Suspected Neospora

jaymla627

Found aborted calf in cubicle house this morning, second one this year along with a cow that came bulling yesterday that was scanned 4 months incalf, vet came out reckons its nespora got all three blooded.
Anyone with dogs going around the yard etc be very careful their the only way it can be transmitted to pregnant cows, on reading up on it, it seems to be a seriously damaging disease, no way to vaccinate it for it along with that fact once a cow becomes infected she has it for life so all resulting pregnancies have a high chance of resulting in abortions was wondering what was going to snooker us in 2014 think i found my answer.

karj28

jaymla627 wrote: »

Found aborted calf in cubicle house this morning, second one this year along with a cow that came bulling yesterday that was scanned 4 months incalf, vet came out reckons its nespora got all three blooded.
Anyone with dogs going around the yard etc be very careful their the only way it can be transmitted to pregnant cows, on reading up on it, it seems to be a seriously damaging disease, no way to vaccinate it for it along with that fact once a cow becomes infected she has it for life so all resulting pregnancies have a high chance of resulting in abortions was wondering what was going to snooker us in 2014 think i found my answer.

Just wondering if you got any results back from your tests. we are in the same position, 2 cattle aborted, 1 heifer, 1 cow within 2 weeks of eachother. And we noticed another cow bulling today that was scanned in calf in october. We got the bloods back for the first one, the heifer, nespora was neg but lepto anti bodies positive, and salmonella inconclusive, the vet doesn't think she has lepto because we vaccinated in nov for lepto and salmonella so think it came up as positive cos anti bodies still high. we had our second cow abort this morning. The difference between the 2 was the heifer was springing down for a good while before she aborted, but this one wasn't. We sent the fetus to lab today, formed properly and everything. both animals at 8 months. anyone else having problems, we have heard a few farmers are having problems?

jaymla627

karj28 wrote: »

Just wondering if you got any results back from your tests. we are in the same position, 2 cattle aborted, 1 heifer, 1 cow within 2 weeks of eachother. And we noticed another cow bulling today that was scanned in calf in october. We got the bloods back for the first one, the heifer, nespora was neg but lepto anti bodies positive, and salmonella inconclusive, the vet doesn't think she has lepto because we vaccinated in nov for lepto and salmonella so think it came up as positive cos anti bodies still high. we had our second cow abort this morning. The difference between the 2 was the heifer was springing down for a good while before she aborted, but this one wasn't. We sent the fetus to lab today, formed properly and everything. both animals at 8 months. anyone else having problems, we have heard a few farmers are having problems?

Noting yet, if its neospora they can tell straight away in the lab from the fetus affects the brian visibly noticeably along with a few other areas, vet remarked that neospora overtook salmonella in this area as the number one cause of abortions last year.
Do you have dogs around the yard, we have 3 went and got a fencer kit for the dogs working a treat.
To add to this lad locally has had 5 abort and all tests are showing up negative, starting to wonder could the schmallenberg virus be rearing its head again, they don't actually test for it unless you specifically ask

karj28

No, not dogs over in the farm. we have a dog at home alright. our heifer tested neg for neospora, so vet ruled that out. The cow today had a temp so the vet thinks it could be something infectious but then again, the cow was under a bit of stress cos the calf's other leg was down. Have you had any other problems, are you calving already? Started to dread going to the cow shed, we not due to start calving until first week in feb. did you isolate your two animals?

jaymla627

karj28 wrote: »

No, not dogs over in the farm. we have a dog at home alright. our heifer tested neg for neospora, so vet ruled that out. The cow today had a temp so the vet thinks it could be something infectious but then again, the cow was under a bit of stress cos the calf's other leg was down. Have you had any other problems, are you calving already? Started to dread going to the cow shed, we not due to start calving until first week in feb. did you isolate your two animals?

No all the cows are fine and in good form, yeah i threw the 2 of them over to a out-farm with a couple of cull cows, starting in Feb as-well.
Agree with yeah there, actually hoping its not neospora, once a cow gets it she is 5 times more likely to abort in all her future pregnancies, theirs no available vaccine either so its not something you can eradicate

karj28

Our vet has put down schmallenberg as well in the bloods tests today, but aren't the fetus supposed to be deformed or something? Ya our neighbour down the road had 2 abortions .

awaywithyou

karj28 wrote: »

No, not dogs over in the farm. we have a dog at home alright. our heifer tested neg for neospora, so vet ruled that out. The cow today had a temp so the vet thinks it could be something infectious but then again, the cow was under a bit of stress cos the calf's other leg was down. Have you had any other problems, are you calving already? Started to dread going to the cow shed, we not due to start calving until first week in feb. did you isolate your two animals?

