12 year old and Phone Secrecy

Timmythedonkey

My 12 year old is very grown up (or so she think's!) and has a phone and Tablet. Myself and her father are seperated 3 and a half year's. She had a phone that wasn't working very well before xmas and she decided she wanted a new mobile for xmas. So around Nov I checked her old mobile and found she'd been phoning her dad - Now I have no problem with he talking to him but it's just the Secrecy that freck's me out! We had word's and she said she couldn't remember the phone call's and there were a few text's that I also questioned!

So Before Xmas I told her if she wanted a new phone There would be some ground rule's - She must tell me if she's phoning her dad, she must not delete any history details and no text's are to be deleted either.

I have just asked to look at the phone and There is no call history at all and the first text message sent was 8th Jan...............I checked her phone over the new year and there were calls to her father and texts too to him and other people but nothing now! I am so cross but feel I can't bring it up and she is frecking out (obviously know's I have seen them earlier than now!)

I don't know what to do - he father dosen't back me up as when I told her before I need to know BEFORE she contact's him she must have text him about it and he text me saying she can contact him anytime! (we don't talk and just communicate through text!)

I feel like tearing my hair out! I honestly don't know how to deal with this - Can I get a log of her calls and Text's from the phone company just to keep an eye in the background?

RustyNut

Is there a reason you don't want her to be able to call her dad when she wants without asking permission?

You can block his number from the phone but you might be building up a little resentment.

MoonDancer

Why should she ask your permission to phone her dad at all?
My kids can ring their grandparents and uncles anytime they want. Their dad isn't in the picture, so I always tell them they can chat to family anytime they want.
I don't see why you want her to tell you before she rings her dad.

freshpopcorn

What's your issue with her contacting her dad either by phoning or text?

Darsad

Your not going to get much traction unless you give some background or details as to why you dont want your daughter contacting her Dad

January

Why have you such an issue with her phoning her dad? Just because you two don't communicate except by text doesn't mean she should have to refrain from contacting him when she is not with him. Or are you jealous that she contacts her dad but probably doesn't ring you when she's with him?

Orion

I also fail to see why she should tell you if she's talking to her father. He may not be your partner anymore but he's still her father and she should be allowed to talk to him anytime she wants and not need your permission on knowledge.

She may be a child but she's still entitled to her privacy as well as having a reasonable expectation for your trust. If you try to limit that privacy and force her to start hiding things from you you're already lost that trust and you are damaging your relationship with your child. In my opinion you should rethink the restrictions that you have put on her.

MagicMarker

You're being a bit ridiculous OP. Her dad has said she can she can call anytime, so what is the problem exactly?

Orion

Let's not name-call please. You could have made the exact same point without the first 6 words.

freshpopcorn

You daughter us at that age now when she's becoming a young woman. If she feels she isn't even allowed to talk to her dad. Wait until boyfriends come along and she'll really hide it from you because of how your acting now.

Ham Sambo

MoonDancer wrote: »

Why should she ask your permission to phone her dad at all?
My kids can ring their grandparents and uncles anytime they want. Their dad isn't in the picture, so I always tell them they can chat to family anytime they want.
I don't see why you want her to tell you before she rings her dad.

Moondancer, read her post again, it's obvious that this couple are separated and their daughter is living with the Mum, their daughter is only 12 years old and should not be contacting her father without her Mums permission.

GarIT

I think you need to calm down, apologize to her and let her know that she can talk to her dad if she wants. You should ask her to put a passcode on the phone so you can't get tempted again. She has just as much right to talk to her dad as she does you, if you can't accept that she is going to eventually resent you greatly. If this is difficult for you I think you need to talk to your doctor about it.

GarIT

Ham Sambo wrote: »

Moondancer, read her post again, it's obvious that this couple are separated and their daughter is living with the Mum, their daughter is only 12 years old and should not be contacting her father without her Mums permission.

Why not? We know nothing about the father or the reason the mother doesn't want them talking.

Just note as well, the daughter is 12, she is old enough to tell a judge which parent she wants to have custody. Trying to stop a child talking to their father is probably the next worst thing you can ever do if you want to win a custody case.

Unless the fater is a convicted criminal/drug dealer the child should have access to unlimited private conversations with her father.

meoklmrk91

I also don't see the issue with her ringing her father, he is after all her father and tbh I think it's important that you encourage that relationship as opposed to trying to get her to get permission. Unless there is something else going on then I don't see why she shouldn't be allowed to talk to her Dad. I would sit her down and tell her that she's allowed to talk to her Dad whenever she wants but that if anymore phone logs or text messages are deleted then the phone will be confiscated for a period of time, it's important that you know who she is texting and ringing at this age but she is getting that bit older and does her right to privacy. She obviously feels that this is something she has to hide from you and that is definitely not a good thing, an open dialog would be much better as opposed to encouraging her to be secretive, just every few days maybe ask her if she was talking to her Dad, is he keeping well etc.

