Irish water meters removed after stand off

lightspeed

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/meters-removed-by-irish-water-after-three-week-standoff-in-housing-estate-30274126.html

Just the above going around on facebook.


"A statement from Irish Water is expected later on the Togher development and its significance for their nationwide meter installation campaign."

Somehow i dont think the water charges are going anywhere except up in future budgets, still pretty weak looking that the uninstalled them.

Surely they just going to install them again?

Mr. Incognito

They'll be back to install them a day after the election. Wait and see

Banjo String

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

They'll be back to install them a day after the election. Wait and see

Are Irish Water running in the elections now?

Proof that people United in protest can achieve the outcome they wanted.

More estates will Surely follow suit now.

Gatling

Some of the quotes from residents are funny ,were not against water meters and paying for water ,we just don't want smart meters on pipes outside properties

Mr. Incognito

Banjo String wrote: »

Are Irish Water running in the elections now?

Proof that people United in protest can achieve the outcome they wanted.

More estates will Surely follow suit now.

They dont want the bad PR of the Guards using force to allow the water installation to go ahead.

Besides I believe that most of the protesters dont live in the estate but were "invited there by the residents" as they say.

They'll be metered after the elections is over. Failing that theyll be getting estimated bills

Gatling

Gatling wrote: »

Some of the quotes from residents are funny ,were not against water meters and paying for water ,we just don't want smart meters on pipes outside properties

The radio waves will give you cancer.

Pawwed Rig

Probably just charge them the flat rate for the first few years like alot of other people.

Gatling

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The radio waves will give you cancer.

Give them tin foil hats

zuhuraswa

Don't think that will last!

Pawwed Rig

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Probably just charge them the flat rate for the first few years like alot of other people.

Til the meter is in, yeah. Only advantage is that without the meter they don't have to worry about being put on a trickle but I doubt they'll be the last in the country to end up with the meters in.

Gatling

Gatling wrote: »

Give them tin foil hats

To amplify it and make it even more power like a microwave? You're insane!

emo72

we'll all get cancer from the stress and worry of paying ever increasing bills and taxes.

drunkmonkey

Wasters protesting sponsored by us, water meter install sponsored by us, removal of water meters sponsored by us, re-installation of removed water meters sponsored by us, Gardaí to protect installers sponsored by us.

Suggest we remove the wasters protesting and it sure would save us a fortune in sponsership.

There's probably not one of the protestors with a full time job, were sponsoring them so they can drive up our cost of living. Insane.

emo72

they're ****ing heroes!

Banjo String

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

They dont want the bad PR of the Guards using force to allow the water installation to go ahead.

Besides I believe that most of the protesters dont live in the estate but were "invited there by the residents" as they say.

They'll be metered after the elections is over. Failing that theyll be getting estimated bills

I think it's too late for the coalition to be worried about pr at this stage, they're about to take a kicking in the locals and they know it.

Besides, as I've stated on the other thread on after hours, this is a serious development that took place today, Irish Water relented.

Possible outcome of today's events will be that many more estates will follow their example today and resist metering.

People that are suggesting flat charges etc, have you any suggestions what the repercussions will be to those unmetered estates that will refuse to engage with Irish Water?

Antar Bolaeisk

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Failing that theyll be getting estimated bills

This.

Easiest option really, won't they be billing at 10% over the average or something for those without meters?

How many more places are going to follow suit now though when they see this succeed I wonder.

Pawwed Rig

Isn't one of the guys a ringleader of the 'Freemen of the Land'. He was taken to hospital last week after a schmozzle with a slightly sore arm.
Tin foil hat brigade

Lu Tze

Banjo String wrote: »

I think it's too late for the coalition to be worried about pr at this stage, they're about to take a kicking in the locals and they know it.

Besides, as I've stated on the other thread on after hours, this is a serious development that took place today, Irish Water relented.

Possible outcome of today's events will be that many more estates will follow their example today and resist metering.

