My partner wont leave my son with anyone.

LegacyUser

Hi Fellow Boardsies,

It’s my first time over in this neck of the site. I have an account here for 10+ years but find this so embarrassing that I can’t have people knowing who I am.
I am with my partner (from another country) for 4 years and we have a 2.5 year old son. Since the day he was born my partner has never left him alone with anyone. She cooks, cleans, and follows him around all day.

As a small baby when my family would visit she would take him to the room and pretend to breast feed him so they could not bond. She is does not like anyone in my family although have never been anything but nice to her. She will not let my parents who are 60+ mind him even for an hour so we can go shopping or even catch lunch. I really want my son to know his grandparents but she will not allow it. She will not even let him wear clothes my family but him.

My son is behind in his talking, and comprehension of things because she will not socialise him. She will not let us take him to parent and toddler groups classes or let him play with kids in the park. I have asked her in the nicest way to speak with someone or a doctor. She has no friend in Ireland and refuses to make some. She has everything she wants with my son and I and says she could not be happier. On the other hand I have not seen my friends outside of work in 3 years as she will accuse me of cheating. I see my family twice a month and all they want is to bond with my son but that is not allowed. We have not gone to the cinema, dinner, away for a day even to the zoo since ds was born. I am at breaking point. I could walk out the door in the morning and never go back my life is being made hell by her as my family are so hurt and I am caught in the middle.

Please advise, and remember I have tried to talk, get her to see a doc etc but she says she could not be happier.
Thanks,
Popz

CaraMay

The child is 50% yours so how can you not be allowed???? Grow a pair and take the kids to see your parents.

Merkin

PopzWithAProblem wrote: »

Please advise, and remember I have tried to talk, get her to see a doc etc but she says she could not be happier.

That's all well and good but she is actually stunting your child's development as well as depriving him of that really special relationship shared by tots and their grandparents.

It honestly sounds like she needs professional help and while there is obviously some psychological issues at play here YOU also have equal responsibility for the parenting of YOUR child.It's up to you to start taking the child to see your extended family and to attend social events which will allow him to socialize with other little ones.

As it stands, the status quo is in no way sustainable. What happens when the kid reaches school going age, is she going to lock him under the stairs?

LegacyUser

OP does she allow you any alone time with the child? Have any of her own family come to visit since the child was born at all?

It sounds very unhealthy and you say you can already see the effect it's happening on the childs development. I understand you want to try and work with her and not cause upset but I'm with CaraMay on this, pick the child up and walk out of the house with them. The longer you allow this behavior to continue the bigger the impact it will have on the child and the harder it will be to break the cycle. As hurtful as keeping him away from your family is I'd be more concerned with the lack of interaction with other kids, what is she planning to do when he starts school?

What is stopping you from being more assertive about the rising of the child? Are you afraid she will take the child and try and go to her own country? She legally can't do that and while there is a risk she may react badly and your marriage could be at risk but honestly you have to put the welfare of the child above everything and it doesn't sound like your having much a decent life as it stands right now. The child need to be interacting with more then two people!

Your wife may not want to talk to your GP but there is nothing stopping you talking to your GP and asking for advice. You need to speak to your wife much more forcefully and make her aware of the damage she is causing the child with her actions. If you've a good relationship with your GP perhaps ask them about a home visit to check the childs development or ask your GP to refer someone from HSC to come check the child. If your wife doesn't want to seek help that's her choice, but Your focus should be on the childs health and development

LegacyUser

TBH I am on egg shells she goes home to her homeland for 8 weeks at a time every few months and I think if I upset the status quo she will not bring him back to me. I understand that it is my responsibility but I swear I can not even have him on my own. She needs to be with him 24/7. She sleeps with him in his room. I sleep on my own in our room. 7 nights a week. When he goes for a nap, she goes for a nap. When he baths she baths. It is like i do not have a partner any more. If I upset it she could take him next time she goes home and not come back.

Neyite

Could some of this, or an element of this be cultural OP? my thinking is that say, a form of attachment parenting might be the norm where she comes from but because she has no peers or friends of her own here, its her own skewed version of it, and she has no comparisons or friends to compare to.

Are you married? Do you have guardianship? What you can do about this situation is limited by that.

Does she ever bring him to a GP or public health nurse? if so, could you privately have a word with those professionals so that they can pop in unexpectedly or see if they can give you any avenues to help.

Will she discuss this with you at all. What happens when you try to suggest you go for a walk alone with him or that you give him his bath? What's her reaction?

LegacyUser

Neyite wrote: »

Could some of this, or an element of this be cultural OP? my thinking is that say, a form of attachment parenting might be the norm where she comes from but because she has no peers or friends of her own here, its her own skewed version of it, and she has no comparisons or friends to compare to.

Are you married? Do you have guardianship? What you can do about this situation is limited by that.

Does she ever bring him to a GP or public health nurse? if so, could you privately have a word with those professionals so that they can pop in unexpectedly or see if they can give you any avenues to help.

Will she discuss this with you at all. What happens when you try to suggest you go for a walk alone with him or that you give him his bath? What's her reaction?

Op here. We are not married. I am not sure what guardianship is in my situation. I own my own house she lives here with me for two months goes home for two months comes back and goes again so essentially they live with me half the year but split up in two month segments.

If I try to bring him places she says he will get sick if we take him out it's to cold it's to wet etc my brother has two kids who we never see although they are the same age as when he used to make the effort to call my partner would ignore the adults or just take my son to the room to breast feed which I now know was a way to get away from my family.

