Dublin bus, some truths

mark67a

Bus drivers for the most part start work happy men in the morning, within a hour the complaints begin and the happiness begins to fade.
A colleague said to me in the canteen a few days ago “their ignorance ruins my bliss”.
Well I’m going to try and remove some of the ignorance for this here forum, one of you here might be one of those who complains constantly about something you know very little about.
Ask why things are as they are and i will answer the truth, you might not like it but it will be the truth.
Start it of with these

centre doors-
passengers falls at them driver is personally liable . so drivers don’t open them. which leads to delays.
who here would open the doors?
NTA or dublin bus take responsibility for centre door, problem solved ,the door will open at all stops.(the same complainers here will be saying the bus is cold when the doors open)

Ticket machine-
not able to do the job, slow out of date equipment., which leads to delays
NTA or dublin bus purchase up to date equipment, problem solved.

Dirty bus-
Well the driver did not consume the mountain of food and drink contained in the discarded wrappers and bottles. The 20 metro heralds stuck to the wet floor are not his. The dirty babys nappy stuffed down the side of the seat not his.
NTA or Dublin bus ban the consumption of food and drink on the bus, if you can’t go without food or dink for at most 90 minutes you have a problem.

Dr. Bre

good points made there but when they drive off when someone running for bus.. ya see so many of them doing this

mark67a

Dr. Bre wrote: »

good points made there but when they drive off when someone running for bus.. ya see so many of them doing this

when people are running for the bus, usually more than one.
One might be a low life, don't want them causing problems. Drive off.

Five friends running for the bus , spread out over 100 meters, the lazy lump dragging their fat ass up the road at a snails pace in last place won't get to the bus for ages, thats what the driver uses to judge should he wait for the runners.

Plates

Sounds like you need a new job if you dislike it so much. Can't blame "de management" for all your woes.

mark67a

Plates wrote: »

Sounds like you need a new job if you dislike it so much. Can't blame "de management" for all your woes.

You are getting it wrong,i have no problem with the bus being slow, late, over crowded. dirty, free travel pass and all the other thing that annoy posters here.
They not my woe's, there the passengers, i just turn up and do my job then go home.

it the shocking level of ignorance by a solid 20% of passengers that need to be fixed. Blame the driver for everything, even problems of a passengers making.
For example , if those ignorant people had there leap card or cash ready before they got to the ticket machine dwell times would be reduced..

devnull

mark67a wrote: »

You are getting it wrong,i have no problem with the bus being slow, late, over crowded. dirty, free travel pass and all the other thing that annoy posters here.They not my woe's, there the passengers, i just turn up and do my job then go home.

Priceless. You do know your job is to serve the public yes? Without them you have no job. I'm not saying every passenger is an angel or these things are all your fault, but still it just gives the impression that you don't care or take any pride in the service you provide.

Plates

20% of passengers are ignorant.

20% of drivers are rude and have poor personal hygiene.

Still sounds like you're pretty miserable in your job.

mark67a

devnull wrote: »

Priceless. You do know your job is to serve the public yes? Without them you have no job. I'm not saying every passenger is an angel or these things are all your fault, but still it just gives the impression that you don't care or take any pride in the service you provide.

all the problems complained about here on this forum could be reduced if the ignorant 20% where enlightened. Thats what i shall attempt to do tonight.

Think before you criticise the drivers,most problems are beyond their control, some are passenger stupidity others are infrastructure, a driver can do nothing about either.

So ask your questions and get a answer, might stop people from posting nonsense here

markpb

devnull wrote: »

Priceless. You do know your job is to serve the public yes? Without them you have no job. I'm not saying every passenger is an angel or these things are all your fault, but still it just gives the impression that you don't care or take any pride in the service you provide.

I read exactly the opposite from his post. He's giving reasons for some of the more common gripes and explaining why he, as a driver, can't cause or fix them. With all the passion, care and pride in the world, drivers can't fix the reliability, ticket machines, awful website, etc, etc.

mark67a

Plates wrote: »

20% of passengers are ignorant.

20% of drivers are rude and have poor personal hygiene.

Still sounds like you're pretty miserable in your job.

this may be true. but it don't impact on me.
on the other hand the 20% of the public who are idiots affect the service you use.

devnull

mark67a wrote: »

this may be true. but it don't impact on me.
on the other hand the 20% of the public who are idiots affect the service you use.

