You need an ID to get an ID

July Rain

Has anybody noticed that somebody who wants to get a Passport, Driver's licence or Garda age card now for the first time ,needs to already have one of the three to prove their identity.

wazky

Imagine that, needing an ID to get another ID.

Could they not just take your word on it?

Seachmall

I got my passport without the other two.

Think I just needed my birth cert.

dodderangler

wazky wrote: »

Imagine that, needing an ID to get another ID.

Could they not just take your word on it?

Yeah same with the banks and credit unions.
Look I just want a loan of 20 grand and a brochure for a tropical island. An my name is hatchets.

July Rain

wazky wrote: »

Imagine that, needing an ID to get another ID.

Could they not just take your word on it?

That's a very witty answer but how does one get a first ID if they need an ID to get an Id ?

July Rain

Seachmall wrote: »

I got my passport without the other two.

Think I just needed my birth cert.

The rules changed in 2011

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

My nans never had a drivers license or passport so she wouldn't have ever had photo id. Doubt she's the only person on the island that is like this. It'd be a bit strange that she was made get a passport at her age to receive her pension. Luckily she gets paid money straight to her bank account.

wazky

July Rain wrote: »

That's a very witty answer but how does one get a first ID if they need an ID to get an Id ?

Well without bothering to research and just trying to think, but I think the birth cert is needed to gain a passport so maybe that's the key.

Do you have a birth cert?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

July Rain wrote: »

Has anybody noticed that somebody who wants to get a Passport, Driver's licence or Garda age card now for the first time ,needs to already have one of the three to prove their identity.

Brith cert will get you the passport.
Student ID will get you the age card.

wnolan1992

July Rain wrote: »

Has anybody noticed that somebody who wants to get a Passport, Driver's licence or Garda age card now for the first time ,needs to already have one of the three to prove their identity.

Birth cert is all you need for Age Card and Passport.

Cee-Jay-Cee

Seachmall wrote: »

I got my passport without the other two.

Think I just needed my birth cert.

And two photos certified by a Garda who has to satisfy themselves as to your identity.

AnonoBoy

"Gotta spend money to make money Lou."

SweepTheLeg

CJC999 wrote: »

And two photos certified by a Garda who has to satisfy themselves as to your identity.

Doesn't have to be a Gardai, Just someone reputable like a Doctor, Teacher etc.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

July Rain wrote: »

The rules changed in 2011

Not to the extent you're claiming.

From 17 January 2011, adult applicants in these categories are required to submit the following additional evidence in support of their passport application:

a completed and suitably witnessed passport application form and four photographs, (two of which must have the application form number written on the reverse and be signed by an approved witness);
The Passport Service reserves the right to contact witnesses as required. Passport applicants should therefore note that where it is not possible make contact with those witnessing applications then it is likely that the application will be rejected.
the long form birth certificate of the applicant and a civil marriage certificate, if appropriate, and evidence of entitlement to Irish citizenship ,where applicable;
additional form of photo-identification; e.g. certified copy of a drivers licence, work ID; student card; social club membership; passport from other country etc.;
documentary evidence to show use of name, e.g. payslips; records of unemployment or disability payment; bank statement; college registration etc.; and
evidence of residency at the application address, e.g. utility bills; official correspondence from public or private sector etc.

Plenty of options there, most of which do not need a passport to obtain.

http://www.dfa.ie/home/index.aspx?id=84782

Seachmall

SweepTheLeg wrote: »

Doesn't have to be a Gardai, Just someone reputable like a Doctor, Teacher etc.

I'm fairly certain it has to be a Garda.

Lapin

CJC999 wrote: »

And two photos certified by a Garda who has to satisfy themselves as to your identity.

Does this mean that everyone with an Irish passport is now technically 'known to the Gardaí'?

There was a time when any ould codger could sign the mugshots. A politician, priest, doctor, local business tycoon etc.

I wanted the King of the Claddagh to sign mine but he was away on official business that day (fishing), so I had to make do with my headmaster at the time.

Seachmall

Lapin wrote: »

Does this mean that everyone with an Irish passport is now technically 'known to the Gardaí'?

The station doesn't keep a record or copy of the form.

They complete the form, stamp it, sign the photos and send you on your way.

So the passport office has a record of which Garda signed it, and at which station, but the Gardaì have no records of who they verified (so you're still unknown to them).

At least that's how I remember it, it's been a couple of years since I got mine.


EDIT - Don't think the Garda signs the photos, you sign them in the presence of a Garda and then he stamps the form. I think.

SweepTheLeg

Seachmall wrote: »

I'm fairly certain it has to be a Garda.

