Custom Mouth Guard for Sport

cormie

Maybe I should be posting this in the Boxing/MMA or some other sport forum but just wondering if anyone has any advice on custom mouth guards?

I'd like to get one for basketball, have already had a close call with my incisors going into one guys head and after seeing another player lose his tooth when something similar happened, I think it's a worthwhile investment and probably better off spending a bit extra to get something comfortable and more protective than a generic boil and bite one.

Did a small bit of research into it and I can get a custom one from gladiatorguards.com who have come highly recommended from several sports forums when googling. The way it works is I will pay $60 for the custom piece, they ship the mould for $20 (to Ireland), I ship it back and they make the piece from this and it will cost me another $20 shipped to Ireland, so around €95 or so altogether, expensive enough I know but I play a lot and if anything happens it'll end up costing much more.

I've seen a few similar high quality guards advertised locally but there seems to be a lot and you don't know if they are any use, the gladiator ones seem to get a lot of great reviews so would like to go with them, unless anyone can convince me otherwise? They said if I already have a model of my mouth I can just ship this direct and then they will make it out of this, so I won't have to pay the two $20 fees and it will speed it up. Any idea how much it would cost and where I could get a model of my mouth done around Dublin? Is this something any dentist could do?

Any feedback appreciated

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Get a custom guard made by a dentist from a accurate impression. Cost 60-80 euro. Any dentist can do this for you.

cormie

Thanks for that, is that 60-80 eur just for the impression or for the finished guard? Have read posts here from others saying they had guards for €300 and one guy even mentioned €750 :eek:

Would the type of guard I'd get here be suitable for sports or would it be mainly the type used for teeth grinding etc? Need it to be comfortable enough to play with etc..

Mingetoad

The €60-80 (closer to 80 I reckon) would be a custom fitted sportsguard, not just the impression. The stuff you see most rugby/GAA/boxers using. The more expensive ones are probably something like Under Armour "Performance Mouthwear". According to sponsored research they reduce cortisol, increase oxygen etc etc. You see a few of the pro rugby players and the odd GAA player with them.
The usual one from the dentist for 80 odd is certainly comfortable enough for use in sports and provides very good protection.

cormie

Thanks for that. I guess given the high volume of quality feedback the gladiator guards have it might be better to just spend the extra €15 or so and do it with their kit..

btkm8unsl0w5r4

You would have seen grind splints for more, soft sport guards are generally less than 100 euro (complete). The underarmour guards and the performance guards dont offer great protection in some designs.

cormie

Thanks for that, seeing as it'll work out pretty much the same price, I'll probably just go with the gladiator given it's reputation, plus every future re-order will be half price so if I need more in future, it'll be only around €35 delivered.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Your better off getting a professionally made one, the chances are you will not take a good impression yourself. A dentist made guard is the best type of guard. If the fit is sloppy the protection is diminished and the comfort is not so good. The only reason to get one of these given the price of it is if you really don't want to go to a dentist.

cormie

Hmm interesting alright, how are these having such rave reviews if you can get better for pretty much the same investment locally?

Mingetoad

Cos usually a dentist made one in the US is a few hundred dollars.
Regarding the Under Armour ones Fitz, they have three types. Two custom made (one for contact sports, one for non-contact sports) and one that is stock mouldable. The contact sports one really is a good piece of kit, better than a lab would give us here, but at a very very high cost (lab fee alone a couple of hndred last time I checked). They certainly offer full protection.

cormie

Oh yeah? So it's actually cheaper to get the dentist made ones here? That's a first

What way does the under armour one work? Where do you get fitted for them or do some dentists have affiliation etc?

Mingetoad

Yeah they have 'preferred suppliers' who take an impression and send it to Under Armour to be made. I'd expect them to cost about 400 odd.

cormie

Wow, that's a lot of money.

So in summary, would this be about right?

Gladiator - Best "own impression" option for avoiding dentist at a cost of circa €90 for first guard and €35 per guard after.

Irish Dentist Regular Mould - Professional impression taken and guard made from this, will be more effective, protective and comfortable than Gladiator. Cost is around €80 per guard.

Under Armour via Preferred Supplier - Best protection and comfort possible with lab design and professionally taken impression. Cost around €400.

Does that sound about right?

