blamed the girl, not her favourite son who was raping his little sister. Aunt goes off to work in the big city. Comes back pregnant and is told to get rid of 'it' the same way she got it. She gives birth in a mother and baby home and that child is taken for adoption after six weeks. She's kept under virtual house arrest by her mother and brother. She stole money and got away to England with the collusion of my gentle grandfather who couldn't bear to see the beatings she was getting. The woman is a nervous wreck to this day, jumping at shadows and suffering anxiety and depression.

1970s - my cousin falls pregnant. She is denounced from the pulpit. She and the new daddy are forced to marry by her father. Neither is fond of the other. Hubby starts beating hell out of her just because he can. She runs in the night, leaving her child behind, and gets the boat to England. She hopes to return for the child. Turns out she has no rights at all - they all lie with the 'deserted' father. So she loses her child. Her life is sad and desperate and the drink gets to her.

Three generations whose women were brutalised and ruined for life. And you know what: I don't blame the Church or the State. They were just enablers, symptoms of a broken and corrupt system of morality. I blame my family - none of whom, except for my grandfather, had the decency to do what was right by their daughters. Where was there any love or compassion for them? This was just a microcosm of what was going on in the wider society. How could a nation, collectively, lose sight of what is right and what is wrong.

And don't say they were just victims of the times. Another aunt had a child. Nothing happened. The family wasn't ostracised, they weren't excommunicated.

It was all about collective cowardice, a fear of what the neigbours might think. It's the same mentality that breeds honour killings.

Spring Onion

The cabinet are meeting today to discuss the mother and baby homes issue.
I would suggest people email some of the cabinet (Flanagan, Fitzgerald, Quinn etc) to push them for a full judicial inquiry.
It's not just Tuam. We need to get to the bottom of the following issue in all mother & baby homes throughout Ireland.
1. High mortality rate
2. Forced adoption
3. Mass graves for children with no memorial whatsoever
4. Medical trials/experiments

Spring Onion

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0610/622...t-meet-babies/

Minister for Children Charlie Flanagan has announced a statutory Commission of Investigation into mother-and-baby-homes across the State.

Speaking on RTÉ's News at One, Mr Flanagan said that it is too early to say who will lead the commission, but that he has some names in mind.

He said that the Government will receive an initial report by 30 June.

Minister Flanagan said he hopes the inquiry will examine all issues, including the high mortality rates, the burial practices following these deaths, the legal circumstances around adoptions and the question of conducting of clinical trials.

nowanathiest

Yes, bear in mind that some of those women incarcerated by their families may have been victims of incest.

More than one type of crime was covered up in some instances.

ScouseMouse

I regret stumbling upon this thread. I makes me feel ashamed of my religion.

nowanathiest

I was in one of the Mother & Baby homes in 1981. I was 16 years old. My daughter was forcibly adopted - family, nuns, social workers all in agreement that it was the only option. I didn't have any say in the matter.

All these year, I have assumed that my daughter was adopted by a good family and hopefully is enjoying a good life. Now I'm wondering if she is alive or dead and weather I should start looking into it. Who knows where she ended up as the RC has proved beyone doubt now that they cannot be trusted with human beings.

Shakespeare's Sister

ticklebelly7 wrote: »

Three generations whose women were brutalised and ruined for life. And you know what: I don't blame the Church or the State. They were just enablers, symptoms of a broken and corrupt system of morality.

In my opinion, the church, aided by the state, were what created those attitudes. Would there have been such shame towards pregnant unmarried women without the church's influence? Dangerous not to blame the church when their representatives were the ones who carried out such terrible abuse within those institutions.
I'd blame both the church and the people on the outside who happily sent their daughters to those places.

Fluffybums

Families put these women & girls in these homes because they had been brought up to believe in shame and guilt, of course only the females were guilty the men bore no blame. The sense of 'morality' was taught at school from day one and the pulpit. This was happening really quite recently, the 1980s.

Have things changed: How many parents have children in religious primary schools don't believe but allow their children to go through the farce that is communion and confirmation because they might feel left out? Another generation of sheep are created and nothing changes. I think it is the Jesuits that say 'give me the child of 5 and i will give you the man', how profound.

Bring your children up to stand up for themselves, to be different and to be proud of it.

As for abortion, that will never be legal here as legal abortions save lives (fortunately Ireland's nearest neighbour supplies these) but only saves women's lives and we know how little they are valued here.

Zed Bank

Despicable. How these people harp on about morality is disgusting, and how anybody can take their "teachings" seriously is mind boggling.

It's time for us as a nation to openly condemn this hideous organisation and expose it for what really is, and strip it of all it's societal influence.

Nothing but pain and suffering caused by the RCC in this country IMO.

Spring Onion

Zed Bank wrote: »

Despicable. How these people harp on about morality is disgusting, and how anybody can take their "teachings" seriously is mind boggling.

It's time for us as a nation to openly condemn this hideous organisation and expose it for what really is, and strip it of all it's societal influence.

Nothing but pain and suffering caused by the RCC in this country IMO.

I would suggest worldwide. I believe the Roman organisation has done way more harm than good.

michael999999

Spring Onion wrote: »

I would suggest worldwide. I believe the Roman organisation has done way more harm than good.

Only God knows what is happening in missionary countries!

Spring Onion

michael999999 wrote: »

Only God knows what is happening in missionary countries!

Absolutely, history repeating itself from all accounts.