You say she tells you she is perfectly happy with how things are. What does she say when you tell her you are unhappy? I think instead of putting the focus on her and her behaviour or even on the baby, you could try talk about the personal cost to your happiness in all this. Perhaps she's got some level of pnd and can only cope with it when she's with the baby, but it doesn't seem like it. Her disregard for the baby's development is concerning, and I would urge you to speak privately with the public health nurse about your concerns before his next developmental check. The nurse can then be very specific about concerns and how to address them through greater socialisation to your partner.

If she won't get help and is immune to appeals to make your life happier, it's a very difficult situation. The fact she takes the baby abroad and seems to regard him as her sole property is worrying, and I would suggest that you visit a citizens advice centre or consult a solicitor for advice, not because I think you should split, but so that you are armed if any threats are made when the status quo is upset in the future. I'm sorry if that sounds very negative, but you have to protect both yourself and the baby against this tendency to unreasonable behaviour.

Tell her she's harming the baby and harming your relationship. Her reaction should guide you to the right path in dealing with it, and deal with it you must, for the sake of the baby who isn't meeting his milestones. He deserves better, so do you.

Tokyo

OP, there seems to be a bigger issue at stake here than just your child that goes beyond a cultural difference or being an overprotective mother - with her stopping anybody from going near your 2 year old, coupled with the fact that you can't go anywhere lest she assumes that you are cheating on her, it's safe to say that she has serious trust issues in general - it's only becoming obvious to everybody now because the child is extending how she treats you onto everybody else.

I’m sorry to be the one to tell you but there is no way you can personally force upon her that she can trust you, or your family. As you pointed out, you’ve done nothing to earn her mistrust. You acquiesce to her every wish, you have abandoned your friends, even your family, in order to keep her happy, but that isn’t enough. Her anxiety about what you do and how you act isn't your fault. It is coming from somewhere inside her, and only she can change that.

My main concern is that her level of suspicion and mistrust and distancing you from your own child, and her attempts to control you as the solution to this problem will only get worse as time goes by. As it stands, she is already isolating you from your friends, isolating your child from you and your family. She is manipulating you, pure and simple. I'm not surprised that you feel like you are walking on eggshells - something here is very, very wrong.

You say that your partner goes back to visit her family 8 weeks at a time every few months - that in itself is far too excessive if you are both parents to this child. Have you ever visited her family with the child? Is her behaviour any different in how she lets your child relate to HER family, as opposed to how she allows the child to interact with your family??

I hate to say it, but TBH, it sounds like your relationship is in a pretty bad place. She disappears off home for two months at a time, with your child. She controls everything you do when she's in Ireland. And now your child has become a bargaining chip in all of this. If you are to stay together as a couple, then it sounds like she needs some professional help if she is to continue being your partner. You don’t want to spend the rest of your life walking on eggshells to keep her from being upset, or God forbid, running off with your child in tow. I know that she has rejected any discussion of the issue, but you need to continue to talk to her and see if you can both resolve this, perhaps with the aid of professionals. Otherwise, if I were in your shoes, I'd honestly be looking at what my legal rights are as a father, in terms of her disappearing and taking the child with her. Good luck...

LegacyUser

Op here

We are not married. I am not 100% how guardianship works? I own a house here since before we met. They come over from her homeland and stay with me for 8 weeks go “home” for 8 weeks come back for 8 weeks go “home” for 8weeks. I pay for all the flights as she does not work. I can not go on like this anymore.

I am sure my family are all talking about me behind my back but I am doing everything I can to keep this relationship going and my son under my roof and not at the other side of the world. Where she comes from it is not uncommon for multiple generations to live under one roof this is why I cannot understand that if her mum has a relationship with him every 8 weeks why cant mine see him for an hour or so every two weeks.
If I say oh il take him to town/for a walk/to the park/to my mum she says oh it’s to cold/wet/he will get sick/I will come too (except to my mums of course) Bath time is totally off limits for me to do it as its their routine. They both bath and she goes to bed with him at 8.30 I only get home from work at 6. I honestly don’t think we have a relationship and she thinks it is perfect.

Maybe I am not the best father I grew up in rural Ireland where my uncles aunts granny neighbours mother and father brothers and sisters reared us all. I don’t know what attachment parenting is but I will read up on it to see if what I am experiencing is elements of this. Financially I am broke paying for these visits but like I say if this goes wrong she might just not come back to me on her next trip home.

I would also add that since his role as a partner and his role as a father has been removed from him, his sole role now seems to be provider. I assume you finance the trips home to her parents? That should stop, you don't exist to support her in indulging her paranoia and control. She isn't contributing to your partnership in any way at all, and if you need to wield the only power you have over the situation to get her to listen, then that's what you have to do.

I'm very sorry you're in this position. I knew a man who endured something similar and the stress of living with it day-to-day was huge, and the relief of resolving it was incalculable. I hope that comes to you too.

Neyite

From your last post, it reads more like that from her point of view your relationship is over and that she resides abroad, bringing the baby over for shared custody/visitation. Most odd.

The ugly truth of it OP, its that being unmarried, you have few legal rights and if you have not gone to a solicitor and arranged guardianship, then you have no say in the child's life. Theoretically, if anything happened to your girlfriend, her next of kin gets her child, not you. I'm not married and if anything happened to me, my mother would get my child, the father has no claim in law, unless there is guardianship in place.