Could it be IBR...?

jaymla627

karj28 wrote: »

Our vet has put down schmallenberg as well in the bloods tests today, but aren't the fetus supposed to be deformed or something? Ya our neighbour down the road had 2 abortions .

Their meant to be but its a really complex disease could be another type of it, very little conclusive research has been carried out on the disease.

karj28

testing for that two, but cows were healthy looking don't have the symptoms? results suppose to be due next thurs/fri. I also read that fetus's from IBR abortion can be partially decomposed, but our two calves were formed, and looked perfect except a month two early.
I also read that 80% of all cattle show up lepto antibodies , can they test the fetus for lepto, is that more accurate

karj28

jaymla627 wrote: »

Their meant to be but its a really complex disease could be another type of it, very little conclusive research has been carried out on the disease.

so many possibles! Did the calves for you look normal? ruling out salmonella two now cos just after reading the calves would be smelly.

Bizzum

karj28 wrote: »

testing for that two, but cows were healthy looking don't have the symptoms? results suppose to be due next thurs/fri. I also read that fetus's from IBR abortion can be partially decomposed, but our two calves were formed, and looked perfect except a month two early.
I also read that 80% of all cattle show up lepto antibodies , can they test the fetus for lepto, is that more accurate

Had you vaccinated against Lepto? If not would ya throw a shot into the rest at this stage?

flat out !!

Dept Vet was telling me national abortion rate is 5%, sounds very high. Had a cow abort last week too, 5-6 weeks from due date. Results said neaspora too.

jaymla627

karj28 wrote: »

so many possibles! Did the calves for you look normal? ruling out salmonella two now cos just after reading the calves would be smelly.

Yeah both where perfect vaccinating for ibr/lepto/bvd here, hopefully the tests come back with something its not knowing what's the cause that's the head wreaker if you can pin it down then at least you can follow some plan of action.

karj28

Bizzum wrote: »

Had you vaccinated against Lepto? If not would ya throw a shot into the rest at this stage?

Ya vaccinated against lepto. Only thing is it was november when we did it, didn't realise it should have been before breeding commenced. starting to worry now that maybe the bull was the cause of it, we got him end of breeding season, a pure breed whitehead, papers and all, but i never asked the farmer if he was vaccinated for lepto. Worried now! /cos spotted one bullling yesterday that he had served. Most bulls sold as ready for breeding would be vaccinated before selling would they?

karj28

flat out !! wrote: »

Dept Vet was telling me national abortion rate is 5%, sounds very high. Had a cow abort last week too, 5-6 weeks from due date. Results said neaspora too.

Wonder if its all the mild weather. Neospora is a pain, hopefully you will have no more from it. did you fence away dogs etc like suggested here

Rovi

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biddy2013

karj28 wrote: »

Ya vaccinated against lepto. Only thing is it was november when we did it, didn't realise it should have been before breeding commenced. starting to worry now that maybe the bull was the cause of it, we got him end of breeding season, a pure breed whitehead, papers and all, but i never asked the farmer if he was vaccinated for lepto. Worried now! /cos spotted one bullling yesterday that he had served. Most bulls sold as ready for breeding would be vaccinated before selling would they?

no we do not vaccinate bulls we are selling for lepto. On neospora is it carried by the dogs urine or ****e?

jaymla627

biddy2013 wrote: »

no we do not vaccinate bulls we are selling for lepto. On neospora is it carried by the dogs urine or ****e?

Dog *****e and also water troughs if your dog can access them.

karj28

jaymla627 wrote: »

Yeah both where perfect vaccinating for ibr/lepto/bvd here, hopefully the tests come back with something its not knowing what's the cause that's the head wreaker if you can pin it down then at least you can follow some plan of action.

Totally agree with you, at least once we know can vaccinate or treat or whatever needs to be done. That schmallenberg virus is spread by midges. there was definitely midges with all the mild weather!!

Deepsouthwest

jaymla627 wrote: »

Dog *****e and also water troughs if your dog can access them.

