would you move farms?

jersey101

Would you move farms to get bigger? To double or triple your acres? How far would you ve willing to move within ireland. We did it here, we only moved 30 miles but it has been a hard ten years since we moved.

moy83

jersey101 wrote: »

Would you move farms to get bigger? To double or triple your acres? How far would you ve willing to move within ireland. We did it here, we only moved 30 miles but it has been a hard ten years since we moved.

The father always told me that if I wanted to farm full time I would be aswell sell up and buy better land . I would certainly consider it but it would be a hard move .
Are ye happy that ye did move jersey or would you do it if you had your chance again ?

epfff

jersey101 wrote: »

Would you move farms to get bigger? To double or triple your acres? How far would you ve willing to move within ireland. We did it here, we only moved 30 miles but it has been a hard ten years since we moved.

I think I'd find it very hard to move
although I'm very congested area with a 10 mile spread between pieces of land
Have good neighbors and way of life going on here

Timmaay

My granddad/dad moved up from kerry 40/50yrs ago, then managed to buy up the neighbours in the 80s (which involved the serious pain of 20% interest rates!). I guess given what we have now, there will be no chance of selling in the next 10/15yrs, I'd be as well off pushing this farm to its limit than moving. However I've never really been the sort of person to sit still in life, serious opportunities do exist abroad for low cost milk production, like eastern Europe, Brazil etc, I'd always be open to new ideas. I guess if I had a family holding me down it would definitely change the situation.

Another option I could have would be to sell myown land, and rent a large tillage block here in Ireland longterm to convert into dairying, not a bad option either, but again, I'm probably better off pushing ourown farm to its limit now, then use profits from that to start another farm! All of the above assumes I can actually pull a decent profit from milk ha, if I can't then I wouldn't hesitate leaving farming ha!

jersey101

moy83 wrote: »

The father always told me that if I wanted to farm full time I would be aswell sell up and buy better land . I would certainly consider it but it would be a hard move .
Are ye happy that ye did move jersey or would you do it if you had your chance again ?

very happy now moy but we thought it was a big mistake 6 yrs ago when we were only left with 20 cows after a big mastitis problem. I dont know if i would do it again tbh, the placecwas very over grown and run into the ground, i wpuld want to be buying a well looked after farm with clean ditches and the soil in good condition, but good land dont cone cheao

Conmaicne Mara

No intention of moving from here, I would miss the good weather and flat fertile land way too much to be able to cope with the trauma of it all.

just do it

Home is where the heart is. Sure how could I support a different gaa club, not to mention a different county?!

jersey101

just do it wrote: »

Home is where the heart is. Sure how could I support a different gaa club, not to mention a different county?!

GAA in wicklow?? No such thing when i was there

moy83

jersey101 wrote: »

very happy now moy but we thought it was a big mistake 6 yrs ago when we were only left with 20 cows after a big mastitis problem. I dont know if i would do it again tbh, the placecwas very over grown and run into the ground, i wpuld want to be buying a well looked after farm with clean ditches and the soil in good condition, but good land dont cone cheao

Must be some feeling starting into a new farm , ye were probably planning it in yer sleep for a couple of years !

jersey101

moy83 wrote: »

Must be some feeling starting into a new farm , ye were probably planning it in yer sleep for a couple of years !

still am tough work tbh now came with 50 cows and 20 maiden heifers, and in the middle if may too, 3 years later animals dying all over the place and the co op threatening not to take the milk

GRASSorMUCK

Timmaay wrote: »

Another option I could have would be to sell myown land, and rent a large tillage block here in Ireland longterm to convert into dairying, not a bad option either, but again, I'm probably better off pushing ourown farm to its limit now, then use profits from that to start another farm! All of the above assumes I can actually pull a decent profit from milk ha, if I can't then I wouldn't hesitate leaving farming ha!

