Summons no seat belt

oholly121

A few Sundays ago I was driving to the pharmacy to get some medicine for my wife who was ill I had tried 3 pharmacies and all of them where closed on the 3rd pharmacy I got out of my car and went the door as I thought I saw it open but it was closed the manager told me the other one down the road was open.
So I jumped into my car and left off forgetting to put on my seat belt baring in mind I was concerned for my wife she had not slept due to the illness to present about a mile down the road the garda came up from the side of me and saw I had no seat belt they pulled me over an I showed him the prescription and explained the situation he said there was nothing he could do but I could write to the supt to explain my case I did and never heard back I even gave copies of the prescription the dr note from the previous night and receipt yesterday received a Summons to court and advise please?

Ken.

Are you one of the following. If not your screwed. Go to court and pay the fine. You weren't wearing the seatbelt.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/roads_and_safety/seatbelts_when_motoring_in_ireland.html
Exemptions from requirement to wear seatbelts

If you are sitting on a seat that is not fitted with a safety belt
If you are giving instruction in respect of the driving of a vehicle (i.e., you are teaching someone else how to drive). This is another example of a case where it might not be so wise to avail of the leniency of the law.
If you are driving test examiner conducting a driving test
If you are a member of An Garda Siochana or the Defence Forces and are driving as part of your duties
If you hold a medical certificate signed by a qualified medical practitioner stating it is inadvisable on medical grounds you wear a seatbelt or child restraint

Since July 2004 drivers of small public service vehicles (i.e., taxis) are required to wear seatbelts when driving these vehicles.

timmy4u2

I am afraid that that will not work. You were a mile down the road without a seat belt.
The Supt would not be authorised to exempt you on those circumstances.
Perhaps the judge will listen, then again maybe not.

oholly121

So just go to court and explain my case

wexie

oholly121 wrote: »

So just go to court and explain my case

It may not help you much, I'm not sure your excuses would be considered in any way valid but you'll need to go either way.

Out of interest though, would no seatbelt not just be a fine and points? Why would there be a summons?

MRG77

There is no case to explain. You were driving your car on the road, you weren't wearing your seatbelt. Just go to court, pay your fine, and learn from it.

Kettleson

Think of it logically. Here's the scenario.

2 Garda arrive at your door looking for your wife to tell her that you have been seriously injured in a car crash. It appears that you were involved in a collision with a drunk driver, just a mile from home. You are critical and your chances of recovery are slim due to the fact that you were not wearing a safety belt.

You may not appreciate it, but the Garda are doing you a valuable favour.

oholly121

MRG77 wrote: »

There is no case to explain. You were driving your car on the road, you weren't wearing your seatbelt. Just go to court, pay your fine, and learn from it.

Would the circumstances not be taken into consideration?

bumper234

oholly121 wrote: »

Would the circumstances not be taken into consideration?

No excuses, you broke the law end of story.

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

Would the circumstances not be taken into consideration?

In my opinion, they might be listened to out of due procedure, but not a chance of getting you off. You may well irritate the Judge into the bargain.

oholly121

bumper234 wrote: »

No excuses, you broke the law end of story.

That's a bit harsh mate I wasn't even speeding?

oholly121

Kettleson wrote: »

In my opinion, they might be listened to out of due procedure, but not a chance of getting you off. You may well irritate the Judge into the bargain.

So what's going to happen to me punishment wise?

Gosub

oholly121 wrote: »

Would the circumstances not be taken into consideration?

With all due respect, what circumstances? You were distracted and forgot to put your belt on? If you were that distracted you shouldn't have been behind the wheel at all. Call it lucky it's not careless driving as well and pay the fine.

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

So what's going to happen to me punishment wise?

I'm guessing, 2 points and an €100 fine?

bumper234

oholly121 wrote: »

That's a bit harsh mate I wasn't even speeding?

If i was drunk and caught driving would i be able to say to the judge "I wasn't even speeding"

oholly121

Gosub wrote: »

With all due respect, what circumstances? You were distracted and forgot to put your belt on? If you were that distracted you shouldn't have been behind the wheel at all. Call it lucky it's not careless driving as well and pay the fine.

Ok cheers for your advise

F1ngers

oholly121 wrote: »

So I jumped into my car and left off forgetting to put on my seat belt... about a mile down the road the garda came up from the side of me and saw I had no seat belt they pulled me over

I've deleted the irrelevant stuff - makes everything so much clearer.

Ken.

