Are horses on a hunt allowed on my land to hunt?

pf85

Last weekend there was a hunt with hounds which came across my land with around 20 people following on foot, they were chasing wild hares. They were not from my area, in fact most of them were from England. They proceeded to tell me that they were coming back next weekend with horses to follow the hunt to which I told them not to be entering any of my land as it is in too bad condition for me to let my own cattle graze never mind two dozen horses galloping through them.

What is the legal point of view on this subject?

I have told them in person they are not welcome and I think I will put up private property no trespassing signs but where do I stand?

Thanks

Stationmaster

Any hunts that happen around here (in Clare) definitely ask all landowners for permission first. I'm really surprised to hear that happened you. I would presume once you tell them they can't come onto to your land that that's it?

Mycroft H

pf85 wrote: »

What is the legal point of view on this subject?

I have told them in person they are not welcome and I think I will put up private property no trespassing signs but where do I stand?

Thanks

It's your land, they have no permission or presumed or otherwise to enter it unless you let them. They should know that.

ganmo

Inform the local guards that you will take 'measures' to keep them from entering your land.
If the guard doesn't turn up to stop you he isn't doing his job in keeping the peace.

pf85

Sorry I should have also said I'm in County Armagh

They have been warned not to come back with horses but I'm not sure that they will adhere to this seeing as they are over specifically for hunting around my town land

ganmo

http://www.psni.police.uk/wildlifeandthelaw.pdf
page 13 & 17

whitebriar

I go on the premise that being on private property without permission is trespass, put up your signs stating trespassers will be prosecuted and your 'lands preserved' signs meaning hunting not allowed.

By coming over, do you mean are they from GB?
(Edit I see they are from GB)

Regardless , in no uncertain terms,get onto the master of that hunt immediately with the bill for damage caused etc (land poaching) and send solicitors letter.
Unacceptable.

Please post back with an update.

whitebriar

ganmo wrote: »

http://www.psni.police.uk/wildlifeandthelaw.pdf
page 13 & 17

Excellent.
From that link,page 17 :

"
The law imposes many restrictions on when and where you can hunt. You must obtain permission from the person holding the right to hunt on the land in question, whether your quarry is game, deer or rabbits. In some cases it will be the owner or occupier of the land who has the right to authorise hunting. For many forms of hunting you must also have a game licence and valid certificates are always necessary for any firearms involved. Taking any animals or birds without the necessary permission and licences is a crime. Trespassing in search of game is also a crime, as is most hunting at night, and severe penalties can be imposed on offenders, especially those carrying firearms."

pf85

Thanks for the quick replies and also for providing the PSNI wildlife law document it has been a great help

I will get definitely put the signs up before the weekend and also put locks on as many gates as possible just to ensure they don't try pull the old 'the gates were open' so we continued to follow the dogs.

Base price

A few "No Hunting" signs hanging on the gates would also be a good idea. Local farmer around here paints on the lids from mineral lick buckets and wires them to the gates.

whitebriar

pf85 wrote: »

Thanks for the quick replies and also for providing the PSNI wildlife law document it has been a great help

I will get definitely put the signs up before the weekend and also put locks on as many gates as possible just to ensure they don't try pull the old 'the gates were open' so we continued to follow the dogs.

If they break those locks,that's not only trespass, it's criminal damage and breaking and entering.

td5man

pf85 wrote: »

Thanks for the quick replies and also for providing the PSNI wildlife law document it has been a great help

I will get definitely put the signs up before the weekend and also put locks on as many gates as possible just to ensure they don't try pull the old 'the gates were open' so we continued to follow the dogs.

Somebody should follow the hounds on foot to keep them under control, but the horses dont have to follow the hounds.

pf85

td5man wrote: »

Somebody should follow the hounds on foot to keep them under control, but the horses dont have to follow the hounds.

Yes I would agree with this

There are hunts up my area almost every Sunday but there is only ever a handful of people following the hounds on foot with no horses which I am happy with

larrymiller

The hunt is definitely after taking years off my life, the "h" word is not allowed in my house!

TheFarrier

Every hunt I've been involved with has a local member seek permission from landowners prior to the meet. It is then his responsibility to ensure the hunt doesn't cross into land they have no permision to enter.

If you can find out which pack of hounds is due to meet in your area, a quick call to the masters or secretary stating that your land is not to be crossed should be enough. You could also request that you be informed prior to any future meets in your area.

yellow50HX

Don't let the f**kers bully you, if they want to hunt tell them to use their own land. Find out from your neighbours if they are going to let them in to their land. Find out who the master of the hunt is and get it from him/her in writing that they won't be be going onto your land. Don't expect the BS about them not knowing the boundaries or just getting the hounds. If they want to enter your land to get their dogs tell them that only one person on foot can go in for them.

