Family problem

peterthehitman

Iv worked on the home farm since i left school in 3rd year of seconder school. My parents took me out to get the farm out of financial bother cause my father did not no how to run the farm .I worked the farm without pay only pocket money.
I have worked from 17 up to the age i am now 33 on the farm . In this time my brother went off to college and go a degree and finished it 8 years ago and only manged to get petite jobs and came home to farm with me 4 years ago fulltime.
My father gave my brother and me both equal parts of land(150ac) and he kept some back for himself (50ac) which i was happy with.
This year my father went and gave his part rent free to the brother and left me out .
I have bought alot of machines between myself and the brother 50/50 .
This situation has really pissed me off and was thinking of sell my half of machinery .
What do yee think of this scenario ?

delaval

Have you spoken to your father about this?
I wouldn't go nuclear just yet
From what you describe it seems unfair but it is his land.

If you press the red button how will it impact on your business?

Butcher Boy

you should never go half in anything only the bed, have it of your own or don't have it at all.

bbam

Must be rough only being handed 150ac and not it all !!

It's his land and he'd be entitled to do what he sees fit.

Only one thing I hate more than greed is a sense if entitlement. It's like kids squabbling over toys!!

Timmaay

delaval wrote: »

Have you spoken to your father about this?
I wouldn't go nuclear just yet
From what you describe it seems unfair but it is his land.

If you press the red button how will it impact on your business?

Agreed, once you press that button there usually is no return, most family fallouts I know about all results in a lifetime of not speaking to each other etc. Go talk, despite how hard that might be.

Mulumpy

No point in making the situation worse cos farm is unworkable then. Could you come to an agreement with your brother than he can have the 50 acres but while you are farming it that you split all the profits ftom it.

Manoffeeling

This is an awkward situation. You have 2 options.

Firstly, do nothing but be unhappy and let it fester, because believe me, it will get in on you.

Or secondly, you could be assertive and sort it out.

There is a myth that its your father's land and he can do whatever he wants. While this maybe interpreted as the case, the fact that you have farmed almost 17 years means that there was a probable expectation of you inheriting the land. Have you had a tax partnership number with your father? Have you a joint account with him? Have you invested money in the farm?

I was in similar situation. I had to call Daddy's bluff. Either you divide or you will be sold out. You have more rights than you know.

****ing land, the ruination of families.

epfff

[quote="bbam;87720506"

Only one thing I hate more than greed is a sense if entitlement. It's like kids squabbling over toys!![/quote]

This is very different
This certainly is not greed
Missing valuable years of social development cannot be compensated for
However don't have fallout with family at any cost
It will fester in you if you don't deal with it
Be prepared to walk away from whole thing if needs be
u built that business you are capable of doing it again

iverjohnston

I note that you use the term "rent free" regarding the 50 acres. Does this mean that the father has not signed it over to your brother permanently?, but he has the use of it?
Is the 150 acres you were given now yours, freehold, or do you pay a rent/consideration to your father? Are the Folios in your sole name?

If you sell your half of the machinery, how will you farm the land you have? Or perhaps half the machines are yours, not half of each machine?
The day will come, when there is a spouse to consider, or a next generation coming on, when this will need sorting, machinery, stock, land, house etc.
Many is the farm has had the same situation to sort out. And its not always a happy outcome. Wives, and husbands, often do not get on, and perhaps its time to start looking at the long term outlook. Selling up your half of land and machinery may look to be a nuclear option right now, but if a 150 acres and a house came up in an area with better land, you could do worse than consider moving. Anyway, talk to the father and brother, if you can.

on the river

ask your father his position and let him know how you feel about the situation. If ye dont agree either put up with it or get out competely. all or nothing their is no inbetween . Dont waste time on something that can be sorted out quickly .

munkus

i left school in 3rd year of seconder school. My parents took me out to get the farm out of financial bother cause my father did not no how to run the farm .I worked the farm without pay only pocket money.
I have worked from 17 up to the age i am now 33 on the farm


This doesn't add up. you were pulled out of school at 14 to manage the farm, better than your father was? How then did you work from 17 until 33?

