garda whistleblowers. heros or just disgruntled employees??

bajer101

bajer101 wrote: »

@Bubblypop. If we get back to the questions in your original post, I think you will find that most people do support the two whistle blowers. You might have conversations over coffee with your colleagues that disagree with this assessment, and you might instinctively not like what they have done. But I think you will just have to accept that the public support them and you and your colleagues should act accordingly. You could probably start by inviting Maurice out to the bowling this weekend.

http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/01/30/garda-whistle-blower-not-invited-out-with-the-lads-from-work-this-weekend/

oh sweet baby cheeses, if people didnt invite him along then clearly they dont like him, and dont like spending time with him. so are you suggesting that all gardai in the country should invite their collegues that they dont get on with on their nights out????

how many people that you dont like do you bring out on a night on the piss with you??

WoollyRedHat

bubblypop wrote: »

well im certainly not the commisioner or minister for justice, so why would i discredit someone if they were genuiely showing up some terrible injustice????

do you not think that members of AGS would welcome bad practise being shown for what it is?

Em no, if they're part of the system and it's part of the system, they wouldn't welcome it at all.

WoollyRedHat

WoollyRedHat wrote: »

Em no, if they're part of the system and it's part of the system, they wouldn't welcome it at all.

Don't be ridiculous, if gardai r out 24hours a day trying to do their job, they would obviously welcome anything standing in their way

bajer101

bubblypop wrote: »

oh sweet baby cheeses, if people didnt invite him along then clearly they dont like him, and dont like spending time with him. so are you suggesting that all gardai in the country should invite their collegues that they dont get on with on their nights out????

how many people that you dont like do you bring out on a night on the piss with you??

http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/01/30/garda-whistle-blower-not-invited-out-with-the-lads-from-work-this-weekend/

:-) Where do I start? You do realise that this was a satirical article? You actually have powers of arrest? Am I to understand that you go on duty and can deprive people of their liberty based on your understanding of the law?

Mods, I've racketed up a fair few warnings over the last couple of weeks responding to gobsh!tes. But this one takes the biscuit and I will gladly be permanently banned for what I am about to say.

You are a ****ing idiot. You have the cheek to start a thread questioning the integrity, motives, morals, and intelligence of John Wilson and Maurice McCabe when you don't even possess the basic cop on to realise that the article I posted was a satirical piece! I am actually sitting here flabbergasted and I am still trying to get to grips with the realisation that I could step outside my front door and could be greeted by you and that you would actually have the power to arrest me and put me in a jail cell!

It has taken me over an hour to type those few sentences because I just can't get my head around it. You started this thread questioning John Wilson and Maurice McCabe? I think the mods should make this thread a sticky.


Mod: Banned.

flynnlives

You have to wonder about a police force which never investigated and uncovered any of the countless scandals to hit this country in the past 25 years. NOT ONE SINGLE SCANDAL! ZERO!

Not a single scandal involving elements of the establishment in this country was uncovered by An Gardai.

I think Irish people should thing about that for awhile. Let it into your thought process and dwell on for a few days.

bajer101

bajer101 wrote: »

http://waterfordwhispersnews.com/2014/01/30/garda-whistle-blower-not-invited-out-with-the-lads-from-work-this-weekend/

:-) Where do I start? You do realise that this was a satirical article? You actually have powers of arrest? Am I to understand that you go on duty and can deprive people of their liberty based on your understanding of the law?

Mods, I've racketed up a fair few warnings over the last couple of weeks responding to gobsh!tes. But this one takes the biscuit and I will gladly be permanently banned for what I am about to say.

You are a ****ing idiot. You have the cheek to start a thread questioning the integrity, motives, morals, and intelligence of John Wilson and Maurice McCabe when you don't even possess the basic cop on to realise that the article I posted was a satirical piece! I am actually sitting here flabbergasted and I am still trying to get to grips with the realisation that I could step outside my front door and could be greeted by you and that you would actually have the power to arrest me and put me in a jail cell!

It has taken me over an hour to type those few sentences because I just can't get my head around it. You started this thread questioning John Wilson and Maurice McCabe? I think the mods should make this thread a sticky.

Er? Clearly I didn't read it!

KERSPLAT!

bubblypop wrote: »

Er? Clearly I didn't read it!

Clearly you should have before responding to it...

steddyeddy

You're asking if I think people who report potential crimes are a bad thing? Stupid question.

