Irish School of Motoring..OMG.....

Max Headroom

I've seen it all now....Travelling along Nutgrove Ave towards Churchtown Rd this afternoon..traffic was heavy as usual....We're a few cars back from the end of the bus lane...next i see a car coming down the lane, its a learner in an ISM car with the instructor beside her...:rolleyes:....as the road narrows she must merge...indicator on and the car in front of me lets her in...:mad:
We approach the lights, theres roadworks on the inside lane, so theres only one lane leading to the "T" junction....lights go green, two cars ahead of her make the lights as shes a bit slow taking off....lights go orange , red as she approaches....She stops....not a fcuking chance...straight through a red (at least 2 seconds) and around the corner....
Seriously is this what learners are being taught by the ISM...its ok to use a bus-lane and break red lights.....:eek:...is it any wonder the drivings so bad here.....

challengemaster

I'm assuming it's not a 24hr bus lane? Out of hours, bus lane is the normal driving lane, hence everyone but the learner was in the wrong.

Max Headroom

challengemaster wrote: »

I'm assuming it's not a 24hr bus lane? Out of hours, bus lane is the normal driving lane, hence everyone but the learner was in the wrong.

Clearly not....i use them as per the rules....its the 07.00-19.00 type....

corktina

it's saturday,,,,is it a M to F lane?

dnme

Shes only learning. Give her a chance fgs

Cleveland Hot Pocket

dnme wrote: »

Shes only learning. Give her a chance fgs

If she's on the road she should already be at a stage where she can drive!

Noccy_Mondy

As said give her a chance, I'm sure that the instructor is well qualified, and won't put any other motorist in danger when teaching a learner.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Who said she was a learner ?

Im sure the instructers use the cars too as daily go abouts

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

Who said she was a learner ?

Im sure the instructers use the cars too as daily go abouts

Some of the worst driving I've seen on the road has been in single occupied learner cars.
Shocking that!

dukedalton

Noccy_Mondy wrote: »

As said give her a chance, I'm sure that the instructor is well qualified, and won't put any other motorist in danger when teaching a learner.

So breaking a red light isn't putting other motorists in danger?!

Noccy_Mondy

There is actually a few seconds grace before the other set of lights will change from red to green.

dukedalton

Noccy_Mondy wrote: »

There is actually a few seconds grace before the other set of lights will change from red to green.

I sincerely hope you get to use that excuse some day with a cop.

Noccy_Mondy

Don't get me wrong, I'm by no means suggesting that that carry on should be used, nor am I condoning it. Obviously the learner shouldn't have done it, that's where the instructor should have stepped in with the dual controls. But that's in an ideal world...

dnme

I can remember learning to drive and being told to stop, panicing with the pedals and ending up taking off again.

For the love of god, would all the holier than thou absolutely perfect drivers on boards.ie give the wee girl a chance. Why is this even a thread. Id say the sheer outrage and anger clearly demonstrated by the OP who is of course boards.ie driver of the year, would be as dangerous on the road as anything.

Put it to bed. We're all human and we make mistakes. She's learning. Get a beer and watch a game, or better still, google "wimin" and "chilling out".

FFS !!!!

Stoolbend

Noccy_Mondy wrote: »

There is actually a few seconds grace before the other set of lights will change from red to green.

There's three seconds for cars to clear the junction. It's not a grace period.

Noccy_Mondy

Stoolbend wrote: »

There's three seconds for cars to clear the junction. It's not a grace period.

Sorry thats what I meant, wrong choice of words :pac:

Scortho

dnme wrote: »

I can remember learning to drive and being told to stop, panicing with the pedals and ending up taking off again.

For the love of god, would all the holier than thou absolutely perfect drivers on boards.ie give the wee girl a chance. Why is this even a thread. Id say the sheer outrage and anger clearly demonstrated by the OP who is of course boards.ie driver of the year, would be as dangerous on the road as anything.

Put it to bed. We're all human and we make mistakes. She's learning. Get a beer and watch a game, or better still, google "wimin" and "chilling out".

FFS !!!!

I don't think the op is giving out about the girl. He's giving out about the instructor.
Huge difference.