From my link above.
Offences carry a fixed-charge fine of €60. You must pay this fine within 28 days, or face an increased fine of €90 payable within 56 days of the offence. Two penalty points will be added to your licence if you opt not to go to court. If you are convicted in court for not wearing a seatbelt, four penalty points will be added to your licence and you will be liable to an €2,000 fine.

Did you receive a fine and not pay it. If their taking you to court your in big trouble.

oholly121

bumper234 wrote: »

If i was drunk and caught driving would i be able to say to the judge "I wasn't even speeding"

Mate there's a massive difference between drink driving and not wearing a seat belt do you not think!!?

oholly121

ken wrote: »

From my link above.
Offences carry a fixed-charge fine of €60. You must pay this fine within 28 days, or face an increased fine of €90 payable within 56 days of the offence. Two penalty points will be added to your licence if you opt not to go to court. If you are convicted in court for not wearing a seatbelt, four penalty points will be added to your licence and you will be liable to an €2,000 fine.

Did you receive a fine and not pay it. If their taking you to court your in big trouble.

I was told to appeal it and await the outcome so I wrote to the supt but he never wrote back to me so yes the 56 days passed I assumed that these days where included in an appeals process I was obviously wrong it's not like I got the fine and ignored it I appealed this to the supt would this also be looked at?

Bucklesman

You're a danger to yourself and others in either case. Just take it as a learning.

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

I was told to appeal it and await the outcome so I wrote to the supt but he never wrote back to me so yes the 56 days passed I assumed that these days where included in an appeals process I was obviously wrong it's not like I got the fine and ignored it I appealed this to the supt would this also be looked at?

You'd be better talking to a Solicitor asap.

oholly121

Kettleson wrote: »

You'd be better talking to a Solicitor asap.

Really a solicitor for not wearing my seat belt?

Greenmachine

oholly121 wrote: »

I was told to appeal it and await the outcome so I wrote to the supt but he never wrote back to me so yes the 56 days passed I assumed that these days where included in an appeals process I was obviously wrong it's not like I got the fine and ignored it I appealed this to the supt would this also be looked at?

Were you proactive at all in following up with the superintendent besides simply writing a letter.

oholly121

I'm very shocked here from some of the responses

Yes I forgot to wear my seat belt and yes it's against the law but in fairness I really don't think this particular situation and circumstances warrant this response you would swear I had 22 pints got into my car and killed an infant!!!!
I needed to get medication in an emergency situation and forgot my belt? If I was speeding to the pharmacy I don't think people here woul be less judgemental in fact there are loads of posts with worse off situations and more sympathetic people comment on them I have obviously logged into the garda boards lol

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

Really a solicitor for not wearing my seat belt?

Yes, look at the advice that Ken has given. You might well be in deeper than you thought.

oholly121

Greenmachine wrote: »

Were you proactive at all in following up with the superintendent besides simply writing a letter.

I really didn't want to be hassling a supt as I'm sure you would understand!?

Molester Stallone

oholly121 wrote: »

Really a solicitor for not wearing my seat belt?

How many times do you need to be told? Try that line with the judge & see how far it gets you

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

I really didn't want to be hassling a supt as I'm sure you would understand!?

@OHolly121....are you being serious? Please let us know how you got on.

Kettleson

oholly121 wrote: »

I'm very shocked here from some of the responses

Yes I forgot to wear my seat belt and yes it's against the law but in fairness I really don't think this particular situation and circumstances warrant this response you would swear I had 22 pints got into my car and killed an infant!!!!
I needed to get medication in an emergency situation and forgot my belt? If I was speeding to the pharmacy I don't think people here woul be less judgemental in fact there are loads of posts with worse off situations and more sympathetic people comment on them I have obviously logged into the garda boards lol

Then you'd better prepare for being a bit more shocked. Take the advice, get a solicitor.

oholly121

Molester Stallone wrote: »

How many times do you need to be told? Try that line with the judge & see how far it gets you

I won't "try a line" with a judge but I'm under the impression that court is fair transparent and equitable? I get my say in there yes!!
So according to you and basically everyone here they want even listen to me and slap a fine and points on me?
Why so I need a solicitor to explain my side of a story in court?

wexie

oholly121 wrote: »

Really a solicitor for not wearing my seat belt?

But it's no longer just about the seatbelt, it's also about not having paid the fine during the period you were given to do it in. The letters with the fines are pretty clear, pay up or we'll be seeing you in court.

timmy4u2

oholly121 wrote: »

I was told to appeal it and await the outcome so I wrote to the supt but he never wrote back to me so yes the 56 days passed I assumed that these days where included in an appeals process I was obviously wrong it's not like I got the fine and ignored it I appealed this to the supt would this also be looked at?

