Buying 1st diesel €6000

almostover

Thinking of buying a diesel car. Have 6k ish to spend. Currently I'm driving a 1.6 petrol mitsubishi carisma and did 20k miles in the past year so I think I would make a decent saving on juice.

Was looking at getting an 06/07 Volvo S40 1.6D. Tax bill wont increase and the extra 15-20mpg will be a big plus. Have heard that these engines can suffer from turbo failure if the oil is not regularly changed due to the oil passages becoming blocked up from soot and carbon. Will not buy a car without comprehensive service history with this in mind. Seeing as I've always changed the oil in my carisma every 5k miles I'm thinking similar service interval should prevent a major issues?

Are there any other issues to consider when buying this model? I also plan on cleaning the EGR at every 2nd service (10k miles) if accessible. Do these cars come with DPF or DMF as I've heard both of these can be trouble areas for modern diesels?

road_high

Had one myself for about 4years. Lovely car and loved owning it. Looks great, decent enough to drive and great interior. But...I did spend a fortune on various engine repairs. Anything that went wrong was always big money, broke my heart. Replaced the EGR valve twice, various turbo lines that cracked, rocker cover gaskets that leaked oil. Other stuff I can't even remember. Have to say the Insignia I have now is a total contrast, not a thing goes wrong.
A quick search of that engine will tell a lot, unless meticulously serviced with the correct oil trouble is almost certain. Even then I'd be wary.
Coming from the reliability and cheap ownership of a Mitsubishi this could be quite a shock. The latest Lancer always strook me as a nice car.

thadg

that 1.6 diesel engine is the same engine as the berlingo hdi, partner, ford focus.
best word to describe that engine is scrap. google dv6 engine problems

turbo's are a major fault with them

almostover, think about a prius MK II, good economy considering it's a petrol automatic.

Ultra reliable even buying one with high mileage that are well maintained do not cause much problems at all.

No timing belts.

Watch out for the Anti Prius brigade telling me off because you said you're "thinking" about a "diesel" and how I go on about the prius etc.

But it's still a very good car and it's not slow and 55-60 mpg should be achievable without much effort. And a lot of people are not aware about how good it is and instantly write it off because of it's eco image and because it has a battery, but the battery needs no maintenance and usually lasts well over 300,000 miles.

knipex

To me 20 miles is a little short of justifying a diesel. Especially an older one. Your maintenance costs will be higher and your fuel savings will not be as much as you think..

dgt

Well that didn't take long.....

JohnBoy26

almostover wrote: »

Thinking of buying a diesel car. Have 6k ish to spend. Currently I'm driving a 1.6 petrol mitsubishi carisma and did 20k miles in the past year so I think I would make a decent saving on juice.

Was looking at getting an 06/07 Volvo S40 1.6D. Tax bill wont increase and the extra 15-20mpg will be a big plus. Have heard that these engines can suffer from turbo failure if the oil is not regularly changed due to the oil passages becoming blocked up from soot and carbon. Will not buy a car without comprehensive service history with this in mind. Seeing as I've always changed the oil in my carisma every 5k miles I'm thinking similar service interval should prevent a major issues?

Are there any other issues to consider when buying this model? I also plan on cleaning the EGR at every 2nd service (10k miles) if accessible. Do these cars come with DPF or DMF as I've heard both of these can be trouble areas for modern diesels?

A service history and regular oil changes is no guarantee that these will not suffer from turbo failure. There have been plenty of examples in the uk with full service histories that suffered from sludge problems and turbo failure.

tbh there is far nicer and more reliable 1.6 diesel engines out there.

dr.fuzzenstein

dgt wrote: »

Well that didn't take long.....

OK, let's save time here::cool:
1.6 is not far off a 2 liter, so let's look at a 520d, these are rubbish, because they are not 6 cylinder, so let's go 525d, waste of time, let's go for 535d, might as well be petrol now, so 535i, now at this money it would just silly not to buy an M5, an older one can be had for very reasonable money, so OP, buy a BMW M5!