In 10-15+ years unless something serious changes (re-introduce stuble burning, lenghten rotations) and new active group comes along that the Vegans and the Bee's like so the Eu will allow it there will be 10,000's of acre put into grass in the uk due to Blackgrass. Some seriously big spreads that would even make a Nz farmers eye water. We have some of the worst ground let to a very good dairy man for young stock(one of the few that can compete with cropping in east anglia) and has taken him 3 years for Prg to out compete Blackgrass in intensive management. Amoung many of the problems are 42 yr seed life but 1st 10 are the most viable, too much Osr/WW occasional beans rotations, too low rates of chems in early 00's bred target site resistance and enhanced metabolism in. Chem spends of 100+ quid an acre for 80% odd control is not uncommon and just breeds more resistant plants multiplying them
A lot of dairy farms here have either gone all-in or gotten out in recent years and are very in debted, and when wheat drops below 100 pound a ton again a lot of the super big contract farmers will go broke as 200 pond rents are unsustainable. Arla have opened a new Mega plant in the 3 home counties which is heavy ground and Bg central.

Miname

Never. if i wanted a bigger farm i'll either have to buy clean out or just keep expanding from the home base but i could never sell up.

just do it

jersey101 wrote: »

GAA in wicklow?? No such thing when i was there

No hurling in wicklow either, but there's plenty of it in my county

jersey101

just do it wrote: »

No hurling in wicklow either, but there's plenty of it in my county

used to play loads of hurling in wicklow but as soon as i moved i never bothered, hard to get in on a new team

jomoloney

Miname wrote: »

Never. if i wanted a bigger farm i'll either have to buy clean out or just keep expanding from the home base but i could never sell up.

ditto

great neighbours and local community here, won't leave till they carry me out in the wooden overcoat

jersey101

jomoloney wrote: »

ditto

great neighbours and local community here, won't leave till they carry me out in the wooden overcoat

had good neighbours in the old place, but we wouldn't be milking cows now if we hadnt moved, father was getting very big into contracting, doing 10k bales of silage a year. Plus straw and hedge trimming.

redzerologhlen

jersey101 wrote: »

had good neighbours in the old place, but we wouldn't be milking cows now if we hadnt moved, father was getting very big into contracting, doing 10k bales of silage a year. Plus straw and hedge trimming.

What was the cause of the deaths and stuff after you moving jersey? Must have been a bi*ch after taking such a big step.

mahoney_j

Wouldn't move from where I am as I have good dry fertile land and sheds ,slurry storage and milking facilities in place.dont understand why lads just want to move to have more land ,more cows more work ,big repayments etc and bd no better off financially than they were.saying that I'd love more land where I am but there is little or no chance if getting it.

jersey101

redzerologhlen wrote: »

What was the cause of the deaths and stuff after you moving jersey? Must have been a bi*ch after taking such a big step.

ibr, salmonella, staf aurus and no P in the soil what so ever so led to cows not going in calf and culling most

delaval

jersey101 wrote: »

very happy now moy but we thought it was a big mistake 6 yrs ago when we were only left with 20 cows after a big mastitis problem. I dont know if i would do it again tbh, the placecwas very over grown and run into the ground, i wpuld want to be buying a well looked after farm with clean ditches and the soil in good condition, but good land dont cone cheao

If you bought run down land as opposed to same land quality in super shape for 20% less, would you not be better writing off the reinstatement costs rather than just the interest?

keep going

Looked seriously at 3 different moves and probably should have moved the first one when I was single .lucky we didnt do the move in 07 as we would be broke now.the children have started schooland I have a fairly good set up now so bbasically im too lazy to move at 44.

delaval

I will be moving within the next two years but will continue to live where I am now, roll on 2015

jersey101

delaval wrote: »

If you bought run down land as opposed to same land quality in super shape for 20% less, would you not be better writing off the reinstatement costs rather than just the interest?

dont understand what you mean here?

Timmaay

Del, I'd assume Jerseys dad did just that, wroteoff all the costs of repairing that land, as well as any interest charges on money borrowed for it. Where yas stand in terms of capital gains/appreciation is the only thing, I'd assume the land had to be appreciated in his books also, as its now a fully functional dairyfarm as oppose to run down land?

jersey101

Timmaay wrote: »

Del, I'd assume Jerseys dad did just that, wroteoff all the costs of repairing that land, as well as any interest charges on money borrowed for it. Where yas stand in terms of capital gains/appreciation is the only thing, I'd assume the land had to be appreciated in his books also, as its now a fully functional dairyfarm as oppose to run down land?

ye the land hasnt been valued simce we bought it, its on the cards now soon so we'll see what happens with CGT, father has spent ten years cutting trees and trimming ditches and he's shagged now, fricken hate goin to cut wood now tbh and we still have a few acres tied up in corners of feilds that need to be sorted out

delaval

I'm not referring to Je's farm but to farmland in general.