Santa Cruz

bubblypop wrote: »

lets face it, they seem a bit mad, no?????

i wasnt allowed out of station because i had a beard, that isnt allowed, so i thought id get my own back on the local chief superintendent.
i got in trouble in dublin because i shot a gun, from inside a car, straight across the drivers face through a window!!

the other one, i tape record everyone i speak to!!!!
paranoid much??????

and, if im not mistaken, both these guys have accessed peoples private information on the pulse system. against Data Protection no?

from interviews i've heard, they're a right pair of weirdos!!

why would the country believe they are great fellows??

There's only one way to find out. A proper independent public enquiry where they and anyone else (including journalists) can have their allegations examined. It will probably end up finding that some of their allegations will stand up and others are as a result of some disgruntlement. If they have had disciplinary problems that will all be revealed. At least the truth will be out. This entire issue would not have arisen if proper procedures were in place for the investigation of allegations by Gardaí and others.

As regards the GSOC I don't think GSOC management will come out smelling of roses.

Santa Cruz

bubblypop wrote: »

We don't know that the judge wouldn't have given him bail in this case even if he did know he was already on bail.
There are a huge amount of offenders that commit crimes while on bail.
Its not fair but that is the judges decision.

In this particular case, yes, the judge should've been aware of all the details but it still does not mean he wouldn't have got bail.

Have to agree with that. judges are not interested in other bail cases. Their attitude is " innocent until proven guilty" Was he honouring the bail terms of the other cases? If he was then bail would be given. If refused the High Court would grant it. The Gardaí have to satisfy the court that he is a flight risk.
That is the facts as happen in the courts every day of the week. Ridiculous I know. We also had the case in Ballygar where a local women was murdered by a man on temporary release from the prison.

Femme_Fatale

I'm well past teenage "Fight tha powah!" stuff and I still say a big well done to those lads. Lots of institutional wrongs are only imagined (e.g. in the minds of those Freeman idiots) but there are still unfortunately genuine wrongs at an organisational/institutional level - and fair play to those who are brave enough to speak out.

wicklowstevo

"As Gardai and law and order types are so oft to say when the latest new power is granted to the Guards, "if you've nothing to hide, you've nothing to fear". If you do your job properly and above board, you've nothing to fear from GSOC."


tell that to the two garda who were dragged before the courts in cork for just doing their job and then left with a big legal bill for defending themselfs

Sir Humphrey Appleby

wicklowstevo wrote: »

"As Gardai and law and order types are so oft to say when the latest new power is granted to the Guards, "if you've nothing to hide, you've nothing to fear". If you do your job properly and above board, you've nothing to fear from GSOC."


tell that to the two garda who were dragged before the courts in cork for just doing their job and then left with a big legal bill for defending themselfs

They got the same treatment as any other citizen, time the Guards realized they are not two steps above the rest of us and there job is to enforce and obey the law, not make it up as they go along!

wicklowstevo

Sir Humphrey Appleby wrote: »

They got the same treatment as any other citizen, time the Guards realized they are not two steps above the rest of us and there job is to enforce and obey the law, not make it up as they go along!

how do you figure ? they were brought to court with out any evidence of wrong doing , which became clear as soon as the trial started which is why it was thrown out , wasn't that very clear ??

Sir Humphrey Appleby

wicklowstevo wrote: »

how do you figure ? they were brought to court with out any evidence of wrong doing , which became clear as soon as the trial started which is why it was thrown out , wasn't that very clear ??

They were prosecuted, the case was withdrawn, same as any other citizen they paid for their own defence team, all's well.

Fact is our police force is a disgrace, it is institutionally corrupt, and led by an incompetent buffoon. Judge Smitwick was certainly correct when he said that the Gardaí valued loyalty to the force far above loyalty to the truth.
One can only hope that the family of a woman murdered because of the inaction of our corrupt and incompetent police force succeed in their case against the Gardaí and the state.

wicklowstevo

why was the case withdrawn ? corruption or because there was no evidence ? how many people pay for their own defense in courts ? i know one guy who owned two houses and a garage while driving a 40000 euro merc and still got free legal aid. No the fact is they were overly aggressively prosecuted by a incompetent organisation (GSOC) with an unaccountable grudge and were rightly blown out of the water for it

im not going to get into the rest of that stuff, its been done to death already and if you arent willing to see whats going on i am not going to waste me time on that merry go round

baldbear

Fair play to those 2 whistleblowers. It would of been alot easier to keep quiet and not ruin their careers. Too many people don't speak up in Ireland when they witness wrongdoing. Callinan and Shatter are a disgrace.