Anyway. Do you have a poor relationship with the father? I'd be pissed off myself if I didn't get to go to college, as your brother is far more employable off the farm then you are, considering he has an education and so more opportunities. This should be taken into consideration by your father.

rs8

at 33 you would have to stand up and confront

RaggyDays

Just be happy with what you have, 150ac is no bad farm and a great start; let your father and brother off to do there own things and concentrate on getting your farm going as best it can, maybe consider renting another bit of land if you feel you can handle more

Muckit

Yes it's a case of glass half full or half empty. 150 acres with a brother nearby to lend a hand at times is no bad thing. Keep a cool head and talk things out. The very best of luck to you all

TITANIUM.

RaggyDays wrote: »

Just be happy with what you have, 150ac is no bad farm and a great start; let your father and brother off to do there own things and concentrate on getting your farm going as best it can, maybe consider renting another bit of land if you feel you can handle more

Good man Raggy.
You have a grand farm there lad. So go and make a job of it.
Lifes to short to be falling out with people.
Im not saying that i agree with what's gone on but there comes a time when you have to man the fcuk up and get on with it.

Seaba

Is it the fact that your father gave the land to your brother and not you/halved it between you that's the issue, or is it the financial side of things that is annoying you because you have mentioned rent free land, buying machinery etc?

If it's the latter it's reasonably simply maths. Your brother owns 4/7s of the land and you own 3/7s - anytime a bill comes up in the future that you both have to pay, split it that way.

If it's the former you will have to swallow a bit of pride and ask your father why he gave the land to your brother and not split it with you. It could be a simple answer that your brother has more bills/kids etc and he thought he was doing the right thing.

Either way 50 acres is not worth falling out of over (if he handed the whole farm over then fair enough). We own just 60 acres in total, but I appreciate it's the principle of the matter that might be at stake with you.

1chippy

stay calm and talk to your father on his own. dont try playing the sympathy card and definately dont go bald headed at anyone. yo never know your father might be giving it to him rent free but could be leaving it to you. family feuds are a disaster and no matter what happens there will always be a sense of resentment somewhere. who does your father turn to or which of you will be looking after him in the years to come?

the_syco

peterthehitman wrote: »

This year my father went and gave his part rent free to the brother and left me out .
I have bought alot of machines between myself and the brother 50/50 .
This situation has really pissed me off and was thinking of sell my half of machinery .
What do yee think of this scenario ?

Whose name is the machinery in, and how's things between you and your bro?

moy83

I would ask the father straight out why he did it . He might have a valid reason in his own head , often I have seen parents favour one of the kids with less "go in him " because they know the better lad will probably improve his own lot easier than the other .
I remember a cousin of mine was getting a nice farm off his father , but the sheds and a bit of good land was going to another brother . He fell out with him over it because he helped build some of the sheds . All he has now is his lawn !
I fell out with some of my family recently and to be honest I'm glad , they had a way about telling me what to do and annoying me with crap because they always thought they knew better . I was too long putting up with them and sorry I didnt kick up sooner . In saying that falling out with family is a messy business and should be a last resort if at all possible .

Manoffeeling

Moy is right about falling out with family. BUT if you are being shafted, then I wouldn't waste my time with them. I was being shafted but stood up for myself. Things going really well for me. Best thing ever was rinsing my hands of my family. You see who's who.

Have you any loans in your name?

Talk to the old man about it and your future. If your gut turns, then it's up to you.

RoscommonTom

Talk to him but try nor to fall out, you only get one family and youll miss them when there gone

moy83

RoscommonTom wrote: »

Talk to him but try nor to fall out, you only get one family and youll miss them when there gone

Youre right about only having one family , but if they are bothering you or taking advantage that one family will be a thorn in your side for the rest of your life and its not worth putting up with that either .

