Irish Football fans least homophobic

skallywag

Howshocowpownw wrote: »

That's a survey from a tiny sample. The majority are homophobic.

I'm guessing that you don't really know many football fans.

Howshocowpownw

skallywag wrote: »

I'm guessing that you don't really know many football fans.

Not personally. I don't care for the game myself.

Pawwed Rig

Howshocowpownw wrote: »

Not personally. I don't care for the game myself.

Howshocowpownw wrote: »

Life experience. How do I link ?

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seamus

I think we underestimate the Irish people's level of tolerance, and I think this tolerance comes from there being a lack of any history of intolerance; with the exception of our conflict with the English, we were 99.9% white Catholics, so there was very little fragmentation in Irish society, unlike in western societies with large numbers of black people, for example. So there's regional slagging and disputes, but basically everyone was united under the banner of being Irish, there was no hint of "Xs and Ys don't mix"

I was reading a discussion yesterday about Nichelle Nichols and the example she set in the US and how many people were "inspired" by her and how shocking some of the Star Trek episodes were for breaking down racial barriers. And that all seems a little foreign to me here. I was born in the early 80s and for as long as I can remember there have been black people on TV. And there was never anything strange about black people. They were just people with black skin. Except that there were no black people in Ireland (for all intents and purposes). So when immigration became a big thing in the late 90's and we started seeing the growth of the black demographic in Ireland, there was no history there of racial tension, no simmering ancestral hatred. Through consuming US & UK arts and culture we had already accepted black people as equal, before black people existed in Ireland in any tangible numbers.
Sure, there is some racism, of course there is, but in comparison it's tiny. And we tend to be more picky about our racism, prejudicing people based on their country of origin rather than their skin colour.

Such I think the same is basically true of homosexuality. Until the late 80's/early 90s there weren't really any gays in Ireland (as far as Ireland was concerned). OK so "gay" is still a derogatory term, but there were no hate campaigns, children weren't taught to watch out for dangerous gays lurking around the corner. As far as Ireland was concerned, gay rights was a battle being fought in other countries. And once more, through consuming foreign culture which would routinely feature gay characters (though admittedly often as stereotypical harmless fops), gays became basically normalised, even when it was still illegal here. As a result, there was no real "fear" of homosexuals in Ireland except in the minority hardline religious quarters. Fear of the unknown perhaps, but as most people hit their 20s, met at least one gay person and realised they weren't going to be turned or molested, they realised there was no reason for intolerance.

Wompa1

seamus wrote: »

I think we underestimate the Irish people's level of tolerance, and I think this tolerance comes from there being a lack of any history of intolerance; with the exception of our conflict with the English, we were 99.9% white Catholics, so there was very little fragmentation in Irish society, unlike in western societies with large numbers of black people, for example. So there's regional slagging and disputes, but basically everyone was united under the banner of being Irish, there was no hint of "Xs and Ys don't mix"

I was reading a discussion yesterday about Nichelle Nichols and the example she set in the US and how many people were "inspired" by her and how shocking some of the Star Trek episodes were for breaking down racial barriers. And that all seems a little foreign to me here. I was born in the early 80s and for as long as I can remember there have been black people on TV. And there was never anything strange about black people. They were just people with black skin. Except that there were no black people in Ireland (for all intents and purposes). So when immigration became a big thing in the late 90's and we started seeing the growth of the black demographic in Ireland, there was no history there of racial tension, no simmering ancestral hatred. Through consuming US & UK arts and culture we had already accepted black people as equal, before black people existed in Ireland in any tangible numbers.
Sure, there is some racism, of course there is, but in comparison it's tiny. And we tend to be more picky about our racism, prejudicing people based on their country of origin rather than their skin colour.

Such I think the same is basically true of homosexuality. Until the late 80's/early 90s there weren't really any gays in Ireland (as far as Ireland was concerned). OK so "gay" is still a derogatory term, but there were no hate campaigns, children weren't taught to watch out for dangerous gays lurking around the corner. As far as Ireland was concerned, gay rights was a battle being fought in other countries. And once more, through consuming foreign culture which would routinely feature gay characters (though admittedly often as stereotypical harmless fops), gays became basically normalised, even when it was still illegal here. As a result, there was no real "fear" of homosexuals in Ireland except in the minority hardline religious quarters. Fear of the unknown perhaps, but as most people hit their 20s, met at least one gay person and realised they weren't going to be turned or molested, they realised there was no reason for intolerance.

It's in stark contrast to the Irish who moved to America. I've read that the Irish people living and trying to work in America decades ago were very racist towards Black people and Asians, because even though, at the time the Irish were seen as on the same level and were discriminated themselves, they were competing against them for low level jobs and each group banded together with their own.

I read something else, saying that a lot of Irish Americans that are 2nd or 3rd generation removed go back to Ireland to discover their roots and some see the difference in ideology. Basically the Irish Americans were raised with the old Irish mindset, religion of utmost importance and the cycle didn't really break like it did in Ireland. So while those of us at home progressed, the Irish Americans still living in the states did not. They take pride in their Irish side and try to live up to it, meanwhile they don't have a clue what modern day Irish are like until they get over there. Apparently, speaking with many living in Boston. Boston has a huge problem with racism...

More to that. I use to go to Galway United matches, they signed three Barbados Internationals. Whilst most chatter wasn't completely malicious, there were many 'dark fella's', 'darkies' etc. thrown out. Also take a look at the Biography of Phil Lynott, he loved Irish history and mythology but at one point after becoming famous he started to feel discriminated against at home.

I don't think modern day Irish are all that racist (except against Travellers) but I can't say the same for previous generations.

porsche959

skallywag wrote: »

Stephen Ireland is not coming back lads, just let go of it.

He's not a real gay! He's one of those meterosexuals they have now.