Finally I will just pose this question to you, how would you feel if when she was with her father he made her ask permission everything she wanted to ring you? It's not something I would be comfortable with anyway. My worry would be that if you keep this up she would become resentful towards you for not encouraging her relationship with her father. Pick your battles OP, she is heading into some difficult years and you don't want to make them any worse.

January

Ham Sambo wrote: »

Moondancer, read her post again, it's obvious that this couple are separated and their daughter is living with the Mum, their daughter is only 12 years old and should not be contacting her father without her Mums permission.

Why should she not be contacting her father without her mums permission?

Paddy Cow

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

Finally I will just pose this question to you, how would you feel if when she was with her father he made her ask permission everything she wanted to ring you? It's not something I would be comfortable with anyway.

I was going to say the same thing. Unless there is something unsavoury about the father, like he is an addict or criminal or something else that would make him a bad influence, I don't understand why she would need permission to ring him?

By all means at 12 it is responsible of you to be keeping tabs on her phone but there has to be some leniency when it comes to her father. I'd be with the father on this one. His daughter should be able to contact him whenever she wants.

It sounds like there is animosity between you and your ex as you say that you only communicate through text. Your daughter is old enough to pick up on this and she might feel like she has to keep her contact with her dad a "secret" so that she doesn't cause trouble. If you make a big deal out of this, it will only cement in her mind that she is doing something "wrong", when all she wants to do is communicate with her dad. As someone else said, it could lead to resentment.

SamAK

We need a reply from the OP before this can go any further to be honest.......

maguic24

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

My 12 year old is very grown up (or so she think's!) and has a phone and Tablet. Myself and her father are seperated 3 and a half year's. She had a phone that wasn't working very well before xmas and she decided she wanted a new mobile for xmas. So around Nov I checked her old mobile and found she'd been phoning her dad - Now I have no problem with he talking to him but it's just the Secrecy that freck's me out! We had word's and she said she couldn't remember the phone call's and there were a few text's that I also questioned!

So Before Xmas I told her if she wanted a new phone There would be some ground rule's - She must tell me if she's phoning her dad, she must not delete any history details and no text's are to be deleted either.

I have just asked to look at the phone and There is no call history at all and the first text message sent was 8th Jan...............I checked her phone over the new year and there were calls to her father and texts too to him and other people but nothing now! I am so cross but feel I can't bring it up and she is frecking out (obviously know's I have seen them earlier than now!)

I don't know what to do - he father dosen't back me up as when I told her before I need to know BEFORE she contact's him she must have text him about it and he text me saying she can contact him anytime! (we don't talk and just communicate through text!)

I feel like tearing my hair out! I honestly don't know how to deal with this - Can I get a log of her calls and Text's from the phone company just to keep an eye in the background?

I think you are being very unfair! She should be able to call her father without consulting you! Maybe she is afraid to tell you because you might react badly. After reading what you posted, it's sounds like you don't get on with her father and would react badly. I think you need to back off a bit to be honest.

You are totally over-reacting. I think the fact that you don't trust her and are checking her phone is way out of line.

Moonbeam

Is it the secrecy of her hiding it or the fact that she is calling him that bothers you?

My dad was always the one person that I was allowed to ring no matter what and didn't even have to ask.

Ham Sambo

GarIT wrote: »

Why not? We know nothing about the father or the reason the mother doesn't want them talking.

Just note as well, the daughter is 12, she is old enough to tell a judge which parent she wants to have custody. Trying to stop a child talking to their father is probably the next worst thing you can ever do if you want to win a custody case.

Unless the fater is a convicted criminal/drug dealer the child should have access to unlimited private conversations with her father.

@GarIT. You said it yourself, the child is only 12 years old so any responsible parent should know what numbers or web sites their child visits or calls, it's the parent that's in control not the child, when she calls her Dad should be a matter for both parents to discuss and not the child.

Mint Aero

Jesus. You two only talk via text, great stuff. It's her dad, you should be happy he wants to talk to his daughter whatever about the issues you have with him, unless he's cooking meth or something.

freshpopcorn

Ham Sambo wrote: »

@GarIT. You said it yourself, the child is only 12 years old so any responsible parent should know what numbers or web sites their child visits or calls, it's the parent that's in control not the child, when she calls her Dad should be a matter for both parents to discuss and not the child.

The child should have every right to pick her phone up and call the dad. There's nothing wrong with it.
Its important that the the girl has a good relationship with both the mother and father. It doesn't matter if the parents don't get on. The child should be encouraged to communicate with her dad not discouraged.

Ham Sambo

freshpopcorn wrote: »

The child should have every right to pick her phone up and call the dad. There's nothing wrong with it.
Its important that the the girl has a good relationship with both the mother and father. It doesn't matter if the parents don't get on. The child should be encouraged to communicate with her dad not discouraged.

But how can you pass judgement when you don't know the parties involved, it would be up to the child's Mum to tell us the background, the point I am making is allowing this child or any 12 year old to have free access to a mobile phone and especially if it has internet access. If she needs to call her father then an arrangement I am sure can be made between father and mother regarding times etc.

retro:electro

Well this was an interesting read!!

freshpopcorn

Ham Sambo wrote: »

But how can you pass judgement when you don't know the parties involved, it would be up to the child's Mum to tell us the background, the point I am making is allowing this child or any 12 year old to have free access to a mobile phone and especially if it has internet access. If she needs to call her father then an arrangement I am sure can be made between father and mother regarding times etc.