Ignorant drivers affect the service too.....

devnull

markpb wrote: »

I read exactly the opposite from his post. He's giving reasons for some of the more common gripes and explaining why he, as a driver, can't cause or fix them. With all the passion, care and pride in the world, drivers can't fix the reliability, ticket machines, awful website, etc, etc.

I agree - but my point is that doesn't mean a driver shouldn't care about his job.

Jawgap

mark67a wrote: »

all the problems complained about here on this forum could be reduced if the ignorant 20% where enlightened. Thats what i shall attempt to do tonight.

Think before you criticise the drivers,most problems are beyond their control, some are passenger stupidity others are infrastructure, a driver can do nothing about either.

So ask your questions and get a answer, might stop people from posting nonsense here

What about aggressive driving and / or 'shoulder surfing' directed towards cyclists. Who is responsible for that?

markpb

devnull wrote: »

I agree - but my point is that doesn't mean a driver shouldn't care about his job.

Where did he say he didn't care?

mark67a

Jawgap wrote: »

What about aggressive driving and / or 'shoulder surfing' directed towards cyclists. Who is responsible for that?

shoulder surfing? whats that?

Yet again the ignorant 20%, this time among cyclists who do not obey the rules of the road are causing problems beyond the control of drivers.

I see a aggressive dog, i stay away from it. Idiot on bike see a 10 ton bus and he trys to sneak up on the inside.
Look at the UK in the last few months, cyclists versus Bus/HGV , didn't end well for the cyclist in all cases.

Take responsibility for your safety, get there alive not in a person record, breaking red lights all the way. Some cyclist are like children, they imagine there are wiggins or froome speeding along the road. Cop on to your self

December2012

Q for OP:

Do you notice / care / appreciate it when somebody says thanks when they leave the bus?

JayRoc

mark67a wrote: »

shoulder surfing? whats that?

Yet again the ignorant 20%, this time among cyclists who do not obey the rules of the road are causing problems beyond the control of drivers.

I see a aggressive dog, i stay away from it. Idiot on bike see a 10 ton bus and he trys to sneak up on the inside.
Look at the UK in the last few months, cyclists versus Bus/HGV , didn't end well for the cyclist in all cases.

Take responsibility for your safety, get there alive not in a person record, breaking red lights all the way. Some cyclist are like children, they imagine there are wiggins or froome speeding along the road. Cop on to your self

Ah
...I was actually on your side up to this

mark67a

December2012 wrote: »

Q for OP:

Do you notice / care / appreciate it when somebody says thanks when they leave the bus?

Yes you do. give them a little wave, say goodbye allways acknowledge them in some way

mark67a

JayRoc wrote: »

Ah
...I was actually on your side up to this

a cyclist?
they are their own worst enemy.
Stay safe, assume the driver can't see you sneaking up the side /weaving through traffic.
The fantastic thing about the CCTV on the bus now , is that it has proven more times that not, the driver is not at fault.
Complaints come into the garage, boss views tape, driver not at fault.

Then they come here are complain about dublin bus, the horde on here eat it up, not knowing the incident has been caught on camera and the driver is not at fault.

Dave!

In relation to a dirty bus—the 20% who leave dirt are the same people who leave dirt in a cinema, or in McDonald's, or what have ya. I used to work in a cinema part-time, and I don't think I would have gotten away with blaming the 20% when a customer has to sit in filth; employees are expected to clean up. Hardly surprising. Dirty people exist.

And at least in the case of McDonald's, customers can vote with their feet if they have complaints about hygiene or customer service. Not so much with Dublin Bus.

UCDVet

mark67a wrote: »

a cyclist?
they are their own worst enemy.
Stay safe, assume the driver can't see you sneaking up the side /weaving through traffic.
The fantastic thing about the CCTV on the bus now , is that it has proven more times that not, the driver is not at fault.
Complaints come into the garage, boss views tape, driver not at fault.

Then they come here are complain about dublin bus, the horde on here eat it up, not knowing the incident has been caught on camera and the driver is not at fault.

