Are your opinions your own?

lahalane

Too often I have tackled someone on their view about something to find that they actually dont really know what theyre talking about. Examples being Oasis lyrics are rubbish, Clint Eastwood is a **** actor and Pele was better than Maradona or vice versa.

I accept that people have differing opinions than my own but surely they need to have a valid reason for it instead of blindly giving one just for the sake of having an opinion. You dont need to have an opinion on everything. Id feel stupid discussing something if I didnt know anything about it.

Does anyone else encounter these people who have an opinion on something that they recited from someone else and actually know nothing about? What are some of the lazy opinions that you hear offered frequently that you know would crumble to nothing if you attempted to debate it.

Ive often heard people say that Brian Cowen ruined the country and when I, genuinely, question them as to why, so I can at least know what he did, I am never given a proper answer. Just mumblings about the recession, being drunk on radio, being from Offaly and looking like a dope. Im no wiser to the whole thing at all.

RayM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcAqR-Hs9II

MadsL

lahalane wrote: »

You dont need to have an opinion on everything.

I beg to differ...

Maximus Alexander

lahalane wrote: »

Does anyone else encounter these people who have an opinion on something that they recited from someone else and actually know nothing about?

This is the internet, it's pretty much all we encounter here.

mathie

No opinion is your own.

jimgoose

Opinions expressed here and elsewhere by me are my own, no-one else's. I made them, I can destroy them. They do what I tell them, they're usually armed and always dangerous. Feel quite free to disagree with them - in fact, I'll fight any man who says you can't disagree with me or anyone else. But my opinions are mine, God-dammit! :cool:

mutley18

Everyone jumps on the Ryanair are cúnts bandwagon, (in fairness they are from experience) but people who have never flown with them will still hop on the bandwagon.

Savoir.Faire

Much of the modern European liberal tradition is taken blindly by its minor disciples and spouted on the Internet. Sites like here and politics.ie are a toxic waste ground for proper debate. Much of the serious analysis and debate taking place is still happening by thought-leaders involved in academia.

lahalane

mathie wrote: »

No opinion is your own.

Thats just your opinion...

ScumLord

A lot of human society is based on trust. Money has no value we just trust that it will to other people. Most of us specialise our skill set and interests too, so we don't have time to figure out plumbing or rocket science.

We hand over trust very easily and unless we're given good reason to doubt someone we accept everything they say.

Maximus Alexander

Savoir.Faire wrote: »

Much of the modern European liberal tradition is taken blindly by its minor disciples and spouted on the Internet. Sites like here and politics.ie are a toxic waste ground for proper debate. Much of the serious analysis and debate taking place is still happening by thought-leaders involved in academia.

Where did you hear that?

Starscream25

There's only so many opinions to round on any one topic, may aswell pick one of them

jester77

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVCtkzIXYzQ

Corkfeen

They're my own however they developed around stuff I have read or watched. An opinion is far more worthwhile if it's based on something more than it being simply your opinion.

mathie

lahalane wrote: »

Thats just your opinion...

I got it from someone else.

EuropeanSon

I think Pele is better than Maradona, but have very limited basis for the opinion, having seen probably less than two hours in total of either player (and read quite a bit, which is slightly less valid). It doesn't make the opinion not my own, however.

Edit: I've liked Clint Eastwood movies I've seen, though he always seemed very similar, and have no opinion on Oasis.

sbsquarepants

I've been thinking about this quite a bit lately, on close examination I came to realise that I held a lot of opinions for no real or valid reason, i'd say everybody does. We "feel" a certain way about something but don't always do the homework required to know if we're right to feel that way. We reckon it feels right, therefore it must be right - but that's just not the case.
I've actually signed up for an online course in rational thinking to help remedy the situation!

Oink

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I've been thinking about this quite a bit lately, on close examination I came to realise that I held a lot of opinions for no real or valid reason, i'd say everybody does. We "feel" a certain way about something but don't always homework required to know if we're right to feel that way. We reckon it feels right, therefore it must be right - but that's just not the case.
I've actually signed up for an online course in rational thinking to help remedy the situation!