She should be allowed to contact her dad when ever she wants. The father has access to the child so he can't be bad. Preventing a 12 year old girl from contacting her dad is bad.

MoonDancer

Ham Sambo wrote: »

Moondancer, read her post again, it's obvious that this couple are separated and their daughter is living with the Mum, their daughter is only 12 years old and should not be contacting her father without her Mums permission.

Excuse me, I have read her post and I replied with my opinion on the matter.
I see no reason a child should EVER have to ask for permission to phone their father.
I am separated and my children would never have to ask if they can phone their dad.

January

MoonDancer wrote: »

Excuse me, I have read her post and I replied with my opinion on the matter.
I see no reason a child should EVER have to ask for permission to phone their father.
I am separated and my children would never have to ask if they can phone their dad.

This.

The OP is monitoring her daughter's phone usage so she does not have access to the phone unlimited. The OP knows her daughter is phoning her father but still has a problem with her doing it.

animum

Hi OP,

To answer your questions, if her phone is credit then you cant see the calls she makes.
If its a bill phone and i would imagine you are paying for it then you can see who she calls.
Other than your daughter being honest with you, or you sneaking a look, there is no other way to know.

This is a very delicate situation and I read that the main thing is your daughter and her father being 'sneaky', which in my opinion is very wrong.

Parents although seperated need to agree on rules and boundaries togther and stick at them togther.
Yes she can call her father when she likes, but I dont think that is the issue here. its you have asked her for honesty and transparency and you are not getting it, and her father is helping her. And i can fully understand why you want to pull your hair out.

If perhaps you send the father a text explaining, that its not the fact that she is contacting him,its the sneakiness behind it. And lack of trust between a parent and her child going into the teenage years just spells touble.

Its my tuppence worth anyway.
Best of luck and try to keep your relationship with your daughter as best as you can, its her safety you are worried about, or maybe I am the only person, who read that from your post.

SamAK

Looks like OP wasn't up for any further discussion on the matter!?

Paddy Cow

animum wrote: »

Hi OP,

To answer your questions, if her phone is credit then you cant see the calls she makes.
If its a bill phone and i would imagine you are paying for it then you can see who she calls.
Other than your daughter being honest with you, or you sneaking a look, there is no other way to know.

This is a very delicate situation and I read that the main thing is your daughter and her father being 'sneaky', which in my opinion is very wrong.

Parents although seperated need to agree on rules and boundaries togther and stick at them togther.
Yes she can call her father when she likes, but I dont think that is the issue here. its you have asked her for honesty and transparency and you are not getting it, and her father is helping her. And i can fully understand why you want to pull your hair out.

If perhaps you send the father a text explaining, that its not the fact that she is contacting him,its the sneakiness behind it. And lack of trust between a parent and her child going into the teenage years just spells touble.

Its my tuppence worth anyway.
Best of luck and try to keep your relationship with your daughter as best as you can, its her safety you are worried about, or maybe I am the only person, who read that from your post.

OP I don't know if you are still reading this thread and I am directing my reply to this post at you, as it reiterates something I said in a previous post. I know that as your daughter is young you need to supervise her phone usage. However, unless there is a reason why you would mistrust her father, there is no reason why she should have to ask you for permission every time she wants to contact him.

He is her father. Sometimes she will want to talk to you and sometimes she will want to talk to her father. You cannot schedule when phone calls take place as you cannot schedule the emotions of a child. Would you be happy if when your daughter is in her father's care, he was reading all the texts sent between you and your daughter and was not only monitoring calls but making your daugher ask permission before she could call you?

I can understand you felt that your daughter and your ex were being sneaky but really they weren't. At 12 your daughter is still a child but not in the sense that she will tell you about every detail that happened in her day. She is a child entering the teenage years where she grows to be independant of you both. Sometimes she will turn to you for advice and sometimes she will turn to her father. If you make her feel that contacting her father without permission is "wrong", it will set up barriers between you.

As I have said before, your daughter is old enough to have picked up on the animosity between you and your ex and may feel that her contact with her Dad is "wrong", which is why she is hiding it from you. I hate to ask but have to, why are you upset that your daughter is contacting her Dad? Is a part of you afraid that you will lose your daughter if she is contacting her Dad?

I don't know your circumstances but from the little information you have given us, your ex is a part of your daughter's life and you are trying to restrict access between them. Unless you have good reason for this, let your daughter have a relationship with her father or it could backfire on you.

animum

Paddy Cow wrote: »

OP I don't know if you are still reading this thread and I am directing my reply to this post at you, as it reiterates something I said in a previous post. I know that as your daughter is young you need to supervise her phone usage. However, unless there is a reason why you would mistrust her father, there is no reason why she should have to ask you for permission every time she wants to contact him.

