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Drink Driving

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  • 22-11-2013 11:59am
    #1
    jayreddin
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭


    I'm looking for some advice, I was convicted of drink driving 2 weeks ago. I received a 2 year ban and a €500 fine. I couldn't be in court on the day as I'm in Australia. I made contact with the Garda informing him of the situation and also wrote a letter to the judge to explain this and that a family member was there to represent me, which was presented to the Judge in court on the day.

    My blood alcohol limit was 50mg/100mg, but from what I'v read online the legal limit is 50mg/100mg of alcohol in the blood? I'm a non professional full licensed driver with my licence over 6 years and a first time offender.

    -Should this of been brought to court or is this normal?
    -Was I technically not on the limit?
    -Should presumption of been used in an Irish court house? (as in the Judge presumed I was over the limit at some point)
    -Should I appeal this or what should I do?

    Many Thanks in advance.
    Tagged:


«13

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    #2
    Bepolite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,737 ✭✭✭Bepolite


    Speak to a solicitor. If you'd done that in the first instanced you'd have all the above questions answered.

    Don't drink and drive - not even one pint, it's not worth it.


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    #3
    jayreddin
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭jayreddin


    Thanks, Its hard to arrange all this as I'm in Australia. That's why I'm seeking advice here


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    #4
    Bepolite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,737 ✭✭✭Bepolite


    jayreddin wrote: »
    Thanks, Its hard to arrange all this as I'm in Australia. That's why I'm seeking advice here

    You can't get legal advice here and frankly I don't buy that it's hard to arrange a solicitor - just phone one of the larger criminal firms or get the family member to do it.

    If you were right on the limit I'd suggest taking proper advice on an appeal.


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    #5
    emmabrighton
    Registered Users Posts: 582 ✭✭✭emmabrighton


    Why did you receive a 2 year ban? That makes no sense.


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    #6
    paddydriver
    Registered Users Posts: 2,079 ✭✭✭paddydriver


    So you still driving away happily in Australia? Do they know your a convicted drink driver...:rolleyes:


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    #7
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #8
    wexie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,480 ✭✭✭wexie


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    really? is it not a case that during the ban 'technically' you don't hold a valid license? (that was my understanding? which might well be wrong)

    Or do you mean there simply is no way of checking this from Australia?
    What if he had an accident in Ozz and the insurance company went looking for details?


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    #9
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #10
    porter shark
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭porter shark


    How much drink had u? Just curious bout how much leaves a man right on the limit!


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    #11
    dobman88
    Registered Users Posts: 6,461 ✭✭✭dobman88


    porter shark wrote: »
    How much drink had u? Just curious bout how much leaves a man right on the limit!

    That's irrelevant. Drink driving is drink driving. One is too many. Just don't do it.


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    #12
    FreudianSlippers
    Registered Users Posts: 20,397 ✭✭✭✭FreudianSlippers


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    Agreed, however wexie has a good point. Regardless of whether the insurance is on the vehicle, if you do not hold a valid licence to drive, the insurance doesn't have to pay out (frequent occurrence in the US). If the OP is driving on the basis of having a physical Irish licence in Australia, however in reality he does not have a valid licence - it's a risky game.

    If the OP ditches the Irish licence and gets a new Australian one, there is nothing stopping him from doing that and nothing compelling him to tell them about his past errors.


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    #13
    FreudianSlippers
    Registered Users Posts: 20,397 ✭✭✭✭FreudianSlippers


    Disclaimer: I'm no expert in criminal law. After the MCQ in criminal law in the Inns, I tried to forget as much as humanly possible... so I'm open to correction on these points. However, I think I can answer some of your questions nonetheless:
    jayreddin wrote: »
    My blood alcohol limit was 50mg/100mg, but from what I'v read online the legal limit is 50mg/100mg of alcohol in the blood? I'm a non professional full licensed driver with my licence over 6 years and a first time offender.
    The amount of alcohol in the blood is actually a second part of the offence. You could be totally fine to the observer, but be over the limit - you're breaking the law. You could also look totally smashed and be all over the road, but be under the limit - still an offence.