I alternate between cycling and riding the bus and this matches my experience 100%

syklops

I've been using DB twice a day everyday for the past 2 months or so and had little to no problems with the driver. Not noticed any hygiene problems during the 5 seconds when I am saying "K thx bye!". The only thing that annoys me is buses not stopping at the bus stop that you are waiting for. What is the reason for that?

mark67a

Dave! wrote: »

In relation to a dirty bus—the 20% who leave dirt are the same people who leave dirt in a cinema, or in McDonald's, or what have ya. I used to work in a cinema part-time, and I don't think I would have gotten away with blaming the 20% when a customer has to sit in filth; employees are expected to clean up. Hardly surprising. Dirty people exist.

And at least in the case of McDonald's, customers can vote with their feet if they have complaints about hygiene or customer service. Not so much with Dublin Bus.

and when does a driver do all this?
where does he put the rubbish?

mark67a

syklops wrote: »

I've been using DB twice a day everyday for the past 2 months or so and had little to no problems with the driver. Not noticed any hygiene problems during the 5 seconds when I am saying "K thx bye!". The only thing that annoys me is buses not stopping at the bus stop that you are waiting for. What is the reason for that?

bus full?
did not stick hand out,maybe at last second, bus takes distance to stop.
don't point at the bus, stand at the curb ,stick your arm out 90 degrees from you body and leave it out until the bus indicator comes on

syklops

mark67a wrote: »

bus full?

I mean, without me or another passenger sticking out their hand.

Happened to me one of the very windy wet nights before christmas. Im keeping an eye on the real time sign, 5mins, 4mins, 2mins, zoooom, half full bus whizzed by with out stopping.

syklops

mark67a wrote: »

bus full?
did not stick hand out,maybe at last second, bus takes distance to stop.
don't point at the bus, stand at the curb ,stick your arm out 90 degrees from you body and leave it out until the bus indicator comes on

Why do I have to stick my hand out? Is people standing at the stop not enough?

UCDVet

Dave! wrote: »

In relation to a dirty bus—the 20% who leave dirt are the same people who leave dirt in a cinema, or in McDonald's, or what have ya. I used to work in a cinema part-time, and I don't think I would have gotten away with blaming the 20% when a customer has to sit in filth; employees are expected to clean up. Hardly surprising. Dirty people exist.

And at least in the case of McDonald's, customers can vote with their feet if they have complaints about hygiene or customer service. Not so much with Dublin Bus.

They can clean the busses more often, but it'll mean paying someone to do it. That'll mean increased ticket prices....and I feel like they are already high enough.

My wife needs to do some travelling and I was amazed at how renting a car for a month was about the same price as taking the bus.

UCDVet

syklops wrote: »

Why do I have to stick my hand out? Is people standing at the stop not enough?

Most stops have a lot of bus routes that service it. The driver won't know if you are waiting for it or one of the other routes if you don't do the arm thing.

mark67a

syklops wrote: »

Why do I have to stick my hand out? Is people standing at the stop not enough?

several different bus routes use the stop?

no hand, bus stops, "ooh driver i don't want the bus, i waiting here for my friend to pick me up in their car".

no hand no stop.

SimonLynch

Bit off topic but is it DB policy not to run heating, even on freezing days? Few times I've used the bus the driver's been dressed like Nanuk of the north and the bus bloody freezing.

Youzername

Why do no bus drivers enforce the no smoking rule?

You say if there was rules against eating you would enforce it.

Well, I would be surprised tbh.

(I honestly don't mind someone eating on the bus, and I never have blamed a bus driver on any rubbish anyway...)

Maybe if there was an actual bin on the bus people would use it? Never thought about it but I've never actually noticed a bin on a bus?

Smoking on the bus does my f**king head in though!

pm1977x

Hi Mark, firstly thanks for starting the thread - can't say I have any issue with the stuff you mention in the OP and 99% of the drivers on my route are excellent, I have a question about insurance/liability:

If you've just pulled up at the lights (lights just gone red) approx 50 meters after leaving the terminus, and you let someone on the bus - is that against the rules, are you liable if something happens to the passenger as they go to board?

I sometimes get a bus that leaves the terminus early now and then, or sometimes I'm running late and might catch it at the lights, one driver will let you on, the next one might just shake his head and point back towards the stop...

discus

syklops wrote: »

Why do I have to stick my hand out? Is people standing at the stop not enough?

