Owning a fraction of a farm

wesleysniper38

I recently inherited one fifth of a 17 acre farm which is in one block. The rest was left to my cousin for whom I hold no great love!
However, given that the fraction left to me isn't much good I am willing to sell it to him. However he is offering me well below the 'per acre' value of what I think it's worth and told me that his legal advice is I cannot sell the portion to anyone else but him.
I'm going to get an independent valuation and hopefully we'll agree on that.
Has anyone else found themselves in such a ridiculous situation?

Base price

By any chance does this parcel have any road frontage?

moy83

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I recently inherited one fifth of a 17 acre farm which is in one block. The rest was left to my cousin for whom I hold no great love!
However, given that the fraction left to me isn't much good I am willing to sell it to him. However he is offering me well below the 'per acre' value of what I think it's worth and told me that his legal advice is I cannot sell the portion to anyone else but him.
I'm going to get an independent valuation and hopefully we'll agree on that.
Has anyone else found themselves in such a ridiculous situation?

Find out if its true that you can only sell to him . Im sure at least you can rent it to someone else if the selling price isnt good enough from him .

Conmaicne Mara

Well now if you really don't like him, members of the travelling persuasion are always looking for horse grazing.

Farmer Pudsey

Did you inherit one fifth or part of the 17 acres. This would be very unusual. I get a different legal opinion. Get the will to your solicitor for a legal opinion. Your cousin may not relise but this is as much of an issue for him as you. If both you names are on the land he cannot use it to draw any payments without your signiture. It is amazing a solicitor did not advise the benefactor of the issue involved.

Offer you cousin 4 time what he is offering you for his share.

brian_t

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I'm going to get an independent valuation and hopefully we'll agree on that.

Finding out your exact legal position is the first thing you need to do.

Use your own solicitor for this or get one other then the one your cousin uses.

wesleysniper38

I am awaiting legal advice on this. My own solicitor didn't think I could sell the fifth to anyone other than the guy who owns the four fifths...
He has asked that the matter be given to a Senior Counsel who specialises in this area. However this guy charges 2k for his opinion...!:rolleyes:

I know what you guys are saying, I could be very awkard surely if I wanted to be but it's probably not worth the hassle in the long term.
A good valuation at the top rate would give me something to go back to this most unpleasant individual with..

Miname

Either you just get 1/5 or 3.4 acres fenced off and use it for a year or two and then sell that piece, when a clear boundary is set. If the 1/5 isnt clearly ddefined surely you could put the pressure on tha whole lot to be sold and you get your share. I think your cousin might be just chancing his arm.

Farmer Pudsey

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I am awaiting legal advice on this. My own solicitor didn't think I could sell the fifth to anyone other than the guy who owns the four fifths...
He has asked that the matter be given to a Senior Counsel who specialises in this area. However this guy charges 2k for his opinion...!:rolleyes:

I know what you guys are saying, I could be very awkard surely if I wanted to be but it's probably not worth the hassle in the long term.
A good valuation at the top rate would give me something to go back to this most unpleasant individual with..

Is his opinion worth 500 euro or maybe 1K. A dumb priest never got a parish. Tell the solicitor that it not worth that too you but........

wesleysniper38

I know, thats a ridiculous fee for an opinion, but the Lawyer reckons he's the best in the Country at this sort of thing and it would be money well spent...
I see his point all right if I end up getting 10k more than this fellow is willing to pay... he did say that 2k fee included VAT!
I'm going to chew on it over the w'end.

Local Auctioneer estimates the land to be worth about 8-9k per acre.
The cousin was talking about 20k to buy me out...

roadsmart

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I know, thats a ridiculous fee for an opinion, but the Lawyer reckons he's the best in the Country at this sort of thing and it would be money well spent...
I see his point all right if I end up getting 10k more than this fellow is willing to pay... he did say that 2k fee included VAT!
I'm going to chew on it over the w'end.

Local Auctioneer estimates the land to be worth about 8-9k per acre.
The cousin was talking about 20k to buy me out...

Why would you pay him? Deal directly, tell the cousin you want €32k, or 35, and bargain it out between you. If you get 27 that's your 8k an acre. No need to spend another 2.