OP I dont know whats going on in your case and there might be a simple reason as to why your brother got the use of the land so of course I wouldn't encourage a blow up but I would say ask your father straight out whats going on and at least you would know his reasons before you go any farther .
Also dont forget that lads are renting alot more land than they will ever own and are happy with their lot and would never expect to be given anything

jersey101

Best thing you do now is talk to your father and see what the storey is, from what you have said so far it seems very unfair that you have worked since you were 17 and not got the chance of going to college or going abroad for a few years and your brother gets to do all that and just comes in and gets it with out doing the work you have done since you were 17. I know how you feel my father worked like a dog since he was 20 at home and then it turned around and he had to buy the farm off my grandmother after building it up. Then we sold it and bought another, partly because we wanted to get away from family but more for the fact that we wanted more land. By the sounds of it you deserve more of a share in the land than your bro, go talk to your father

whelan1

did your father say anything to you before he gave the land to your brother? Are you relying on what your brother said.... as others said i would speak to your father

mf240

A small bit of land will do us all when we kick the bucket.

Walk away with your 150, let him look after the old lad,

Fighting with family is sole destroying. Better spend your energy building your own business up.

Juniorhurler

Similar job happened here with the last generation. The grandmother and my mother could never see eye to eye so after mu grandfathers death the will was changed and the place went to another son with no interest in ot aptitude for farming. He ran it to the ground and my father ended up buying it from him. This generation it has been made clear and I presume legal that it comes to me as I have invested heavily in the place.
I would urge you to talk it through between all three of you before falling out and possibly making solicitors wealthy from a dispute. You do have rights though, as you were only getting pocket money if it all goes wrong you have a legitimate claim for wages owed plus interest over a 16 year period if your 150 ac are not transferred to your name. Happened with a neighbour here when a son came home and got a place that the brother had harmed for 20 years on pocket money.

coolshannagh28

Read the parable of the prodigal son

stanflt

peterthehitman wrote: »

Iv worked on the home farm since i left school in 3rd year of seconder school. My parents took me out to get the farm out of financial bother cause my father did not no how to run the farm .I worked the farm without pay only pocket money.
I have worked from 17 up to the age i am now 33 on the farm . In this time my brother went off to college and go a degree and finished it 8 years ago and only manged to get petite jobs and came home to farm with me 4 years ago fulltime.
My father gave my brother and me both equal parts of land(150ac) and he kept some back for himself (50ac) which i was happy with.
This year my father went and gave his part rent free to the brother and left me out .
I have bought alot of machines between myself and the brother 50/50 .
This situation has really pissed me off and was thinking of sell my half of machinery .
What do yee think of this scenario ?

how did you pay for these machines if you only got pocket money

Massey10

I think if you do have the 150 in your name you should just get on with things. Tell them both your point of view but what else can you do. Id say any judge will say the 150 you got covers the past work you've done.

mayota

Your brother was given 50 acres rent free. Maybe this land is to be willed to you. Talk to both. Nice to have brother close for help and support.

whelan1

know a few families in a similar situation to the op, thankfully it didnt happen here as everything was written down early on so everyone knew where they stood. My dad had seen many families falling apart over the years over a total lack of communication and didnt want it to happen here, hopefully in a few years i can do the same

Rhys Essien

OP,you should bite your lip and leave them talk to you first.Your father wont be around forever,and if your brother has any decency now,he should tell you that he will give you back 25 acres in time.

Don't fly off the handle.Who knows what idea your father has in his head now.

peterthehitman

The reason is i think my father has decided not to give that piece of land is because of my mother . Basically she never wanted to see me with any girls or even meet up with a girl which i have told her my whole life to stay out of my private life. My farther is influenced by my mother . My brother is single by the way and never stands up for himself walkover..
Last year I went and got married to a beautiful girl which comes from a farm herself and she could not believe what was going on and how backwards my mother is . My mother hates my wife even thou they have met and talked and when my wife would leave the house my mother would make little of her with my sister ,so my wife doesn't bother going into the house anymore .
Before i even arrived home all them years ago my father had run the farm into the ground and i was sent home to get the bank off there backs .
The machinery was manly bough last year so there is a little death on them between my brother and me .
I own more of the machinery case my wife gave me a loan . She has a good job so im not so badly off and i do own my peace of land fully thank god .
Alot of people have told me i should have let years ago but the land flows in my blood.
Im not making this up its true . Maybe i should be posting in relationship issues ..

munkus

You have a wife you love and land. By the sounds of it, you are far better off than the rest of them. Fu#k them and move on with your life.

tabby aspreme

OP you have your farm and a laying hin , both of which your happy with ,don't get worked up over the 50 acres, make your own life and let your brother be his mammies boy, he will never get married and he'll end up leaving it to your children

Rovi

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rs8

forgot aboyt the 50 acres, your the winner!! land and a wife what more could you ask for? move on and forget about them

Prop Joe

Parents can be incredibly unfair on working sons/daughters,Some just want to hold some form of power over you until the grave.

