How to keep cortisol in check whilst training/dieting to get lean?

blah88

How do crossfitters and athletes who train constantly and stay lean manage it?

I hate counting calories so I figured that just training my ass off and eating loads of healthy Paleo-ish food and keeping my carbs to pre/post exercise would take care of the fat loss for me. And at first it was working.

Starting off this ''cut'' I'd say I was around 15% bodyfat. For the first 10 days or so I felt great. Loads of energy, strength was going up and I was feeling and looking much better. Never felt hungry either, was eating plenty of protein, veg, fruit and good fats. No wheat, dairy or sugar.

Then, I can't put my finger on what happened, but I just started to feel gradually worse. I developed symptoms of a cold, strength stalled, I started to look worse in the mirror, became more irritable, sex drive dropped, trouble sleeping, etc. Basically all the symptoms associated with a rise in cortisol and a drop in testosterone.

This ALWAYS happens me as I drop fat. I reach a point of diminishing returns. It's like my body just wants me to hold onto a bit of pudge. I tried to continue training and did a high carb ''refeed'' day but it didn't make me feel any better.

I've accepted now that continuing to train will just be digging a hole and making it worse. So now I've just resorted to sitting at home and eating more until I begin to feel myself again. It's so frustrating as it feels like I'm taking two steps forward then two steps backward.

There are a couple of things that may have caused the sudden 180 in the results I was getting.


- I'm unemployed at the moment and my sleeping pattern is very bad. I get plenty of sleep but it's between the hours of 3AM and 1PM usually. Then there was one night where I only got four hours sleep as I had to be up for an appointment. That morning was where I began to feel worse.

- Most of my sessions have gone on for over an hour. (weights then metcons/intervals)


How do I go about sorting myself out and what can I do in future to stop this happening? I'm 25, male and don't have any history of sickness or anything.

I don't have any work related stress in my life and my daily activity besides the gym is basically non-existent at the moment thanks to a foot injury.

These are the things I've read that are meant to help bring cortisol levels back down.

- Cut out stimulants (caffeine etc)

- Eat at regular intervals (don't do Intermittent Fasting)

- Stay hydrated.

If anyone would like to share some wisdom I'd be delighted to hear it. I'm just staying in for the weekend and taking it easy.

ford2600

Just reading book on cholesterol and heart disease at moment by Malcom Kendrick; have just started chapter on stress/relaxation system which are hormone controlled. If anything pops up I'll revert.

Being un or under employed is stressful for some; I wouldn't discount stress. Don't underestimate value of social connections, charity work, team sports, family relationships etc for your well being.

Diet and exercise are a small part of the picture.

blah88

I know other factors can affect your stress levels as well, but I've been lifting seriously for over 7 years now and I'm always happy as Larry until I start making a focused effort to get shredded. It always goes fine and I lose fat from everywhere until I come to that bit of stubborn fat around the love handles. Then it all starts to go pear shaped and affects my life so bad that it's not even worth it.

It's not as if my activity is excessive. I do two upper and two lower body workouts with moderate volume a week, and 2-4 short metcons/intervals. In the past I've experimented with doing much less volume than this and I still got the same negative reactions. Also, I really enjoy exercising so I would rather achieve the fat loss through working out than dieting.

I do restrict my carbs slightly as I'm already eating high protein and high fat, so I assume going high carb as well would just result in no fat loss. Still though, I always eat a fairly carb heavy meal post workout. I guess I'll start doing more regular refeeds as well.

It's probably that my Circadian rhythm is all messed up. Since I left school, I've always had irregular sleeping patterns. None of the jobs I've worked have ever been just your regular 9-5.

Mellor

While it isn't impossible for cortisol to be the cause. It's a bit of a jump to assume it's definitely it.
It's more likely to be the sleep issue imo.

JJayoo

You are probably dropping your calories too much. In regards to Hormones and fat loss then the main one is Leptin.

If you want to get lean then you need to change this

I hate counting calories

get on myfitnesspal

discus

This could have been written by me op. Had to get my diet in check, stop eating fried foods, half the amount of red meat I ate, eventually had to increase the amount of carbohydrate I was taking in.... all in order to sleep. Once the sleep got back to normal (6/7 hours a night) everything else came back quickly.

blah88

Mellor wrote: »

While it isn't impossible for cortisol to be the cause. It's a bit of a jump to assume it's definitely it.
It's more likely to be the sleep issue imo.

Well apparently one night of inadequate sleep can raise cortisol levels by 45%. So I'm guessing that one night where I got feck all sleep kickstarted a bad chain of events. I didn't train that day I did drink a load of coffee and continued to train hard the next few days.

JJayoo wrote: »

You are probably dropping your calories too much. In regards to Hormones and fat loss then the main one is Leptin.

If you want to get lean then you need to change this get on myfitnesspal

In the past I have spent a long time anally tracking calories and macros, weighing everything etc. I know what foods are calorie dense and which aren't. I always felt it's such an un-natural way to live though and have been looking for an approach that makes it unneccessary. That's what I thought I'd found here initally. I was eating only whole, unprocessed foods and losing fat and feeling great. I was probably undereating though as I being very cautious with my portions when it came to things that are easily over-eaten, like nuts and coconut milk.

discus wrote: »

This could have been written by me op. Had to get my diet in check, stop eating fried foods, half the amount of red meat I ate, eventually had to increase the amount of carbohydrate I was taking in.... all in order to sleep. Once the sleep got back to normal (6/7 hours a night) everything else came back quickly.

In the past I have tried to do the IIFYM approach whilst only guesstimating my kcals. It never worked! This time though I was eating only the highest quality foods. I can probably eat a lot more than I'm used to with these foods, it's just I'm always thinking in the back of my head ''no kcal deficit=no fat loss''.