    Prohibition on driving mechanically propelled vehicle while under influence of intoxicant or if exceeding alcohol limits.

    You likely fell into Section 4(1)
    A person shall not drive or attempt to drive a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place while he or she is under the influence of an intoxicant to such an extent as to be incapable of having proper control of the vehicle.

    jayreddin wrote: »
    -Should this of been brought to court or is this normal?
    Normal
    jayreddin wrote: »
    -Was I technically not on the limit?
    See above.
    jayreddin wrote: »
    -Should presumption of been used in an Irish court house? (as in the Judge presumed I was over the limit at some point)
    I'm not sure what you mean by this. I presume the member of AGS showed up and informed the court that you failed roadside tests and had a BAC of 50mg/100mg - you had also failed to appear to contest. I'm not sure how the criminal judges would react to a letter and family member, but in the civil side: either you're there or you send a solicitor on your behalf.
    jayreddin wrote: »
    -Should I appeal this or what should I do?
    Phone/email a solicitor as suggested. Explain the situation and they will give you advice.


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    #14
    suave.4u
    Registered Users Posts: 966 ✭✭✭suave.4u


    porter shark wrote: »
    How much drink had u? Just curious bout how much leaves a man right on the limit!


    When the house is burning, you stand there trying to light your cigarette with the fire.


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    #15
    slimjimmc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,787 ✭✭✭slimjimmc


    How did this even end up in court? Surely a fixed penalty would have been issued unless it's not your first DD notice within the previous 3 years?

    http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/motoring_1/driving_offences/drink_driving_offences_in_ireland.html


    Edit: Just saw FreudianSlippers's bit about not being in control.


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    #16
    mcgarrett
    Registered Users Posts: 376 ✭✭mcgarrett


    The Op's story doesn't make sense, if he was a fully licensed driver he is not in excess of the limit which is 50mgs per 100mls. You have to exceed 50.

    If he was treated as a specified driver the limit is 20, so if he was 50 he would get a FCPN.

    Don't know where this 2 year disqualification is coming from.


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    #17
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    mcgarrett wrote: »
    The Op's story doesn't make sense, if he was a fully licensed driver he is not in excess of the limit which is 50mgs per 100mls. You have to exceed 50.

    If he was treated as a specified driver the limit is 20, so if he was 50 he would get a FCPN.

    Don't know where this 2 year disqualification is coming from.

    Did the court have evidence of the full licence, I assume not, as the OP did not attend.


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    #18
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    FreudianSlippers wrote: »
    Disclaimer: I'm no expert in criminal law. After the MCQ in criminal law in the Inns, I tried to forget as much as humanly possible... so I'm open to correction on these points. However, I think I can answer some of your questions nonetheless:


    The amount of alcohol in the blood is actually a second part of the offence. You could be totally fine to the observer, but be over the limit - you're breaking the law. You could also look totally smashed and be all over the road, but be under the limit - still an offence.

    Prohibition on driving mechanically propelled vehicle while under influence of intoxicant or if exceeding alcohol limits.

    You likely fell into Section 4(1)



    Normal
    See above.
    I'm not sure what you mean by this. I presume the member of AGS showed up and informed the court that you failed roadside tests and had a BAC of 50mg/100mg - you had also failed to appear to contest. I'm not sure how the criminal judges would react to a letter and family member, but in the civil side: either you're there or you send a solicitor on your behalf.
    Phone/email a solicitor as suggested. Explain the situation and they will give you advice.

    While everything you state is correct, and most importantly the difference between simple intoxicated driving and a sample case. It would be most unusual of a DJ to convict of simple intoxicated driving (unless really strong evidence of inability to have proper control) if not in excess of the limit.

    The issue I think here is as no evidence (telling AGS I have a full licence is not evidence) of a full licence so convicted under the lower limit.


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    #19
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    jayreddin wrote: »
    I'm looking for some advice, I was convicted of drink driving 2 weeks ago. I received a 2 year ban and a €500 fine. I couldn't be in court on the day as I'm in Australia. I made contact with the Garda informing him of the situation and also wrote a letter to the judge to explain this and that a family member was there to represent me, which was presented to the Judge in court on the day.