That is so petty it's beyond childish! So you want every bus to stop when you are standing there, to ask politely if this is the bus you're looking for?

Fair play mark, I'd say ya get frustrated sometimes!

mark67a

SimonLynch wrote: »

Bit off topic but is it DB policy not to run heating, even on freezing days? Few times I've used the bus the driver's been dressed like Nanuk of the north and the bus bloody freezing.

Have not heard anything official,don't know why it would make a difference to DB if it was on or off.
I do know drivers just as much as passengers are not happy.

mikemac1

When I hit the stop button I get the ding and I'm aware there is a louder noise for the upstairs and the wheelchair area

Do drivers listen for the sound or do they have a light on the dashboard to help them?

I've never ever had a Dublin Bus driver miss my stop but it happened all the time on Bus Eireann in Galway

So does something light up on your dashboard?

JayRoc

mark67a wrote: »

a cyclist?
they are their own worst enemy.
Stay safe, assume the driver can't see you sneaking up the side /weaving through traffic.
The fantastic thing about the CCTV on the bus now , is that it has proven more times that not, the driver is not at fault.
Complaints come into the garage, boss views tape, driver not at fault.

Then they come here are complain about dublin bus, the horde on here eat it up, not knowing the incident has been caught on camera and the driver is not at fault.

I am a DB customer and a cyclist.
I have never tried to overtake a bus on the inside because I am not a moron.

I generally find DB drivers to be well-trained and very aware of exactly how much room their bus takes up, and even then give themselves a good margin of error when dealing with traffic (including cyclists).

I have, unfortunately, had two occasions to report DB drivers for coming ****-scaring-ly close to clipping me by swinging back in too soon after overtaking me.
On both occasions I caught up with them and attempted to calmly (honestly!) explain their mistake, but one fella worked very hard to not hear me tap his window and the other fella bellowed something that brought my ancestry into question. I wouldn't have reported either of them if they'd been willing to listen to me at the time

Dave!

mark67a wrote: »

and when does a driver do all this?
where does he put the rubbish?

At the end of every route? Most seem to do this anyway, I've seen it. It takes about 1.5 mins to walk the length of a bus twice, sticking empty coke bottles into a bag. Keep the bag in the driver's area. Or if there's a public bin at the stop, as there often is, use that. Again I've seen this. Use your initiative.

I've seen others sit there for 10 mins between journeys, and then not clean anything.

I can't say I generally have a complaint about cleanliness tbh anyway

panjero

Many thanks to the OP.Answered some questions for me

Many years using DB and can honestly say the vast majority of drivers are excellent.
Dealing with the public can be a thankless job.We all know that.

Respect for the driver and passenger is mutual. when it is lacking by one or the other problems can arise.
Originally Posted by syklops
I've been using DB twice a day everyday for the past 2 months or so and had little to no problems with the driver. Not noticed any hygiene problems during the 5 seconds when I am saying "K thx bye!". The only thing that annoys me is buses not stopping at the bus stop that you are waiting for. What is the reason for that?


Still obligatory to put your hand out for the bus to stop?

mark67a

Youzername wrote: »

Why do no bus drivers enforce the no smoking rule?

You say if there was rules against eating you would enforce it.

Well, I would be surprised tbh.

(I honestly don't mind someone eating on the bus, and I never have blamed a bus driver on any rubbish anyway...)

Maybe if there was an actual bin on the bus people would use it? Never thought about it but I've never actually noticed a bin on a bus?

Smoking on the bus does my f**king head in though!

you could see someone bringing on a chicken curry not so much a pack of smokes.
Bin on bus at the bottom of stairs

SimonLynch

So it's happening but it's not official?

syklops

discus wrote: »

That is so petty it's beyond childish! So you want every bus to stop when you are standing there, to ask politely if this is the bus you're looking for?

Fair play mark, I'd say ya get frustrated sometimes!

Beyond childish? :rolleyes:

If I am standing at the no 15 bus stop I expect the no 15 to stop. I appreciate one bus stop might be the same stop for 6 or more other buses but I would expect them to stop aswell. This is how it works in many other cities. I was asking very politely why this is so.

