Third class honours degree

Gael23

I have found out that I will most likely be graduating later this year with a third class honours degree. I have 2 questions really on this.
As some of you might have seen on my other threads here, I have had some interviews recently, based on an expected 2:2. If I was to be offered one of those Jobs would the offer be withdrawn as I will not achieve this?

Secondly, with this level of degree, what options do I have? It's just going to be a waste of time applying for jobs with less than a 2:2 and I think hard to get into a postgraduate course.
Degree is Business Studies with French, Accounting specialisation.

Some might withdraw the offers as they would have to tick the box, others if you impressed them in your interview wouldn't care.

What are you looking to do afterwards? I've a friend who got a level 7 ordinary degree (she failed final year engineering) and was accepted into a job in an accounting firm as maternity leave cover. Once in, she impressed them and was kept on. Just treat it as another small hurdle. After awhile it's about experience not qualifications (though your field may differ).

Gael23

I was looking at Accounting/Tax Roles but I may broaden that if needed.
I've been told alot that after only a short while your degree grade will be irrelevant but I still need that first break.
In Accounting, you really need a 2.1 and I have known for a while now that was not achievable for me no matter how hard I tried but I was aiming to get a 2:2 and do a Level 9 Course

InReality

I have a pass degree (!) .
I figured that was it academic wise for me
I've got on to a post-grad diploma which normally required a 2.1.
I'd say apply away , put work into a covering letter and see what happens.
Like the other poster said its a hurdle that can be overcome.

Gael23

I know I just need to get the right advice and I'll be ok. I would consider someting like a post grad diploma if it opened more doors for me.

Aglomerado

I have a Third, and went on a year later (I worked for a year immediately afterwards) to do a Postgrad diploma and I have just completed my second Masters (part-time work related), and I am contemplating a Ph.D next if I can get the funding.

A third is not the end of the world. A lot of postgrad application forms have a space for your rationale for applying. I have found that if you can put together something reasoned and logical they will consider you.

Best of luck.

Gael23

Aglomerado wrote: »

I have a Third, and went on a year later (I worked for a year immediately afterwards) to do a Postgrad diploma and I have just completed my second Masters (part-time work related), and I am contemplating a Ph.D next if I can get the funding.

A third is not the end of the world. A lot of postgrad application forms have a space for your rationale for applying. I have found that if you can put together something reasoned and logical they will consider you.

Best of luck.

Mind me asking what field you're in?
My rationale would be quite simple in that I want to better myself in some way. I kind of got my degree off to a bad footing in terms of grades but always thought I could catch up and come out with a 2:2 but yesterday realised it won't happen

Aglomerado

ryanf1 wrote: »

Mind me asking what field you're in?
My rationale would be quite simple in that I want to better myself in some way. I kind of got my degree off to a bad footing in terms of grades but always thought I could catch up and come out with a 2:2 but yesterday realised it won't happen

No problem, I'm public sector at the moment, but have also worked in the private sector. I am working in an area relevant to my first Masters and have expanded on it with my second. Primary degree was in English.

OnTheCouch

Yeah I would also recommend looking into a postgraduate qualification. If financially and time-wise possible, which may or may not be a big if of course depending on your personal circumstances.

If nothing else, it takes the focus away from your primary degree and will represent your most recent qualification. Even psychologically, employers will assume that you got something fairly decent in your undergraduate if you then decided to do further study.

In my experience, most colleges are desperate for the money, so if you can manage to come across well in your application, or in person or on the phone or whatever, I think only the real elite places will rule you out on your marks alone.

Of course, it is still a crap time to be looking for a job unfortunately, (although depends on your field to some degree) so it could be an option.

Mr. Loverman

I agree with the others. Get a post grad (make sure you get a first!) and no one will ask you about your degree result.

Gael23

Any postgrads I have looked at need a 2:2 minimum.
When my exams are over I might try to get an appointment with a careers advisor in college to get the appropriate advice.

Mr. Loverman

ryanf1 wrote: »

Any postgrads I have looked at need a 2:2 minimum.
When my exams are over I might try to get an appointment with a careers advisor in college to get the appropriate advice.

Written down it says 2.2 minimum. Talk to them in person.

Gael23

Even if i do a post grad diploma I will still have to put the third on my cv won't I?

Billyblog

Lie.

Gael23

Billyblog wrote: »

Lie.