Of course if your cousin is watching this thread...........

housetypeb

Can you clarify whether you were left 1/5 of the whole lot OR a field or section that amounts to 1/5.
There's a big difference between the two legally.
Although going by your posts it would seem to be the latter, your cousin telling you that you can't sell to anyone but him would seem to indicate that maybe your section is landlocked/needs to go through his land to reach it etc, and he would be the only bidder in any case.

have2flushtwice

if you inherited it, its a bonus, don't be spending 2k. it cost you nothing.

let the cousin come up to close to the worth value.

is the 1/5th defined, or is it at the edge near another landowner?
i'm sure there would be a neighbor interested also.
nothing like a bit of competition or loose talk to get the cousin in gear and dig deeper!!
bear in mind, the cousin might be on boards also!!!!
Theres another thread here where a guy is in the states and inherited a farm in Ireland. he weighing up the pros and cons of what to do. perhaps see if you can gain any ideas from that discussion.
good luck and don't fall out!

solerina

[QUOTE= and don't fall out![/QUOTE]


I think by the vibes that's the least if the OPs worries !!

arctictree

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

However this guy charges 2k for his opinion...!

This feckin country drives me mad. That rate is probably his free legal aid rate.

wesleysniper38

have2flushtwice wrote: »

if you inherited it, its a bonus, don't be spending 2k. it cost you nothing.

let the cousin come up to close to the worth value.

is the 1/5th defined, or is it at the edge near another landowner?
i'm sure there would be a neighbor interested also.
nothing like a bit of competition or loose talk to get the cousin in gear and dig deeper!!
bear in mind, the cousin might be on boards also!!!!
Theres another thread here where a guy is in the states and inherited a farm in Ireland. he weighing up the pros and cons of what to do. perhaps see if you can gain any ideas from that discussion.
good luck and don't fall out!

Its one fifth of the entire block.
The cousin was using it for years. It was willed late last year with 80/20 in his favour. I never farmed it and wont either as its too far away from my place.
The owner was an elderly relative who stayed with us briefly after a stay in hospital before she had to go into a nursing home. We are both Nephews. Him by name..

on the river

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

Its one fifth of the entire block.
The cousin was using it for years. It was willed late last year with 80/20 in his favour. I never farmed it and wont either as its too far away from my place.
The owner was an elderly relative who stayed with us briefly after a stay in hospital before she had to go into a nursing home. We are both Nephews. Him by name..

I think your best bet is to go back to your cousin and show him the actionners
reports and ask for a price based on them .

I try to avoid the legal route as it will be alot of expense plus their will more bad blood between ye.

It seems your relative made a very bizarre will . it is the person who made the will is to blame nobody else .

patjack

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

Its one fifth of the entire block.
The cousin was using it for years. It was willed late last year with 80/20 in his favour. I never farmed it and wont either as its too far away from my place.
The owner was an elderly relative who stayed with us briefly after a stay in hospital before she had to go into a nursing home. We are both Nephews. Him by name..

Who is your cousins solicitor? Is it the same solicitor that your Aunt used? If so then there are a lot of questions on the method of land division applied by the solicitor to your aunts will I'd be asking!!!!!

ravima

housetypeb wrote: »

Can you clarify whether you were left 1/5 of the whole lot OR a field or section that amounts to 1/5.
There's a big difference between the two legally.
Although going by your posts it would seem to be the latter, your cousin telling you that you can't sell to anyone but him would seem to indicate that maybe your section is landlocked/needs to go through his land to reach it etc, and he would be the only bidder in any case.

Yes - this is the issue - are you joint owners or tenants in common? In one, you own a specified portion, in the other you own that percentage, but no specific area. That's it in very simple English.

Therefore, if you own a specified part, then you can fence it off and tell cousin you will put it up for auction. if you own in common,then you can't do this, but he can't draw grants without your signature and you are probably entitled to 1/5 of the grants as well.

Mind you, you are responsible for the maintenance and insurance as well!

dar31

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I know, thats a ridiculous fee for an opinion, but the Lawyer reckons he's the best in the Country at this sort of thing and it would be money well spent...
I see his point all right if I end up getting 10k more than this fellow is willing to pay... he did say that 2k fee included VAT!
I'm going to chew on it over the w'end.