Was thinking of a UK passport, never mind :P

Fred Swanson

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Scrappy600

July Rain wrote: »

Has anybody noticed that somebody who wants to get a Passport, Driver's licence or Garda age card now for the first time ,needs to already have one of the three to prove their identity.

Age card is not id, merely proof of age, is serves to verify the age of the holder and won't and shouldn't be accepted as Identification. How else do you propose to verify you are that age in order to get a card that says it? If it was that easy sure you could just say you were whatever age you wanted and every 16yr old in the country would be locked 24/7

wnolan1992 wrote: »

Birth cert is all you need for Age Card and Passport.

Not true, form states you need one proof of identity from the following, Passport, GNIB card or Birth Cert and a second unspecified form of identification.

Fred Swanson wrote: »

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Correct. And it is also checked regularly by the passport office to ensure they match up
Misinformation is a pain in the ass and helps no one

Peregrine

I had to provide a proof of address when I was getting my provisional license, they said just go and open a bank account.

So I went to open a bank account to get a proof of address and they asked me for proof of address.

Ended up showing the bank my passport, my Dad's utility bill, my Dad's passport and and my birth cert to prove that he was my father. ****ing hell..

But once you have one, you're fine.

Czarcasm

You can also get an ML10 form OP in any Garda Station. It's a valid official form of identification as good as a passport or drivers licence. I don't need a passport or drivers licence as I don't travel abroad and I don't drive, but it's handy to have a valid form of ID in the wallet all the same.

Scrappy600

July Rain wrote: »

You can also get an ML10 form OP in any Garda Station. It's a valid official form of identification as good as a passport or drivers licence. I don't need a passport or drivers licence as I don't travel abroad and I don't drive, but it's handy to have a valid form of ID in the wallet all the same.

No you can't, an ml10 form is part of money laundering legislation (hence the prefix ml) that requires the banks to take it as form of id for a person that does not hold a valid drivers licence or passport, in order to open a bank account. It is not identification and can't and shouldn't be produced as such. It is merely a piece of paper to open a bank account and that is all. The use of these have been abused by local authorities in the past (local housing, social welfare) who had no right to ask for them and as a result are no longer being issued for any purpose other than to comply with money laundering legislation. It is not a valid form of ID.

Fred Swanson

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Scrappy600

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Yup, and even the passport office have no right to ask for them.

Stojkovic

I asked a Gard (mucksavage of course) to sign a photo for passport renewal and he asked to see my old passport to prove the photo was me,

How fcuking stupid can you get.

Went back the next day and a Dublin Gard signed it no problem.

Czarcasm

Scrappy600 wrote: »

No you can't, an ml10 form is part of money laundering legislation (hence the prefix ml) that requires the banks to take it as form of id for a person that does not hold a valid drivers licence or passport, in order to open a bank account. It is not identification and can't and shouldn't be produced as such. It is merely a piece of paper to open a bank account and that is all. The use of these have been abused by local authorities in the past (local housing, social welfare) who had no right to ask for them and as a result are no longer being issued for any purpose other than to comply with money laundering legislation. It is not a valid form of ID.

It is.

The rest of your post is just conspiracy theory nonsense I'm not even going to bother my arse entertaining tbh.

Scrappy600

Czarcasm wrote: »

It is.

The rest of your post is just conspiracy theory nonsense I'm not even going to bother my arse entertaining tbh.

Show me something that clarifies that I'm talking nonsense and it's a conspiracy theory please? Show me something that clarifies that an ml10 form is an acceptable form of ID?

Scrappy600

http://books.google.ie/books?id=pFDyw4zChcsC&pg=PA109&lpg=PA109&dq=ml10+form+money+laundering&source=bl&ots=vJPL39_tqk&sig=xnLRZ-jFcLj0oFlyvJho_xcTKX4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=cs2HUueRBK7A7Aa_7IEQ&ved=0CDcQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=ml10%20form%20money%20laundering&f=false

I can link at least ten other sites from financial institutions listing that in order to comply with money laundering legislation you must be identified with photo Id or by using an ml10 form. Please show me something online other than a financial institution that requests quoting legislation compliance? Everyone can ask for a form even if it's not what it's supposed to be used for that doesn't mean it's right. Also show me something online that states it can be used for everyday identification purposes?

FreshKnickers

Czarcasm wrote: »

It is.

The rest of your post is just conspiracy theory nonsense I'm not even going to bother my arse entertaining tbh.

The missus had to get an ml10 form recently and the garda wrote on it "Only to be used for opening a bank account."

Scrappy600

And also just because the Garda stations handed them out willy nilly for years not knowing what they were supposed to be used for, (or not caring) doesn't meant it's right also.