Should the Board of CRC resign for the good of the CRC

raymon

The Central Remedial Clinic board has been stuffed with some highly paid Fianna Fail cronies for many years ,and has even been using charity donations to suppliment their income since the recession hit.

The board was hijacked by Fianna Fail according to Shane Ross
http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/shane-ross/noble-vision-hijacked-by-ff-cronies-29798432.html

(There have also been some good independent members of the board - lets not forget that)

Shouldn't they now resign and allow the board be populated based on other factors other than being a friend of Fianna Fail

Des Peelo (Haughey's Friend) is missing the point - the fact that the charity money was used to suppliment Fianna Failers salaries was just wrong

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-knew-charity-money-used-for-top-ups-says-former-clinic-chair-29801983.html

Floppybits

Yes if it is found that the board sanctioned the top ups from charity donations. Also in saying this there should be a root and branch investigation of how charity donations are being spent by each and every registered charity in the country. People who make donations to these charity expectiing their money to be put to good use for the people/animals or whatever the charity supports, should know what percentage of donations go towards wages and what is spent on helping the causes. I am disgusted that donations that I made to the CRC are being spent on topping up some fat cats wages, that is not why I gave the money for and I am sure it is the case with most of the donations people make.

I dont believe for one moment that the CRC are the only charity paying top ups out of charity donations and I dont believe this is a FF thing either, I think all parties are up to their neck in it/ I expect the government will make some noises about it being disgraceful and are going to have a full investigation and it will be white washed and some toothless regulator will be put in charge on a cushy wage and gold plated pension. Typical reaction by the government of this country and it is now beyond sickening.

raymon

Floppybits wrote: »

I dont believe for one moment that the CRC are the only charity paying top ups out of charity donations and I dont believe this is a FF thing either, I think all parties are up to their neck in it/ I expect the government will make some noises about it being disgraceful and are going to have a full investigation and it will be white washed and some toothless regulator will be put in charge on a cushy wage and gold plated pension. Typical reaction by the government of this country and it is now beyond sickening.

If these specific fat cats were SF, FG , Lab it would be equally as bad. This is not the case .

FF have been stuffing this specific board with overpaid FF cronies.

Floppybits

raymon wrote: »

If these specific fat cats were SF, FG , Lab it would be equally as bad. This is not the case .

FF have been stuffing this specific board with overpaid FF cronies.

FF have been stuffing boards all over the place because they were in power for 15 years, If FG, Lab or SF had been in that position they would have done the same. it is going to take a long time to get rid of all the FF cronies from boards but then the boards will be stuffed with cronies from whatever party is in power at the time. I also believe some of these payments go as far back as 1996 when FF were not in power.

raymon

Floppybits wrote: »

FF have been stuffing boards all over the place because they were in power for 15 years, If FG, Lab or SF had been in that position they would have done the same. it is going to take a long time to get rid of all the FF cronies from boards but then the boards will be stuffed with cronies from whatever party is in power at the time. I also believe some of these payments go as far back as 1996 when FF were not in power.

But you are not getting my point. This specific overpaid board , stuffed by Fianna Fail , should resign in the interest of the crc

The board should then be appointed on a non partisan basis.

You keep introducing the argument that other parties would have , could have , should have , etc., but specifically this is a Fianna Fail mess. These Fianna Failers are digging in for the long fight which will damage the charity.

Floppybits

raymon wrote: »

But you are not getting my point. This specific overpaid board , stuffed by Fianna Fail , should resign in the interest of the crc

The board should then be appointed on a non partisan basis.

You keep introducing the argument that other parties would have , could have , should have , etc., but specifically this is a Fianna Fail mess. These Fianna Failers are digging in for the long fight which will damage the charity.

I agree the board should resign and should have resigned as soon as the information came out, if the board had the good of the CRC at its heart. But lets face it that is the not the Irish way of doing things now is it, the Irish way in policitcal and public life here is the dig in and hold on for as long as you can or until the story goes away and that is not just consigned to FF.

All boards of charities should be appointed on a non partisan basis and I wouldnt stop with the charities either, it should be across the whole spectrum where political stuff boards with as many party faithful as they can.

For me all charities are damaged by this not just CRC, you can hear the ads already on the radio saying all donations go to the charity and not wages top ups. So it is not just CRC that is damaged.

creedp

Floppybits wrote: »

I dont believe for one moment that the CRC are the only charity paying top ups out of charity donations and I dont believe this is a FF thing either, I think all parties are up to their neck in it/ I expect the government will make some noises about it being disgraceful and are going to have a full investigation and it will be white washed and some toothless regulator will be put in charge on a cushy wage and gold plated pension. Typical reaction by the government of this country and it is now beyond sickening.