He is her father. Sometimes she will want to talk to you and sometimes she will want to talk to her father. You cannot schedule when phone calls take place as you cannot schedule the emotions of a child. Would you be happy if when your daughter is in her father's care, he was reading all the texts sent between you and your daughter and was not only monitoring calls but making your daugher ask permission before she could call you?

I can understand you felt that your daughter and your ex were being sneaky but really they weren't. At 12 your daughter is still a child but not in the sense that she will tell you about every detail that happened in her day. She is a child entering the teenage years where she grows to be independant of you both. Sometimes she will turn to you for advice and sometimes she will turn to her father. If you make her feel that contacting her father without permission is "wrong", it will set up barriers between you.

As I have said before, your daughter is old enough to have picked up on the animosity between you and your ex and may feel that her contact with her Dad is "wrong", which is why she is hiding it from you. I hate to ask but have to, why are you upset that your daughter is contacting her Dad? Is a part of you afraid that you will lose your daughter if she is contacting her Dad?

I don't know your circumstances but from the little information you have given us, your ex is a part of your daughter's life and you are trying to restrict access between them. Unless you have good reason for this, let your daughter have a relationship with her father or it could backfire on you.

She never once said she didn't want them to have a relationship...nor does she want them to stop contact.

I would take a guess she came on to the parenting section seeking advice on controlling a mobile belongings to her almost teenage daughter.

She said she doesn't mind them in contact, she mentions, there was contact with other people too.

Why is everyone lecturing the woman on her relationship with the father. If I was op I wouldn't come back and read this either, because there are not many replies answering her question....only people asking her business with the father..and he is supporting the daughter, in being sneaky...when there were conditions laid down in order to get a new phone.

maguic24

animum wrote: »

She never once said she didn't want them to have a relationship...nor does she want them to stop contact.

I would take a guess she came on to the parenting section seeking advice on controlling a mobile belongings to her almost teenage daughter.

She said she doesn't mind them in contact, she mentions, there was contact with other people too.

Why is everyone lecturing the woman on her relationship with the father. If I was op I wouldn't come back and read this either, because there are not many replies answering her question....only people asking her business with the father..and he is supporting the daughter, in being sneaky...when there were conditions laid down in order to get a new phone.

How is the daughter being sneaky, she has 2 parents?!!!! One parent should not have the authority to say when their daughter can call the other parent. It's ridiculous! Like other people have already said, imagine if the roles were reversed and the father was acting like the mother in this instance. The daughter should be able to contact either parent at all times, there is nothing sneaky about that!!! If she chooses to ring her dad, that should be fine, she shouldn't have to look for permission. Why does the dad have less rights in this case, it is very very very unfair?????!!!!

I would never ever keep my children from contacting their dad and I hope that he would do the same!!! I guess I don't need to worry as I am female which automatically gives me the right to dictate when my kids can see their dad or at least that's the vibe I am getting from your last post!!! I'm actually in shock with how blatantly sexist you are being.

animum

maguic24 wrote: »

How is the daughter being sneaky, she has 2 parents?!!!! One parent should not have the authority to say when their daughter can call the other parent. It's ridiculous! Like other people have already said, imagine if the roles were reversed dand the father was acting like the mother in this instance. The daughter should be able to contact either parent at all times, there is nothing sneaky about that!!! If she chooses to ring her dad, that should be fine, she shouldn't have to look for permission. Why does the dad have less rights in this case, it is very very very unfair?????!!!!

I would never ever keep my children from contacting their dad and I hope that he would do the same!!! I guess I don't need to worry as I am female which automatically gives me the right to dictate when my kids can see their dad or at least that's the vibe I am getting from your last post!!! I'm actually in shock with how blatantly sexist you are being.

Didn't once say mother has more rights, I actually said in an earlier post that rules should be set and agreed in both households.

All I am sayin is the mother asked how to control her daughter's phone, giving the example of her deleting calls to her father, as well as to others...everyone jumps down her throat and asks what's her problem, and let her have a relationship with the dad....not once does she say she wants to stop their relationship...

All she wants to do is control the child's phone usage...

And I get called sexist.

Major overreaction to be honest. My thoughts would be the exact same if it was the father who lay down the rules of phone usage, and the mother was relaxed about the rules.

Fact is child is deleting history, who says it's only the dad she is deleting, who says it's not another boy that is saved on her phone at dad...we don't know.
Mom isn't comfortable with child being sneaky on her phone. That the issue here..

SamAK

animum wrote: »

Fact is child is deleting history, who says it's only the dad she is deleting, who says it's not another boy that is saved on her phone at dad...we don't know.
Mom isn't comfortable with child being sneaky on her phone. That the issue here..

Well we won't know a dang thing unless the OP gives us more detail, in which case we'd be in a better position to give our opinions and help her deal with the issue!

Not sure why the radio silence, maybe she's a busy person....

sawdoubters

I don't think you should get her to tell you if she phones her dad you should welcome that he show an interest
you are going to drive a wedge between you
and her

I think your still angry at the dad

but you should not put children in the middle

she probably does not tell you because she knows you will be angry

many fathers don't call their kids,your lucky he does

animum

SamAK wrote: »

Well we won't know a dang thing unless the OP gives us more detail, in which case we'd be in a better position to give our opinions and help her deal with the issue!