TheFarrier

Seems to me that a lot of people on here have had bad experiences with hunts in the past.
Or else the perception of snobs on horses persists.

The vast majority of hunting people are normal joe soaps with a passion for horses and/or hounds.

I'd be willing to bet that farmers or farming stock make up a large part of the members of every hunt in the country. ( 50+% of my crowd are of farming backgrounds, myself included)

Sorry about the long winded derailment of the thread, but I feel hunting people are getting a not-altogether-deserved bad reputation around here. I know some hunts have and do cause trouble, but please believe me when I say it's a small minority.

jimini0

I'm all for the hunts I love watching it. Here a few involved in the hunt are local and know the farmers. they go around a few weeks in advance and call to every farmer enroute. They ASK permission before setting foot on a persons land. Then they walk it to check for routes and possible troubles (wet land, possibility of damaging property). Then they go back to the farmer and ask for permission to bring dogs and horses through. Most farmers give them permission to bring horses and dogs but some say no and others say dogs and one horse only. They respect every farmers decission. I have let them tru our land we have some open drains that the love jumping. They muck it up a bit but if they see its getting too mucky they stop letting more horses tru.
Not everyone is against the hunt but they must have respect for the land and farmer.

TheFarrier

jimini0 wrote: »

.
Not everyone is against the hunt but they must have respect for the land and farmer.

Agreed wholeheartedly, any hunt that doesn't respect the farmers may just fold, as without the goodwill of farmers hunting on horseback would be impossible.

Btw, the small number of packs that have little or no regard for the farmers are despised by the rest of the hunting community too, not just the landowners they piss off.

yellow50HX

Tell them to go to fairy house or punchestown plenty of fences there to jump over and no farmland to make crap of.

Livestockmad

ganmo wrote: »

Inform the local guards that you will take 'measures' to keep them from entering your land.
If the guard doesn't turn up to stop you he isn't doing his job in keeping the peace.

Your right there.. stand at the gate and say that once they leave the road they are trespassing and breaking the law.. ring guards beforehand too.. I had this problem years ago.. I hate the hunt since. They think that they have the right to go where they want!!

Livestockmad

TheFarrier wrote: »

Seems to me that a lot of people on here have had bad experiences with hunts in the past.
Or else the perception of snobs on horses persists.

The vast majority of hunting people are normal joe soaps with a passion for horses and/or hounds./quote]

If their from farming background why dont they f**k off and use their own land instead of crossing land without permission? ?

Livestockmad

ganmo wrote: »

Inform the local guards that you will take 'measures' to keep them from entering your land.
If the guard doesn't turn up to stop you he isn't doing his job in keeping the peace.

Your right there.. stand at the gate and say that once they leave the road they are trespassing and breaking the law.. ring guards beforehand too.. I had this problem years ago.. I hate the hunt since. They think that they have the right to go where they want!!

TopCon

I too have had a couple of rather unfortunate encounters with 'the hunt'.

Damage to fences, by damage I mean intentionally cutting wire etc. Trampling of ground and worst of all upset livestock.

The most ignorant shower of .... That I have ever met. DO NOT believe the b.s. people spout 'oh they're all farmers, repair fences, ask for permission etc etc'

they stay away from me now.

Do not allow them to bully you. If dogs upset/hurt your livestock they are out of control and you should be free to protect your stock using necessary force. They know that and believe me it upsets em too...

But if you can at all, try to resolve difficulties by peaceful means as others have mentioned. But you will find they don't care until their own property is at risk. They don't care about your property.

larrymiller

TopCon wrote: »

I too have had a couple of rather unfortunate encounters with 'the hunt'.

Damage to fences, by damage I mean intentionally cutting wire etc. Trampling of ground and worst of all upset livestock.

The most ignorant shower of .... That I have ever met. DO NOT believe the b.s. people spout 'oh they're all farmers, repair fences, ask for permission etc etc'

they stay away from me now.

Do not allow them to bully you. If dogs upset/hurt your livestock they are out of control and you should be free to protect your stock using necessary force. They know that and believe me it upsets em too...

But if you can at all, try to resolve difficulties by peaceful means as others have mentioned. But you will find they don't care until their own property is at risk. They don't care about your property.