I would suggest finding out the legal side of things from a solicitor. What your rights and obligations are, if you are considered legally co-habiting (as after 3 years with a child she is entitled to a share of owned assets)

With regard to your son's speech, if she is not from an english speaking country and only talks to him in their native language I can see why he would be slow at english.

CaraMay

You need to sort out the guardianship of your child and then you can stop her leaving the country with him. This should have been your first priority when you figured she could not be trusted.

LegacyUser

Op Here:
I am going to swing by my mother’s on my way home this evening and sit down with my mum and dad and read this thread with them, from there we can make a plan to lay down some ground rules go to a solicitor etc. I am so sickened after reading all of this I am at my wits end, I don’t think I mentioned that we are both late 30’s this could sound like a teenage strop. I will follow up here tonight when they go to bed.

Emme

PopzWithAProblem wrote: »

Op here

We are not married. I am not 100% how guardianship works? I own a house here since before we met. They come over from her homeland and stay with me for 8 weeks go “home” for 8 weeks come back for 8 weeks go “home” for 8weeks. I pay for all the flights as she does not work. I can not go on like this anymore.

I am sure my family are all talking about me behind my back but I am doing everything I can to keep this relationship going and my son under my roof and not at the other side of the world. Where she comes from it is not uncommon for multiple generations to live under one roof this is why I cannot understand that if her mum has a relationship with him every 8 weeks why cant mine see him for an hour or so every two weeks.
If I say oh il take him to town/for a walk/to the park/to my mum she says oh it’s to cold/wet/he will get sick/I will come too (except to my mums of course) Bath time is totally off limits for me to do it as its their routine. They both bath and she goes to bed with him at 8.30 I only get home from work at 6. I honestly don’t think we have a relationship and she thinks it is perfect.

Maybe I am not the best father I grew up in rural Ireland where my uncles aunts granny neighbours mother and father brothers and sisters reared us all. I don’t know what attachment parenting is but I will read up on it to see if what I am experiencing is elements of this. Financially I am broke paying for these visits but like I say if this goes wrong she might just not come back to me on her next trip home.

You are being had by your partner and her family. Even though you are not married you do know your partner might have the right to claim 50% of your property under common law? As things are her family are living with you for a substantial part of the year - do you pay for their subsistence?

You, as the father of the child, are not being allowed to participate in his upbringing. Your partner is not allowing your family contact with him. Your role has diminished to financial provider and little else.

You're going to have to play hardball because that's what your partner has been doing, albeit in a very subtle way. You could start by refusing to pay for her flights to her home country. Organise renovations in your house while her family are over here so it's not too cosy for them. Get a friend in who has DIY skills and get him or her to stomp around and generally make noise and a mess. Do you pay for your partner's flights over as well, if so stop doing that altogether. Stop being a walking ATM for your partner's family.

Why can't your partner work? Has she good English and if not is she bothered to improve her language skills? Poor language skills might be one reason she's holding on to her child so much but if she wants to improve her English she will have to let you care for the child while she takes classes.

To be honest I don't think there are any excuses for her behavior. She and her family are taking you and your family for fools.

That is why it is most important for you to get good legal advice on your rights as a father. It might not be any harm to get advice on your property rights as well. You may not intend ending this relationship but half of your property might provide a nice little nest in Ireland for her, her child and her parents.

Oryx

Do you want her back from when she goes abroad, or just your son? Because it is hard to see if you actually have, or want, a relationship with her.

LegacyUser

I'm sorry OP, but I believe that you are being deliberately bled dry financially, and that she will take your child to her home country, where she will ask you to finance her and your child living with her family.

I don't mean to be cruel in saying the above, but it is honestly my take on it. It's not even any of the individual things you've said - it's all of them combined; you having a house, pregnant very early in the relationship, not working, controlling you and isolating you to keep you on your toes re access to your child - and financing her family coming and going. Legal advice is an absolute must.

LegacyUser

Would it be really bad of me to say - do not ever pay for her flights "home" again?


Sorry if I offend but honestly, this situation doesnt look good, if I was in your shoes I wouldnt be paying for her to feck off "home"

You cant even bring your child to the shops but she can go off back to her country?? Nope, sorry I may seem a bit heartless but I wouldnt be having any of that. Tough if she doesnt have a job, that's not your problem. You arent married to her so in my opinion you arent obliged to pay for her to go home every 8 weeks.

You know what to do now, I wish you the very very best of luck by the way!

LegacyUser

Emme wrote: »

You are being had by your partner and her family. Even though you are not married you do know your partner might have the right to claim 50% of your property under common law? As things are her family are living with you for a substantial part of the year - do you pay for their subsistence?

You, as the father of the child, are not being allowed to participate in his upbringing. Your partner is not allowing your family contact with him. Your role has diminished to financial provider and little else.

You're going to have to play hardball because that's what your partner has been doing, albeit in a very subtle way. You could start by refusing to pay for her flights to her home country. Organise renovations in your house while her family are over here so it's not too cosy for them. Get a friend in who has DIY skills and get him or her to stomp around and generally make noise and a mess. Do you pay for your partner's flights over as well, if so stop doing that altogether. Stop being a walking ATM for your partner's family.

Why can't your partner work? Has she good English and if not is she bothered to improve her language skills? Poor language skills might be one reason she's holding on to her child so much but if she wants to improve her English she will have to let you care for the child while she takes classes.

To be honest I don't think there are any excuses for her behavior. She and her family are taking you and your family for fools.

That is why it is most important for you to get good legal advice on your rights as a father. It might not be any harm to get advice on your property rights as well. You may not intend ending this relationship but half of your property might provide a nice little nest in Ireland for her, her child and her parents.

