Towing a trailer in Ireland with foreign car?

CiniO

As we all know, light trailers are not being registered in Ireland, and when they are being towed, you need to stick number plate showing towing vehicle registration number on a trailer.
However different rules apply in most EU countries, where trailers are issued separate registration numbers.

So my question is - if someone comes to Ireland in foreign registered vehicle (non-resident so we can drop VRT stuff) and intends to rent a trailer here to use it, what registration number do they put on a trailer?
They can't put a vehicle registration number plate, as they have no way to get one.
And they can't put a number plate with trailer registration number, as trailers don't have registration number in here.

Anyone have any ideas?

Kenny Logins

They can get a plate made up to match the car, no problem.

CiniO

Kenny Logins wrote: »

They can get a plate made up to match the car, no problem.

Where would you get that?
In Ireland or in country where car is registered?

galwaytt

CiniO wrote: »

Where would you get that?
In Ireland or in country where car is registered?

Any motor factors.

corktina

or a bit of cornflakes pack and a marker

Kenny Logins

^^

Ireland isn't strict on this, in fact one UK company I know of moved production to Wexford for this reason.

CiniO

galwaytt wrote: »

Any motor factors.

But motor factors in Ireland can not make a German, French or Polish plate, can they?
At least not legally...

F.e.
If I had someone from Poland to come over here to Ireland with his Polish registered car, and I borrow him my trailer, could he just make up his Polish registration plate in any motor factors in Ireland to put them on a trailer and drive it legally?
I strongly doubt about "legally" part of it.

Kenny Logins

You've been here long enough now to know that there are grey areas everywhere - it may not be legal, but I'm sure 'it will be grand'.

CiniO

Kenny Logins wrote: »

You've been here long enough now to know that there are grey areas everywhere - it may not be legal, but I'm sure 'it will be grand'.

Oh yes - I know "it will be grand"
But I was wondering if there is any fully legal way, or maybe there isn't. That's what I wanted to find out

corktina

move the rear plate from the car to the trailer....the trailer doesn't need an additional plate, merely the number has to be displayed at the rear of the combined unit. (or just don't bother...)

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

move the rear plate from the car to the trailer....the trailer doesn't need an additional plate, merely the number has to be displayed at the rear of the combined unit. (or just don't bother...)

That's surely not legal.
Even if vehicle is towing a trailer, it still need to display it's own registration number on its rear.

corktina

why so? it is simply so the registration number is visible from the rear of the combined unit.... It can't be seen on the car with the trailer attached so why would it be illegal for it not to be there?

el pasco

As long as you have the necessary documentation you can get the plate made up for you at a motor factor
You also need the plate without IRL on it and without the EU flag (if its from outside the EU)
You then need the country code sticker
Make sure that you are insured to drive and licenced to drive a vechicle with a trailer (>750kg BE licence)

If the documentation is not in English you need to have it translated and approved by an embassy

CiniO

corktina wrote: »

why so? it is simply so the registration number is visible from the rear of the combined unit.... It can't be seen on the car with the trailer attached so why would it be illegal for it not to be there?

Here's why

(7) Subject to the provisions of subparagraph (8), the identification mark of a vehicle shall be exhibited, in the case of a vehicle which has only one front wheel, on the back of the vehicle and, in the case of any other vehicle, on the front of and on the back of the vehicle in a vertical or nearly vertical position, so that every letter or figure of the identification mark is vertical or nearly vertical and is easily distinguishable, in the case of the letters and figures placed on the front of the vehicle, from in front of the vehicle and in the case of the letters and figures placed on the back of the vehicle, from behind the vehicle.

This puts a requirement for number plates to be fixed to both front and back of any vehicle, no matter if it's towing a trailer or not, so no matter if you can see rear number plate or not.

(8) Where one or more trailers of any kind are attached to a vehicle, a duplicate of the identification mark of the vehicle shall be exhibited on the back of the rearmost trailer in the manner that the identification mark is required to be exhibited on the back of the vehicle.

This puts requirement for trailer number plate to be displayed on last trailer on the back (in case of more than one trailer).

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1992/en/si/0318.html

CiniO

el pasco wrote: »

As long as you have the necessary documentation you can get the plate made up for you at a motor factor
You also need the plate without IRL on it and without the EU flag (if its from outside the EU)
You then need the country code sticker

So you are suggesting a copy of original vehicle number plate should be made in Ireland in any motorfactors, and country code sticker sticked to it.
I really don't think this is in any way legal.
Most number plates issued within EU have security marks on them, and it's illegal to use plates which are not originals.