People with dogs who mow there gardens and fire the grass over the ditch is another issue. Cattle eating/picking at those lawn trimmings are also possibly exposed to neospora

biddy2013

this is not a new thing is it? I think i remember it here over 20 years ago and dog was being blamed, said dog died of lepto a year later

maxxuumman

Had neosporia here a few years back. 14 cows aborted within the space of 8-10 days. We tested the rest and had 8 more positives. All 22 were culled straight away. There were no dogs on the farm at the time.
We had a great vet then and he suggested foxes as the carrier. I think there are questions as the weither foxes can carry it or not. I got in a person to do some hunting and he shot 11 foxes on the farm over the space of a week. He showed me the paths of the foxes and you could see where the foxes were coming into the yard p1ssing on the silage.
Keep an eye out for foxes in the place and careful disposal of after births is very important

karj28

maxxuumman wrote: »

Had neosporia here a few years back. 14 cows aborted within the space of 8-10 days. We tested the rest and had 8 more positives. All 22 were culled straight away. There were no dogs on the farm at the time.
We had a great vet then and he suggested foxes as the carrier. I think there are questions as the weither foxes can carry it or not. I got in a person to do some hunting and he shot 11 foxes on the farm over the space of a week. He showed me the paths of the foxes and you could see where the foxes were coming into the yard p1ssing on the silage.
Keep an eye out for foxes in the place and careful disposal of after births is very important

Jesus that was a dose! Did all cows that aborted test positive. Did they spring down before hand or throw the calf spontaneously can you remember? We have had 2 in the last two weeks, alot for us cos have a small herd only starting out, but the first one's blood test came back neg for neospora

karj28

jaymla627 wrote: »

Yeah both where perfect vaccinating for ibr/lepto/bvd here, hopefully the tests come back with something its not knowing what's the cause that's the head wreaker if you can pin it down then at least you can follow some plan of action.

Just had a thought, have you vaccinated for salmonellla? Only thing with salmonella you would notice id say cos the cows would have diarrhea. We vaccinate for salmonella now cos had it in the farm years ago, last time there was cows there. we only started milking again last year

Deepsouthwest

karj28 wrote: »

Just had a thought, have you vaccinated for salmonellla? Only thing with salmonella you would notice id say cos the cows would have diarrhea. We vaccinate for salmonella now cos had it in the farm years ago, last time there was cows there. we only started milking again last year

Can't help thinking that a lot of the abortions mentioned in this thread is schmallenberg starting to surface again. Wasn't it this time last yr that it was starting to kick off?

karj28

Deepsouthwest wrote: »

Can't help thinking that a lot of the abortions mentioned in this thread is schmallenberg starting to surface again. Wasn't it this time last yr that it was starting to kick off?

Most of the department website though seems to say that the fetus would be deformed in some way

"Diagnosis
Farmers are asked to contact their veterinary practitioner if they encounter cases of aborted foetuses or newborn animals showing malformations or nervous signs. Veterinary practitioners should contact their Regional Veterinary Laboratory for advice on appropriate laboratory tests. "

onyerbikepat

I'd a heifer that aborted a whiel back, test positive for Neospora. It's is only spread from mother to daughter and not contagious from cow to cow.
I suspect it may have been lawn cuttings fed to the cattle that spread it or maybe foxes eating the afterbirth in the fields. Have put an end to both practices now. If a cow tests positive for it you should test the mother aswell, if she is still around.
I think the reason we hear so little about the disease is, there is no commercial treatment or vaccine about, so no money to be made by pharmaceutical companies.

funny man

Not exactly correct as it can be spread horizontly across a herd as well as vertically from mother to daughter, ask a vet for advice as to how to stop its spread.

onyerbikepat

funny man wrote: »

Not exactly correct as it can be spread horizontly across a herd as well as vertically from mother to daughter, ask a vet for advice as to how to stop its spread.

Are you sure about 'horizontall spread' as you call it?

"However, there is no evidence of adult cow to cow transmission, so when a farm is enclosed, with no dogs present, even when an infected cow is introduced to a naïve herd, there is no risk of infection, although imported feed or water can pose a risk."

http://www.fwi.co.uk/articles/12/08/2010/122817/avoid-the-risk-of-dogs-spreading-neospora-in-your-herd.htm

biddy2013

caught oh the other day throwing the few square bales that the dog sleeps on to the dry cows- i near flipped:eek::eek:

greysides

onyerbikepat wrote: »

Are you sure about 'horizontal spread' as you call it?

http://afsdairy.ca.uky.edu/extension/reproduction/management/neosporacaninum

Neospora caninum Abortion in Cattle

By: Michelle Arnold, DVM

Neospora caninum is a protozoan parasite that is emerging as an important infectious cause of weak calves and abortion in cattle. N. caninum infections have been reported from most parts of the world with studies in the United States, New Zealand, the Netherlands, and Germany indicating that 12-45% of aborted fetuses from dairy cattle are infected with the organism. Exposure is common in US dairy herds ranging from 16% to 36% of dairy cows testing positive on serum. A distinguishing feature of the disease is abortion at 4-6 months of gestation, a unique time frame among infectious causes of bovine abortion. It is a very efficiently transmitted parasite with infection rates reaching 90% within some herds.