FaganJr

Max Headroom wrote: »

I've seen it all now....Travelling along Nutgrove Ave towards Churchtown Rd this afternoon..traffic was heavy as usual....We're a few cars back from the end of the bus lane...next i see a car coming down the lane, its a learner in an ISM car with the instructor beside her...:rolleyes:....as the road narrows she must merge...indicator on and the car in front of me lets her in...:mad:
We approach the lights, theres roadworks on the inside lane, so theres only one lane leading to the "T" junction....lights go green, two cars ahead of her make the lights as shes a bit slow taking off....lights go orange , red as she approaches....She stops....not a fcuking chance...straight through a red (at least 2 seconds) and around the corner....
Seriously is this what learners are being taught by the ISM...its ok to use a bus-lane and break red lights.....:eek:...is it any wonder the drivings so bad here.....

She was the Instructors wife and she takes none of his ****!

Peanut2011

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

If she's on the road she should already be at a stage where she can drive!

Wonder where you learned to drive?

djimi

dnme wrote: »

Put it to bed. We're all human and we make mistakes.

Mistakes like running red lights can have serious consequences. Learner or not, if this driver does not have basic car control and ability to obey stop signs/traffic lights then they have no business on a public road with other cars.

Stark

dnme wrote: »

I can remember learning to drive and being told to stop, panicing with the pedals and ending up taking off again.

Instructor cars have dual controls so the instructor can stop the car if the learner panics or makes a mistake. There's no excuse for driving straight through red lights.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Guy:Incognito

Noccy_Mondy wrote: »

As said give her a chance, I'm sure that the instructor is well qualified, and won't put any other motorist in danger when teaching a learner.

Define well qualified. Up to recently all they needed was a full licence. Is it any different now?

challengemaster

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Define well qualified. Up to recently all they needed was a full licence. Is it any different now?

Yeah, they're regulated now and have to be registered with the RSA (and tested to become an ADI first) AFAIK. It's an offense for anyone that isn't a RSA registered ADI to give lessons.

JohnBoy26

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

If she's on the road she should already be at a stage where she can drive!

Like maybe learning how to park correctly?

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Peanut2011 wrote: »

Wonder where you learned to drive?

I learned to drive on quiet roads and industrial parks for my first few lessons until I was competent enough to drive on the road.

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

Like maybe learning how to park correctly?

I can park correctly

However, the dings on the doors of my 535d would indicate that the same cannot be said for others on the road. Therefore I park to take evasive action from these sort of fcuktards. Not sure what that has to do with the discussion at hand but I will humor you.

BuffyBot

With the best will in the world, there is only so much someone can learn running around quiet roads.

Learners have to go into the real world. When they do, even the most competent in other environments will go to pieces sometimes and make big mistakes when faced with live traffic situations despite having an instructor in tow. Part of the process, and experienced licenced drivers have to make allowances for that.

Scortho

BuffyBot wrote: »

With the best will in the world, there is only so much someone can learn running around quiet roads.

Learners have to go into the real world. When they do, even the most competent in other environments will go to pieces sometimes and make big mistakes when faced with live traffic situations despite having an instructor in tow. Part of the process, and experienced licenced drivers have to make allowances for that.

Come on everyone knows it's illegal to break a red light.
If it was a learner on their own in the car, I don't think the op would be annoyed. It's the fact that there was a driving instructor with her, who was not in control of the car. There is no reason why an instructors car should break red lights.

Cleveland has a point. If you're not confident to stop at a red light while learning to drive, then no you shouldn't be on the road.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Again... who said it was a learner driving ?

by the sounds of it, it does sound like a regular driver for them to be driving in the bus lane and then going through the light.

if they were under instruction then they would've stopped.

i dont believe it was a learner driving,

Scortho

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime wrote: »

Again... who said it was a learner driving ?

by the sounds of it, it does sound like a regular driver for them to be driving in the bus lane and then going through the light.

if they were under instruction then they would've stopped.

i dont believe it was a learner driving,

In that case, it'd be an instructor, which is fecking worse.

djimi

BuffyBot wrote: »

With the best will in the world, there is only so much someone can learn running around quiet roads.