Shane Fitz

Wow!!! 5 post!!!
5 fupping post!!!
He asked for diesels, in fact a very specific diesel. And within 5 post with have suggestions of petrol/EV and a " you ain't doing the mileage... "

Why is it so hard to just answer the OP's question.

dr.fuzzenstein

thadg wrote: »

that 1.6 diesel engine is the same engine as the berlingo hdi, partner, ford focus.
best word to describe that engine is scrap. google dv6 engine problems

turbo's are a major fault with them

Mostly with "Irish" servicing of every 50k km or every 4 years with 15w30 mineral oil.

road_high

How about a Jetta 1.9 tdi? Assume they are a lot more reliable than the 1.6 Volvo, couldn't be much worse tbh. Similar size and sub-premuim style.

road_high

road_high wrote: »

How about a Jetta 1.9 tdi? Assume they are a lot more reliable than the 1.6 Volvo, couldn't be much worse tbh. Similar size and sub-premuim style.

the old PD's were a horrible un-refined rattle box diesel, but if looked after they were bullet proof ! I can't say that about VW DMF's though !

Shane Fitz

Shane Fitz wrote: »

Wow!!! 5 post!!!
5 fupping post!!!
He asked for diesels, in fact a very specific diesel. And within 5 post with have suggestions of petrol/EV and a " you ain't doing the mileage... "

Why is it so hard to just answer the OP's question.

And as usual it seems someone other than the OP actually gives a crap. I'm sure the Op will take all advice into consideration.

corsav6

Have a look at the 1.9tid Saab, lovely car and fairly reliable engine, its a Fiat/GM engine.
The insignia is out of your price range but the Vectra looks cool and has a few diesel engine options. The 1.9 sri comes fairly well equipped with 6 speed gearbox and at your budget you would pick up a nice clean car. The astra may be a bit small but the 1.7cdti is a bulletproof engine and fairly economical.
If you go down the smaller route then I can recommend the 1.3cdti astra, great mpg, lovely 6 speed box and great power from its tiny size. I service every 6k and never had a sign of trouble.
Good luck finding the right car OP, do plenty of homework.

JohnBoy26

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Mostly with "Irish" servicing of every 50k km or every 4 years with 15w30 mineral oil.

this is just a silly post with no basis. If cars were that badly maintained here don't you think we would see far more cars with engine failure, or engine problems related to oil issues?

Also if the problems with the 1.6d psa engine are down to the "Irish servicing" then how is it that cars fitted with this engine are suffering from the same issues in the uk and other countries?

These uk cars are hardly badly maintained, most have full main dealer service histories.

131spanner

What size of a car do you want or need? If you didn't mind something on the smaller side, a Corolla D4D might be worth a look at. I have an '07 commercial one, and it's been hard to fault it engine-wise so far. 1.4 might be thirstier on motorway miles, but for daily trips it's doing me fine

road_high

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

this is just a silly post with no basis. If cars were that badly maintained here don't you think we would see far more cars with engine failure, or engine problems related to oil issues?

Also if the problems with the 1.6d psa engine are down to the "Irish servicing" then how is it that cars fitted with this engine are suffering from the same issues in the uk and other countries?

These uk cars are hardly badly maintained, most have full main dealer service histories.

There are known issues with this engine. Well documented and experienced them myself. And car was well serviced too. Funny how other engines don't suffer all the issues under "Irish" servicing. Just a shame PSA fcuked it royally. How are the latest ones going? Assume they've ironed it out?

Shane Fitz

[Deleted User] wrote: »

And as usual it seems someone other than the OP actually gives a crap. I'm sure the Op will take all advice into consideration.

Look I've no issue with you so ease up there!!!
I like your posts. The are generally very informative.
BUT the fact remains You didn't answer the question posed in the OP.

Ps. If I was feling as precious as some I might view that as an " attack the poster rather than the post"

Bpmull

Tbh for a first diesel something vag 1.9tdi like an octavia you really can't go wrong. They rarely cause any trouble. Not all 1.6 Psa engines are bad you can be lucky and have no trouble but I wouldn't say the odds are stacked great. I personally wouldn't touch a 1.6psa engine and I have one. The amount of money I've spent on mine in the last year and even at that I've done most work myself if I was putting it in a garage everytime something went wrong I can only imagine the cost. Although infairness my one causes little trouble at the moment it's cost a serious amount of money and time to put things right. My parents 05 octavia 1.9tdi is 2 years older than my focus and has over 50k miles more on it. Total repair bill for last 2 years of ownership 100 euro for 2 cv boots that's literally it where could you go wrong with that :pac:

road_high

Bpmull wrote: »

Tbh for a first diesel something vag 1.9tdi like an octavia you really can't go wrong. They rarely cause any trouble. Not all 1.6 Psa engines are bad you can be lucky and have no trouble but I wouldn't say the odds are stacked great. I personally wouldn't touch a 1.6psa engine and I have one. The amount of money I've spent on mine in the last year and even at that I've done most work myself if I was putting it in a garage everytime something went wrong I can only imagine the cost. Although infairness my one causes little trouble at the moment it's cost a serious amount of money and time to put things right. My parents 05 octavia 1.9tdi is 2 years older than my focus and has over 50k miles more on it. Total repair bill for last 2 years of ownership 100 euro for 2 cv boots that's literally it where could you go wrong with that :pac:

Sounds exactly like my old s40, except I couldn't do the work meself! Say I could have spent easily €3-4k on repairs over the 4 years to the engine. Any "saving" I may have made on diesel well and truly out the window. It made me very cautious about buying any car in future tbh. Lucky now I have a co car though. Can really appreciate why people are buying Hyundai, Kia and even renault with their long warranties after that.

cabb8ge

Would Mondeo 1.8 diesel be option for you?

http://cars.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/08-diesel-ford-mondeo-test-and-tax/6399847

120 thousand of miles not unreasonable for diesel of that age, tax price is less compared to Carisma for 2008 Mondeo 1.8

If happy to pay tax at cc price list there are many options

road_high

Lot of car for the money there if sound.

Shane Fitz

Shane Fitz wrote: »

Look I've no issue with you so ease up there!!!
I like your posts. The are generally very informative.
BUT the fact remains You didn't answer the question posed in the OP.

Ps. If I was feling as precious as some I might view that as an " attack the poster rather than the post"

Peace !

corkgsxr

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

OK, let's save time here::cool:
1.6 is not far off a 2 liter, so let's look at a 520d, these are rubbish, because they are not 6 cylinder, so let's go 525d, waste of time, let's go for 535d, might as well be petrol now, so 535i, now at this money it would just silly not to buy an M5, an older one can be had for very reasonable money, so OP, buy a BMW M5!

To be fair its a handy jump from 1.6-2.0. If it was me id go for the 2 litre. For my driving tend to get better mpg at 70-75 mph in the bigger engine and same at lower speed

How about petrol and converting to LPG ?

dr.fuzzenstein

Deleted User wrote: »

How about petrol and converting to LPG ?

Might as well get a V8 then...:p

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Might as well get a V8 then...:p

Oh yeah !

My brothers S80 2003 1.8 Turbo 180 hp 5 cylinder is a gloriously smooth engine, how anyone could want a diesel is beyond me when such good cars are going for half nothing.

robertxxx

What about my primera 9 years of ownership 15 year old and repair bills totaling 700euro, not bad for a banger.

dr.fuzzenstein

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh yeah !

My brothers S80 2003 1.8 Turbo 180 hp 5 cylinder is a gloriously smooth engine, how anyone could want a diesel is beyond me when such good cars are going for half nothing.

I well believe it, but for me and doing 120 km a day something like that would never be viable.
I put 150000 km on the CMax since I got it in 2010 and very little has gone wrong bar the clutch and a leaky fuel line, the same on a petrol would simply not be viable for me.
But we will just again descend into the same debate, where I will say that droning along at 120 on the motorway it doesn't matter what engine and so on.

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I well believe it, but for me and doing 120 km a day something like that would never be viable.
I put 150000 km on the CMax since I got it in 2010 and very little has gone wrong bar the clutch and a leaky fuel line, the same on a petrol would simply not be viable for me.
But we will just again descend into the same debate, where I will say that droning along at 120 on the motorway it doesn't matter what engine and so on.

Yeah but on LPG @75 C/L would make worth while IMO. Would be more like 50 mpg equivalent.

dr.fuzzenstein

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah but on LPG @75 C/L would make worth while IMO. Would be more like 50 mpg equivalent.

I'd just need a grand for the conversion then...:rolleyes:

Tea 1000

Deleted User wrote: »

Oh yeah !

My brothers S80 2003 1.8 Turbo 180 hp 5 cylinder is a gloriously smooth engine, how anyone could want a diesel is beyond me when such good cars are going for half nothing.

I assume you mean 2 litre turbo? Don't know of any 1.8 volvo I5's.

Tea 1000

Tea 1000 wrote: »

I assume you mean 2 litre turbo? Don't know of any 1.8 volvo I5's.

Correct. It's the 2.0L T my mistake.

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I'd just need a grand for the conversion then...:rolleyes:

Yeah if you do the miles it will pay back though.

dr.fuzzenstein

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah if you do the miles it will pay back though.