People that are suggesting flat charges etc, have you any suggestions what the repercussions will be to those unmetered estates that will refuse to engage with Irish Water?

Reduce pressure, they can enjoy the drizzle falling from their shower heads!

For Forks Sake

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Isn't one of the guys a ringleader of the 'Freemen of the Land'. He was taken to hospital last week after a schmozzle with a slightly sore arm.
Tin foil hat brigade

Ah, yes, "John O'Donovan From Cork" as he is known to every phone-in radio show in the country, he's never off the bloody airwaves.

Banjo String

Lu Tze wrote: »

Reduce pressure, they can enjoy the drizzle falling from their shower heads!

How do they reduce pressure to a house or an apartment in an unmetered estate / block?

Reduce everyone's

Won't that piss off the ones who paid?

emo72

Lu Tze wrote: »

Reduce pressure, they can enjoy the drizzle falling from their shower heads!

cant. no meters installed.

Pawwed Rig

For Forks Sake wrote: »

Ah, yes, "John O'Donovan From Cork" as he is known to every phone-in radio show in the country, he's never off the bloody airwaves.

Was he the guy trying to get 'the body' of some lady from the Gardai? Running around outside the Garda station screaming at the window? Fascinating character:pac:

ebbsy

I had some pricks from Labour call around today looking for votes.

Lu Tze

Banjo String wrote: »

How do they reduce pressure to a house or an apartment in an unmetered estate / block?

Reduce everyone's

Won't that piss off the ones who paid?

A mostly closed valve (on the meter) will reduce the pressure to each individual house which has not paid. Presumably with a locking mechanism over it similar to when Bord Gais shut off the gas for non payment.

As regards unmetered shared connection, i dont know what would be proposed. Court eventually presumably

My name is URL

Antar Bolaeisk wrote: »

Easiest option really, won't they be billing at 10% over the average or something for those without meters?

They can go and shite if they are!

I haven't had a meter installed yet and I'm not protesting against them either, but they can whistle for it if they expect me to pay above the average (household of 3) cost until a meter is installed here.

I live alone and already conserve water.

The Backwards Man

Banjo String wrote: »

How do they reduce pressure to a house or an apartment in an unmetered estate / block?

Reduce everyone's

Won't that piss off the ones who paid?

I thought you said no one was going to pay.

My name is URL

Lu Tze wrote: »

A mostly closed valve (on the meter) will reduce the pressure to each individual house which has not paid.

Yes.. and enforcing and carrying out such measures will cost 10 times more than the money they recoup from doing it :rolleyes:

Lu Tze

My name is URL wrote: »

Yes.. and enforcing and carrying out such measures will cost 10 times more than the money they recoup from doing it :rolleyes:

They do it with the TV licence

My name is URL

Lu Tze wrote: »

They do it with the TV licence

At a huge cost to the taxpayer. Court hearings and imprisonment isn't free.

darragh o meara

You can be sure they'll charge above the normal rate to residents who refuse meters and make them actually call Irish Water to have them installed, which you can be sure will not be free either.

We need this to happen en masse to have any impact. Sadly it won't happen.

Banjo String

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I thought you said no one was going to pay.

No I'm honestly asking a question as to how will any punishment be placed on a household, in an unmetered estate?

My understanding is that it's just not possible to target a single house if you wish to reduce water. Their is the option to reduce the whole estates pressure, but that will rightly piss off the ones who paid their bills.

Seriously, I just think the whole thing has been very badly put together and not very well thought through (or they didn't expect the resistance).

The Backwards Man

Banjo String wrote: »

No I'm honestly asking a question as to how will any punishment be placed on a household, in an unmetered estate?

My understanding is that it's just not possible to target a single house if you wish to reduce water. Their is the option to reduce the whole estates pressure, but that will rightly piss off the ones who paid their bills.

Seriously, I just think the whole thing has been very badly put together and not very well thought through (or they didn't expect the resistance).