Run down good land say 7k an acre + 2k to clear and bring to full production. Write off interest on 7k but 2k is all capital and can be written off

Fully developed say 10k an acre you can only write off interest against tax.

That's my question if you get me

jersey101

delaval wrote: »

I'm not referring to Je's farm but to farmland in general.

Run down good land say 7k an acre + 2k to clear and bring to full production. Write off interest on 7k but 2k is all capital and can be written off

Fully developed say 10k an acre you can only write off interest against tax.

That's my question if you get me

Id prefere option 1 at least your getting good land that will produce from day one and you can organise it what ever way you want,
big problem here is we never thought about getting money bring ground up to full production so we just borrowed enough to buy the land, say 7k. If we had the other 2k we would be in a better position now and wouldnt have had as much problems as we had, granted there was other family related problems going on at the same time, my sister was in hospital for a year so parents were concerened about her more

TUBBY

As regards moving farms, would miss the neighbours and be a bit of a pull the fact that it has been the family farm for generations but given the right opportunity, I would not rule it out.

With kids and schools etc, would only consider moving a few miles though.

Also, would have to be moving to a decent set-up rather than just land and having to start with sheds again etc. That is sort of dead money IMO. Land selling with or without good sheds and handling facilities wont differ in selling price by the difference it would take to build them.

My ideal scenario would prob be to move the farm itself to higher ground

Farmer Pudsey

delaval wrote: »

I'm not referring to Je's farm but to farmland in general.

Run down good land say 7k an acre + 2k to clear and bring to full production. Write off interest on 7k but 2k is all capital and can be written off

Fully developed say 10k an acre you can only write off interest against tax.

That's my question if you get me

Senario I is quit tax efficient but you would need more than a 1K margin to make it worth your while. Usually in run down land there is a lot of scrub if this is bulldosed you have a P&K issue. It may take years to sort out.

On the other hand a good farm if you can afford to stock is turning over money from day 1.

It buying at the right price is the key.

sheebadog

Made a move here to France. Farming is much the same all over but you must be able to adopt to the new circumstances.

Conmaicne Mara

sheebadog wrote: »

Made a move here to France. Farming is much the same all over but you must be able to adopt to the new circumstances.

From Ireland?
Are the Department over there are helpful to farmers as I have been told or is that rubbish?

sheebadog

Conmaicne Mara wrote: »

From Ireland?
Are the Department over there are helpful to farmers as I have been told or is that rubbish?

Yes Dept. are spot on, no hassle with them once you keep up with all paperwork.
They try their best for you in fairness. However we have a woman doing paperwork for 5 hours per day.

TUBBY

sheebadog wrote: »

Yes Dept. are spot on, no hassle with them once you keep up with all paperwork.
They try their best for you in fairness. However we have a woman doing paperwork for 5 hours per day.

fair play to you. Big move to make. How long you there. Had you French before going. Is it turning out as you expected. Very different way of life I would imagine.

sheebadog

TUBBY wrote: »

fair play to you. Big move to make. How long you there. Had you French before going. Is it turning out as you expected. Very different way of life I would imagine.

Not all that different really just another bunch of farmers that are stuck in their ways!!
French is not that hard if you simply HAVE to speak it.

maxxuumman

sheebadog wrote: »

Not all that different really just another bunch of farmers that are stuck in their ways!!
French is not that hard if you simply HAVE to speak it.

What part of France are you in. What type of Farming are you at.

sheebadog

maxxuumman wrote: »

What part of France are you in. What type of Farming are you at.

Pays de la Loire. Grain,dairy and poultry. The dairy and poultry are new to me and a steep learning curve. I like the banter or here from the likes of Delaval,Stanflt,Moloney and yourself etc.

maxxuumman

sheebadog wrote: »

Pays de la Loire. Grain,dairy and poultry. The dairy and poultry are new to me and a steep learning curve. I like the banter or here from the likes of Delaval,Stanflt,Moloney and yourself etc.