As the Govt has santioned top-ups for multiple Ministerial advisors then its more than a little hypocritical for the Govt to be criticising other organisations for doing the same. Wasn't is a FG councillor who defended paying a top up to the Crumlin CEO? Justified on the basis that the Board thought the santioned pay scale was too low for their man so they decided to take the law into their own hands! Did somesay say the bad auld days have left with FF?

raymon

creedp wrote: »

As the Govt has santioned top-ups for multiple Ministerial advisors then its more than a little hypocritical for the Govt to be criticising other organisations for doing the same. Wasn't is a FG councillor who defended paying a top up to the Crumlin CEO? Justified on the basis that the Board thought the santioned pay scale was too low for their man so they decided to take the law into their own hands! Did somesay say the bad auld days have left with FF?

Hospital shops should not feed CEO salary. That FG councillor McGinley should not have supported this top up .

rodento

Board should resign only if proved that they did something wrong, they should be entitled to due process

Mr.Micro

rodento wrote: »

Board should resign only if proved that they did something wrong, they should be entitled to due process

People should stop donations in the mean time, as those donations do not appear to be going where they were intended, but into the pockets of FF cronies.

raymon

rodento wrote: »

Board should resign only if proved that they did something wrong, they should be entitled to due process

Redirecting charitable donations to supplement already huge Fianna Failer salaries is surely wrong.

It may not be illegal , is that what you mean?

Reminds me of Charlie and Lenihans kidney fund.

rodento

It means what it says, the board members should be entitled to due process and not trial by media.

Could well have been the case that the HSE sanctioned the top ups

rodento

HSE were 'fully aware' of salary top ups, charity says
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-were-fully-aware-of-salary-top-ups-charity-says-29802572.html

Mr.Micro

rodento wrote: »

It means what it says, the board members should be entitled to due process and not trial by media.

Could well have been the case that the HSE sanctioned the top ups

Indeed that could be the case, but it's the gullible public donor that is kept in the dark, thinking his/her donation is going to help the centre. Not acceptable.

raymon

rodento wrote: »

HSE were 'fully aware' of salary top ups, charity says
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-were-fully-aware-of-salary-top-ups-charity-says-29802572.html

You mean Charlie and Bertie's accountant says ?

Peelo is not a board member.

rodento

More here

http://www.thejournal.ie/crc-hse-agreement-top-ups-1202847-Dec2013/

HSE were sent reports stating a portion of salaries were being paid with lottery proceeds, says CRC

It was agreed that lottery funds would fund the difference between approved pay scales and contractually agreed contracts, and the HSE knew this, said the CRC.

So far we have had two labour ministers suggesting the board resign and one asking for due process but you can't get away from the fact that not only the HSE knew this was happening but the government also breached the cap for their own advisers at the same time, so why wouldn't the HSE and charity groups not do the same

raymon

rodento wrote: »

More here

http://www.thejournal.ie/crc-hse-agreement-top-ups-1202847-Dec2013/

HSE were sent reports stating a portion of salaries were being paid with lottery proceeds, says CRC

It was agreed that lottery funds would fund the difference between approved pay scales and contractually agreed contracts, and the HSE knew this, said the CRC.

So far we have had two labour ministers suggesting the board resign and one asking for due process but you can't get away from the fact that not only the HSE knew this was happening but the government also breached the cap for their own advisers at the same time, so why wouldn't the HSE and charity groups not do the same

The fact that the HSE knew or not is not important in my opinion.

It was wrong for charitable funds to be topping up already bloated salaries

rodento

raymon wrote: »

The fact that the HSE knew or not is not important in my opinion.

It was wrong for charitable funds to be topping up already bloated salaries

Topped up already bloated salaries or maintained contracts that the charities had signed.

raymon

rodento wrote: »

Topped up already bloated salaries or maintained contracts that the charities had signed.

It's a charity for gods sake. The FFers would hardly sue a charity for sick kids run by FFers. Would they ?

The failure of the board to resign in shame will cause untold damage to this charity....... and others.

rodento

I think your hatred of FF is getting in way of u seen the bigger picture, the issue affects most of the section 38 hospitals and agencies

Even those with no political affiliations with FF

Mr.Micro

raymon wrote: »

It's a charity for gods sake. The FFers would hardly sue a charity for sick kids run by FFers. Would they ?