Her family don't live with us they live in her home country. I support my partner and son and pay for them to visit. I only have 4 weeks holidays a year so can not go with them.

Tokyo

• You are the sole provider
• You pay for flights for her and your kid every 8 weeks
• You pay for flights for entire family to come to Ireland every 8 weeks
• You provide for her entire family while they are in Ireland
• You're flat broke

There's no other way to put this OP, you are being taken for a ride. Of course she thinks your relationship is perfect - you are paying for whatever lifestyle she demands, for her and for her family. Honestly, I try to give the benefit of the doubt in most cases, but you aren't in a relationship, whether you realise it or not. You are being used as a walking cash machine, with your child being used as leverage.

Ask yourself this. Would you stay with her if you didn't have a child together? Or would you tell her to go take a running jump with all of her demands?

My gut feeling on this is that you need to see a solicitor as soon as you can, and figure out what your legal rights and obligations are, back to front. Because from here, it sounds like your 'partner' has you over a barrel, and she knows it, and will happily work you into an early grave as long as you can keep coming up with the money to pay for all that she is requesting.

OP, good luck. I really think legal advice and family back up is the best way to go. The only advice I'd give you is to keep your investigations between yourself and your parents and try to keep things as 'normal' as possible at home, in case she panics and takes off.

Rooting for you here

LegacyUser

Oryx wrote: »

Do you want her back from when she goes abroad, or just your son? Because it is hard to see if you actually have, or want, a relationship with her.

I love my partner very much. but what she is doing is killing me so I can not even answer this question truthfully. but you are right we do not have a relationship.

Neyite

Hmmmmmmm??? wrote: »

Would it be really bad of me to say - do not ever pay for her flights "home" again?


Sorry if I offend but honestly, this situation doesnt look good, if I was in your shoes I wouldnt be paying for her to feck off "home"

You cant even bring your child to the shops but she can go off back to her country?? Nope, sorry I may seem a bit heartless but I wouldnt be having any of that. Tough if she doesnt have a job, that's not your problem. You arent married to her so in my opinion you arent obliged to pay for her to go home every 8 weeks.

You know what to do now, I wish you the very very best of luck by the way!

All the money he has probably sent her, she'd have no problem getting her own flight home or even if she was broke, family would help her I'm sure.
And then she would definitely never return with his child to visit again.

LegacyUser

Neyite wrote: »

All the money he has probably sent her, she'd have no problem getting her own flight home or even if she was broke, family would help her I'm sure.
And then she would definitely never return with his child to visit again.

Very very true Neyite

Op - go get this looked into asap.

Have to agree with everyone else here, she's living on cloud nine, at your expense!

kylith

If I were you, OP, I'd discuss the future with her. The child can't be shuttled back and forth like this when he's in school, so talk to her about where the child will be going to school. If it's in her home country then that'll tell you what you need to know and she may well see you as a cashpoint. If the child will be in school in Ireland then you have to put your foot down: he needs to go to a crèche and make friends with kids in the area and he needs a relationship with his Irish family.

Boombastic

I'm open to correction but 2 years in a relationship cohabiting with a child, she may be entitled to half your house etc. Get to a solicitor

Boombastic

Boombastic wrote: »

I'm open to correction but 2 years in a relationship cohabiting with a child, she may be entitled to half your house etc. Get to a solicitor

Hopefully the fact she only lives there half the time means she isn't. He should be able to show how long she spends out of the country since he pays the bills.

Merkin

Do you have a joint account OP? While I'd continue being a good provider with food and comfort etc I would start keeping a reign on the amount of cash that changes hands, start putting away that money yourself for legal advice because you're in dire need of it.

I'm wondering if she has prevented the child from getting attached to anyone in Ireland because it has always been her intention to leave when she's got everything she wanted?

Sorry for the cynicism here OP but I don't think this bodes so well, get yourself to a solicitor.

LegacyUser

Op back again.

Finally broke down tonight in my mums. Two parents in tears I can not believe how much I have hurt them in the last few years they know in love them and I'm in a though place.

My mum thinks we needs to be sensitive so as not to risk losing ds but my dad wants to match us in to the solicitors none if the three of us were aware that I was not a legal guardian that was a real kick in the teeth to us all.especially if anything happened her in the 8 weeks in homeland I'd never get ds out of that country.

Some people asked about joint account only I have an account. We spend money like it's going out of fashion kitchen appliances toys strangely enough not much on herself. As we don't go out no need for dresses make up etc.

I am so thankfull for all your help today. Can anyone confirm that the being attached to the child thing is perhaps cultural?

kylith

kylith wrote: »

If I were you, OP, I'd discuss the future with her. The child can't be shuttled back and forth like this when he's in school, so talk to her about where the child will be going to school. If it's in her home country then that'll tell you what you need to know and she may well see you as a cashpoint. If the child will be in school in Ireland then you have to put your foot down: he needs to go to a crèche and make friends with kids in the area and he needs a relationship with his Irish family.

I think she might have no intention of staying in Ireland with him, and that's why she's not worried about him learning English. I don't think he should discuss the future too much with her until he gets advice, just in case she gets nervous and takes off. Putting his foot down might be the catalyst to bad things, if he's not prepared first.

I know you love your partner OP, but protect yourself before you force her hand.