With the Gladiator there's also a few options The raptor resists chewing. The power grip allows you to bite your lower molars into the guard which is meant to help prevent concussion. Neither should be a big concern for me playing basketball really.

Cosmetically, how would the dentist ones look? I would have been going for the clear gladiator one. They put their logo on most of them and you actually have to pay $10 more to not have the logo on it, which I was going to pay. So the dental one is just the upper teeth too I imagine, how would it be thickness wise etc? This is just for basketball so wouldn't need such high protection as I would if I was boxing or doing MMA or Rugby etc

btkm8unsl0w5r4

you can have it made in any colour you want, or two colours, or three colours although the multicoloured ones are a little more expensive. OP if getting a branded one is going to make you more liekly to wear it then do that, all that matters is getting some good protection for your teeth.

Mingtoad, yeah the full protection custom under armour ones are good but I have seen a few people wearing the lower armourbite thinking its a really cool looking mouthguard. Also a lot of the underarmour guards are boil and bite. Again even a cool looking UA boil and bite is offering worse protection than a custom made one. UA offer custom ones but these are not the ones that people get most often.

cormie

Thanks fitz, I think you misread my post above, I said I was going to pay $10 extra to have the logo REMOVED, just want a simple mouth guard, no need for branding

I wonder are the under armour ones really that much better or if it's just marketing hype?

Mingetoad

The lower Under Armour is for non-contact sports. It is for breathing, cortisol etc. so anyone wearing them for protection has been given bad information from their dentist.
From a protection point of view the Under Armour have nothing more to offer than what the dentist would usually give out. They are so expensive to pay for the research, advertising, etc that goes into them. They MAY improve some aspescts of physical performance, and this is where they differ, not on the protection.

ballsymchugh

just veering slightly off topic for a sec, but how does a mouthguard protect against concussion??

Mingetoad

If it's a serious question and not rhetorical, the short answer is : nobody is sure if they do.
IF they do- the hypothesis is that the mouthguard changes the position of the mandible on impact which in turn will alter the force entering the fossae. Some impact force will be dissipated throughout the guard too. I prefer to advise patients on their use for preventing dental injuries, not concussion.

mikehn

I'M really out of touch pricewise, a neighbour is supplying custom mouthguards, 2 for €80 with a custom case and i remember commenting on how expensive they sounded, ouch, must remember shut mouth catches no flies. He does the total custom bit, impression etc but he carries out a slight modification to the guard, he incorporates a "dam" at the back which is a slightly raised line of material which really creates suction to hold the piece in place. My nephew was showing me how firmly they gripped and it was really difficult to pull them down. I cant see how it would be possible to beat this kind of service.

Big_G

Post dam is not necessary for holding a mouthguard in. The undercuts of the teeth from their natural contour and embrasure is enough to hold a gum shield in in most cases. A correct impression will pick these. Fitz the under armour expensive guard comes from the LVI/Jankelson school of occlusal thinking if you get my drift.

cormie

Mingetoad wrote: »

The lower Under Armour is for non-contact sports. It is for breathing, cortisol etc. so anyone wearing them for protection has been given bad information from their dentist.
From a protection point of view the Under Armour have nothing more to offer than what the dentist would usually give out. They are so expensive to pay for the research, advertising, etc that goes into them. They MAY improve some aspescts of physical performance, and this is where they differ, not on the protection.

Thanks for that. I'm guessing from your posts you're a dentist, if you want to PM me your clinic address and a price to get this done I might get in touch if my own dentist doesn't offer this If any of the other posters here are dentists too just let me know

btkm8unsl0w5r4

Big_G wrote: »

Post dam is not necessary for holding a mouthguard in. The undercuts of the teeth from their natural contour and embrasure is enough to hold a gum shield in in most cases. A correct impression will pick these. Fitz the under armour expensive guard comes from the LVI/Jankelson school of occlusal thinking if you get my drift.

I would go so far as to say a post dam is undesirable for a sports guard as it would effect the fit in the time periods allowed as it sits on uncompressable palatal mucosa (unless this chap does full coverage?) Post dams are present to soak up the shrinkage of acrylic in dentures and sports guards are not made of acrylic.