Cows contract this parasite in one of two ways: 1) “Horizontally” by consuming feed or water contaminated with eggs (oocysts) from infected dogs and other canids or 2) “ vertical” transmission from cow to the fetus during pregnancy. An important feature of this parasite is that once it infects an adult cow or bull, a calf or a fetus, it is maintained as a life-long infection. Once infected, a cow can pass the organism through the placenta to her calf in every pregnancy throughout her lifetime. In some pregnancies, this fetal infection may result in abortion or weak calves. However the vast majority (95%) of calves born with the infection (“congenitally infected”) from positive dams are absolutely normal but remain infected for life. A heifer calf born with the infection can transmit the infection on to the next generation when she becomes pregnant, thus maintaining the infection within the herd. Vertical transmission (dam to calf) is known to be the major mode of transmission in cattle but both horizontal and vertical transmission are vital for parasite survival.
The way in which N. caninum causes abortion is complex and not fully understood. Abortion losses can occur after a primary infection (ingestion of eggs) but it is more commonly associated with reactivation of a persistent infection during pregnancy. Once the organism reaches the bloodstream of a pregnant cow (parasitemia), it invades the placenta and the fetus. Abortion is thought to occur by direct fetal and placental damage and/or the placental damage may cause release of maternal prostaglandins that cause luteolysis and abortion. Definitive diagnosis of abortion is through detection of the N. caninum organism in the fetal tissues, most consistently the fetal brain. There is no known drug to clear a cow of infection. A killed vaccine is available (NeoGuard, Intervet Inc) but studies suggest it has only a modest effect in reducing abortion risk and much uncertainty remains. Control is based on culling positive animals, preventing entry of infected replacements into the herd, and preventing likely routes of horizontal infection.




NB: The vaccine is not available in Ireland, AFAIK.

karj28

That would kinda suggest though that it is not transmitted from cow to cow horizontally, that the horizontal is from eating or drinking the infected stuff.

On the smallenberg virus, has anybody had it, or know anybody who had it, do the calves have to be deformed in some way to put it down to that virus.

Another thing that has been annoying me is the difference in our two abortions, the first animal was springing down away too early and by the time she aborted she had the look of a heifer on the point of calving, the udder had completely filled up, where as the cow that aborted yesterday had very little springing made, so seemed to be more spontaneous

J.O. Farmer

karj28 wrote: »

I also read that 80% of all cattle show up lepto antibodies , can they test the fetus for lepto, is that more accurate

Antibodies can pass from the cow to the foetus across the placenta so I'm not sure testing the foetus that way will be more accurate.
The foetus could be maybe used to try and isolate leptospira if present but this is very difficult to do and would probably take weeks. Also a failure to isolate leptospira would not necessarily mean an absence due to the difficulty in isolating leptospira.

funny man

Sorry OYB i dont know much about it but my cousin had an out break in his herd, from what i remember it Mostly affected the 1st and 2 nd calvers but he had no deformed calves. Plenty of good information on here since.

karj28

Signs of Schmallenberg disease[edit]


.
The virus causes two different profiles of Schmallenberg:
Fever of short duration, diarrhoea and reduced production of milk in cows
These disease signs have occurred during the period when the disease vectors (mosquitos, sandflies, midges) are active, during the summer and autumn of 2011, mainly affecting cattle.
Stillbirths and birth defects in sheep, cattle and goats

Looking back over the summer, I remember at least 3 cows who all of a sudden got diarrhoea and their milk went down for a few days, but they only got the powder for stimulating stomach and they were fine again. Starting to worry now though since that suppose to be one of the symptoms

karj28

Hi all

just updating you, got results back today, turns out it was listeria. So surprised with this, the silage looked to be off good quality and smelled okay. We have removed all dat batch and are feeding a different batch of silage. Hopefully we will have no more, apparently we will have to wait about 10 days, because cows show signs 10 days after digesting it. Cows showed none of the other symptoms, so vet things a milder form.

stanflt

karj28 wrote: »

Hi all

just updating you, got results back today, turns out it was listeria. So surprised with this, the silage looked to be off good quality and smelled okay. We have removed all dat batch and are feeding a different batch of silage. Hopefully we will have no more, apparently we will have to wait about 10 days, because cows show signs 10 days after digesting it. Cows showed none of the other symptoms, so vet things a milder form.