Not sure why the radio silence, maybe she's a busy person....

From what I gather she has asked 2 things...

I'm brief, how can she see calls etc on her daughter phone...

And second issue is the father not supporting her when the daughter is not going along with the ground rules...

We answered about the call log..
And we suggested talkin to the father explaining the situation...

The op has been almost accused of stopping her child's relationship with the child's father.

Thing is, if parents were together, and rule was no deleting of history on the phone...then both parents would be upset...one rule for both homes, no history to be deleted...irrelevant of who is being called..

As I said, that's the impression I got from the op, maybe I picked it up wrong, maybe she is jealous of their relationship, who knows, I am going on what she actually said, not what I may think to read between the lines.

maguic24

animum wrote: »

Didn't once say mother has more rights, I actually said in an earlier post that rules should be set and agreed in both households.

All I am sayin is the mother asked how to control her daughter's phone, giving the example of her deleting calls to her father, as well as to others...everyone jumps down her throat and asks what's her problem, and let her have a relationship with the dad....not once does she say she wants to stop their relationship...

All she wants to do is control the child's phone usage...

And I get called sexist.

Major overreaction to be honest. My thoughts would be the exact same if it was the father who lay down the rules of phone usage, and the mother was relaxed about the rules.

Fact is child is deleting history, who says it's only the dad she is deleting, who says it's not another boy that is saved on her phone at dad...we don't know.
Mom isn't comfortable with child being sneaky on her phone. That the issue here..

I am sticking to my guns, I have read the OP's original post and I think she's well out of line.

You have interpreted differently, I just can't see it from your angle. I have re-read it twice and I still have the same opinion. I think we will have to agree to disagree on this issue to be honest or else we'll end up going round in circles.

animum

maguic24 wrote: »

I am sticking to my guns, I have read the OP's original post and I think she's well out of line.

You have interpreted differently, I just can't see it from your angle. I have re-read it twice and I still have the same opinion. I think we will have to agree to disagree on this issue to be honest or else we'll end up going round in circles.

Ok..fair enough...but I certainly didn't mean to come across as sexist...not in the slightest. Parents are parents...gender has nothin to do with it in my opinion.

Paddy Cow

animum wrote: »

She never once said she didn't want them to have a relationship...nor does she want them to stop contact.

No she doesn't want to stop contact but she does want to control it by having her daughter ask permission every time she wants to call her dad.

animum wrote: »

I would take a guess she came on to the parenting section seeking advice on controlling a mobile belongings to her almost teenage daughter.

As has been said already, at 12 it is responsible of the mother to control who her daughter is contacting. Unless the father is a bad influence, the general consensus is that she shouldn't be controlling phone contact.

animum wrote: »

She said she doesn't mind them in contact, she mentions, there was contact with other people too.

She mentions other people in very few words but elaborates in paragraphs about the father, so that indicates that she is far more upset about the contact the girl has with her father, than anyone else.

animum wrote: »

Why is everyone lecturing the woman on her relationship with the father. If I was op I wouldn't come back and read this either, because there are not many replies answering her question....only people asking her business with the father..and he is supporting the daughter, in being sneaky...when there were conditions laid down in order to get a new phone.

Maybe the op came on here expecting to have her behaviour validated and it was a shock to the system to find out that people in general (including other separated mothers) think she over reacted?

If you read the op, it's clear that her daughter didn't start hiding her contact with her dad until the mother looked at her phone history and in her own words "freaked out". She said that it was the secrecy that made her freak out and that is what everyone is questioning. Why would a mother consider her daughter contacting her dad a "secret"? Why should a child feel like they have to ask permission to contact a parent and if they don't, they are doing something wrong and sneaky?

If her 12 year old daughter was hiding a relationship with an older boy, then I could understand the mother freaking out. Talking to her dad? I doubt that any child considers talking to a parent a "secret". The daughter originally left her contact history with her father on the phone and only started to keep contact with her dad a secret after her mother freaked out. That to me sets off alarm bells. After that she started clearing her history. I think it is incredibly sad that a child feels like they have to contact a parent in secret.

As the op has said herself, her and her ex do not have good communication. She texted him explaining that she wanted her daughter to have set times to call him and he rightly told her to cop on. This is why we are asking about the father. Unless there is a reason why the father should not be talking to his daughter, the mother has no right to interfere in their relationship.

As far as we know, before the mother "freaking out" and "having words" with her daughter, the daughter didn't hide her phone history. Now she feels like she has to hide it. This is not good. Anyone can see that.

Timmythedonkey

Sorry for delay in repling! Just to answer a few of your issue's...