Basic car control and the rules of the road are things that should be learned before ever going near a public road. If you cant stop at a red light then you are not ready to be driving in traffic, simple as.

Kopparberg Strawberry and Lime

Scortho wrote: »

In that case, it'd be an instructor, which is fecking worse.

Or what if it was someone out on a test drive of the vehicle after service/repair ?

What if it was the owners buddy who took a lend of the car ?

Too many variables to be putting people down. Especially since learners get put down as it is and I can see why they'd be annoyed when people are jumping to conclusions like in this thread.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

BuffyBot wrote: »

With the best will in the world, there is only so much someone can learn running around quiet roads.

Learners have to go into the real world. When they do, even the most competent in other environments will go to pieces sometimes and make big mistakes when faced with live traffic situations despite having an instructor in tow. Part of the process, and experienced licenced drivers have to make allowances for that.

Yes, but you learn the basics of car control to put you in a better place to deal with driving on a road with traffic.

If you are confident enough to control your own vehicle you are better placed to deal with the unexpected on an actual road.

Days 298

When I got my permit I was brought to a car park to learn the very basics. The I went out to rural roads. My first driving lessons involved driving in busy city roads and a hill start. I dont know how Id have managed without prior practice. Some adi's are absolutely crap. Thinking back the guy literally told me which pedal was which, showed me a diagram of the clutch and away I went. He skipped the safety checks because "the weathers a bit to damp and sure the cars grand". That said the worst of it was it was a little diesel corsa. Worst and most lifeless car ever. Eveyone should at least learn on a 1.6 or bigger. You cant learn on a moped and then buy a motorbike. Should be no different for cars.

BuffyBot

As said: in theory all the above is all very well. In practice, it doesn't work out that way all the time, especially for learners

As no one here can know for sure what was going on inside the car we can only speculate.

Max Headroom

To clarify....the girl WAS clearly under instruction...i saw at least 3 ISM cars in the same area...I'm guessin the instructor was instructing her to use the bus-lane and also to floor-it through the red light.... they were probably over or getting close to the "hourly lessons"end.....
And as the posters with common sense and cop-on above have pointed out..its the ISM i'm having a go at....if the instructor had told her to run into the crowded bus stop..she would have........

Drive safe ..:)

Elephant Man from china

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

If she's on the road she should already be at a stage where she can drive!

Utterly stupid comment from someone who clearly forget what it's like to learn to drive..

You can't practice navigating around roadworks, traffic lights etc.. In some field / industrial estate. A learner practicing on a back road is also far more dangerous than with an accredited instructor on a main road.

djimi

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

Utterly stupid comment from someone who clearly forget what it's like to learn to drive..

You can't practice navigating around roadworks, traffic lights etc.. In some field / industrial estate. A learner practicing on a back road is also far more dangerous than with an accredited instructor on a main road.

How is it a stupid comment? Do you think its okay to have any drivers on the road who dont have basic car control and a common knowledge of the rules of the road?

An L plate wont prevent them from causing a serious accident if they run a red light.

Elephant Man from china

djimi wrote: »

How is it a stupid comment? Do you think its okay to have any drivers on the road who dont have basic car control and a common knowledge of the rules of the road?

An L plate wont prevent them from causing a serious accident if they run a red light.

No need for the hyperbole.. They're with an accredited instructor.. The instructor can stop the car if there is any real danger..

djimi

Youre giving this instructor too much credit; the fact that they allowed a learner to both illegally use a bus lane and run a red light suggests that this learner would be no worse off having a bag of peat moss sitting next to them in the passenger seat for all the use the instructor is.

And call it what you like; instructor or not, anyone with two brain cells to rub together knows that you dont drive through red lights.

Elephant Man from china

I trust the instructor was in complete control of the situation described above

djimi

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

I trust the instructor was in complete control of the situation described above

Being in complete control of someone breaking two laws in the space of a minute is not exactly something to write home about...

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

Utterly stupid comment from someone who clearly forget what it's like to learn to drive..

You can't practice navigating around roadworks, traffic lights etc.. In some field / industrial estate. A learner practicing on a back road is also far more dangerous than with an accredited instructor on a main road.