Nice part of France you're in. Drove up through there last year from Angers through Le Mans on the way to Cherbourg. Neighbour has some tillage land out there near Le mans. He seems to be doing very well out there.
What type of dairy are you doing.

sheebadog

maxxuumman wrote: »

Nice part of France you're in. Drove up through there last year from Angers through Le Mans on the way to Cherbourg. Neighbour has some tillage land out there near Le mans. He seems to be doing very well out there.
What type of dairy are you doing.

Holstein friesans, no JEX yet. High input system ATM but changing fast. French reckon that you can't produce milk from grass.

blackdog1

Had a french student here who was up by german border and they had similar springs to us but didn't utilise their grass during this period. Maybe spread 23 units of n per acre max if that for all the spring.

maxxuumman

sheebadog wrote: »

Holstein friesans, no JEX yet. High input system ATM but changing fast. French reckon that you can't produce milk from grass.

Tell us more, lots a questions. What's your plan, to move to a Spring type grass based system. Is drought/heat a problem for growing grass in the Summer. What's the story in Spring/Autumn.
Is farm land still good value out there.

sheebadog

blackdog1 wrote: »

Had a french student here who was up by german border and they had similar springs to us but didn't utilise their grass during this period. Maybe spread 23 units of n per acre max if that for all the spring.

Kinda the same here. Grass is seen as being detrimental to cows. Only small farmers graze by day I was informed and only small poor farmers graze day and night.
Nitrogen is used sparingly as with the heat and the moisture in the soil growth is phenomenal. Grass grows crazy and then around June/July burns up and no more until it rains in the autumn

Muckit

Delaval would take it in his stride! :-)

Conmaicne Mara

Muckit wrote: »

Delaval would take it in his stride! :-)

He could give them tips.

Bizzum

Some people seem to have a very strong emotional attachement to the "home place". No matter how attractive or how much sense it makes to think outside the the box, they seem absolutely rooted to one particular plot of ground.
Nothing is written in stone with me!

awaywithyou

dont know about moving farms.....

absolutely no way would i rent or god forbid sell the home farm....

when i was teaching in meath i was definitely tempted to buy a few acres and set up a herd of cows and parlour and so on.... only then what would i do with our home farm??

back on home farm now fulltime with last couple of years.... but buying land in meath hasnt gone away!

J.O. Farmer

Bizzum wrote: »

Some people seem to have a very strong emotional attachement to the "home place". No matter how attractive or how much sense it makes to think outside the the box, they seem absolutely rooted to one particular plot of ground.
Nothing is written in stone with me!

The home place has often been in the family for generations and maybe it's something in us irish since Cromwell that what we have we hold.
I don't want to move. I'm looking for a day job back closer to home. It's a case of home is where the heart is.
I see great land up the country but it wouldn't be the same. I like the history of the previous generations having built up what we have.

Juniorhurler

jersey101 wrote: »

used to play loads of hurling in wicklow but as soon as i moved i never bothered, hard to get in on a new team

If you moved 30 miles, are in Wexford now and used to play hurling I only assume that you were around Carnew when in Wicklow. The other options are Glenealy or Kiltegan and 30 miles would not have got you far enough south to be using Wexford town as your local drinking base.

TUBBY

:P

Juniorhurler wrote: »

If you moved 30 miles, are in Wexford now and used to play hurling I only assume that you were around Carnew when in Wicklow. The other options are Glenealy or Kiltegan and 30 miles would not have got you far enough south to be using Wexford town as your local drinking base.

good morning miss marple

jersey101

Juniorhurler wrote: »

If you moved 30 miles, are in Wexford now and used to play hurling I only assume that you were around Carnew when in Wicklow. The other options are Glenealy or Kiltegan and 30 miles would not have got you far enough south to be using Wexford town as your local drinking base.

Was living in avoca. In enniscorthy now

kevthegaff

Id move anywhere in ireland once i got a larger landbase/better land. But im not farming the homeplace as it wouldnt be an option if i was.

Juniorhurler

jersey101 wrote: »

Was living in avoca. In enniscorthy now

Half way between both places myself. You got into great ground moving to Enniscorthy. Very little waste ground about there.