LegacyUser

Serious number of red flags all over the place from what you've said OP, but I guess to try (hard!) to be fair, has her behaviour changed a lot since the birth of your child? Did she work when you were going out before she became pregnant? Was she always as jealous re you socialising without her? Did she ever try to make friends of her own, or to get along with your friends and family?

Not sure if the answers to the above would change anything really, I guess it might show if she was always as dependent on you and isolating you as much. Which would be worrying if that was the case - it would mean to me that she just cemented her position by having a baby.

Big Bag of Chips

OP, just a little word of advice, we would prefer if you use the word son, instead of "ds". Not everyone might understand what "ds" means. Thanks.

Tokyo

popzwithaproblem wrote: »

My mum thinks we needs to be sensitive so as not to risk losing ds but my dad wants to match us in to the solicitors none if the three of us were aware that I was not a legal guardian that was a real kick in the teeth to us all.especially if anything happened her in the 8 weeks in homeland I'd never get ds out of that country.

I think that a middle ground between hat both of your parents are suggesting would be a sensible approach. Softly softly would be the smart course of action for now - a chat with a solicitor on the QT to get your legal bearings and figure out where you stand in terms of the child, and where she stands in terms of what she can claim from you would be a cautious move, IMHO.

I am so thankfull for all your help today. Can anyone confirm that the being attached to the child thing is perhaps cultural?

It's hard to say without knowing where your partner is from, but there certainly have been countries where I have lived where that level of overprotectiveness is not uncommon. Admittedly I have never seen it to that extent though, and usually where I have seen it, the grandparents are a HUGE part of the child's life, particularly the grandmothers. There may be some grounds in the cultural thing, but TBH your partner's actions raise all sorts of red flags for me.

LegacyUser

I don't know whether this is a good idea or not - as someone said lots of posts back, totally withdrawing funds could make her jumpy - but would it be worth talking about salary cuts happening in work, so that you could discuss cutting back on spending / her looking for work while your parents mind your son?

I don't like suggesting deliberately pulling the wool over her eyes like that, but it could be put in a way that you both need to save so that she could visit her home country.

I know money is a secondary issue, but perhaps it would give some insight into what is more important to her - spending cash here, or seeing her family. Or perhaps you could both financially 'work towards' paying for her mother / a sister to visit her, rather than her leaving Ireland to visit them?

I honestly don't know whether those suggestions would help or make things worse - perhaps other posters can give you feedback on this. I only suggest it as something needs to change, and soon.

I do think a careful approach is needed, and legal advice as soon as you can.

LegacyUser

I posted earlier - just 2 points I forgot to say:

1. This sounds horrible of me, but I'd watch the post for bank / credit union statements in her name, and I'd honestly question whether she has a stash of cash in your house, where she asked you for money for kitchen appliances/toys, but has been squirrelling it away. I don't mean to sound all drama, but it is a point worth considering. I'd buy stuff on your own card from now on (assuming she doesn't have a card for your account). Most stores will only give refunds to the card, rather than cash.

2. I know you said that you love her, and which of us can explain logically why we love someone. But she's been sleeping in a separate room to you for how long? Are you even intimate anymore? Is she your partner in any sense of the word, other than you both live in the same house and were intimate at some stage in the past?

I'm nearly contradicting myself here, but if you are intimate with her, use a condom OP. The last thing you need is a second pregnancy complicating things even further.

Sorry to be so cynical, and hopefully I'm over-reacting, but I had to say those things

free-2-air

OP:

I can honesty say i am a shocked at how similar your story is to mine....I have walked in your shoes and know exactly what you are going through...upto and including the tearful conversations with my own parents....each of the elements that you have outlined i have been through....and unfortunately it is likely to get more rather than less difficult now no matter which options your pursue.

First and foremost what she is doing is not healthy for your child...keep that to the fore when the **** inevitably hits the fan when you do what you've got to do. As importantly, what she is doing suggests that she has very limited ties to Ireland ....this is a big red flag for me.

Legal:
My advice, having walked in your shoes is firstly get a good specialist lawyer - what they will tell you about your rights, or lack of them should be a sense check for you.
Then make an application for guardianship as soon as is possible, if need be go to the District Court explain your circumstances and look for a slot within a week (rather than wait for a higher court or solicitors availability) look for short notice/abridged time service, also look for a Sec 11 order preventing the child being removed from the state.

Dealing with your partner:
Once notice is served on partner (not before) you need to consider what support you can provide to her - to explain your actions and concerns, to help her with her issues to see if you can work towards an agreed position in advance of the court case.

Many on here will say that an un-announced court summons for your partner can be a shock and will not be helpful in terms of your relationship - it is and it won't be. But the alternative of arriving home and finding that your child is gone and is out of your reach is a lot more shocking a scenario and problematic for a relationship.

Lastly i would say, in addition to your folks, confide your situation/fears to a couple of good friends...they probably already know that you're having a tough time and being able to share and talk about a problem can help in so many ways...moral support is real support.

I had pretty much cruised through life until faced with similar and more difficult circumstances ...but someone sent me quote which helped me Adversity is a fact of life. It can’t be controlled. What we can control is how we react to it. And for me that meant stepping up and making some difficult decisions that i would much rather not have had to make.

I hope this helps, but acknowledge it is only my opinion, and as with anything on boards you will get loads of differing opinions from mine.

Good luck.

Slutmonkey57b

Your partner is definitely just using you to finance her child and her family.

Note, very seriously, that you are not part of her family. You're nothing to do with her. You're a source of income. She *will* disappear with your son if she ever gets wind of you taking steps to protect what few rights you have.