We're all your calves born 4 weeks premature ?
Any signs of bloated stomachs ?

Diaphragmatic hernias ?

Did cows spring up normal ?

Were they hard to calve- getting lodged in the cow?

stanflt

karj28 wrote: »

Hi all

just updating you, got results back today, turns out it was listeria. So surprised with this, the silage looked to be off good quality and smelled okay. We have removed all dat batch and are feeding a different batch of silage. Hopefully we will have no more, apparently we will have to wait about 10 days, because cows show signs 10 days after digesting it. Cows showed none of the other symptoms, so vet things a milder form.

We're all your calves born 4 weeks premature ?
Any signs of bloated stomachs ?

Diaphragmatic hernias ?

Did cows spring up normal ?

Were they hard to calve- getting lodged in the cow?

jaymla627

Got results back this morning confirmed nespora, our own dogs have been confined to house yard with electric fencing collars but the neighbours dogs keep wandering in despite owners been told its a no-go.
Going to give one more warning to neighbours then its going to have to be plan b.

onyerbikepat

Good, at least you know now. It's not the worst disease to have confirmed, seeing as it is not contagious in the normal sense. Do you have any mothers, grandmothers about still?

maxxuumman

jaymla627 wrote: »

Got results back this morning confirmed nespora, our own dogs have been confined to house yard with electric fencing collars but the neighbours dogs keep wandering in despite owners been told its a no-go.
Going to give one more warning to neighbours then its going to have to be plan b.

I'd recommend a whole herd blood test, it's a PITH but you'll have a full picture on what the situation is.

jaymla627

maxxuumman wrote: »

I'd recommend a whole herd blood test, it's a PITH but you'll have a full picture on what the situation is.

Herd test is in march going to blood everything then.

greysides

Two aspects of dog control:

1. Dog faeces needs to be kept out of cows mouths, so not in silage, straw, concentrates or grass.
2. Cow cleanings need to be kept out of dogs mouths, whether they calve indoors or out.

A radio fence is a useful way to control your own dogs.

jaymla627

greysides wrote: »

Two aspects of dog control:

1. Dog faeces needs to be kept out of cows mouths, so not in silage, straw, concentrates or grass.
2. Cow cleanings need to be kept out of dogs mouths, whether they calve indoors or out.

A radio fence is a useful way to control your own dogs.

Installed one last week cost 500 euro to cover three dogs with collars excellent piece of kit , re neighbours dogs etc entering farmyard/land am I entitled to shoot/destroy dog in a instance where dog is wandering unsupervised with no owner present

Gillespy

Would your neighbour be willing to put a collar on their dog? they might even pay for it. How much does a collar cost?

jaymla627

Gillespy wrote: »

Would your neighbour be willing to put a collar on their dog? they might even pay for it. How much does a collar cost?

Was approached about this flat-out no, the problem is the neighbour has 7 dogs it's 95 euro a collar, now I know it's neospora their will be one more warning/conversation explaining the seriousness of the situation after that it will have to be dealt with the other way unfortunatley.

Bizzum

jaymla627 wrote: »

re neighbours dogs etc entering farmyard/land am I entitled to shoot/destroy dog in a instance where dog is wandering unsupervised with no owner present

Relevant section of the law:

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1986/en/act/pub/0032/sec0023.html#sec23

greysides

http://www.capcvet.org/capc-recommendations/canine-neosporosis/

Experimentally, oocysts are shed in the feces of canine hosts 5 days or more after ingestion of bradyzoites. The quantity and duration of oocysts shed are highly variable.

If you were to 'threaten' to collect any dog faeces found and send for examination with a view to pursuing a civil case for damages......................

onyerbikepat

Worth a look, from 'Adam's Farm' - looks like he got Neospora on his farm.

Livestockmad

Can fox's carry it aswel as dogs??

Livestockmad

Can fox's carry it aswel as dogs??