The UA guards are a bit Voodoo alright, however they do have literature showing improvement in performance for elite athletes. The placebo effect is strong and real

cormie

Ok, so which one of you wants my business if you're local enough to Dun Laoghaire?

ballsymchugh

cormie wrote: »

Ok, so which one of you wants my business if you're local enough to Dun Laoghaire?

your own one will be able to help you.

cormie

Interesting, sent this to Gladiator:

Hi again,
Thanks for the reply. After having researched this a bit more on an Irish forum, the dental section It has been suggested that I would be much better off getting a custom guard made from a professional impression done by a dentist who will then send it off to get a guard made themselves. It will be maybe around ?80, so a little cheaper (although more expensive for each subsequent guard) but is said to be a better option than doing my own impression. Apparently the cost for US Dental services is much higher than here which is strange as usually everything here is more expensive Unless there are several strong reasons to get a gladiator over a regular dental guard?

Thanks for your help anyway

Regards!

And got this back:

MY guess would be a dental professional answered that question. Ask the dental professional how many guards they do a year we do more most likely in a day. We understand the requirements for different sport and change how we make the guard based on what it will be used for. Each guard is sport specific. we also use a much higher grade of impression material than what a dental professional would use. They will likely use a material called alginate we use crown and bridge material called poly vinyl siloxane a far more accurate material. Dental professional would like you to believe making a simple mold of the mouth is rocket science and you could not possible do it. Frankly we work for dentist as well as the general public and the general public does as well as they do with the molds.
Thank You

ballsymchugh

technically, us dentists don't make them either, we ship the impressions off to a lab that'll make loads of them a day. since the new GAA guidelines are coming in next year, i'd say technicians around ireland are making plenty themselves.

you can do what you want, but there's plain marketing going on in that reply. you're not getting a precision crown or veneer made, so accuracy down to the nanometre is not important.

park500

This is misleading "poly vinyl siloxane a far more accurate material".
This material is good for impressions of teeth but not gums- you need an accurate impression of both at the same time for a gumshield.In fact i would warn against using it as it sets very hard any you may not be able to get it out of your mouth.
For friends and family I use http://www.playsafemouthguards.co.uk/
A dentist will probably charge 100-150 for one of these.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

The PVS material they ship is a putty consistency which has very little surface detail. Taking an impression is not rocket science, but I find it difficult to take a good one of my own mouth, especially with putty and I take dozens of impressions every day.

At the end of the day, its a 80 euro sports guard, nobody is going to get their knickers in a twist about where you go to have it done. My advice to my family and friends (for whom I have to make them for free so it would be easier to tell them to go online) would be to have a custom made one, taken from a good impression made by a dentist. They are cheap, well fitting, comfortable and easily remade if you loose it off the same model. The amount it would cost to fix a fractured tooth is ten or more time greater than the cost of a sportguard, if you go to a dentist to have one made the added benefit is you become a patient of record with that dentist and they provide you with emergency treatment and preventative advice.

All this discussion about a simple, device readily available on every high street in the country for less cost than a tank of diesel, is a waste of your effort. Just get one somewhere and use it.

America is far more expensive for dental treatment, so is Canada, so is Australia. Everyone, everywhere thinks their local prices are too great. The fact that a dentist recommends going to a dentist and a company that make money doing the opposite say the opposite shouldn't come as a surprise, however I hope that we have explained why its better and less expensive to go to a dentist.

cormie

I'm definitely not trolling Just showing the reply after thanking them for their detailed initial email and offer. €80 is a lot when you can get boil your own ones for €5. Before I started looking into getting a mouth guard I wasn't expecting them to be anywhere near €80 as I got one years and years ago for about €5. When I'm buying something I'll be using for a number of years, and in this case, probably having to buy further ones down the line, I like to do the research first be happy with the result and then I know what to do next time and can just go the same route without needing any further research. I know €80 isn't a lot, especially compared to fixing any damage that could be caused without one and I've no problem spending €80 on something that will protect my choppers

Also, I was thinking along the same lines of getting a clean done at the same time