I've always been a night owl and I'm addicted to the internet so it's gonna be hard to get my sleeping in order!

As soon as I start feeling better I'll try starting to lean out again but with extra rest days, refeeds once or twice a week and generally eating and sleeping more.

Squat Rack Curler

It's not cortisol

Drop fats to 0.4g per pound bodyweight and raise carbs. Count macronutrients when cutting for best results, takes two minutes using myfitnesspal.

Dotcomdolly

blah88 wrote: »

I've always been a night owl and I'm addicted to the internet so it's gonna be hard to get my sleeping in order!

Is there really anything so important on your television or computer worth compromising your health? Make time for adequate sleep. You won’t regret it.

from Jason Seib piece
http://everydaypaleo.com/get-some-sleep/

blah88

The main gripe I have with calorie counting is that I don't burn the same amount of calories every day. I like being spontaneous with my activity. As I said, at the moment I'm injured and not doing much outside of the gym. But usually, I like to play football and do things like calisthenics regularly and I don't know exactly how many calories these things are burning off.

JJayoo

So you just try and randomly guess? Why not workout your cals/protein/fat/carbs/fibre for a few days. I also think that a refeed is very important when dieting. Helps ramp up leptin and motivation.

blah88

The best results I ever got from a diet and exercise regimen was before I even understood the concept of calories in vs calories out. I remember a few years back I got very lean just by exercising basically every day and eating a paleo style diet, keeping the protein and fats high and the carbs reasonably low. This was the only time I actually enjoyed the process of losing fat and didn't feel like I was ''on a diet''.

Then, after a J1 Summer I put on a lot of fat. Upon returning, I got really into reading about dieting and calorie counting. Over the last few years I've constantly been going on and off diets and I feel like I've just lost sense of how to eat normally.

I do find refeeds helpful usually. This last time I tried one though I kept the carb sources really clean and trained hard on the same day. It's possible I didn't go over maintenance and that's why it didn't seem to work for me.

jive

blah88 wrote: »

I know other factors can affect your stress levels as well, but I've been lifting seriously for over 7 years now and I'm always happy as Larry until I start making a focused effort to get shredded. It always goes fine and I lose fat from everywhere until I come to that bit of stubborn fat around the love handles. Then it all starts to go pear shaped and affects my life so bad that it's not even worth it.

It's not as if my activity is excessive. I do two upper and two lower body workouts with moderate volume a week, and 2-4 short metcons/intervals. In the past I've experimented with doing much less volume than this and I still got the same negative reactions. Also, I really enjoy exercising so I would rather achieve the fat loss through working out than dieting.

I do restrict my carbs slightly as I'm already eating high protein and high fat, so I assume going high carb as well would just result in no fat loss. Still though, I always eat a fairly carb heavy meal post workout. I guess I'll start doing more regular refeeds as well.

It's probably that my Circadian rhythm is all messed up. Since I left school, I've always had irregular sleeping patterns. None of the jobs I've worked have ever been just your regular 9-5.

fack, you're basically me only you are in the internet

jive

blah88 wrote: »

The best results I ever got from a diet and exercise regimen was before I even understood the concept of calories in vs calories out. I remember a few years back I got very lean just by exercising basically every day and eating a paleo style diet, keeping the protein and fats high and the carbs reasonably low. This was the only time I actually enjoyed the process of losing fat and didn't feel like I was ''on a diet''.

Then, after a J1 Summer I put on a lot of fat. Upon returning, I got really into reading about dieting and calorie counting. Over the last few years I've constantly been going on and off diets and I feel like I've just lost sense of how to eat normally.

I do find refeeds helpful usually. This last time I tried one though I kept the carb sources really clean and trained hard on the same day. It's possible I didn't go over maintenance and that's why it didn't seem to work for me.

You sound a lot like me (as per post above). I generally eat the same things and just tailor my carb intake as per my activity levels and also on whether I want to shed a few pounds or put on a few pounds. Start sleeping from like 11pm to 7am and get out and do shít, nothing worse than waking up at 1pm and missing half the day you just get annoyed at yourself (well, I certainly do). Easier said than done of course but having a nice routine and getting up early will make you feel 10x better

blah88

I do feel way better about myself when I get up at a reasonable hour alright. Nothing more depressing than realising you've missed the majority of a sunny day. People will tell you, ''Just go to bed earlier''. But it's not that simple. You can't force yourself to sleep. I'll try and gradually get up earlier each day so it won't be such a shock to the system.

CM24

I feel your pain OP. I remember I had an awful struggle trying to get the last of the fat off as well. Just the love handle area specifically. I was actually working in a gym at the time and had to teach up to 3 spinning classes a day, on top of my own training.

My sleeping patterns were terrible, I relied heavily on caffeine, I was eating fairly low carb. After a few weeks the love handles still weren't coming off so I added Intermittent Fasting to the mix.

Before long I ran myself into the ground. All these things make your hormones to go haywire and your immune system starts to shut down. I had all the same symptoms as you.

To make it worse, the love handles are considered stubborn fat and are linked with high cortisol levels. According to Poliquin and many others, anyway. So all my efforts were in vain. I lost some fat but not from where I wanted to lose it and my general complexion looked much worse.

Here are some Articles that speak about the topic.

Hanley

More sleep.
Track kcals.
Increase carb intake.

And stop fannying about. If you want to get REALLY lean you have to be quite particular about it.

Davei141

Hanley wrote: »

More sleep.
Track kcals.
Increase carb intake.

And stop fannying about. If you want to get REALLY lean you have to be quite particular about it.

+1 Training really hard but not counting calories and sitting up all night on the internet as a routine is like pissing in the wind. Force yourself up earlier and if you have to spend a few days tired trying to break it so be it, staying awake really late and waking late constantly is not good for mental health either.