Make sure that you are insured to drive and licenced to drive a vechicle with a trailer (>750kg BE licence)

Of course it's priority to make sure you hold appropriate licence before towing a trailer. But actually not always trailer >750kg means a need for BE licence.

If the documentation is not in English you need to have it translated and approved by an embassy

I don't really get that... What documentation should be translated and approved by an embassy?

corktina

CiniO wrote: »

Here's why



This puts a requirement for number plates to be fixed to both front and back of any vehicle, no matter if it's towing a trailer or not, so no matter if you can see rear number plate or not.


This puts requirement for trailer number plate to be displayed on last trailer on the back (in case of more than one trailer).

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1992/en/si/0318.html

you have too much time on your hands. (why didn't you do that sooner?

kermitpwee

corktina wrote: »

you have too much time on your hands. (why didn't you do that sooner?

He is a sad man with a sad life spending his time online showing the irish how stupid we are:D:D He is worried about the legality of these situations but will tell you how its okay to speed and break the law as he is a good driver:D:D:D:D legend of a poster. CiniO we love you

CiniO

kermitpwee wrote: »

He is a sad man with a sad life spending his time online showing the irish how stupid we are:D:D He is worried about the legality of these situations but will tell you how its okay to speed and break the law as he is a good driver:D:D:D:D legend of a poster. CiniO we love you

Irish should be spelled with capital "I" me thinks.

Anyway - genuine question, on probably not very usual case, but perfectly possible.

If you don't have anything productive to mention (and I don't remember you ever had), I recommend avoiding this thread. That's the best advice I could think for you.

Del2005

CiniO wrote: »

So you are suggesting a copy of original vehicle number plate should be made in Ireland in any motorfactors, and country code sticker sticked to it.
I really don't think this is in any way legal.
Most number plates issued within EU have security marks on them, and it's illegal to use plates which are not originals.



Of course it's priority to make sure you hold appropriate licence before towing a trailer. But actually not always trailer >750kg means a need for BE licence.


I don't really get that... What documentation should be translated and approved by an embassy?

You've answered your question here. Your friend can only tow an Irish trailer if he brings a legal number plate from his own country to attach to the trailer.

CiniO

Del2005 wrote: »

You've answered your question here. Your friend can only tow an Irish trailer if he brings a legal number plate from his own country to attach to the trailer.

OK so.
But there is plenty of countries in EU, where it's impossible to get a third legal number plate.
Therefore it looks like drivers from those countries won't be able to legally tow an Irish trailer - which seems odd.

Del2005

CiniO wrote: »

OK so.
But there is plenty of countries in EU, where it's impossible to get a third legal number plate.
Therefore it looks like drivers from those countries won't be able to legally tow an Irish trailer - which seems odd.

There are lots of different laws in Europe so why would trailers be any different.

kermitpwee

CiniO wrote: »

OK so.
But there is plenty of countries in EU, where it's impossible to get a third legal number plate.
Therefore it looks like drivers from those countries won't be able to legally tow an Irish trailer - which seems odd.

And rightly so, we don't want lads towing with illegal plates. You could get your buddy on your insurance and he could tow then. Seems like the only answer.

corktina

kermitpwee wrote: »

He is a sad man with a sad life spending his time online showing the irish how stupid we are:D:D He is worried about the legality of these situations but will tell you how its okay to speed and break the law as he is a good driver:D:D:D:D legend of a poster. CiniO we love you

ah no, leave him alone.... I always enjoy his posts

kermitpwee

corktina wrote: »

ah no, leave him alone.... I always enjoy his posts

So do I actually, im only joking with him. The motors forum would be dead without him. Apologies if I have offended him.

CiniO

kermitpwee wrote: »

And rightly so, we don't want lads towing with illegal plates.

What illegal plates? I asked about legal solution.
Seems strange that it's impossible to tow Irish trailer with foreign car.

You could get your buddy on your insurance and he could tow then. Seems like the only answer.

Get buddy on my insurance? Then he could tow with my car.
That's not what I'm asking about. I'm asking about towing with foreign car.

Del2005

CiniO wrote: »

What illegal plates? I asked about legal solution.
Seems strange that it's impossible to tow Irish trailer with foreign car.

It's not impossible. As has been said earlier just get a plate made up here as our Gardai have little knowledge of our motoring laws so will have no idea about licence plate laws in other countries.