But if it gets found out wouldn't that lead to a fairly quick dismissal? I have interviews lined up for the next few weeks with a 2:2 down on my application because thats what I was hoping to achieve and knew what it would take for it to happen, but my exams didn't go as well as I had hoped so now its unlikely to happen

Billyblog

I'd lie. I got a 2.1 and have moved around a bit in jobs. I have never been asked to prove my results. As long as they like you in the interview you'll be fine. Everyone lies somewhat on their CV.

srsly78

Many large companies do background checks, which includes your qualifications. They will get you to sign a data protection waiver for this.

They might not care about your grade, but they might care about lies.

TimeToShine

Keep the word "predicted" in there and you're covered.

Gael23

yes it does say expected grade so that will hopefully cover me.

sock puppet

A lie will absolutely be found out as as when it comes to the time to apply for exemptions you'll get none of them. Putting expected grade would cover you unless they make their offer conditional on your final grade.

Tarzana

Billyblog wrote: »

I'd lie. I got a 2.1 and have moved around a bit in jobs. I have never been asked to prove my results. As long as they like you in the interview you'll be fine. Everyone lies somewhat on their CV.

OP, don't do this. I've been asked for transcripts a few times. If a lie is discovered, you're out the door.

As to the bolded bit, yeah, people often do some white lying on their CVs, but lying about your degree class is not a white lie.

Gael23

No i will leave it as is for the moment. Im just worried that should i get an offer they will drop me as soon as they find out.People here have suggested a pg dip but other than that i dont know how to move forward.

Tarzana

ryanf1 wrote: »

No i will leave it as is for the moment. Im just worried that should i get an offer they will drop me as soon as they find out.People here have suggested a pg dip but other than that i dont know how to move forward.

The problem is, with smaller accountancy firms, they may take you on thinking that you will have certain exemptions and therefore a number of exams that don't need to be paid for, but if you have to take those exams, that will cost them. Paying for trainees probably is a much bigger consideration at small firms as there's less money floating around. I guess if you get offered a position, notify them as soon as you get your results and see what happens.

Mr. Loverman

You do a post grad, get a first, and put that grade on your CV.

You don't put your degree grade on your CV.

Gael23

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

You do a post grad, get a first, and put that grade on your CV.

You don't put your degree grade on your CV.

Ive seen one that might interest me but its aimed at graduates form a non business background that want to get accounting exemptions.
Would it be worth approaching them with my situation?

username123

ryanf1 wrote: »

Ive seen one that might interest me but its aimed at graduates form a non business background that want to get accounting exemptions.
Would it be worth approaching them with my situation?

Yes, they can only say no.

As for the degree grade, I have two degrees, one is a 2.2 and one is a first. I don't put the grade for either on my CV, and I work in an area related to the 2.2. If I were going for a job in the area of the first I'd tailor a CV and mention the grade.

Once you have a few years work experience it outstrips the academic qualifications anyway so as a "foot in door" exercise, go for the post grad and don't worry about the degree grade.

Mr. Loverman

ryanf1 wrote: »

Ive seen one that might interest me but its aimed at graduates form a non business background that want to get accounting exemptions.
Would it be worth approaching them with my situation?

I'm going to give you some general life advice. (Sorry).

You have to go out there and make things happen for you.

It takes a few minutes to make a telephone call and try to convince someone to give you an opportunity.

Don't use e-mail - you are forcing them to reply with an official response. Face to face or by telephone is how to do it.

So all these "maybe this could work for me, should I try it?" moments, the answer is always yes, go for it, you have nothing to lose.

To put it simply:

If you don't try, you have already lost.

jive

Don't put your grade on your CV, i've never been asked about my grades unless filling out a graduate application to large multinationals. In fact, I've had three jobs since graduating and nobody has even asked to see my degree. I didn't get a third class honours I just choose not to put my grade on my CV as it seems somewhat juvenile and irrelevant, it might have a place in academia but outside of universities I don't rate grades too highly; too course and university dependent, an indicator of work ethic at best.

Tarzana

jive wrote: »

it might have a place in academia but outside of universities I don't rate grades too highly; too course and university dependent, an indicator of work ethic at best.

A good thing, surely?

Mr. Loverman

jive wrote: »

I just choose not to put my grade on my CV as it seems somewhat juvenile and irrelevant, it might have a place in academia but outside of universities I don't rate grades too highly

You're not the person critiquing your CV though...