Passing on private information about Mick The tax cheat about his on the phone episode and trying to use it against him on tv proved this.

Sir Humphrey Appleby

wicklowstevo wrote: »

im not going to get into the rest of that stuff, its been done to death already and if you arent willing to see whats going on i am not going to waste me time on that merry go round

Yeah, run!
The truth is a woman is dead and AGS are responsible for allowing her murder to occur and for covering up their actions.
Nothing new there, as Judge Smitwick so eloquently put it, loyalty to the force is more important in the Gardaí than loyalty to the truth.
Donegal was the tip of the iceberg, what must surely follow will have to lead to high level resignations and to professional police officers being brought in from reputable police forces abroad to take over the control and management of AGS.

wicklowstevo

Sir Humphrey Appleby wrote: »

Yeah, run!
The truth is a woman is dead and AGS are responsible for allowing her murder to occur and for covering up their actions.
Nothing new there, as Judge Smitwick so eloquently put it, loyalty to the force is more important in the Gardaí than loyalty to the truth.
Donegal was the tip of the iceberg, what must surely follow will have to lead to high level resignations and to professional police officers being brought in from reputable police forces abroad to take over the control and management of AGS.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
any one else see what i mean ? talking with out knowing half the facts . the bail laws are shocking in this county the whole justice system really , but sure you fire away at the easiest target you can get

Sir Humphrey Appleby

wicklowstevo wrote: »

:rolleyes::rolleyes:
any one else see what i mean ? talking with out knowing half the facts . the bail laws are shocking in this county the whole justice system really , but sure you fire away at the easiest target you can get

Easy to get bail when your mates in AGS decide not to tell the Judge in your child abduction case that you were already on bail for a serious assault when you were arrested for this crime.
Leaves you free to commit murder while your mate in AGS engage in a hasty cover up.
Loyalty to the force above loyalty to the truth.

Mary Lynch on Newstalk reveals how Garda incompetence or corruption allowed Sylvia Roche Kelly to be murdered, and how Gardaí illegally destroyed her original statement to protect themselves.
http://newstalk.ie/player/shows/The_Pat_Kenny_Show/45967/garda_whistleblowing_mary_lynch_tells_her_story
No doubt Callinan will dismiss her as disgusting as well!

wicklowstevo

so Jerry McGraths had personal contacts in the gardai in both limerick and cavan that conspired together with a district court judge and high court judge to get him bail in order to murder a woman ? and then later got him a life term for murder . that is what you believe ? really ?

jobeenfitz

I believe that the Garda Commissioner should have to justify his remarks about the whistleblowers, calling their actions "quite disgusting". If he has legitimate reasons for this then surely he should be asked to elaborate. Now maybe their acts are disgusting? If on the other hand he has accused them wrongly then he may not be fit for his job? Has nobody questioned him on this matter yet?

Hootanany

He might have been on their payroll

Strawberry Swan

It's seems to be typical in Ireland, and probably elsewhere, that when a person blows the whistle on wrongdoing, their character is attacked rather than the actions they speak out about. When Sheena McMahon spoke out against the corruption in the Donegal gardai one of whom was her ex-husband, rumours were spread that she had personal issues and was only doing it to get back at her estranged husband. Tony Spollen, the AIB internal auditor who found millions of pounds hidden in off-shore accounts, was described as doing back-of-the-envelope accounts. The two gradai being discussed in this thread seem to be no exception in this regard and I admire them for speaking out when they must have known how badly whistleblowers are treated within their profession.

My name is URL

garda whistleblowers. heros or just disgruntled employees??

How depressing is it that such a question needs to be asked?

K-9

When you hear of the contempt whistle blowers are treated with through out Government agencies, not just Gardai, the HSE, charites, and then think of the culture of contempt for touting, whether it be the IRA or telling Social Welfare of fraud, there are times I wonder about the basic honesty and sense of doing the right thing in this country.

And then people wonder why politicians are like they are. They are represntative of the people who elect them. Whistle blowing is an extremely brave thing to do, the OP in this thread engaging in the usual whistleblower shaming that goes on. Their good name and character brought into disrepute.

All I can say is, shame on you, shame on you. They are heroes without a doubt in my eyes, those purposefully seeking to blacken their names are cowards of the highest order.

Floppybits

I see the garda behaviour to the whistleblowers is back in the news again, with a garda admitting there was a campaign to destroy the whistleblower. Kenny is circling the wagons on this by kicking by trying to kick it down the road.

http://www.thejournal.ie/garda-whistleblowers-3-3010684-Oct2016/