Mingetoad

Cormie, I understand €80 may be a lot to you,but as you say, if it protects you from serious dental trauma then it is superb value. I would echo fitzgeme's previous post. You seem to be torn between the gladiator mouthguard and a dentist made one. There isn't a large price difference and there wouldn't be much difference in performance between them. If I were you I would go to the dentist as you will get somewhat of an exam also and you would be guaranteed that the guard will fit properly. Regarding the gladiator statement about sports specific etc, I would respectfully counter that by saying that the sports you are doing (boxing/mma) need the highest protection so those modifications are not applicable to you anyway. I have seen the gladiator guards, there are no problems with them at all, they look cool, but they certainly are not in any performance way better than a custom made one from the dentist- in fact, they are custom made pieces from a lab (essentially the same thing with a cool brand).
Don't sweat over the difference of a few euro, the main thing is you haven't been fooled again by a boil-and-bite one from a sports shop. Go for the gladiator one or one from a dentist and then don't forget to WEAR IT!

cormie

Thanks for that and for your PM. I don't actually do boxing or mma, it's for basketball mainly but good to have for anything I may get into too

Will probably check with my regular dentist and see if they can do it and I'll get a clean/check up at the same time. If I've no luck I'll be in touch

Big_G

Taking an impression isn't rocket science but it isn't easy either. I will often retake impressions that I am not happy with (i.e. I do many impressions and I don't always get it right!). Also, I will often custom fit the impression tray because it may not be covering all of the tissues that we want to get a mouthguard to protect. PVS putty is definitely not the correct impression material for this procedure. I play rugby myself and I have a decent idea of how I want a mouth guard to fit to offer comfort and protection.

icedog11

Gentlemen, I am the owner of Gladiator mouthguards, I am here to educate only not market. Every thing I post I can back up with articles published in peer reviewed dental journals. Lets start with the Under Armour mouthguard the guard is so thin It provides almost no protective value. All mouthguards move the mandible down and forward and provide the same benefit as the under armour performance mouthguard. To be effective a mouthguard should be 4mm thick. Most dentist and Labs make vacuum formed mouthguards these are considered to be vastly inferior to heat and pressure laminated mouthguards which is what Gladiator produces.

Going to a local dentist is great, just go in with knowledge. You want a heat and pressure laminated guard that achieves 4mm in thickness on the buccal, insical edges, and occlusal surfaces ( buccal is the surface of the tooth on the lip side, occlusal is the chewing surface, incisal edges are the edges of the front 6 teeth). After 4mm is achieved the guard becomes increasingly more uncomfortable while adding very little protective value. The guard should be designed with the sport being played in mind is communication important, what can be done with the guard to enhance communication, breathing, and not reduce the protective quality of the guard. What can be done to enhance the athletes performance even more.

Dentist provide less than 1% of all mouthguards made, so labs are not making large numbers of mouthguard, they would rather be making crowns and bridges just like the dentist for obvious reasons $. Companies like mine are very specialized in that all we make are mouthguards. We pay no athletes to wear or endorse our product yet we get athletes like Lebron James, Dwayne Wade, the Canadian olympic women's ice hockey team ( they get free under armour mouthguard and pay for Gladiators). So dealing with a company like mine or a competitor has very little risk. A quick look at reviews of our product on the internet will yield nothing but glowing reports of a great fitting comfortable product. How could that be if taking an impression with PVS is so difficult. We produce hundreds of guards a day verse a local lab which may make 100 in a year and the local dentist may prescribe several mouthguards a month.

ballsymchugh

icedog11 wrote: »

Gentlemen, I am the owner of Gladiator mouthguards, I am here to educate only not market. Every thing I post I can back up with articles published in peer reviewed dental journals. Lets start with the Under Armour mouthguard the guard is so thin It provides almost no protective value. All mouthguards move the mandible down and forward and provide the same benefit as the under armour performance mouthguard. To be effective a mouthguard should be 4mm thick. Most dentist and Labs make vacuum formed mouthguards these are considered to be vastly inferior to heat and pressure laminated mouthguards which is what Gladiator produces.

fire ahead so.

btkm8unsl0w5r4

ballsymchugh wrote: »

fire ahead so.

Once your finished with that, can we discuss why your guards are so expensive given you have so few overheads, its pretty unskilled laboratory work that anyone can do with 10 minutes of training and the raw materials and machinery costs only a few dollars per guard, and the consumers does all the work. I would have though with you turning 100 a day a certain economy of scale would kick in. A dentist has to book two appointments, buy in the guard from the lab, pay postage use impression material, pay skilled staff, keep records and still they charge less.

icedog11

we can start here

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11841462

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21854544

http://www.dentistryiq.com/articles/dem/print/volume-8/issue-1/materials/mouthguard-evolution.html

icedog11

Astrid Tangy Babel wrote: »

Once your finished with that, can we discuss why your guards are so expensive given you have so few overheads, its pretty unskilled laboratory work that anyone can do with 10 minutes of training and the raw materials and machinery costs only a few dollars per guard, and the consumers does all the work. I would have though with you turning 100 a day a certain economy of scale would kick in. A dentist has to book two appointments, buy in the guard from the lab, pay postage use impression material, pay skilled staff, keep records and still they charge less.