Jim2007

Billyblog wrote: »

I'd lie. I got a 2.1 and have moved around a bit in jobs. I have never been asked to prove my results. As long as they like you in the interview you'll be fine. Everyone lies somewhat on their CV.

Well first of all since the OP wants to become an accountant a transcript will be required by the accounting body he wishes to join and secondly a lie on an application to one of these bodies is a disciplinary matter, meaning in most cases that he would be barred from joining such a body in the future. Furthermore such disciplinary actions can be come a matter of public record, so a career over before it begins.

Richard571

jive wrote: »

Don't put your grade on your CV, i've never been asked about my grades unless filling out a graduate application to large multinationals. In fact, I've had three jobs since graduating and nobody has even asked to see my degree. I didn't get a third class honours I just choose not to put my grade on my CV as it seems somewhat juvenile and irrelevant, it might have a place in academia but outside of universities I don't rate grades too highly; too course and university dependent, an indicator of work ethic at best.

I don't think it's either juvenile or irrelevant, particularly for recent graduates with little or no work experience. It gives an indication of the intellectual ability of the candidate and also the amount of work they may or may not have put in over an extended period of time. Whilst it is not the only indicator of performance, if there are a large number of applicants there are worse ways to short list potential candidates.

Jim2007

jive wrote: »

Don't put your grade on your CV, i've never been asked about my grades unless filling out a graduate application to large multinationals. In fact, I've had three jobs since graduating and nobody has even asked to see my degree. I didn't get a third class honours I just choose not to put my grade on my CV as it seems somewhat juvenile and irrelevant, it might have a place in academia but outside of universities I don't rate grades too highly; too course and university dependent, an indicator of work ethic at best.

It does not really matter how you rate grades, it is what employers think that matters! If you do not put down the grade on your resume then it will be assumed that you got a pass degree for the simple reason that people who get higher grades do indicate the grade on their CV.

And the fact that you were not asked about you degree by employers is more likely to indicate that a degree was not necessary for the position than anything else.

username123

Jim2007 wrote: »

It does not really matter how you rate grades, it is what employers think that matters! If you do not put down the grade on your resume then it will be assumed that you got a pass degree for the simple reason that people who get higher grades do indicate the grade on their CV.

This is not true. I've never put the grades on but I have been verbally asked for the grades at interview then asked to follow up with supporting documentation. If a post grad is on there then the degree grade is largely irrelevant anyway, my first post grad was just pass/fail, there was no grade.

Jim2007

username123 wrote: »

This is not true. I've never put the grades on but I have been verbally asked for the grades at interview then asked to follow up with supporting documentation. If a post grad is on there then the degree grade is largely irrelevant anyway, my first post grad was just pass/fail, there was no grade.

The point still stands, if you don't get to the interview stage you'll never get to tell them what the grade was and one of the likely reason you'd get filtered out is the assumption that you'd only got a passing grade. So why would you handicap yourself before you even start???

username123

Jim2007 wrote: »

The point still stands, if you don't get to the interview stage you'll never get to tell them what the grade was and one of the likely reason you'd get filtered out is the assumption that you'd only got a passing grade. So why would you handicap yourself before you even start???

Because most people don't assume a bad grade when no grade is mentioned on a CV? I've never come across anyone make that assumption.

Tarzana

username123 wrote: »

Because most people don't assume a bad grade when no grade is mentioned on a CV? I've never come across anyone make that assumption.

That you know of. I'd certainly wonder why a grade wasn't included.

Gael23

I think myself as a graduate it has to be.

L1011

I've seen plenty of CVs with no grade for a degree; however I'd assume it to be 2.2 or lower as usually 2.1 and 1.1 are the grades I have seen. Same applies for pass/merit/distinction certs - never see pass written down.

username123

Tarzana wrote: »

That you know of. I'd certainly wonder why a grade wasn't included.

I mean when I've been involved in filtering CVs, usually what was of more interest was which course/which university - that being the more pertinent feature in the area at that time (no matter the grade).

Sure, some people make assumptions, but plenty don't. Going by a lot of posts I've seen recently on this site, plenty of people just lie about the grade on the CV anyway so as an employer I'd be looking for supporting documentation either way.

Jim2007

username123 wrote: »

Because most people don't assume a bad grade when no grade is mentioned on a CV? I've never come across anyone make that assumption.