Sharpshooter82

I see it everyday

Prop Joe wrote: »

Parents can be incredibly unfair on working sons/daughters,Some just want to hold some form of power over you until the grave.

Manoffeeling

Prop Joe wrote: »

Parents can be incredibly unfair on working sons/daughters,Some just want to hold some form of power over you until the grave.

The destructive power that one person can have on a family because of their own agenda is quite prevalent among farmers.

KatyMac

You are defo the better off with a wife and land. Your brother may end up very lonely in years to come. You just keep to yourself and leave the rest of them alone.

mf240

KatyMac wrote: »

Your brother may end up very lonely in years to come. .

HE shouldn't have much trouble getting a wife with 200 acres of land and a college education. can't see how getting the extra 50 acres has somehow rendered him celebate.

Mo60

Prop Joe wrote: »

Parents can be incredibly unfair on working sons/daughters,Some just want to hold some form of power over you until the grave.

Unfortunately, there is often someone of the next generation who wants to take over as family controller.

OP, you should discuss the situation with your father. If you do not get satisfaction, walk away. You will be a lot happier making your own way away from family control. I'm talking from my own experience.

Sam Kade

mf240 wrote: »

HE shouldn't have much trouble getting a wife with 200 acres of land and a college education. can't see how getting the extra 50 acres has somehow rendered him celebate.

It's already written in stone he's going to die a lonely old man

moy83

Sam Kade wrote: »

It's already written in stone he's going to die a lonely old man

With 200 acres he should have no bother to take a holiday to thailand and bring back a woman . A lad beside me here is around 60 and never bothered women but a couple of years ago he went out and came back with a wife , her daughter and mother . They are living with him now and happy out .

KatyMac

mf240 wrote: »

HE shouldn't have much trouble getting a wife with 200 acres of land and a college education. can't see how getting the extra 50 acres has somehow rendered him celebate.

If he's a mammy's boy that's exactly what will happen. Seen it near here - no one good enough for the son, he is nearly 50 and still under the thumb, Where will he be once the ol' ones are gone?

Manoffeeling

mf240 wrote: »

HE shouldn't have much trouble getting a wife with 200 acres of land and a college education. can't see how getting the extra 50 acres has somehow rendered him celebate.

Maybe he's gay and will never have a female wife.

mf240

Manoffeeling wrote: »

Maybe he's gay and will never have a female wife.

He could be but I don't think the extra 50 acres caused it.

If it was 50 years ago he would have joined the priesthood an everybody's a winner.

munkus

mf240 wrote: »

HE shouldn't have much trouble getting a wife with 200 acres of land and a college education. can't see how getting the extra 50 acres has somehow rendered him celebate.

The days of 'wemim' marrying for land are long gone thankfully. Probably the opposite.

Juniorhurler

munkus wrote: »

The days of 'wemim' marrying for land are long gone thankfully. Probably the opposite.

Just thinking the same there. I regularly hear the women in work, about 75% of the workforce, regularly tell me they would never marry a farmer and especially not a part rime one like myself. Long hours, no spare cash as it all gets ploughed back in, no holidays and a smell of ****e. I always yell them that's ok coz they wouldn't have been any good as two bucketers anyway.

Rho b

Awful pity that this thread has gone down the sewers by discussing the sexual orientation of the OP's brother.
What difference does it make?
Peterthehitman - some sound advice from previous posters. Have a chat with your dad regarding the rental of the 50 acres to your brother.
I hope that the you get some closure after talking to your dad. I hope that you and your wife can live in harmony in such close proximity to your parents and brother. Your wife has a good job at the moment and you have nice acreage to do with what you wish. I wish you the best of luck in the future.
There is so much turmoil in families due to land issues and in most cases it ends in a deep intrenched rift.
I would also agree with a previous poster who refereed to the fact that some individuals think they have an automatic right of inheritance.