Youzername

mark67a wrote: »

you could see someone bringing on a chicken curry not so much a pack of smokes.
Bin on bus at the bottom of stairs

Fair enough, I suppose, but you can't miss the clouds of smoke floating around the top deck??

And is the bin that little small (almost sleeve like) bucket?

I work with the public myself and can honestly appreciate where you are coming from.

But having a crappy attitude back doesn't help the situation. In fact in any other situation you'd more than likely go out of business.

Luckily though for Dublin Bus there is no alternative for customers to go to if they don't like the service. (Which is probably why Dublin Bus drivers also get so many complaints.)

mark67a

pm1977x wrote: »

Hi Mark, firstly thanks for starting the thread - can't say I have any issue with the stuff you mention in the OP and 99% of the drivers on my route are excellent, I have a question about insurance/liability:

If you've just pulled up at the lights (lights just gone red) approx 50 meters after leaving the terminus, and you let someone on the bus - is that against the rules, are you liable if something happens to the passenger as they go to board?

I sometimes get a bus that leaves the terminus early now and then, or sometimes I'm running late and might catch it at the lights, one driver will let you on, the next one might just shake his head and point back towards the stop...

If driver open doors between stops and a accident happens he is in big trouble.
so it depends on the driver, might just open them by instinct. Might remember they should not be opened and direct you back to the stop.
Could be that a inspector is nearby observing, ready to book a driver for breaking the rules. so door will not be opened.

mark67a

mikemac1 wrote: »

When I hit the stop button I get the ding and I'm aware there is a louder noise for the upstairs and the wheelchair area

Do drivers listen for the sound or do they have a light on the dashboard to help them?

I've never ever had a Dublin Bus driver miss my stop but it happened all the time on Bus Eireann in Galway

So does something light up on your dashboard?

light on dashboard, some have a sign beside the front door that lights up.
don't know about BE

syklops

mark67a wrote: »

several different bus routes use the stop?

no hand, bus stops, "ooh driver i don't want the bus, i waiting here for my friend to pick me up in their car".

no hand no stop.

At least you are able to answer questions in a mature fashion.

JayRoc

syklops wrote: »

At least you are able to answer questions in a mature fashion.

Ah come on....whether you're from here or not, you say you've been getting the bus in Dublin for months...people put their hand out here or the bus doesn't stop. It's not complicated or difficult

mikemac1

Are all the older buses with the steps and the little seating area at the front withdrawn now?

Well I say old but it was just a few years ago that my route always had them. Maybe 4-5 years ago

Were they flogged off cheap to England or somewhere

mark67a

syklops wrote: »

At least you are able to answer questions in a mature fashion.

we are like a mirror, person is nice, be nice back. if person is a prick, be a prick back.

That will explain the behaviour of drivers best.

mark67a

mikemac1 wrote: »

Are all the older buses with the steps and the little seating area at the front withdrawn now?

Well I say old but it was just a few years ago that my route always had them. Maybe 4-5 years ago

Were they flogged off cheap to England or somewhere

afaik all gone, sold to private operators.

NegativeCreep

Youzername wrote: »

Fair enough, I suppose, but you can't miss the clouds of smoke floating around the top deck??

Next time you're on the bus and see someone smoking at the back, have a look at them and see if you'd confront them yourself. I bet the majority of people who smoke on buses aren't the kind of people who'd listen to reason.


What's the story with not being able to put your feet on the seat? Is it enforced? I've never been told off for it and I do it nearly every day.

Jawgap

mark67a wrote: »

shoulder surfing? whats that?

Yet again the ignorant 20%, this time among cyclists who do not obey the rules of ethe road are causing problems beyond the control of drivers.

I see a aggressive dog, i stay away from it. Idiot on bike see a 10 ton bus and he trys to sneak up on the inside.
Look at the UK in the last few months, cyclists versus Bus/HGV , didn't end well for the cyclist in all cases.

Take responsibility for your safety, get there alive not in a person record, breaking red lights all the way. Some cyclist are like children, they imagine there are wiggins or froome speeding along the road. Cop on to your self

Shoulder surfing is when you are cycling along in a shared bus lane and a bus comes up and sits about a metre or so off your back wheel.

I observe the RotR, and nowhere does it say that buses have priority over cyclists in a bus lane.

And before anyone mentions it, there's no requirement to use off road cycle lanes.