Document everything. Bring family round to see your son and let them bring a camera to capture those special moments with their cousin/grandson. As it happens, the only footage they'll get is of your partner keeping your child away from them.

Make sure you have everything ready to go before you tell her a single thing. Make sure her parents aren't here and she doesn't have a plane ticket in her hand. Make sure any court knows that your partner is manipulative and a flight risk.

I'm sorry, but it looks like you've been taken for a mug since the start.

Neyite

popzwithaproblem wrote: »

Can anyone confirm that the being attached to the child thing is perhaps cultural?

It really depends on the culture. Certainly some other cultures breastfeed for longer, use slings instead of pushchairs, in Ireland lots of babies are in childcare from 6 months or 10 months, but that is mostly guided by the duration of maternity leave. Do you want to say what culture she is from?

I dont think, in this instance, that being rash and cutting off money or access to buying things is such a good idea. You need to get information from your solicitor and get paperwork in order without her getting spooked that you are trying to steal 'her' baby.

So have a chat first with your solicitor and decide a plan of action. some of it might include suggesting to her that the guardianship angle is so that your son can inherit your property, or be written into your will.

You might also suggest that you should put your son's name down in the local schools (and by doing so, he would need to be registered with a local GP and public health nurse). These kind of things where you are registered as a guardian along with her means you have a stronger footing if she ever tried to remove your son permanently.

Have a look at treoir.ie and maybe even have a chat with someone there if you can.

Tread carefully.

LegacyUser

Two of you have made points that have touched a nerve.

1. Before my son was born she was smiley bubbly and got on well with my family. We went for drinks and dinner with them which we have not done once since he was born

2. "steal my baby" is a term that has come up with regards my family that is what triggered me to write this post actually.

I didn't say her nationality as I did not want sterio types but she is russian my son also has a russian passport he was born there.

Merkin

:eek: That is just bizarre. Are you sure she doesn't have post natal depression? Unless she is a superb actress, do you think something else could be attributable to this seemingly massive shift in personality?

Neyite

So the baby is a Russian citizen, born in that country, with that passport. Well then, you cant force her or him to stay in this country I'd imagine. He is not Irish!

You REALLY need a solicitor here. And speak to someone in Treoir. Frankly, the set up you have at the moment might be the best you get.

LegacyUser

Merkin wrote: »

:eek: That is just bizarre. Are you sure she doesn't have post natal depression? Unless she is a superb actress, do you think something else could be attributable to this seemingly massive shift in personality?

I suspected depression but she thinks I am being so weird for questioning our set up as she is so happy she has her son and me and it is us against the world etc etc just perfect....

I am a little weary of going in all guns blazing. I am going to say I need to register as a guardian so my son will be looked after if anything happens me. I am not going to try force it just say it needs to happen as in Ireland that's how inheritance works with tax gifts anything else I can find.

With regards public health nurse he does not have to go as he is not a citizen. He has fallen between the cracks really.

It is a relief to see others in my boat I was crumbling thinking I was the only one. When I see my mum with her other grandchildren it kills me so step 1 is the solicitor on Tuesday.

LegacyUser

Neyite wrote: »

So the baby is a Russian citizen, born in that country, with that passport. Well then, you cant force her or him to stay in this country I'd imagine. He is not Irish!

You REALLY need a solicitor here. And speak to someone in Treoir. Frankly, the set up you have at the moment might be the best you get.

He might not be born here but he is my son. As far as my life plan goes the long visits home will stop when school starts and he will be educated here in Ireland as an Irish child. I am going to bring home all the documents for the free pre school year this evening and push to enrol him for September. She says back home kids start education later and there is no need for it but I will try work Irish law into in a nice way.

Big Bag of Chips

Op, you need to be very careful here - have you discussed the future? Education? etc. The fact that she divides her time equally between here and "home" makes me believe she still sees "home" as "home", and she visits you for 2 months at a time to give you access to your child. She doesn't even sleep in the same room as you when she is here!

I'd worry that when the time comes for him to go to school she will move "home" and he will go to school there, and she will then return on holidays etc for you to once again have access.

She has everything she wants. Her family at "home", her son, and you here waiting for her and paying for everything she needs when she visits you. She's set up. She hasn't made friends here, because she doesn't want any, because she doesn't class the area as her home.. she's just here on extended visits. Shes doesn't see the point in allowing him to socialise with other kids of the area, because, I'd guess her long term plan is that he's not going to be here long enough to establish friendships.

Get yourself to a solicitor. I have a feeling this is all going to end in heartbreak for you, but you need to prepare your case anyway. Otherwise if she does up and leave, you will forever be thinking "was there anything I could have done to prevent it?". If you do all you can, and she still is allowed to leave, at least you'd know you did all you can.

iguana

There is no doubt that there are some very, very serious issues here but I'll be honest and say that some of the things you have mentioned here are non-issues that if you focus on, you risk losing focus where it matters. So I'll go through some of the things that in my opinion you should find peace with so that you can focus your efforts on the things that really do matter.

PopzWithAProblem wrote: »

Since the day he was born my partner has never left him alone with anyone. She cooks, cleans, and follows him around all day.

While this is on the outer edges of normal, it's not something I'd take issue with right now as it's not especially unusual for a mother to have no desire to leave her toddler.

My son is behind in his talking, and comprehension of things because she will not socialise him. She will not let us take him to parent and toddler groups classes or let him play with kids in the park.