In those circumstances phone the Supts clerk in the morning and seek an appointment with the Supt. Bring a copy of the letter with you.
He will have a correspondence register showing when the letter was received.

What ever about the merits or lack of merit of your original argument you should have been replied to in a time frame that allowed you to avail of the 2 point option.

oholly121

wexie wrote: »

But it's no longer just about the seatbelt, it's also about not having paid the fine during the period you were given to do it in. The letters with the fines are pretty clear, pay up or we'll be seeing you in court.

But if its in appeal with the supt as in I do t agree with this fine so I appeal it and based on the outcome if the supt doesn't find in my favour I pay the fine and take the points but in this case nothing happened just a summons came to my house if the super wrote bac and said look I appreciate circumstances etc I'd have paid the fine end of but I heard nothing and then bang summons!!!!?

Gosub

oholly121 wrote: »

I won't "try a line" with a judge but I'm under the impression that court is fair transparent and equitable? I get my say in there yes!!
So according to you and basically everyone here they want even listen to me and slap a fine and points on me?
Why so I need a solicitor to explain my side of a story in court?

It's not a case of whether the judge will listen to you, all you can say is that you weren't wearing your belt. No excuses will be entertained. Guilty.

Your main problem now is that the judge might get pissed off that you think you have a special case when you don't. The solicitor will know how to handle the situation and save you from yourself.

No-one's trying to be smart here. You seem to think that we're all wrong and you're right. Good luck trying that with the judge.

oholly121

timmy4u2 wrote: »

In those circumstances phone the Supts clerk in the morning and seek an appointment with the Supt. Bring a copy of the letter with you.
He will have a correspondence register showing when the letter was received.

What ever about the merits or lack of merit of your original argument you should have been replied to in a time frame that allowed you to avail of the 2 point option.

Exactly that's my point no pun intended lol!!!!?

oholly121

Gosub wrote: »

It's not a case of whether the judge will listen to you, all you can say is that you weren't wearing your belt. No excuses will be entertained. Guilty.

Your main problem now is that the judge might get pissed off that you think you have a special case when you don't. The solicitor will know how to handle the situation and save you from yourself.

No-one's trying to be smart here. You seem to think that we're all wrong and you're right. Good luck trying that with the judge.

I really do t think that everyone is wrong you have me all wrong in fact I agree my problem is 2 fold 1 The super should have wrote to me and said no I don't agree I pay the fine end of second I really don't think this particular circumstances warrant this reply from some members

wexie

oholly121 wrote: »

But if its in appeal with the supt as in I do t agree with this fine so I appeal it and based on the outcome if the supt doesn't find in my favour I pay the fine and take the points but in this case nothing happened just a summons came to my house if the super wrote bac and said look I appreciate circumstances etc I'd have paid the fine end of but I heard nothing and then bang summons!!!!?

But is it in appeal with the supt? Have you received anything from them at all, even just to acknowledge receiving your letter in the first place?

If I were you I'd start with checking they have and then seeing what they recommend, what if they didn't receive your letter, or it got stuck behind someone's desk....

oholly121

wexie wrote: »

But is it in appeal with the supt? Have you received anything from them at all, even just to acknowledge receiving your letter in the first place?

If I were you I'd start with checking they have and then seeing what they recommend, what if they didn't receive your letter, or it got stuck behind someone's desk....

Is that my problem though o dropped it directly into my local station and tried to engage with them it's not like I didn't pay my fine at all or give any explanation I wrote to the supt and never got a reply?

wexie

oholly121 wrote: »

Is that my problem though o dropped it directly into my local station and tried to engage with them it's not like I didn't pay my fine at all or give any explanation I wrote to the supt and never got a reply?

It is if you can't prove it, or if there is no record of it?

Kettleson

If I was the Judge, I might be tempted to give you a few days in the Joy.

No Pants

oholly121 wrote: »

That's a bit harsh mate I wasn't even speeding?

There are more than just speeding laws. Your best bet is to go to court and point out to the judge the clause in the law that excludes you from wearing a seat belt when your wife is sick and/or when you're distracted. He'll then dismiss the charge with the courts apology.

Paulw

oholly121 wrote: »

I won't "try a line" with a judge but I'm under the impression that court is fair transparent and equitable? I get my say in there yes!!
So according to you and basically everyone here they want even listen to me and slap a fine and points on me?
Why so I need a solicitor to explain my side of a story in court?