On the other hand, maybe purple in estates won't be so accommodating to the rent a mob protest brigade if they realise that there's a possibility of the pressure being reduced.

lightspeed

if the whole water metering thing fails, id put money on it, water charges will be included in property taxes.

Or else there will be a flat rate water charge for all like the tv license that you can pay along with your property tax if you like.

The OECD has been banging on about Ireland needing to introduce water charges since 2010.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/ireland/ireland-needs-to-introduce-water-charges-says-oecd-36302.html

"Ireland's environmental legal system “lacks coherence” says the OECD. Ireland's track record for transposing EU regulations into national law has been far from adequate. In 2006, the number of procedures brought by the European Commission against Ireland for infringing EU environmental directives was among the highest in the EU."

The idea that we can wipe away water taxes and maintain all the same services is just silly talk. This a country that already spends more than it takes in and we still have pretty high debt to pay off, one of the highest pregnancy rates in Europe and a population that is living longer than ever, with 40% of the country on medical cards.

Im no fan of the water tax and that really is all it is but increased taxes and charges are inevitable for us to maintain the current services.

Take a look at our debt to see the reality

http://www.financedublin.com/debtclock.php

lightspeed

Banjo String wrote: »

No I'm honestly asking a question as to how will any punishment be placed on a household, in an unmetered estate?

My understanding is that it's just not possible to target a single house if you wish to reduce water. Their is the option to reduce the whole estates pressure, but that will rightly piss off the ones who paid their bills.

Seriously, I just think the whole thing has been very badly put together and not very well thought through (or they didn't expect the resistance).

I reckon since a lot of people reluctantly paid the household charge in the end, they perhaps figured that there would be negative press over it but little physical resistance.

It says a lot when Gardai are telling people they will arrest them, people resist anyway and they still just do nothing?

Wonder what the new minister of justice things about such Garda behaviour?

Banjo String

The Backwards Man wrote: »

On the other hand, maybe purple in estates won't be so accommodating to the rent a mob protest brigade if they realise that there's a possibility of the pressure being reduced.

Hey, I see some of the protesters took your advice from the other thread.

Residents celebrated the work and, at one point, brought tea, coffee and scones to the workmen removing the disputed devices.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/meters-removed-by-irish-water-after-three-week-standoff-in-housing-estate-30274126.html

TBM has a secret fan club in Cork :pac::pac::pac:

emo72

lightspeed wrote: »

if the whole water metering thing fails, id put money on it, water charges will be included in property taxes.

yeah, theyd love it if they could just do that. but they cant. thats tax.

they have to make it a commercial utility company that can eventually be sold off. its a catch 22 for our government.

darragh o meara

emo72 wrote: »

they have to make it a commercial utility company that can eventually be sold off. its a catch 22 for our government.

I think the fact that this is going to be sold off in the future is what is hurting a lot of people. Plus the fact that the current setup is favouring one man in particulars business interests and that of his buddies giving him the gig.

The government are in the wrong climate to bring these charges in, I believe that had they introduced them during the Celtic Tiger, that we would all be paying our charges now and the government of the time wouldn't have met the widespread opposition that they are facing now.

In a few years you can be guaranteed that the person I related to above will have a major share in Irish Water, Id bet the house on it..., and running it for him will be Enda and Co.

hatrickpatrick

The reason people are willing to risk a flat charge is because everyone knows full well that the amount of water an average household uses will be so far over the free allowance that no flat charge is likely to match it. The government have completely f*cked this whole thing up - the average Irish person uses 150 litres per day, for a family of three that's 450/day. Multiplied by 365, that's 164,250 per year. 10,000 lires per household is a joke, everyone knew it would be a joke long before it came in, and coupled with the knowledge that most of the revenue from the charge will be wasted in the trough of another bloated quango and its consultants, you have a recipe for fury.

I just hope people aound the country follow suite and put a stop to this before it has a chance to start.

Just curious....will we have to be paying VAT on the water charges?

Phoebas

darragh o meara wrote: »

I think the fact that this is going to be sold off in the future is what is hurting a lot of people.