So, my comment is clearly stupid. Lets let someone in control of a 1.5 tonne machine in a public area with no training whatsoever. Yeah, that seems smart and my comment looks stupid.

:rolleyes:

Peanut2011

djimi wrote: »

Being in complete control of someone breaking two laws in the space of a minute is not exactly something to write home about...

Regarding the two broken laws, firstly as described before not enough information was given on the bus lane, they could have perfectly been able to use it outside designated hours.

Regarding breaking a red light, students panic, mistakes are made. The fact that no harm came of it shows the instructor was in control.

How many times do you see an idiot break a red light on purpose. I nearly see it on a daily basis.

The fact that there was an L plate on the car should tell the others to give them space and allow them time, however in Ireland that means, Lean on the Horn, don't Let them out, drive as close as you can up their a$$......

This tread just shows there are still plenty of people out there thinking they are the best driver and quick to point mistakes of learners, but they forget they were learners once too.

This is why for years we have had a problem with people not displaying their L plates. The minute they do they become targets!

Max Headroom

Peanut2011 wrote: »

Regarding the two broken laws, firstly as described before not enough information was given on the bus lane, they could have perfectly been able to use it outside designated hours.

Regarding breaking a red light, students panic, mistakes are made. The fact that no harm came of it shows the instructor was in control.

!

:rolleyes:......firstly read my posts...the bus lane was a 7-7 bus lane...it was mid afternoon....

Secondly...No harm came....this time perhaps.....
The student had plenty of time to stop safely...
Are we to believe that it was the instructor who actually drove her through the light...if so he should be sacked immediately, for putting her and others in danger....

Elephant Man from china

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

So, my comment is clearly stupid. Lets let someone in control of a 1.5 tonne machine in a public area with no training whatsoever. Yeah, that seems smart and my comment looks stupid.

:rolleyes:

Your talking like this is a strange scenario.. You do your theory test, you get lessons, those lessons take place on public roads. It's completely legal and to be honest, it's completely normal practice. That's why they have a big red L on the car, so you as an experienced driver adjust your behaviour and attitude to give them the space and time to learn safely..

Something tells me you need a bit of help with the attitude part, if your posts are anything to go by.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

Your talking like this is a strange scenario.. You do your theory test, you get lessons, those lessons take place on public roads. It's completely legal and to be honest, it's completely normal practice. That's why they have a big red L on the car, so you as an experienced driver adjust your behaviour and attitude to give them the space and time to learn safely..

Something tells me you need a bit of help with the attitude part, if your posts are anything to go by.

Aaaaaaand ignore.
I like it when they make it easy to spot them. Thanks

(ps don't bother replying to me as I wont see it Elephant man from china)

Elephant Man from china

Strange reaction.. He seems to have taken a post where I mention his attitude to earners was questionable at best, personally and had a little sulk.

Other posters, was I unreasonable or did he not clearly display a bad attitude to learner drivers?

dukedalton

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

Your talking like this is a strange scenario.. You do your theory test, you get lessons, those lessons take place on public roads. It's completely legal and to be honest, it's completely normal practice. That's why they have a big red L on the car, so you as an experienced driver adjust your behaviour and attitude to give them the space and time to learn safely..

Something tells me you need a bit of help with the attitude part, if your posts are anything to go by.

That big red L isn't going to do you much good if the person driving the car is about to smash into you having disobeyed a fundamental rule of the road.

Elephant Man from china

dukedalton wrote: »

That big red L isn't going to do you much good if the person driving the car is about to smash into you having disobeyed a fundamental rule of the road.

Yes, of course.. But have to feel that the instructor(the legal safteynet with his own set of controls) was on top of the situation and no one was in any real danger..

Max Headroom

Elephant Man from china wrote: »

Yes, of course.. But have to feel that the instructor(the legal safteynet with his own set of controls) was on top of the situation and no one was in any real danger..

Having witnessed it first hand, there was plenty of time to stop safely...There were two large cars in front of her...thats possibly 40 feet...she was starting from stationary..she was doing walking pace by the time she got to within 30 feet at the amber..20 feet at the red light......and then accelerated through....
It seems from some of the replies that its ok to run a red light.....