Not sure what your paying for a guard or what you charge, our guards start at $50 and this is for a heat and pressure laminated guard, you also forget the cost of the trays, we have designed our own and the cost of single dose pvs impression material we provide enough of both for two impressions. The equipment is thousand of dollars a piece. we staff customer service reps that evaluate the quality of the impression taken at home and ship additional material and personal instructions if the athlete has failed to do an adequate job.

Would you like to discuss your margins on a crown vs what you pay a lab?

icedog11

Using a currency converter my guards cost 36 euros the rest of the costs are international shipping charges, we have no control over those costs and merely pass them to the consumer. with international customers we suggest seeing a local dentist and shipping the model to us to cut out a single shipping charge we then inventory the model in our facility so they can re-order by email without having to ship the model again.

My turn to ask a question how long was the course on sports dentistry in your dental school. How much of your curriculum was devoted to mouthguards?

btkm8unsl0w5r4

icedog11 wrote: »

Not sure what your paying for a guard or what you charge, our guards start at $50 and this is for a heat and pressure laminated guard, you also forget the cost of the trays, we have designed our own and the cost of single dose pvs impression material we provide enough of both for two impressions. The equipment is thousand of dollars a piece. we staff customer service reps that evaluate the quality of the impression taken at home and ship additional material and personal instructions if the athlete has failed to do an adequate job.

Would you like to discuss your margins on a crown vs what you pay a lab?

Sure, My margin is 200-300% on the laboratory cost of a crown. The machinery I require is 100's of thousands of dollars. I too use impression trays and material (material considerable more expensive than yours), have practice managers, QC staff, I have to bear the cost of my own remakes. I also have 10 years of formal training, am a skilled professional which needs paying for, doing a skilled and difficult job, that carries risks and requires insurance. I have to pay for a clinic and all that goes with that.

If I applied my margin to the costs of a sports guard (blank, time on the pressure former, stone, tray, impression material, and ten minutes of unskilled time) it would cost about 15-20 dollars. I would charge a little more as I would need clinic time for the impression and the fitting and record keeping. However removing the need to pay a dentist and have a clinic I think 20 bucks is about right. Your success and throughput would of course mean your costs would be far less than mine. The cost of shipping is integral to the costs and is not "just passed on" labs have to ship to dentist too but dentist use labs that are close by.

Cheapest guard I could find was 68 USD with shipping on your website. I am sure shipping to Europe is considerably more. Having the patient ship the model is just plane crazy, a dentist would have to charge more than the shipping to make an impression and cast it and give it to the patient, then the patient has to ship that to you. Thats crazy.

http://www.dentistryiq.com/articles/dem/print/volume-8/issue-1/materials/mouthguard-evolution.html

Not a peer reviewed article.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21854544

Technique article, no data on efficacy.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11841462

Lab study, no clinical data, no human trial. Using standardised, uni directional force to a non anatomic synthetic lab specimen

We can play this game all day if you want. You sell expensive branded mouthguards, with things like fangs on them. I am all for these fancy guards if the patient will wear them because they are cool looking, the only bad mouthguard is one that is not worn. Mostly these are boil and bites ones as they are uncomfortable. At the end of the day, mouthguards are not a big profit item for dentists and are more done as a service to patients, it up to the patient where they get it and what value they place on a certain brand. This thread gave your company a nice back link, people will do anything to avoid the dentist, you should leave it there. From a purely economic point of view, it makes no sense for an Irish person to order in from the US. There are Irish companies that provide the same service as you, albeit at similarly inflated prices given the lack of need for skilled staff.

icedog11

buy the articles I did there is plenty of data on efficacy in both. Human trial for impact dispersion would be a little cruel no, would love to hear your thoughts on how that should be accomplished.

a dentist would have to charge more than the shipping to make an impression and cast it and give it to the patient, then the patient has to ship that to you. Thats crazy.