!. She is 12 - I thought we were supposed to monitor our children's phone use???? Regardless of who there phoning! I hate the fact that she's deleting phone activity history and text messages! Why would you do that - and I have said this to her and told her I have no problem in the past with her contacting him but she is not to delete history from her phone!
2. No, her father is not a druggie or anything of the like but he is definatly 'Messed up' and has had a couple of break down's in the last couple of year's.
3. He is DEFINATLY poisining (maybe a strong word but can't think of another word to describe what is going on!) her mind against me - I have read text last year saying 'don't worry about her, she's just in a bad mood at the moment and don't take no notice of her' Lot's more example's of this kind of thing being said.............
4. She is very much against me and she has Zero respect for me - I am worried about the future and how will I handle her when she is 16.
5. I have no problem with her contacting her father during the week - but when it's secretive and she won't 'own' up to phoning him I do have a problem with it!

6. Just to let you know the hight of secrecty (to me) or 'conveniatly forgetting'..... She got a new phone cover in the post last week, as I was popping into school I brought it in and she said she didn't know where her phone was (they were going to there Dad's house that day) I said I would make sure when I got home that she had packed it. When I got home I checked everywhere and not a sign of it????? I went to pick her up after school and the teacher hand's me her phone saying she had been caught with it and had confiscated it!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do feel if I don't get a handle on this secrecy now I won't be able to handle her At ALL when she's 15-16 plus!

maguic24

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

Sorry for delay in repling! Just to answer a few of your issue's...

!. She is 12 - I thought we were supposed to monitor our children's phone use???? Regardless of who there phoning! I hate the fact that she's deleting phone activity history and text messages! Why would you do that - and I have said this to her and told her I have no problem in the past with her contacting him but she is not to delete history from her phone!
2. No, her father is not a druggie or anything of the like but he is definatly 'Messed up' and has had a couple of break down's in the last couple of year's.
3. He is DEFINATLY poisining (maybe a strong word but can't think of another word to describe what is going on!) her mind against me - I have read text last year saying 'don't worry about her, she's just in a bad mood at the moment and don't take no notice of her' Lot's more example's of this kind of thing being said.............
4. She is very much against me and she has Zero respect for me - I am worried about the future and how will I handle her when she is 16.
5. I have no problem with her contacting her father during the week - but when it's secretive and she won't 'own' up to phoning him I do have a problem with it!

6. Just to let you know the hight of secrecty (to me) or 'conveniatly forgetting'..... She got a new phone cover in the post last week, as I was popping into school I brought it in and she said she didn't know where her phone was (they were going to there Dad's house that day) I said I would make sure when I got home that she had packed it. When I got home I checked everywhere and not a sign of it????? I went to pick her up after school and the teacher hand's me her phone saying she had been caught with it and had confiscated it!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do feel if I don't get a handle on this secrecy now I won't be able to handle her At ALL when she's 15-16 plus!

I'm not trying to be smart and please don't take this up the wrong way but what will happen when she's 18? You want her to trust you therefore you have to trust her. You are only pushing her away by what you are doing at the moment. There will be boys in the near future, you are just going to have to deal with this.

Slightly off topic but I went to a mixed school and met my best friend at the age of 12. I'm female, he's male we are still best friends 13 years on. Imagine my mam was checking my phone and decided that I shouldn't be texting or talking to boys? I know you have her best interests at heart but sometimes the apron strings have to be cut. You'll win some and you'll lose some. I would have been mortified if my mam had been checking my phone at that age. I never deleted my messages or anything but I definitely would have if I knew my mam was checking my phone. It's a teenage thing, you're not going to see eye to eye for a couple years, it happens. Her friends will become more important to her and so will her privacy. She'll see the light in her 20's and you'll be pals again. Cycle of life. Remember when you were a teenager?

mitosis

Put her phone on bill pay if you want to track her. Alternatively you could work on your relationship with her and build some trust - at the moment it would seem she doesn't trust you.

maguic24

mitosis wrote: »

Put her phone on bill pay if you want to track her. Alternatively you could work on your relationship with her and build some trust - at the moment it would seem she doesn't trust you.

+10. I second this!

Tramps Like Us

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

Sorry for delay in repling! Just to answer a few of your issue's...

!. She is 12 - I thought we were supposed to monitor our children's phone use???? Regardless of who there phoning! I hate the fact that she's deleting phone activity history and text messages! Why would you do that - and I have said this to her and told her I have no problem in the past with her contacting him but she is not to delete history from her phone!
2. No, her father is not a druggie or anything of the like but he is definatly 'Messed up' and has had a couple of break down's in the last couple of year's.
3. He is DEFINATLY poisining (maybe a strong word but can't think of another word to describe what is going on!) her mind against me - I have read text last year saying 'don't worry about her, she's just in a bad mood at the moment and don't take no notice of her' Lot's more example's of this kind of thing being said.............
4. She is very much against me and she has Zero respect for me - I am worried about the future and how will I handle her when she is 16.
5. I have no problem with her contacting her father during the week - but when it's secretive and she won't 'own' up to phoning him I do have a problem with it!

6. Just to let you know the hight of secrecty (to me) or 'conveniatly forgetting'..... She got a new phone cover in the post last week, as I was popping into school I brought it in and she said she didn't know where her phone was (they were going to there Dad's house that day) I said I would make sure when I got home that she had packed it. When I got home I checked everywhere and not a sign of it????? I went to pick her up after school and the teacher hand's me her phone saying she had been caught with it and had confiscated it!!!!!!!!!!!!