Local Auctioneer estimates the land to be worth about 8-9k per acre.
The cousin was talking about 20k to buy me out...

You want 30 k and the cousin offered 20k to my mind this is just opening negotiations, split the difference save on the legal fees still get along with the relations, if you really want the last bit out of it get him to cover the legal fees as well, still a decent few pound for bugger all

mayota

dar31 wrote: »

You want 30 k and the cousin offered 20k to my mind this is just opening negotiations, split the difference save on the legal fees still get along with the relations, if you really want the last bit out of it get him to cover the legal fees as well, still a decent few pound for bugger all

This.

wesleysniper38

dar31 wrote: »

You want 30 k and the cousin offered 20k to my mind this is just opening negotiations, split the difference save on the legal fees still get along with the relations, if you really want the last bit out of it get him to cover the legal fees as well, still a decent few pound for bugger all

It was left in common so there is no specific portion left to me.
I agree totally that the best way to sort this out is by agreement..
This will not be easy however, the person concerned is very put out by my getting the fifth.. and, as is usual in most of these situations, there are a few other issues simmering beneath the surface..!

freedominacup

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

It was left in common so there is no specific portion left to me.
I agree totally that the best way to sort this out is by agreement..
This will not be easy however, the person concerned is very put out by my getting the fifth.. and, as is usual in most of these situations, there are a few other issues simmering beneath the surface..!

I'm beginning to think whoever left it to ye didn't like either of ye very much.

wesleysniper38

Yes. a wise observer, who knew the Deceased, said she always knew how to launch a scud...!

I'll keep ye's updated on this one next week

bbam

Why not just pocket the €20k and walk away stress free.
**** it, life's too short and it's €20k for nothing that you can put to use on your own land or bank it for a rainy day.

housetypeb

This thread might be better off in the legal forum,but it raises some interesting what-ifs.
Surely your 1/5 share gives you a say in how the farm is run, can your cousin decide to-for example-use it for tillage without running it by you first? What happens if you say no to every proposal?
It seems strange that you were told that you can sell your share-but only to your cousin? He might be the most motivated and only bidder,but that's not guaranteed either.
Your 1/5 share is a saleable commodity and while no local farmer would probably want to get involved, somebody might take a punt if the price was right.
Giving the circumstances,there is always going to be bad blood between you and your cousin.

milkprofit

wesleysniper38 wrote: »

I recently inherited one fifth of a 17 acre farm which is in one block. The rest was left to my cousin for whom I hold no great love!
However, given that the fraction left to me isn't much good I am willing to sell it to him. However he is offering me well below the 'per acre' value of what I think it's worth and told me that his legal advice is I cannot sell the portion to anyone else but him.
I'm going to get an independent valuation and hopefully we'll agree on that.
Has anyone else found themselves in such a ridiculous situation?

use IFA free solicitor service

Conmaicne Mara

housetypeb wrote: »

This thread might be better off in the legal forum,but it raises some interesting what-ifs.
Surely your 1/5 share gives you a say in how the farm is run, can your cousin decide to-for example-use it for tillage without running it by you first? What happens if you say no to every proposal?
It seems strange that you were told that you can sell your share-but only to your cousin? He might be the most motivated and only bidder,but that's not guaranteed either.
Your 1/5 share is a saleable commodity and while no local farmer would probably want to get involved, somebody might take a punt if the price was right.
Giving the circumstances,there is always going to be bad blood between you and your cousin.

You won't get legal advice in the legal forum, think it's against their charter, or was anyway.

Lambofdave

milkprofit wrote: »

use IFA free solicitor service

That service is a disgrace, and when i brought it up with the previous president of the IFA he made it clear he wasn't bothered about our complaint

handlemaster

you both will be raped by the solicitors and rub your heads after and say how did that happen ?

handlemaster

you both will be raped by the solicitors and rub your heads after and say how did that happen ?

wesleysniper38

Opinions are most welcome but, don't worry, I am in no way seeking legal advice here!

milkprofit

Lambofdave wrote: »

That service is a disgrace, and when i brought it up with the previous president of the IFA he made it clear he wasn't bothered about our complaint

I have used them a number of times and found them very helpful