I get you, but my current car is fine, really and it has saved me enough money as it is.
And besides, I actually like it.
I keep saying it, torque curve, max revs, power band, 0-60, noise on startup, gear ratios, etc... all mean pretty much sod all on my daily commute.
Next car will most likely be a 2.0 diesel Yeti.
Maybe at some stage something vintage and petrol for the weekends, for now there's the MX5.
I need LPG like a hole in the head, what with the conversion cost and about 1 garage in the Midwest actually selling the stuff. And charging a euro for it.

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I get you, but my current car is fine, really and it has saved me enough money as it is.
And besides, I actually like it.
I keep saying it, torque curve, max revs, power band, 0-60, noise on startup, gear ratios, etc... all mean pretty much sod all on my daily commute.
Next car will most likely be a 2.0 diesel Yeti.
Maybe at some stage something vintage and petrol for the weekends, for now there's the MX5.
I need LPG like a hole in the head, what with the conversion cost and about 1 garage in the Midwest actually selling the stuff. And charging a euro for it.

Ah yeah if ye have the O'l daysul I suppose there is no point unless you were changing it for a petrol.

dr.fuzzenstein

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Ah yeah if ye have the O'l daysul I suppose there is no point unless you were changing it for a petrol.

Maybe some day, for now the old oil burner has to rattle on for at least another year. ;-)

dr.fuzzenstein

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

Maybe some day, for now the old oil burner has to rattle on for at least another year. ;-)

Yeah know what you mean, I love to change the prius for a leaf/I3 but contracting prohibits spending money. In 4 weeks I could be looking for work again, short term contracts are a BI^&H ! I doubt I'll be made permanent where I am atm, but I'm only 3 mins from the Nissan fast charger !

But I got a spin in my other brothers A6 180 Hp Multitronic TDI yesterday and it a really nice place to sit. Pretty high spec leather, and the park assist is mental.

The Auto is really smooth and auto's work really well with diesels.

Having an extra 70 hp over the Prius was nice !

almostover

The general consensus seems to be that the 1.6 unit is a sh**box so then. Do the same issues exist with the 2.0d? I see someone recommended a Pruis but I have my own ideas about those (sh**box also!) and anyway I don't like the look of them. The 1.9 Cdti vectra is an interesting proposal, car looks good and if the engine is safe then could be a runner. A skoda superb in the right trim level could float my boat too or perhaps a Saab. Hard to know where to go really but I would like to go diesel and something a little more luxurious than my carisma (albeit she is a reliable old bugger).

Tea 1000

almostover wrote: »

The general consensus seems to be that the 1.6 unit is a sh**box so then. Do the same issues exist with the 2.0d? I see someone recommended a Pruis but I have my own ideas about those (sh**box also!) and anyway I don't like the look of them. The 1.9 Cdti vectra is an interesting proposal, car looks good and if the engine is safe then could be a runner. A skoda superb in the right trim level could float my boat too or perhaps a Saab. Hard to know where to go really but I would like to go diesel and something a little more luxurious than my carisma (albeit she is a reliable old bugger).

Speaking of shtboxes - there's few worse than a Vectra.

Bpmull

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Speaking of shtboxes - there's few worse than a Vectra.

A 1.9cdti vectra would be 100 times better than anything with a 1.6 Psa engine. My parents had one for years and it never caused any trouble it was a 05 one. Just when looking at vectra buy a 120 rather than 150 bhp they cause less trouble. You could probably buy better cars reliability wise than a vectra but you could buy a hell of a lot worse too.

dr.fuzzenstein

Ford Focus up to 06, 1.8 TDCI.
Unkillable. Just my €0.02.

Tea 1000

Bpmull wrote: »

A 1.9cdti vectra would be 100 times better than anything with a 1.6 Psa engine. My parents had one for years and it never caused any trouble it was a 05 one. Just when looking at vectra buy a 120 rather than 150 bhp they cause less trouble. You could probably buy better cars reliability wise than a vectra but you could buy a hell of a lot worse too.

I'd rather take my chances with a PSA powered car than have to suffer the driving drivel that is the Vectra.

almostover

Tea 1000 wrote: »

I'd rather take my chances with a PSA powered car than have to suffer the driving drivel that is the Vectra.

I appreciate the advice guys but it seems that every car is sh**e judging by what people are saying. Like I said, I have 6k to spend and want a reliable, comfortable and decent looking diesel car that won't cost a fortune to run. Tbh my current car isn't exactly a standard setter and despite it's reliability I need something more economical.

The 1.6 PSA engine turbo issue worries me. Is the 1.9 fiat/GM unit any better or would a VAG unit be the best bet?

almostover

Ok so have shelved the PSA 1.6d ideas based on responses here and further research.