I wish I could thank that post twice. You actually asked yourself honestly " Am I talking ****e", you had the guts to answer yes, and then you did something about it.

I did the same thing, but instead of the online course I took the lazy route: I decided to shut up when I don't know what I'm talking about.

salacious crumb

lahalane wrote: »

Clint Eastwood is a **** actor

Who the f*ck said Clint Eastwood's a sh*t actor??!! :pac:

sbsquarepants

Oink wrote: »

I wish I could thank that post twice. You actually asked yourself honestly "Am I talking ****e", you had the guts to answer yes, and then you did something about it.

I did the same thing, but instead of the online course I took the lazy route: I decided to shut up when I don't know what I'm talking about.

Ah here, don't go putting words in my mouth, I was far more diplomatic with myself!

Also i'm too argumentative to just shut up!:D

SEPT 23 1989

Maradona's lyrics are rubbish, Pele is a **** actor and Clint Eastwood was better than Oasis or vice versa.

uch

Ice Pops taste better when they're free. Just my own opinion

Tiddlypeeps

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I've been thinking about this quite a bit lately, on close examination I came to realise that I held a lot of opinions for no real or valid reason, i'd say everybody does. We "feel" a certain way about something but don't always do the homework required to know if we're right to feel that way. We reckon it feels right, therefore it must be right - but that's just not the case.!

This is pretty much it. I don't believe, at least most of the time, that people are trying to knowingly convince people they know more than they do. It's likely down to a thing called source amnesia. It's basically where somebody learns something from a source they trust but then later forgets where they learned it altogether. They will repeat the thing they learned as fact even tho they have no idea where it came from. I think pretty much all humans are guilty of this to some degree.

I'd consider myself to be a pretty rational thinker and I've caught myself doing it. I got into a debate recently on why communism doesn't work and I said something along the lines of "because people don't innovate when there is no reward to be gained from it". That's something that for some reason my brain just feels to be right. Somebody challenged me and asked for a source and it wasn't till that point that I realised I have no idea where that information came from or why I believe it to be true and I could find no studies on the internet that back it up. It may still be true but I have no business spouting it as fact.

Maximus Alexander

Tiddlypeeps wrote: »

I'd consider myself to be a pretty rational thinker and I've caught myself doing it. I got into a debate recently on why communism doesn't work and I said something along the lines of "because people don't innovate when there is no reward to be gained from it". That's something that for some reason my brain just feels to be right. Somebody challenged me and asked for a source and it wasn't till that point that I realised I have no idea where that information came from or why I believe it to be true and I could find no studies on the internet that back it up. It may still be true but I have no business spouting it as fact.

Same as yourself. I consider myself a rational person, take pride in it in fact. I prefer to get to the truth of a matter rather than just back up what I already believe. But I've found myself well into an argument on occasion, before realizing that I couldn't remember how I knew what I 'knew', and if that's the case you don't know it at all.

ScumLord

I always try to remind myself that I'm probably wrong, or at the very least not 100% right.

wretcheddomain

lahalane wrote: »

Too often I have tackled someone on their view about something to find that they actually dont really know what theyre talking about. Examples being Oasis lyrics are rubbish, Clint Eastwood is a **** actor and Pele was better than Maradona or vice versa.

That's the religious for you right there.

But seriously, I bought my opinions on Ebay.

Nah...I'll be serious this time.

Many people appear to have difficulty in separating the concepts of being entitled to an opinion and being entitled to facts. You're not entitled to your opinion if it's based on factually incorrect premises. Too often, I hear people defend nonsense by claiming their opinion is equally valid to mine as we're all entitled to one. Usually this happens when said individual's facts are being challenged and they get pretty uncomfortable and resort to detestable defences such as that outlined above.

sbsquarepants

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I prefer to get to the truth of a matter rather than just back up what I already believe. .