After 25 years working for multinational, I've lost count of how many people I've recruited but in all that time I can never recall coming across that type of logic! But at the end of the day I you want to take a chance on them guessing what is in your mind that is your business.

Jim2007

username123 wrote: »

I mean when I've been involved in filtering CVs, usually what was of more interest was which course/which university - that being the more pertinent feature in the area at that time (no matter the grade).

Sure, some people make assumptions, but plenty don't. Going by a lot of posts I've seen recently on this site, plenty of people just lie about the grade on the CV anyway so as an employer I'd be looking for supporting documentation either way.

So how many CV are you talking about and how did you filter it down to the few you were going to interview?

rockbeast

Jim2007 wrote: »

So how many CV are you talking about and how did you filter it down to the few you were going to interview?

Randomly throw 90% of the CVs in the bin - you don't want to hire unlucky people!

Tarzana

rockbeast wrote: »

Randomly throw 90% of the CVs in the bin - you don't want to hire unlucky people!

Trite urban myth.

blindsider

OP - if you can do the Post-grad (financially), go for it.

I presume you're paying for it - if so, most HEI's will be fairly happy to accept your cash these days - as long as you have passed your Under-grad.

One question - what are you going to do differently in your PG to get you a 2:1? Why would your academic performance be better? (Rhetorical question - I don't need an answer, but I do think you need to work through the answer for yourself.)

jive

Tarzana wrote: »

A good thing, surely?

Indicator of work ethic surely is a good thing. I've received a few academic awards which are on my CV so I guess that is an indicator of how I performed academically.

Mr. Loverman wrote: »

You're not the person critiquing your CV though...

Fair point but I have tailored my CV in a manner which I believe gives me a good chance of getting an interview. I don't put too much weight in grades, within reason, and as such I don't put them on my CV. If they want them then they can ask for them and they will receive.

Richard571 wrote: »

I don't think it's either juvenile or irrelevant, particularly for recent graduates with little or no work experience. It gives an indication of the intellectual ability of the candidate and also the amount of work they may or may not have put in over an extended period of time. Whilst it is not the only indicator of performance, if there are a large number of applicants there are worse ways to short list potential candidates.

In my experience grades and standards vary considerably from institution to institution and from course to course, so much so that I really don't put too much heed in them at all. There are certainly worse ways to short list potential candidates and that's why the 2.1 cut-off is so popular.

Jim2007 wrote: »

It does not really matter how you rate grades, it is what employers think that matters! If you do not put down the grade on your resume then it will be assumed that you got a pass degree for the simple reason that people who get higher grades do indicate the grade on their CV.

And the fact that you were not asked about you degree by employers is more likely to indicate that a degree was not necessary for the position than anything else.

It does matter how I rate them because it's my CV. If employers want to make erroneous assumptions then that is up to them; I won't get that particular job. A lot of graduate jobs have a 2.1 pre-requisite and as such surely they will assume a 2.1.

I've held three jobs since graduating all of which relevant to my degree and all three requiring a degree as per legal requirements. Questionable due diligence on the part of my three employers perhaps or, alternatively, it was obvious that I had obtained a relevant degree due to discussions during the interview process.

Jim2007 wrote: »

The point still stands, if you don't get to the interview stage you'll never get to tell them what the grade was and one of the likely reason you'd get filtered out is the assumption that you'd only got a passing grade. So why would you handicap yourself before you even start???

Perhaps the CV will be read by a like-minded individual and they will give you the interview based on the fact that you don't over-emphasise your grades...

littleblackDRS

It's funny isn't it how it depends on the course. In my course, we were told that if we got less than a 2.1, we were better off not even mentioning the degree, as it would be as good as useless to us.

D Weasel

Got a pass BBS now on over 100k pa package with no further qualifications.

Richard571

D Weasel wrote: »

Got a pass BBS now on over 100k pa package with no further qualifications.

And I'm sure your very good at what you do with a track record of achievement; with this your academic performance is of less relevance once you've demonstrated ability in your chosen profession.

Gael23

Just wanted to update this.
Ive had a few more interviews but not even one offer or second round interview.

Also and post grad diploma I have been interested in requires a 2.2 minimum so I really don't know where to turn.

on_my_oe

I appreciate that you might have left it too late for exam boards, but any chance of mentioning 'exceptional circumstances'?

Otherwise perhaps doing post grad through an online university? RDI have some options? Or maybe some of the Accounting Technician papers? You may be able to get exemptions from your degree papers for some modules?