    My blood alcohol limit was 50mg/100mg, but from what I'v read online the legal limit is 50mg/100mg of alcohol in the blood? I'm a non professional full licensed driver with my licence over 6 years and a first time offender.

    -Should this of been brought to court or is this normal?
    -Was I technically not on the limit?
    -Should presumption of been used in an Irish court house? (as in the Judge presumed I was over the limit at some point)
    -Should I appeal this or what should I do?

    Many Thanks in advance.

    OP why have you waited 2 weeks, you have to take appeal within 15 days. Now to appeal an application must be made to the DJ to extend time and set recogs. BTW you remain banned if the appeal is late until the appeal.

    Did you have person in court produce your full licence, or ask for an adjournment or even say "sorry judge he has full licence."

    If you want to get rid of this conviction, then get a solicitor at this stage this not not be sorted by anyone other than you or a solicitor and a solicitor will be far cheaper than a flight home. Don't wait make the call Monday morning.


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    #20
    mcgarrett
    Registered Users Posts: 376 ✭✭mcgarrett


    There's not a hope a Superintendent would direct a prosecution for Drink driving simpliciter when a certificate of analysis is available.
    A dangerous driving charge could be added.

    Is it possible the OP has been put off the road for no insurance and thinks it's for the Drink driving charge.


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    #21
    Pro Hoc Vice
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,087 ✭✭✭Pro Hoc Vice


    mcgarrett wrote: »
    There's not a hope a Superintendent would direct a prosecution for Drink driving simpliciter when a certificate of analysis is available.
    A dangerous driving charge could be added.

    Is it possible the OP has been put off the road for no insurance and thinks it's for the Drink driving charge.

    It's more likely that the OP never produced a full licence, otherwise why was evidence given of sample result.


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    #22
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    It may vary from state to state but if your. Irish licence is not current you are not licenced to drive on it in Victoria.


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    #23
    Five Lamps
    Closed Accounts Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Five Lamps


    It's also odd that the OP in the knowledge that he would be facing a court appearance and out of the country, did not appoint a solicitor to act on his behalf.

    Most people who are in Australia for long or short periods will use their Irish drivers licence for the first year there. The OP can no longer avail of this and will have to apply (if legally allowed to) for an Oz licence.


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    #24
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    Five Lamps wrote: »

    Most people who are in Australia for long or short periods will use their Irish drivers licence for the first year there. The OP can no longer avail of this and will have to apply (if legally allowed to) for an Oz licence.

    If you are on a Permanent visa you have 6 months to get a Victorian licence

    If you are on a temporary visa you can drive on your irish licence for the lenght of your stay.


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    #25
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #26
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    Fred Swanson wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.
    Of course you could but until recently you would be mad to.


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    #27
    Fred Swanson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 21,730 ✭✭✭✭Fred Swanson


    This post has been deleted.


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    #28
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    They started a points tally on drivers not just licences


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    #29
    jayreddin
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭jayreddin


    emmabrighton wrote: »
    Why did you receive a 2 year ban? That makes no sense.

    Assumption is all I can guess that was used here. maybe my absence from court didn't help either but I did inform them and had someone representing me. But the physical evidence which was the blood results proved I was on the limit.


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    #30
    jayreddin
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭jayreddin


    porter shark wrote: »
    How much drink had u? Just curious bout how much leaves a man right on the limit!

    I had one large bottle of Bulmers. that was it.


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    #31
    seamus
    Registered Users Posts: 68,317 ✭✭✭✭seamus


    I suspect you're mixing up your measures.

    If your blood alcohol was 50mg, then the disqualification is 6 months.

    However if your breath registered at 50mcg per 100ml, then that's a 2 year ban for a first offence.

    They are minimum periods, which the judge can increase, but if the judge was looking to punish you, he would have levied a much bigger fine than €500. Looks to me like you got the minimum ban for a 50mcg breath test, and a relatively light fine.


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