The judge is there to enforce the law as it is written. From your postings, and from the law, you are not exempt from wearing a seatbelt. Clear cut case.

You were tired, not paying attention, only driving down the road a little, not driving fast, your wife was ill, etc, etc, etc ..... the judge has heard it all before.

Sorry, but I can't see any reason for the judge to let you off. A solicitor, who is familiar with the court and the law may (just may) be able to help lessen any fine or punishment the judge gives out.

It is up to you though. You have had plenty of information and advice in here.

BanzaiBk

For your own benefit OP I think a trip to your local district court to observe the rationale and demenour of the judge and how s/he applies the law would help you understand posters reactions here and help you better understand the situation you are in. The judge is going to be more interested in why you didn't pay the fine, not a complicated back story tbh.

wexie

BanzaiBk wrote: »

For your own benefit OP I think a trip to your local district court to observe the rationale and demenour of the judge and how s/he applies the law would help you understand posters reactions here and help you better understand the situation you are in. The judge is going to be more interested in why you didn't pay the fine, not a complicated back story tbh.

Good advice,

for future reference, if this happens again, go into the station yourself, hand the letter to a person and pester them for a receipt or stamp, preferably on a copy of the letter. As it stands you have nothing to prove you did what you said you did.

It still wouldn't get you off but at least it might afford you the option of taking the 80 euro fine and 2 points rather than whatever the judge decides. Which (as above) could be worse.

timmy4u2

oholly121 wrote: »

I won't "try a line" with a judge but I'm under the impression that court is fair transparent and equitable? I get my say in there yes!!
So according to you and basically everyone here they want even listen to me and slap a fine and points on me?
Why so I need a solicitor to explain my side of a story in court?

Try the Supt 1st as he did not respond within a time that would allow you to make the decision to accept the fine and 2 penalty points.

Frankly I do not see what you need a solicitor for.
Its not as if you are disputing the law on the matter or quoting cases stated

If the Supt yet again does not respond and you finish up in court you should be quite capable of showing the Judge the letters (Register that second letter) and stating your willingness to pay the fine had the Supt sent a negative response to your request.

You can also go to court and apply for a Gary Doyle order of course if the Supt is not cooperating.

roadsmart

wexie wrote: »

Good advice,

for future reference, if this happens again, go into the station yourself, hand the letter to a person and pester them for a receipt or stamp, preferably on a copy of the letter. As it stands you have nothing to prove you did what you said you did.

It still wouldn't get you off but at least it might afford you the option of taking the 80 euro fine and 2 points rather than whatever the judge decides. Which (as above) could be worse.

Afaik writing to the local superintendent is not a form of appeal in any legal sense, and proof of having written to them will not be a defence. The OP should have paid his penalty regardless of having written to anyone.

well, lets face it, with the bad publicity the Superindents in the country are getting at the moment regarding cancelling tickets, id imagine the chances of them cancelling ANY tickets in the future are extremely slim.

they will probably just let the people tell the judge the excuse.

as regards the OP not getting an answer from the Super, id tell the judge,
( obviously making sure the Super got the letter first) maybe he might be lenient.

timmy4u2

roadsmart wrote: »

Afaik writing to the local superintendent is not a form of appeal in any legal sense, and proof of having written to them will not be a defence. The OP should have paid his penalty regardless of having written to anyone.

Of course he was entitled to apply to the Superintendent and he was entitled to receive a prompt reply irrespective of the merits(we are not arguing the merits)...the proof of writing to the Supt will of course be a credible issue as to his failure to pay the fine within the allotted time as he was awaiting a response in order tovdecide how to proceed

MagicMarker

OP, your reasons for appealing are ludicrous. You didn't wear a seatbelt, end of story, you should have paid the fine.

Pat Mustard

I've heard that "get on to the Super" line many times. I've never heard of it working. The Super is a public servant who is possibly looking forward to his retirement and his State pension in a few years. I doubt that he would bend the rules for some bloke even if he feels sorry for him.

I could be wrong, but I doubt that a Garda Superintendent would instruct a prosecuting Garda to request that the court strike out such a routine matter, without a very good reason.

I think that "get on to the Super" line is something that Gardai say to make their lives easier, as they take so much sh1te from the public anyway.

I think that the reality of the matter is that a summons has issued now, so the OP has to reckon with a court appearance at this stage.

People have advised the OP to get a solicitor, and while such advice could never be wrong, I think that many punters who have common sense and a realistic approach should be able to manage a guilty plea on a charge of not wearing a seat belt.