I do feel if I don't get a handle on this secrecy now I won't be able to handle her At ALL when she's 15-16 plus!

You will make things worse the way you are going. Someone having breakdowns is no reason to call them "messed up" or any reason why he should not speak with his daughter.

January

That's not poisoning her, that's him saying 'oh maybe your mum is having a bad day and that's why you feel she's lashing out at you'

ElleEm

OP, I agree with the other posters. You build up trust through respect. You have to understand that your little girl is growing up. She is probably deleting her phone history to avoid you going off on one about her contacting her dad, which should be encouraged, not discouraged. Yes, as a parent you should be monitoring her phone usage, but you get to live with her, she should be allowed contact her dad frequently without having to ask you first. I agree with Trampslikeus, having a breakdown does not make him messed up. I think it is really disrespectful that you would say that.

Your daughter is a growing young woman. She deserves to have as much contact with her PARENT as she likes, obviously as long as it is not at 1am or during school hours. They are the sorts of things you should be controlling, not when she speaks to her dad. Maybe part of her disrespecting you and not following your orders is because she doesn't understand or respect them. This will continue and get worse if you do not start compromising with her. You need to give her some control back on her own life. You seem a bit "my way or the highway" which absolutely does not work with teens/ pre teens.

Also- January was spot on above. Your daughter was probably complaining to her dad about your moods, and he was probably just responding by showing that he was hearing what she was saying. It is hardly poisoning her against you.

SamAK

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

3. He is DEFINATLY poisining (maybe a strong word but can't think of another word to describe what is going on!) her mind against me - I have read text last year saying 'don't worry about her, she's just in a bad mood at the moment and don't take no notice of her' Lot's more example's of this kind of thing being said.............

From that example i'd suggest that 'poisoning' is a bit strong. I think you are expecting some kind of 'perfect' relationship with your daughter and i'm sorry to say that's just not realistic. She's entering her teenage years and no matter how brilliant a parent you are, there will always be friction. It will get worse before it gets better, but it's not her dad's fault. She's looking for someone to confide in that isn't you. Don't take offence to that. I'm assuming she lives with you full time? If so, then it's even more important that she has someone like her dad to talk to.

Your daughter needs two parents, and she needs to be able to talk to either one about the other and vent her feelings. Kids, especially 'tweens' and teens are a melting pot of emotion and turmoil. it's a natural thing.

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

She is very much against me and she has Zero respect for me - I am worried about the future and how will I handle her when she is 16.

Being overly controlling and demanding total transparency will most likely lead to even more resentment against you. I speak from personal experience. Kids want to be independent and free from parental control. If she was going out at all hours and not telling you where or who with and coming back stinking of fags and booze then you'd have a right to be concerned, but owning a phone is different.

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

I have no problem with her contacting her father during the week - but when it's secretive and she won't 'own' up to phoning him I do have a problem with it!

Maybe she has a problem with you having a problem with it? If you didn't react the way you have then maybe things would be different.

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

Just to let you know the height of secrecy (to me) or 'conveniatly forgetting'..... She got a new phone cover in the post last week, as I was popping into school I brought it in and she said she didn't know where her phone was (they were going to there Dad's house that day) I said I would make sure when I got home that she had packed it. When I got home I checked everywhere and not a sign of it????? I went to pick her up after school and the teacher hand's me her phone saying she had been caught with it and had confiscated it!!!

I've lost count of the number of times I got a phone confiscated in school, Along with everyone else. It's a symbol of coming of age and a certain 'loosening' of parental control. it's also a symbol of status among other students..quite normal.

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

I do feel if I don't get a handle on this secrecy now I won't be able to handle her At ALL when she's 15-16 plus!

It will only intensify as she goes through her teenage years until she's 18/19/20. Then things should settle down, the relationship between you will improve and you'll laugh together and remember when she used to hide her phone from you..

I was caught in the crossfire of an extremely messy divorce between my parents, and it did damage me to an extent. It's horrific, being 10+ and not knowing what the hell is happening and why mum and dad hate each other. I would never, ever wish it upon any child.

I mean all of this message to be constructive, and I hope it can perhaps help you to see things from a different angle and re-adjust your perspective. Be aware that as your daughter gets older you're going to have to make compromises and allow her a certain amount of freedom and independence. Teenagers CRAVE independence. It's just the way it is. Be supportive, be open, trust her and she will have no reason to resent your control.

Above all, i'd like to point out that some kids never get the chance to have any sort of relationship with their father. Like my brother and sister(different father to me), their dad is a deadbeat alcoholic who has never achieved anything and never will. He has no responsibility, no job, and no idea of what being a father figure is about. It breaks my heart because I have to be big brother and a kind of 'dad' to them as well. The fact that your kid has a dad that is at least willing to have them visit and keeps in contact with her is much, much more than a lot of children get.