What is the UK law as they have the same rules for trailer licence plates?

joujoujou

CiniO wrote: »

[...] I asked about legal solution.
Seems strange that it's impossible to tow Irish trailer with foreign car.

Yes, it is strange.

And yes, it is impossible.

Simple as that.

There is no legal solution.

Live with that or die.

CiniO

Del2005 wrote: »

It's not impossible. As has been said earlier just get a plate made up here as our Gardai have little knowledge of our motoring laws so will have no idea about licence plate laws in other countries.

It's not impossible, but it's not possible to be done legally, unless there is some other solution we didn't think of.

What is the UK law as they have the same rules for trailer licence plates?

I don't know.
I'll try looking up online.

The most interesting is the case of someone trying to buy a trailer (or caravan) in Irelnad for export
F.e. French person finds perfect caravan he was looking for ages for sale in Ireland, drives up here with his French registered car, and can't tow it back home.

CiniO

OSI wrote: »

If he rocked up into the country knowing he was going to export a caravan that would require license plates to be brought home, and didn't bring any, he'd be an idiot. It's akin to turning up to Hertz in Dublin airport without a license and expecting the local NDLS to sort you out.

But how could he bring a number plate with himself, if in his country there's no such thing as extra number plate for trailer?

CiniO

OSI wrote: »

Are they incapable of making number plates in France? Why does it have to be a trailer specific number plate?

I'm not exactly sure about France.
But in general on the Continent, trailers get awarded their own registration number, so there is no need to have another 3rd plate of your car number, for which reason most likely in many countries it's just not available.

In Poland f.e. it's impossible to obtain 3rd plate with your registration number. Number plates, unlike in Ireland, are only provided by vehicle registration authority and they have authentity mark on them.
Anything not coming from official source is deemed illegal.
There is no legal way to obtain 3rd number plate with your registration number in Poland. And it works similar in many other EU countries.

Also after exporting trailer from Ireland with Continental registered car, where trailer would have the same number plate as car, you would only drive up to next checkpoint, where most likely trailer would be seized.

kermitpwee

CiniO wrote: »

What illegal plates? I asked about legal solution.
Seems strange that it's impossible to tow Irish trailer with foreign car.


Get buddy on my insurance? Then he could tow with my car.
That's not what I'm asking about. I'm asking about towing with foreign car.

As I said you will have to get your buddy on your insurance, that is the only solution. There is obviously a problem with the irish law that hasn't foreseen your buddy driving his foreign reg car here with an irish trailer. He has no other option but to do this. What he could do is get a third plate as he wont be breaking Irish law while here, obviously he is in trouble when he goes back to the continent if he brings the irish trailer with him and he has the third plate. perhaps the best solution is he should stay at home or bring the foreign trailer.

djimi

If you were to lose your number plate for whatever reason in Poland then Im sure its possible to get another one made up? I cant imagine its that hard to get hold of a third plate if you just think outside the box a bit.

Anyway, a quick Google suggests that http://www.eireplates.com/ are able to make up plates with whatever EU flag you want on them.

foggy_lad

To be completely legal they should get the number plate made in their country before coming to Ireland as they will be unable to get a foreign plate in a motor factors here, most will only have standard IRL plates.

corktina

It should be understood here that in some countries, you actually get issued with the plates rather than the number (and if you export the car you have to surrender the plates).Thus if that country doesn't issue a third plate for a trailer (or issues a separate plate for it) then it would be impossible to get a plate in Ireland that was legal to use. (This being Ireland however, I wouldn't worry about it, I'd just drive on. the Gard won't know the foreign regulations anyway)

Wexfordian

Or just order one

Del2005

Wexfordian wrote: »

Or just order one

Why spend 45 for a plate when they can be got a lot cheaper in any motorfactors and be just as illegal.

Del2005

Sitec wrote: »

Is this actually an issue you're facing OP or just theoretical? I think your reading way too much into this. Just get a plate made. If the trailer is being exported it won't even matter if "Irl" is on the plate. A Garda is hardly going to put you in jail over it, you'd be basically only driving to a port.

The problem isn't here it's when they get off the boat and deal with a professional police force who enforce all laws, not just a couple of easy ones like here.

corktina

Del2005 wrote: »

The problem isn't here it's when they get off the boat and deal with a professional police force who enforce all laws, not just a couple of easy ones like here.

the plate isn't needed at home ...he is trying to stay legal here where a plate is needed.

Del2005

Sitec wrote: »

If you just explained the situation there wouldn't be an issue. If they need a separate number for the trailer they should have organized that before traveling.