That's not a fact.

Banjo String

Phoebas wrote: »

That's not a fact.

It is a fact that the government refused to rule the possibility of it out.

Phoebas

Banjo String wrote: »

It is a fact that the government refused to rule the possibility of it out.

They did rule it out in the legislation.

Some future government could decide to reverse the decision that this government made not to privatise Irish Water, but that's a million miles away from it being a fact that it is going to be sold off in the future - that's simply untrue.

Skatedude

Can you not simply install additional water tanks so even if it's reduced to a trickle. it will still fill the tanks,, just takes longer to do so instead of the stop cock stopping it after a few mins? the tanks feed most of the house anyway.
the raw feed is usually only for drinking water

renegademaster

lightspeed wrote: »

if the whole water metering thing fails, id put money on it, water charges will be included in property taxes.

Or else there will be a flat rate water charge for all like the tv license that you can pay along with your property tax if you like.

The OECD has been banging on about Ireland needing to introduce water charges since 2010.

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/ireland/ireland-needs-to-introduce-water-charges-says-oecd-36302.html

"Ireland's environmental legal system “lacks coherence” says the OECD. Ireland's track record for transposing EU regulations into national law has been far from adequate. In 2006, the number of procedures brought by the European Commission against Ireland for infringing EU environmental directives was among the highest in the EU."

The idea that we can wipe away water taxes and maintain all the same services is just silly talk. This a country that already spends more than it takes in and we still have pretty high debt to pay off, one of the highest pregnancy rates in Europe and a population that is living longer than ever, with 40% of the country on medical cards.

Im no fan of the water tax and that really is all it is but increased taxes and charges are inevitable for us to maintain the current services.

Take a look at our debt to see the reality

http://www.financedublin.com/debtclock.php

it's not our debt!!

Phoebas

Skatedude wrote: »

the raw feed is usually only for drinking water

Where I live, the mains feed is used for drinking water, water for cooking, the dishwasher, the washing machine etc...

bumper234

renegademaster wrote: »

it's not our debt!!

It's everybody's debt.

Figerty

Ive been told that in parts of the south the meters are being installed and the someone...unknown... is pouring concrete down the hole with the meter...

Not easy reduce pressure then or read the meter.

There was a programme on BBC last night where water utility companies were doing the same to shut off companies/people that refused to pay their bills.

bumper234

Figerty wrote: »

Ive been told that in parts of the south the meters are being installed and the someone...unknown... is pouring concrete down the hole with the meter...

Not easy reduce pressure then or read the meter.

There was a programme on BBC last night where water utility companies were doing the same to shut off companies/people that refused to pay their bills.

This is the funniest part.

People call the government crooks and criminals and then go out and cause criminal damage to meters:D Will be funny to see the face of the first one as he/she is dragged into court when arrested.

Jester252

Deleted User wrote: »

Til the meter is in, yeah. Only advantage is that without the meter they don't have to worry about being put on a trickle but I doubt they'll be the last in the country to end up with the meters in.

Disadvantage would being a larger bill and a day in court for failing to pay.

Figerty

bumper234 wrote: »

This is the funniest part.

People call the government crooks and criminals and then go out and cause criminal damage to meters:D Will be funny to see the face of the first one as he/she is dragged into court when arrested.

The meter isn't damaged.. just not accessible.
There are plenty people out there that don't see a day in court as a problem. The thing is, to be arrested there needs to be evidence that someone has caused the damage. No one can police every meter for every minute of the day.

SCOOP 64

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Wasters protesting sponsored by us, water meter install sponsored by us, removal of water meters sponsored by us, re-installation of removed water meters sponsored by us, Gardaí to protect installers sponsored by us.

Suggest we remove the wasters protesting and it sure would save us a fortune in sponsership.

There's probably not one of the protestors with a full time job, were sponsoring them so they can drive up our cost of living. Insane.

Dont think you have to have a full time job to protest, not sure.