Presumably your son is being raised bi-lingual? It's normal for children who are learning more than one language to be slower to speak as they have to do twice as much work in learning how to communicate verbally. It's normal for them to rely on non-verbal communication while they work out both languages. It also has nothing to do with socialisation, there is no evidence whatsoever that children benefit from peer socialisation before the age of 3. What benefits children most at this age is being part of normal family life and engaging in the world their parents engage in. Presumably your son has this normal interaction when your partner is in her home country, so he is getting it half the time at least and if your partner talks to him during the time she is in Ireland lack of socialisation isn't an issue. It's a good bet that when you talk of the importance of peer socialisation, your partner knows from her culture that it isn't important and it allows her to not only dismiss you on this issue but on all issues because she can tell herself that if you are so wrong on this, you are wrong on everything else. So I'd stop trying to tell her she needs to take him to toddler groups, etc, personally I love toddler groups but to some women they are a hellish idea and pushing her toward them will make her more likely to dismiss all you say.

On the other hand I have not seen my friends outside of work in 3 years as she will accuse me of cheating. I see my family twice a month and all they want is to bond with my son but that is not allowed. We have not gone to the cinema, dinner, away for a day even to the zoo since ds was born.

It seems to me that you do love this woman and want to make things work but you can't go on as things are. I think that you should take all of Neyites advice re: the legal side of things as first and foremost you need to do what you can to protect your relationship with your son. But unlike most of the posters I'm not convinced that there is no relationship here and think that you should also focus on trying to form a stronger family unit. I wonder if your partner feels some of your suggestions for things to do are about splitting her apart from her son, instead I suggest you focus on suggesting things that bond the three of you. Can you try to organise things for you 3 as a family? Most cinemas do family viewing on weekend mornings? Maybe the 3 of you can do that together, or go to a kids show, toddler music classes, etc, all 3 of you. Start with building bonds with the 3 of you and supporting her in getting out more, and if you can make the 3 of you stronger together, then push more to get her involved with your family and friends. But if you push too much too soon, you really do risk her leaving with your son and not returning.

I know it seems unfair to have to work so hard when she is being very difficult and unfair. But really and truly your legal situation here is very, very tenuous and you could lose your relationship with your son for good if you push too hard right now. I think she does have some postnatal depression and desperate homesickness. I think she has gotten herself in a desperate rut in Ireland and doesn't realise how unhappy her lifestyle here is making her (and you) as she is so focussed on her time with her family.

Lastly one other thing here has disturbed me a little, though no-one else has mentioned it. You went to your parents with your problem and your first description of how that conversation went is that you can't believe how much you have hurt them. Seriously? Your very first sentence about it was guilt for their feeling? Not their shock and upset at what you have been going through and what a horrible situation you have been for the last two years? It's all about how your desperate situation has hurt them? I'm sorry but that's not actually normal either. If I went to my parents with a story like yours, their first reaction would be to put their own hurt aside so as not to make me feel worse. Heartbreaking as it would be for them to be pushed away from their grandson, they wouldn't make my situation about them. Your parents need to recognise that right now, their role is to support you in strengthening your ties to your son, not pushing for their desire to see him. It does make me wonder if maybe their concern for their rights to their grandson has played a part in spooking your partner and making her feel like they want to take him from her? Even if you are 100% sure this isn't the case, you should bear in mind that if they support you and you achieve a stronger position, their ability to see your son will grow. If they push now and are too concerned about their own feelings, they will lose out too.

Merkin

Popzwithaproblem wrote: »

With regards public health nurse he does not have to go as he is not a citizen. He has fallen between the cracks really.

Do you mean to tell me that the little fellow hasn't had his jabs etc?

Popzwithaproblem

Popzwithaproblem wrote: »

He might not be born here but he is my son. As far as my life plan goes the long visits home will stop when school starts and he will be educated here in Ireland as an Irish child. I am going to bring home all the documents for the free pre school year this evening and push to enrol him for September. She says back home kids start education later and there is no need for it but I will try work Irish law into in a nice way.

Does the little guy have Irish Citizenship Popz? He will need it to enrol in an Irish school.

You must talk your solicitor for information on that - and don't forget Citizens Advice Bureaux for free guidance.

You could perhaps frame it to your partner as a prerequisite for putting him on your health insurance so he gets private care in Ireland if he's ill, or some other ruse to make it sound solely as a benefit to the baby. Keep it apart from any other issue at all. Once he's an Irish Citizen, the Irish State has obligations towards him, including providing him with regular developmental and dental checks, education, free heathcare. He can then be officially domiciled in Ireland, making it his legal home. All this stuff is important if it comes to the wire.

Citizenship will require declarations of paternity signed by your partner, and it'll probably make it easier to pursue guardianship when she's already signed legal documents to that effect.

I feel so bad for you Popz, it must be dreadful having to be so underhanded. I'm really sorry you're in this position.



ETA: Just saw that he isn't a citizen. I'd pursue that asap Popz, make sure the solicitor is on the case.

Neyite

I think iguana is spot on here. Maybe try and foster the family unit a bit more - forget about your parents in this for the moment. The way you are prioritising their wishes and feelings in this is a concern. You have to do right by your son first and foremost - he is your primary family now and comes first. If that means sucking it up a bit with your girlfriend to foster better communication for his benefit, then that's what you do.

Would she go to couple counselling with you do you think? It might be an opener if she does have deeper issues with regard to parenting. A foot in the door so to speak. I remember when I first had the newborn, I had to fight myself to let me hand over my baby to his dad to hold. It was strange really, some sort of built-in protectiveness maybe mixed with hormones at the time. I know other mothers have felt instincts like that handing over their babies to in-laws and friends.