It's is an issue. The combination is illegal and most police forces don't like illegal vehicles on their roads. It's been posted before that in some European countries there is no way to get a third plate for trailer, as they have a different reg.

corktina

Del2005 wrote: »

It's is an issue. The combination is illegal and most police forces don't like illegal vehicles on their roads. It's been posted before that in some European countries there is no way to get a third plate for trailer, as they have a different reg.

+1, If only people would read the thread.

pred racer

If it's any good to you, I've been towing trailers in this country for over 25 yrs, I have never once (not even by accident )had a licence plate on the trailer that matched the vehicle! So I wouldn't worry about it

My current trailer

djimi

Del2005 wrote: »

Why spend 45 for a plate when they can be got a lot cheaper in any motorfactors and be just as illegal.

Because at least the ones off those websites look the part with the correct country code on it. The Gardai dont seem to give a toss either way (people get away with homemade plates on trailers made from the back of a cereal box), but if you want to be as close to legal as possible then its one way of doing it, as opposed to getting a foreign reg plate made up onto IRL plates.

colm_mcm

pred racer wrote: »

If it's any good to you, I've been towing trailers in this country for over 25 yrs, I have never once (not even by accident )had a licence plate on the trailer that matched the vehicle! So I wouldn't worry about it

My current trailer

I see you got a 'facelift' cluster for the passenger side

How's the field mazda going?

pred racer

colm_mcm wrote: »

I see you got a 'facelift' cluster for the passenger side

How's the files mazda going?

Lent it to my brother in law, came back like that:D

Mazda is flying, I'd probably be better off driving that and giving him the Alfa :pac:

knipex

CiniO wrote: »

It's not impossible, but it's not possible to be done legally, unless there is some other solution we didn't think of.


I don't know.
I'll try looking up online.

The most interesting is the case of someone trying to buy a trailer (or caravan) in Irelnad for export
F.e. French person finds perfect caravan he was looking for ages for sale in Ireland, drives up here with his French registered car, and can't tow it back home.

Says who ?? Your applying polish law renumber plates to Ireland. In Ireland it's perfectly legal to make a copy of a number plate so no problem using one in Ireland. However once back in Poland then it's different.

Del2005

djimi wrote: »

Because at least the ones off those websites look the part with the correct country code on it. The Gardai dont seem to give a toss either way (people get away with homemade plates on trailers made from the back of a cereal box), but if you want to be as close to legal as possible then its one way of doing it, as opposed to getting a foreign reg plate made up onto IRL plates.

There Gardai don't care what's on a trailer so making a plate slightly less illegal doesn't matter in this country and if they knew Polish law would get you in more trouble. If someone wants to leave the island then it's impossible to do legally.

corktina

knipex wrote: »

Says who ?? Your applying polish law renumber plates to Ireland. In Ireland it's perfectly legal to make a copy of a number plate so no problem using one in Ireland. However once back in Poland then it's different.

that isn't the case. For a foreign car to be used in Ireland it must be road-legal in it's home country

corktina

no indeed you don't se the problem (not that it is much of a problem). He wants to be road legal. That means his foreign registered car must comply with the regulations in his own country.

corktina

I think it's you finding it hard to understand.

A car visiting Ireland must be road legal in it's home country, just as you visiting France need a breathalyzer, thus a foreign car needs whatever the foreign regulations say it must have to tow a trailer, to be road legal here.

Del2005

Sitec wrote: »

The car is legal. He has to follow Irish law in Ireland, not the Polish law. It's the same as me driving through France without a breathalyzer and being stopped. They will fine me, even though in Ireland we don't need one. Common sense and not difficult to understand.

If they stick a plate with the car registration that makes the combination illegal in Poland, since it's illegal in Poland it can't be legal to drive in Ireland.

To drive in a foreign country you have to comply with the regulations in your country otherwise how would Irish, and UK, people be allowed tow a trailer with the tow vehicle's reg in a country that requires trailers have a separate reg?

corktina

Sitec wrote: »

Read the OP. A foreign registered vehicle to tow a trailer from Ireland, in Ireland. For it to be legal, all the person has to do is get a copy of the number plate of the foreign car & put it on the trailer.

Why do you think that is illegal?

YOU read it.

You cannot legally drive a foreign vehicle in Ireland unless it is road legal in it's home country , just as if you take an Irish car to France, it must be road legal here to do so. Thus to tow a trailer here, the guy must comply with his home regulations, and if they say the trailer must be seperatley registered with an officially issued number plate, then that's what he needs to tow it here.