The failure of the board to resign in shame will cause untold damage to this charity....... and others.

I would question why such a board would keep such expensive individuals on the payroll, that the CRC can ill afford? Is the organization there to serve the FF cronies or the charity? Pigs at the trough, where the charity comes second.

michael999999

Mr.Micro wrote: »

I would question why such a board would keep such expensive individuals on the payroll, that the CRC can ill afford? Is the organization there to serve the FF cronies or the charity? Pigs at the trough, where the charity comes second.

There jobs for berties 'friends' , I'm sure the favour was repaid many times by them!

Wasn't kiely a donor to aherns cash fund, in the days when bertie was doing cash collections.

Sad bastards are even robbing funds from disabled kids charitys to fund the new merc to pull up at the next fianna fail ard fheis in!

Fianna fail should be disbanded and investigated by the CAB!

creedp

raymon wrote: »

Hospital shops should not feed CEO salary. That FG councillor McGinley should not have supported this top up .

I agree but I didn't hear Kenny and Co coming out criticising this comment by one of the party faithful and saying that any top-up paid to CEOs of voluntary bodies approved by boards stuffed with political hacks to be unacceptable in any circumstance. It was also telling that the only board member of one of these bodies which was called to resign was the guy who called for the repayment of the top-ups.

raymon

creedp wrote: »

I agree but I didn't hear Kenny and Co coming out criticising this comment by one of the party faithful and saying that any top-up paid to CEOs of voluntary bodies approved by boards stuffed with political hacks to be unacceptable in any circumstance. It was also telling that the only board member of one of these bodies which was called to resign was the guy who called for the repayment of the top-ups.

FG should condemn all topups . Shame on them all if they haven't. Boards shouldn't be stuffed with politically aligned cronies of any ilk.. But let's not fall for the old " look over there " trick.

The thread is specifically about the board of the crc. Should they resign or not????

raymon

rodento wrote: »

I think your hatred of FF is getting in way of u seen the bigger picture, the issue affects most of the section 38 hospitals and agencies

Even those with no political affiliations with FF

This isn't about me , although I am openly anti FF dishonesty, so I may have a certain bias.

The facts of this case are clear.

A charity used charity funds to increase salaries of its board . In one case the salary was 242,000 Euro.

How can that be good for sick children.?

creedp

raymon wrote: »

FG should condemn all topups . Shame on them all if they haven't. Boards shouldn't be stuffed with politically aligned cronies of any ilk.. But let's not fall for the old " look over there " trick.

The thread is specifically about the board of the crc. Should they resign or not????

If the Board is actually concerned with CRCs reputation, then it should resign immediately. However, questions must also be asked of those who knew the Board was sanctioning these top-ups but choose to do nothing about it.

joe swanson

Resignations sooner rather than later are imperative. It will show the public it is unacceptable and will be dealt with. The facts should then be established and procedures put in place to ensure it will not happen again, and indeed show transparency.

If this does not happen, people will not donate again and the good work that is done at the crc will cease to exist

rodento

HSE did know of top ups but err... didn't sanction them, you'll probably find out like other top ups that they were fully compliant with the law

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/kennys-43k-top-up-pay-fully-compliant-with-the-law-184302.html

Question is if the HSE knew about them four years ago, why was nothing done about it....

raymon

rodento wrote: »

HSE did know of top ups but err... didn't sanction them, you'll probably find out like other top ups that they were fully compliant with the law

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/kennys-43k-top-up-pay-fully-compliant-with-the-law-184302.html

Question is if the HSE know about them four years ago, why was nothing done about it....

I suspect you are pulling the "look over there" trick for reasons unknown.


Do you agree that 242000 per year for one board member was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that diverting charitable funds to top up already huge salaries was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that running a surplus of 12 million was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that the board hanging on will affect donations?

jmayo

raymon wrote: »

Des Peelo (Haughey's Friend) is missing the point - the fact that the charity money was used to suppliment Fianna Failers salaries was just wrong

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-knew-charity-money-used-for-top-ups-says-former-clinic-chair-29801983.html

Well if he was involved there certainly is something to question.

raymon wrote: »

But you are not getting my point. This specific overpaid board , stuffed by Fianna Fail , should resign in the interest of the crc

The board should then be appointed on a non partisan basis.