By building up a trusting relationship with your girlfriend, strengthening your family unit, doing family things together, putting the legal protections in place that benefit your son (and indirectly benefit you then as a dad), Maybe when she sees what a great dad you are when you are all together might make her more trusting to let him off alone with you. He is still very small and in 8 weeks people can become strangers to a child again.

Have you ever visited where your girlfriend is from or seen how she is there? maybe she does the toddler groups and has friends there?

Big Bag of Chips

Neyite wrote: »

I remember when I first had the newborn, I had to fight myself to let me hand over my baby to his dad to hold. It was strange really, some sort of built-in protectiveness maybe mixed with hormones at the time. I know other mothers have felt instincts like that handing over their babies to in-laws and friends.

This is very true, OP. On our first child, at first me and my husband shared lots of the changing/feeding/cuddling. And little by little I took over. "Sure I'll do it" sort of thing. By the time my 2nd arrived I was doing EVERYTHING, all the time, because I had excluded my husband so much, he had taken a step back. By the time the 3rd arrived, I ended up having a blasing row with him where I blamed him for leaving me to be a single mother, doing everything for 3 children with no help from him...

When I calmed down, I realised it was me who had made it like that, by taking over. I knew my babies. I knew what way they liked to be held, fed, changed, comforted etc, and nobody else would do it the same way as I did... therefore everyone else did it wrong, and I was the only one who could do it right.

I eventually got over that! But by the time I had learnt to relax and realised that nobody was going to "break" my babies by holding them differently to I did, I had already done the damage. Now I will give my children to anyone who is kind enough to offer!!!

I do think that integration here is a big thing, and you need to be the one to push (gently!) for that. Your gf doesn't see herself as a member of this society, and you need to slowly introduce that. You mentioned if you say you will bring the baby for a walk she says she will come too.. that's not a bad thing! Then on the walk, stop into the local playground. If she doesn't allow the child to talk to other kids, that's fine. Many 2 year old aren't known for being all the sociable anyway.

Your gf doesn't feel like this is "home" - so as well as getting all your legal advice and guardianship etc sorted out, you also need to encourage (not force, argue, push etc) your gf to do more with you as a family.

LegacyUser

Merkin wrote: »

Do you mean to tell me that the little fellow hasn't had his jabs etc?

No vaccines, his mother is against them thinks they cause Autism/could kill him etc.

Candie wrote: »

Does the little guy have Irish Citizenship Popz? He will need it to enrol in an Irish school. /QUOTE]

Yes he has he holds duel citizenship, we were claiming benefit for him but that is now gone becasue of the habitual residence rule. I was actually glad this happened as it gave us the chance for me to say they go to homeland to much.

Have you ever visited where your girlfriend is from or seen how she is there? maybe she does the toddler groups and has friends there?

Just once, but that was before my son ever came to Ireland so i had nothing to compare too. her family have no English so i could not communicate with them. my partner is fluent in English.

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

This is very true, OP. On our first child, at first me and my husband shared lots of the changing/feeding/cuddling. And little by little I took over. "Sure I'll do it" sort of thing. By the time my 2nd arrived I was doing EVERYTHING, all the time, because I had excluded my husband so much, he had taken a step back. By the time the 3rd arrived, I ended up having a blasing row with him where I blamed him for leaving me to be a single mother, doing everything for 3 children with no help from him...

When I calmed down, I realised it was me who had made it like that, by taking over. I knew my babies. I knew what way they liked to be held, fed, changed, comforted etc, and nobody else would do it the same way as I did... therefore everyone else did it wrong, and I was the only one who could do it right.

I eventually got over that! But by the time I had learnt to relax and realised that nobody was going to "break" my babies by holding them differently to I did, I had already done the damage. Now I will give my children to anyone who is kind enough to offer!!!

I do think that integration here is a big thing, and you need to be the one to push (gently!) for that. Your gf doesn't see herself as a member of this society, and you need to slowly introduce that. You mentioned if you say you will bring the baby for a walk she says she will come too.. that's not a bad thing! Then on the walk, stop into the local playground. If she doesn't allow the child to talk to other kids, that's fine. Many 2 year old aren't known for being all the sociable anyway.

Your gf doesn't feel like this is "home" - so as well as getting all your legal advice and guardianship etc sorted out, you also need to encourage (not force, argue, push etc) your gf to do more with you as a family.

Very helpful thanks.

iguana

Popzwithaproblem wrote: »

I am going to bring home all the documents for the free pre school year this evening and push to enrol him for September. She says back home kids start education later and there is no need for it but I will try work Irish law into in a nice way.

Tbh, that's a terrible idea as what you will do if you do that is make her feel like you are trying to pull her and the boy apart. If she dislikes the idea it makes her more likely to move back home and stay there. You need to go more gently about how you act, make her feel supported by you, so she wants to stay, not under attack so she bolts.

What age exactly is your son? If he's 2.5 years (30 months) now, he won't even be eligible for the free preschool year until 2015 as he needs to be 39 months on the first of September.* And even if he is old enough a lot of pre-schools seriously discourage such an early start as it's now the norm here to start pre-school nearer the child's 4th birthday and school near their 5th. You could end up with egg on your face if you push this as what you are expecting re:schooling don't even meet the norms in this country, never mind what she is used to.

*http://www.dcya.gov.ie/viewdoc.asp?fn=/documents/childcare/ECCE_guideforparents.htm#2