Thinking of the vectra 1.9 sri 150bhp. Have got insurance quote and no major changes there and an 08 model with 390 tax is in my budget. That will save from the 514 for my existing car. Fuel economy may not be as good as a 1.6 PSA but high 40's/low 50's is a great improvement on mid to high 30's. Have done my research here too and timing belt/water pump issues seem to be prevalent but if service interval is shortened to 40k miles then doesn't seem to a be a problem. Looking like I'll have to do that every 1.5/2 years which is fine considering my existing car needs one at every 50k miles. EGR's also seems to be trouble some which isn't any different to other diesel lumps and i can clean regularly or replace with blanking plate. Swirl flaps can fail too due to EGR dumping coke in the intake manifold but I reckon a good service strategy can negate this.

Are there any other issues to look out for on these? DMF's? DPF's? And does anyone have experience of owning/running these? Thinking of getting a 6 speed to make the most of my regular motorway/dual carriageway/open road driving.

thadg

to be fair the 1.9 cdti Vectra are a good car. I got a 08 sri cdti 150bhp for a friend last august in the uk, full service history 105,000 miles. 6000 euro all inclusive of boat and flights and vrt. tax is around 400 a year. a lot of car for 6k

Bpmull

almostover wrote: »

Ok so have shelved the PSA 1.6d ideas based on responses here and further research.

Thinking of the vectra 1.9 sri 150bhp. Have got insurance quote and no major changes there and an 08 model with 390 tax is in my budget. That will save from the 514 for my existing car. Fuel economy may not be as good as a 1.6 PSA but high 40's/low 50's is a great improvement on mid to high 30's. Have done my research here too and timing belt/water pump issues seem to be prevalent but if service interval is shortened to 40k miles then doesn't seem to a be a problem. Looking like I'll have to do that every 1.5/2 years which is fine considering my existing car needs one at every 50k miles. EGR's also seems to be trouble some which isn't any different to other diesel lumps and i can clean regularly or replace with blanking plate. Swirl flaps can fail too due to EGR dumping coke in the intake manifold but I reckon a good service strategy can negate this.

Are there any other issues to look out for on these? DMF's? DPF's? And does anyone have experience of owning/running these? Thinking of getting a 6 speed to make the most of my regular motorway/dual carriageway/open road driving.

The 150bhp vectra gives injector and dpf trouble and other stuff that the 120bhp doesn't. There's a reason I said to get a 120bhp. I wouldn't touch a 150 bhp.

2ndcoming

almostover wrote: »

I appreciate the advice guys but it seems that every car is sh**e judging by what people are saying. Like I said, I have 6k to spend and want a reliable, comfortable and decent looking diesel car that won't cost a fortune to run. Tbh my current car isn't exactly a standard setter and despite it's reliability I need something more economical.

The 1.6 PSA engine turbo issue worries me. Is the 1.9 fiat/GM unit any better or would a VAG unit be the best bet?

The 1.9tdi VAG engine is without doubt the best of the three. So that gives you options of various Seats, Golfs, Boras, Passats, Superbs, Octavias, A4s, A3s. Pick which one you like best and go with it.

charcosull

I have a 1.6D Volvo C30. 120,000 Miles on it now. Serviced every 15,000 miles at least, with the correct oil.
Only issue I have had is injector seals. A tenner on parts and a few hours of labour to a local guy sorted that.

As long as it is properly looked after I wouldnt be too worried. 50-55mpg generally and a very nice place to sit.

2ndcoming

2ndcoming wrote: »

The 1.9tdi VAG engine is without doubt the best of the three. So that gives you options of various Seats, Golfs, Boras, Passats, Superbs, Octavias, A4s, A3s. Pick which one you like best and go with it.

Yeah the old PD 1.9 TDI VAG was a terrific engine, but noisy and trashy as hell. I couldn't go back to it, but for it's time it was good.

cadaliac

2ndcoming wrote: »

The 1.9tdi VAG engine is without doubt the best of the three. So that gives you options of various Seats, Golfs, Boras, Passats, Superbs, Octavias, A4s, A3s. Pick which one you like best and go with it.

+1
This, op, you were looking for reliability and economy. The 1.9 vag is tried and tested. All diesel cars will have higher maintainence costs when you replace consumables like cluches and dmf's. The 1.9 tdi will be no different. Test drive loads and good luck.
BTW, the vectra option is best avoided imo. The 1.7 diesel is beyond sh1t. The 1.9, 120bhp option if any and avoid the 150bhp one like the plague. A neighbor is a broken man after his.