Have to agree 100% with you, and the cutting of the fence don't get me started

Nekarsulm

had loads of problems here years ago with the local "beaglers" (if that is even a word) crossing the land. They, or a guest hunt, were out every weekend, often twice. Then you had lost hounds wandering around for a few more days. Complained to local huntsmen, "shor the dogs will follow the hare/fox, wherever he goes" I told them in no uncertain terms to keep off my land, or else. The next weekend, the same story. Cars and trailers stuck in lane ways and gaps. Fellows driving round the roads looking for dogs, other lads up on hills trying to view the hunt. Sheep all agitated in the fields. So I shot the first two dogs in the sheep's field. In full view of the "spotters". Strangely enough the hounds learned to map read, and never come on the land any more!

This is not a horsey area, so no local hunting with horses. Had a bunch galloping around once, cut the crap out of the headlands of a few fields. Told them to leave and they did. Some lad came round with a bottle of Hennesey a few days later.

ford2600

"Sheep all agitated in the fields. So I shot the first two dogs in the sheep's field. In full view of the "spotters". Strangely enough the hounds learned to map read, and never come on the land any more!"

As much as I like the look of foxhounds was just going to suggest OP put up a sign or two and shoot first dog that enters field.

When no doesn't work, they can't complain much

GY A1

ford2600 wrote: »

"Sheep all agitated in the fields. So I shot the first two dogs in the sheep's field. In full view of the "spotters". Strangely enough the hounds learned to map read, and never come on the land any more!"

As much as I like the look of foxhounds wad just going to suggest OP put up a dign or two and shoot first dog that enters field.

When no doesn't work, they can't complain much

fair play, thats the only way to stop them,
put the sheep all over the place here again recently,
these people dont understand when told to stay out and obviously cant read the signs either,
pure arogant so they are,

jimini0

Some very bad experiences there. I'm glad those type of hunts don't happen here. The hunt that goes on here seems to be more organised or just have decent people involved.

RoscommonTom

Shoot at them, if they have an accident they cansue you so better scar them off, rotten bunch

mf240

Some pretty bad experiences here too but when I stood up to them they have copped on,

By the way someone said farmers think of snobs on horses, but to be honest theres another group of people that are associated with horses, and thats what the hunt remind me of.

partyguinness

Only allowed if you give them permission. I know a farmer who successfully sued a hunt for going through his land without permission. About 40 horses running at speed. Wrecked the fields. A financial settlement was reached. Cld not believe the arrogance of the t he hunt as they knew they had no permission

larrymiller

mf240 wrote: »

Some pretty bad experiences here too but when I stood up to them they have copped on,

By the way someone said farmers think of snobs on horses, but to be honest theres another group of people that are associated with horses, and thats what the hunt remind me of.

yeah i agree

partyguinness

Only allowed if you give them permission. I know a farmer who successfully sued a hunt for going through his land without permission. About 40 horses running at speed. Wrecked the fields. A financial settlement was reached. Cld not believe the arrogance of the t he hunt as they knew they had no permission

grazeaway

OP, Did they turn up around your place over the weekend?

coolbeans

RoscommonTom wrote: »

Shoot at them, if they have an accident they cansue you so better scar them off, rotten bunch

Complete bull and stupid advice.

gozunda

Pf85

With some good advice there is unfortunately somewhat a mix of poor advice and usual ranting about "huntin' going on.

The problem is that everyone gets showered with the same verbiage whether they are genuine or not.
The crowd you describe hunting on foot are coming across from the UK on foot with hounds. In my experience these groups have no local connection, don't ask permission and are hunting over areas that have been traditionally hunted by locals.

On foot and with hounds they have no more right to entry especially in that they have no connection or agreement and and can't be pursued if things go wrong ie they will hot foot if needs be.

It is unlikely that this group actually hunt on foot and horseback. Generally hunting with hounds is one or the other rarely if ever both.

Sounds like this bunch were chancing their arm. Hounds or otherwise I would tell them to sling their hook.

Around my area - locals - mainly farmers and rural people hunt (with horses) and have built up good relationships with other landowners who don't necessarily hunt and who don't take kindly to groups arriving with the expectation of going hunting just because they think they can.

Hunting here is always by agreement. Any group on foot like that are chancing their arm. The 'horse' story sounds like a load of bollichs tbh.

If you have a genuine hunt locally - I would contact them and ask do they anything about this, most hunts in Ireland both North and South are or have finished up especially with the weather we are having,

I would also be concerned that that bunch are not what they say they are as well. Report them to the psni. If necessary.

GY A1

The ones that invade here have no local connection either, they travel about 20 miles but think they can keep comming back trespassing.

Base price

GY A1 wrote: »

The ones that invade here have no local connection either, they travel about 20 miles but think they can keep comming back trespassing.

You could contact the Hunting Association of Ireland which. Their members are registered and insured.
They maybe able to assist you.
http://www.hai.ie/