I find this statement rather funny based on your post about my costs, tray, alginate, assistant time, pour a cast = few dollars X 300% = $12

I carry very expensive product liability insurance for both the product and for the impression process, believe me this was no easy feat, have advertising costs in national publications in the US for a consumer product that run in the 100's of thousand of dollars, I have QC people and managers just like you, I eat the cost of remakes as well. I am a skill professional as well which needs paying for. trust me my overhead is huge and we work on very tight margins. Climb off your high horse Dr.


Cheapest guard I could find was 68 USD with shipping

again shipping is a pass through cost I'm not making money on shipping the guard is 36 euros.

what is your lab cost for a heat and pressure mouthguard there?

I'm not here to promote my company but an industry that exists because of the need, your lack of understanding of business aside if every dentist devoted a day of his practice to just mouthguards you would not put a dent in the need for this product. The alternative to me and others being around would be unmet demand and more athletes using boil n bite guards. using local company would make sense, they found us because we are the largest consumer direct mouthguard company. The promotion of Under Armour as a protective appliance is what brought me here frankly their custom guards are 2mm thick providing little protection and are all marketing hype.

helimachoptor

You have to get your product to the consumer it's an intrinsic part of the cost not some thing you can just say it's extra and you have no choice about it.

I'm not a dentist but have a commercial background and the cost to get a complete item is the cost the customer must pay they aren't separate no matter how much you might like to think they are

btkm8unsl0w5r4

buy the articles I did there is plenty of data on efficacy in both. Human trial for impact dispersion would be a little cruel no, would love to hear your thoughts on how that should be accomplished.

Human Cadavers.

I find this statement rather funny based on your post about my costs, tray, alginate, assistant time, pour a cast = few dollars X 300% = $12

Your paying a dentist, making an appointment, making a chart, keeping records, medical histories taking up clinic time and the times portion of the daily running costs, lot more than 12 bucks. But you know that cause you have gotten customers to do it before, no?

I carry very expensive product liability insurance for both the product and for the impression process, believe me this was no easy feat, have advertising costs in national publications in the US for a consumer product that run in the 100's of thousand of dollars, I have QC people and managers just like you, I eat the cost of remakes as well. I am a skill professional as well which needs paying for. trust me my overhead is huge and we work on very tight margins. Climb off your high horse Dr.

Welcome to the world of dentistry. You will notice my list was in response to mirror yours, Your marketing budget is what people are paying for, glad that's cleared up now. Making mouth guards is not skilled, its a process anyone with minimal training and simple equipment can do. You are however a entrepreneur which I applaud and is a skill, but you should stick to that side, you have a cool product and good branding, avoid publically defaming your competition, or entering into these tit for tat arguements, underarmours budget is bigger than yours . I think I am only trying to reach the hight of the horse you rode in on taking the tack that dentists or their labs don't know how to make a simple mouth guard


again shipping is a pass through cost I'm not making money on shipping the guard is 36 euros.

Cost is cost, that's why is ludicrous to pay in shipping from the US to europe. Unless you value the branding.

what is your lab cost for a heat and pressure mouthguard there?

24 euro picked up and delivered. 5 euro if I make it myself but I only keep single colour blanks. However as you point out a commercial lab is doing a lot of other things, I would assume a busy single product production line like yours would have much lesser costs from bulk buying and the facts that you pour them, form them and trim them en mass

ballsymchugh

how much are mouthguards in budapest? i'm going on a holiday yada yada...

i never thought a thread on this would go past 10 posts. the OP will probably have given up on sport by the time he makes a decision.

icedog11

LOL your funny, with any consumer product your paying for marketing as the largest part of the cost you don't think it costs more than a few pennies to make compression short or any other athletic apparel.

I have been a part of the world of dentistry my entire life, I have had my work published in JADA an other peer reviewed publications ( not mouthguards ).

I have no fear of Under Armour they actually have sold the division off its a dental lab that pays a licensing fee to be branded as UA

I never said or insinuated dentist or their labs don't know how to make a simple mouthguard. I just came here to post facts that should educate the consumer what they need to look for in a quality mouthguard. If you think every lab and every dentist only practices best method you are quite naive. Many dentist 3500 I believe sell Under Armour mouthguards to their patients at greatly inflated prices, in the USA about $450, in my opinion it is of poor quality and damages companies like mine. The academy of sports dentistry has made an official position statement on the claims Under Armour makes for their mouthguards, saying they are false.