You keep introducing the argument that other parties would have , could have , should have , etc., but specifically this is a Fianna Fail mess. These Fianna Failers are digging in for the long fight which will damage the charity.

Here is a better idea lets get rid of the fooking board altogether.
All these boards cost money and expenses.
Why is yet another quangoe style talking shop in place.

rodento wrote: »

It means what it says, the board members should be entitled to due process and not trial by media.

Could well have been the case that the HSE sanctioned the top ups

due process my ar**.
With or without HSE sanctions they were completly disengenous in using charitable funds to pay topups to anyone's salaries.
What grates even more is the fact it was to ceo, HR manager and IT manager and the likes.

And whoever sanctioned a salary of 240,000 for the cheif executive in the first place deserves a kick up the ar**.
Then to add insult they dipped into funds to pay him half his salary whilst probably at the same time telling people in need of their services that they needed more money to provide those services.
This was whilst at the same time siphoning it off for overpaid connected gobdaws.

Oh yes we hear the argument about how their contract necessitated it.
Well if there wasn't the money then either put up with the cuts or fook off.
I was suppose they thought it was better to tell the kids or parents to fook off.

This country stinks.
It has for a long time, but it is only now we truly are getting to see how some classes of people feel their entitlements outweigh everything and everyone else.
Decency and honesty be dammed.

We often hear quiet a number of high placed publicly funded individuals on the airwaves complaining about lack of funding.
We always knew they were very well paid.
But we never knew quiet how far some of these probably were willing to go to ensure that the lack of funds never impacted on them.

jmayo

rodento wrote: »

HSE did know of top ups but err... didn't sanction them, you'll probably find out like other top ups that they were fully compliant with the law

There are lots of things compliant with the law.
There are lots of things one can do that isn't brekaing the law.
That doesn't mean these things can't be downright repugnant and scummy.

Mr.Micro

jmayo wrote: »

There are lots of things compliant with the law.
There are lots of things one can do that isn't brekaing the law.
That doesn't mean these things can't be downright repugnant and scummy.

Yes indeed, the likes of these parasites sucking the blood out of the charity and the board approving the salaries for each other. A cozy little set up. Is there anything honourable left in this country, that is not tainted by greed and cronyism?

rodento

Yes it may well be toxic and nasty it's way better to deal with the issue when all the information is available for all th section 38 hospitals and agencies. Seems your happy to make an issue of one for political purposes and let the others and the government off scot free

raymon

rodento wrote: »

Yes it may well be toxic and nasty it's way better to deal with the issue when all the information is available for all th section 38 hospitals and agencies. Seems your happy to make an issue of one for political purposes and let the others and the government off scot free

So why don't the Fianna Failer board come forward with the facts instead of sending out Bertie and Haugheys friend Peelo to blame the HSE.

rodento

You'd have to agree they have been more transparent than most of the other section 38 hospitals and agencies, some if which have been very very quite, but my guess is that you've missed that

raymon

rodento wrote: »

You'd have to agree they have been more transparent than most of the other section 38 hospitals and agencies, some if which have been very very quite, but my guess is that you've missed that

Another board had someone on 242,000 euro and reserves of 12 million, and riddled with Fianna Fail cronies? Some other hospital was diverting funds from its charity to top up over 100,000 for one person?

Sorry missed that scoop.

Don't get me wrong FG or SF or Lab cronies are wrong too.

rodento

Looks like the HSE chief who is giving out about the unsanctioned top up is actually in receipt of an unsanctioned top up, ya couldn't make this up

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-chief-who-criticised-topups-defends-his-own-25k-allowance-29811221.html

raymon

rodento wrote: »

Looks like the HSE chief who is giving out about the unsanctioned top up is actually in receipt of an unsanctioned top up, ya couldn't make this up

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/hse-chief-who-criticised-topups-defends-his-own-25k-allowance-29811221.html

That's another attempt at whataboutery.

You haven't answered my questions specific to the OP.

Do you agree that 242000 per year for one board member was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that diverting charitable funds to top up already huge salaries was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that running a surplus of 12 million was outrageous and wrong?
Do you agree that the board hanging on will affect donations?

Any official getting top ups is wrong, but this thread is very specific.

golfball37

raymon wrote: »

So why don't the Fianna Failer board come forward with the facts instead of sending out Bertie and Haugheys friend Peelo to blame the HSE.

Des of course is the man who said on Frontline one night that Bertie's knowledge of the horses made him believe his story about winning big on the GeeGee's was credible.