Parenting is very complex and difficult, but it will get better. I wish you the very best and hope that we have been helpful in some way....boards is a wonderful place to gather opinion and perspective. The more heads, the better!

retro:electro

OP, the message you read from her father reading take no notice of her, "she is in a bad mood", is not him poisoning her mind at all, and it's quite shocking that you would think that. To me, that sounds like what any father would say when their child is complaining about their parent, regardless of their relationship status. Clearly from reading that text you should have gauged that she is having some sort of relationship problem with you and finds you somewhat unapproachable.

I think you need to chill out a bit and let her call her dad whenever she wants. If he is "messed up", she will figure that out herself. You're doing neither yourself or your daughter any favours by your seemingly irrational behaviour.

Dick phelan

Frankly OP i feel sorry for the dad in this case, why has he not got the right to a private conversation with his daughter, you sometimes ask advice from one parent and not the other, How would you feel if her dad was reading everything you said to her or he wasn't allowing her to ring you whenever in private. Clearly their is a deep lack of trust between you and your daughter and unless you alter the restrictions it's likely you will drift apart and she becomes even more secretive. Lastly on your points about her father, him having a breakdown a few years ago is no reason to restrict your daughters access to him, unless he is a bad or dangerous influence on her and that does not sound the case, also you say he is poisoning her that comment was like anything a parent would say to a child when they talk about the other parent giving out to them ect. If anything her dad must feel you are poisoning her, making it seem like its some big deal to talk to her father, that she needs your say so to phone him. Your both her parents and she should be able to talk to either of you as often as she wishes without the other parent needing to know every detail of the conversation, do you tell your ex everything you and your daughter talk about?

Orion

Timmythedonkey wrote: »

Sorry for delay in repling! Just to answer a few of your issue's...

!. She is 12 - I thought we were supposed to monitor our children's phone use???? Regardless of who there phoning! I hate the fact that she's deleting phone activity history and text messages! Why would you do that - and I have said this to her and told her I have no problem in the past with her contacting him but she is not to delete history from her phone!

Let's look at this alone. You have the right to monitor but if it's in relation to her father not control. There is a huge difference. You said in the OP that you "found she'd been phoning her dad " and "She must tell me if she's phoning her dad". You still need to answer why she must do so - he is her father - she has every right to keep in touch with him.

Timmythedonkey wrote:

2. No, her father is not a druggie or anything of the like but he is definatly 'Messed up' and has had a couple of break down's in the last couple of year's.

So? Is that a reason that his daughter should be prevented from keeping in touch with him? Maybe having access to talk to his daughter could help him.

Timmythedonkey wrote:

3. He is DEFINATLY poisining (maybe a strong word but can't think of another word to describe what is going on!) her mind against me - I have read text last year saying 'don't worry about her, she's just in a bad mood at the moment and don't take no notice of her' Lot's more example's of this kind of thing being said.............

How about what you are saying about him here? What do you say to your daughter about him apart from telling her that she must ask your permission to contact him. There is an element of pot vs kettle here.

Timmythedonkey wrote:

4. She is very much against me and she has Zero respect for me - I am worried about the future and how will I handle her when she is 16.

5. I have no problem with her contacting her father during the week - but when it's secretive and she won't 'own' up to phoning him I do have a problem with it!

6. Just to let you know the hight of secrecty (to me) or 'conveniatly forgetting'..... She got a new phone cover in the post last week, as I was popping into school I brought it in and she said she didn't know where her phone was (they were going to there Dad's house that day) I said I would make sure when I got home that she had packed it. When I got home I checked everywhere and not a sign of it????? I went to pick her up after school and the teacher hand's me her phone saying she had been caught with it and had confiscated it!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm going to take these three together and I'm going to be quite blunt here - I don't blame her. You are showing complete lack of trust and respect for her and are attempting to control her relationship with her father. Of course she's going to react to that. As I said in my first response to this thread you are damaging your own relationship with your child and you need to show her some trust and respect if you want to regain that relationship. There is currently no trust between the two of you. You are the adult here - you need to start showing some trust and respect if you want to get any back. Respect is earned not given freely and 12 year olds deserve as much respect as an adult. Maybe if you had not tried to control her contacting her father then she wouldn't have felt the need to hide it from you and this wouldn't be an issue at all.

My opinion is that you should remove any barriers from her contacting her father and try to rebuild your relationship with her. You can't lose if you try this as neither of you currently trust each other.

silverbolt

Ham Sambo wrote: »

@GarIT. You said it yourself, the child is only 12 years old so any responsible parent should know what numbers or web sites their child visits or calls, it's the parent that's in control not the child, when she calls her Dad should be a matter for both parents to discuss and not the child.

Really? Monitoring the phone usage yes - so shes not ringing premium numbers or talking to people she shouldnt.

But her father? Atm this just stinks of mom being petty and spiteful - she and he dont talk so she enforces this on he daughter and then wonders why the daughter naturally enough wants to talk to her dad.

I think you need to be the better person and let go a little. Especially if your just being petty towards him and using your daughter as a weapon against him (which does happen)

Also think on this - shes 12 - you tell her no you cant, her father says yes you can - who do you think she is going to be going to in future?