Yes my cost to produce are lower than most labs but my advertising dollars helps everyone including you, 90% of my advertising is to educate the consumer on the difference in mouthguards, boil and bites vacuum formed, for every customer who is willing to try my process there are multiple athletes not comfortable with the process who will seek out a dentist such as the original poster.

cormie

Well that certainly took off I guess from all that the conclusion for the best end guard would be to have a dentist fit the gladiator guard and I send it off to them. This would of course be a big up front cost but would mean Gladiator would have that mould forever and so if I was to require mouth guards for a long time, would probably offer the most protection and work out cheapest?

Big_G

First off there is no need for ad hominems in here. The one study I would like to see is the ability of the untrained consumer to produce an impression of equal quality to a dental professional. Or even if that is relevant. For example, having seen hurlers getting alveolar fractures I've learned that the labial flanges of a mouthguard need to be extended sufficiently to reduce this risk.

One of the surgeries I work in has a pressure former. I got one of the nurses to make me a 4mm dual layer pressure formed mouthguard from mounted casts and it fit great. I have no idea how much it cost but wouldn't say much. The two key stages are impression and fitting in my opinion, both of which are compromised if the consumer self impresses and fits.

As stated before this stuff isn't exactly rocket science, but every once in a while you're going to get a person that doesn't quite fit the cookie cutter such as a class III skeletal or a person with a long alveolus.

The point is it is a bit much for anyone to market themselves as superior to anyone else when talking about mouthguards I think.

Having looked at your website I'll have lebron's fangs please.

icedog11

We are pretty particular about what we accept and use the internet a lot for QC. Every athlete is given enough putty and trays for 2 impressions and instructions as well as an example of what a good impression looks like. If the first impression does not look correct they send us an email with a picture of what they achieved from several angles. We reply with suggestions of what they need to change to get a better impression. You would be surprised how well they actually do. we also staff several high level technicians who have become very proficient at correcting the model work. For compliance issue we terminate the guard at 3/4 of the canine root bulge. we actually have international patents for our mouthguard design. So patent authorities have determined that what we are doing is novel enough to warrant patent protection.

Even with a poorly done impression the fit and protection of a heat and pressure laminated mouthguard greatly out weights that of a traditional boil and bite.

We hate making the Lebron fangs guard and charge enough to dissuade most consumers from purchasing it as well as us cautioning consumers in sports with a high likely hood of contact to not buy the guard due to the extended mouthguard material to accommodate the 3d fangs.

Clinical Dental tech

Hi Cormie,
As a Clinical Dental Technician I both take impressions and make mouth guards. I totally agree with regards to have an impression taken by a dental professional in Ireland and have a custom made mouthguard made here. As previously stated PVS is used for taking impressions of teeth not gums. When it is used to take impressions of a full arch it tends to drag or stretch. The other point is, if you take your own impression,how do you know of its an accurate impression?do you know what the parts of the mouth you need to capture and what the inside of your mouth looks like? quite often impressions need to be retaken over even the slightest discrepancies . Don't even consider a boil and bite! if anyone wants to test this out, if you know someone with a custom made mouth guard buy them a boil and bite for around €10 and let them tell you the difference.
Why would any company suppling mail order mouth guards say that it would be better to get an impression taken by a dental professional?

Regards
Philip

cormie

Thanks again for the replies. I've been a bit slow at following them up as I've a neck injury at the moment so won't be playing for a while again anyway

Anyway, I think actually the best thing to do is maybe just get 2, one from Gladiator which I will then take to the local dentist and get them to do the Gladiator impression as well as ordering their own custom guard while there. I'll then have the dentists guard, send the gladiator professionally done impression back to Gladiator and get the Gladiator guard shipped after too so I'll have two guards as I tend to play a lot so it would be good to have a backup in the car if I forget my bag or for whatever reason. If I don't see any difference in performance, comfort etc between the two, then the Gladiator will probably work out cheaper to replace so can just go for that again.. and again over the years as I'm guessing your mouth doesn't change too much between late 20's and however long I'll be playing? Almost feel I should be giving both sides my business as both have been so helpful