Mr.Micro

golfball37 wrote: »

Des of course is the man who said on Frontline one night that Bertie's knowledge of the horses made him believe his story about winning big on the GeeGee's was credible.

Just look at the countenance of Peelo, he looks like he came from the same pod as Ahern......lol.

expectationlost

the 12 million surplus is ok it its for a big building project

rodento

Looks like the HSE chief can keep the unsactioned top up he received as an oversight....

Reilly: HSE chief O'Brien can keep €160k wage top-up
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/reilly-hse-chief-obrien-can-keep-160k-wage-topup-29817838.html

rodento

rodento wrote: »

Looks like the HSE chief can keep the unsactioned top up he received as an oversight....

Reilly: HSE chief O'Brien can keep €160k wage top-up
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/reilly-hse-chief-obrien-can-keep-160k-wage-topup-29817838.html

quote from the article


The spokesman added: "Had Tony O'Brien known that the arrangement had not been properly processed, he would have ensured that it was immediately rectified in order to correctly reflect the agreement.

"It would be unjust to seek to have the money repaid."

raymon

rodento wrote: »

quote from the article


The spokesman added: "Had Tony O'Brien known that the arrangement had not been properly processed, he would have ensured that it was immediately rectified in order to correctly reflect the agreement.

"It would be unjust to seek to have the money repaid."

But this thread is not about the HSE , Tony o Brien, Enda Kenny or any other unrelated official.
It is specifically about the CRC board .

You have another thread about top ups in general. I agree all top ups are wrong, but you seem determined to derail this thread away from the OP for some bizarre reason.

Can you answer the questions

Do you agree that 242000 per year for one board member was outrageous and wrong?Do you agree that diverting charitable funds to top up already huge salaries was outrageous and wrong?Do you agree that running a surplus of 12 million was outrageous and wrong?Do you agree that the board hanging on will affect donations?

rodento

Seems to me that you are happy to focus on a worm in a very large can of worms and it seems purely for political purposes

Yes the payments are wrong, the top ups are wrong but one can not afford a knee jerk reaction to this and as a result let the other section 38 hospitals, agencies and government appointees or advisors off the hook

In the case of the HSE chief, if I was overpaid an acting allowance for 5 years because of a clerical mistake or oversight I would have to pay the money back...

I hope your seen a pattern with all the spin been made about this but in the meantime have a read about how much Reilly pays someone to look at trolleys

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/reilly-hires-another-164k-expert-191059.html

And remember that Reilly insisted that there is a pay cap in place in the HSE and they have to stick to it

raymon

The CEO of the CRC Brian conlon has finally resigned , only to be replaced by long term friend of Fianna Fail James Nugent. Well done Fianna Fail , you couldn't make this Fianna Fail pantomime up.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/ceo-of-central-remedial-clinic-resigns-29821909.html

michael999999

raymon wrote: »

The CEO of the CRC Brian conlon has finally resigned , only to be replaced by long term friend of Fianna Fail James Nugent. Well done Fianna Fail , you couldn't make this Fianna Fail pantomime up.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/ceo-of-central-remedial-clinic-resigns-29821909.html

Jesus christ almighty, so does this mean that he no longer has to appear before an Oireachtas committee?

So another 'friend' of fianna fail lands in a top job. I'm sure its only coincidence!

Can we not just give the contract to rentokil to rid Ireland of fianna fail.

raymon

Let me introduce you to the new CEO .

He was one of Berties whiparound donors.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1207/96938-mahon/

According to RTE he is also an ex banker.

Well done CRC , I'm sure your Christmas Bears are flying off the shelves.

It is very depressing that the real victims here are the vulnerable children and adults.

Fianna Fail uber alles.

rodento

michael999999 wrote: »

Jesus christ almighty, so does this mean that he no longer has to appear before an Oireachtas committee?

You have to wonder at the people who wanted him out so quickly :rolleyes:

raymon

rodento wrote: »

You have to wonder at the people who wanted him out so quickly :rolleyes:

I was particularly outraged at the charity donations to be used to make a fat cat fatter .

I wanted him out , and I want Berties mate "whiparound" Nugent to go too.

So rodento ....... What is your plan to oust all the other top uppers from FG , FF , Lab , Ind?

In principle I agree with you .

rodento

That I can't answer but would have like him to talk before he walked, just hope it doesn't take the spotlight off the hospitals, trusts etc