I think this is where most people go wrong, myself included. We put the cart before the horse a lot of the time, start with our "opinion" and then find or even invent reasons to justify it. I don't think it's a conscious thing most of the time, seems to be just the way we work.

wretcheddomain

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I think this is where most people go wrong, myself included. We put the cart before the horse a lot of the time, start with our "opinion" and then find or even invent reasons to justify it. I don't think it's a conscious thing most of the time, seems to be just the way we work.

Very true - we have to try hard to persist in studied from as much a neutral and objective perspective as possible or else you end up deluding yourself by reinforcing your own biases.

Maximus Alexander

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I think this is where most people go wrong, myself included. We put the cart before the horse a lot of the time, start with our "opinion" and then find or even invent reasons to justify it. I don't think it's a conscious thing most of the time, seems to be just the way we work.

I'm not saying that I don't do that, just that I prefer not to. I try not to. I think everyone does the same, at least part of the time. Once you're at least aware that you're doing it it becomes easier to stop yourself before getting into a heated debate and say "Hey, is what I'm about to argue actually true?"

Karl Stein

lahalane wrote: »

Examples being Oasis lyrics are rubbish, Clint Eastwood is a **** actor and Pele was better than Maradona or vice versa.

How can taking a stance on these issues be anything but a dearly held opinion?

pharmaton

no I just go with the popular opinion that way I get to be more accepted by society as a whole

lahalane

Carlos Roca wrote: »

How can taking a stance on these issues be anything but a dearly held opinion?

One of the people who I challenged on why Clint Eastwood was a **** actor admitted never having watched one of his films but hated westerns so his misguided opinion was born.

Not sure how many westerns he had watched either so his hatred towards them is probably spurious too.

Mint Aero

lahalane wrote: »

Ive often heard people say that Brian Cowen ruined the country and when I, genuinely, question them as to why, so I can at least know what he did, I am never given a proper answer. Just mumblings about the recession, being drunk on radio, being from Offaly and looking like a dope. Im no wiser to the whole thing at all.

Are you for real?

He was Minister for Finance during the boom, then derailed the country completely during his tyranny as taoiseach whist lying to the country about the situation, 'nuff said.

He didn't act alone though if that's what you mean but he is greatly responsible amigo.

lahalane

Mint Aero wrote: »

Are you for real?

He was Minister for Finance during the boom, then derailed the country completely during his tyranny as taoiseach whist lying to the country about the situation, 'nuff said.

He didn't act alone though if that's what you mean but he is greatly responsible amigo.

I wasnt standing up for him or anything, I just genuinely hadnt a notion what was going on and why he was being blamed. I dont follow politics that much. Now I know a little more

iwantmydinner

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I've been thinking about this quite a bit lately, on close examination I came to realise that I held a lot of opinions for no real or valid reason, i'd say everybody does. We "feel" a certain way about something but don't always do the homework required to know if we're right to feel that way. We reckon it feels right, therefore it must be right - but that's just not the case.
I've actually signed up for an online course in rational thinking to help remedy the situation!

This! Yes!

I've become aware that I often let other people's opinions influence mine and the realisation dismayed me to no end. So now if I find that I 'feel' a certain way about something without much objective justification, I'll either keep my mouth shut on it or make it very clear that I'm still forming a proper opinion on whatever it is.

Agricola

This phenomenon is mostly down to ego and narcissism. The majority of people really NEED to impress others and have others believe they know their onions when it comes to any given subject. Speaking from a position of knowledge and authority gives you status. If you can't really do it for real, why not bluff, spoof and chance your arm, because you know most of the people you're talking to havent a féckin clue either.

Of course internet forums are this things spiritual home!

Mark Twain

My opinions are my own. I refuse to waiver to popular consensus.

Karl Stein

lahalane wrote: »

One of the people who I challenged on why Clint Eastwood was a **** actor admitted never having watched one of his films but hated westerns so his misguided opinion was born.

Clint Eastwood is a shit actor.

Friend Computer

Agricola wrote: »

This phenomenon is mostly down to ego and narcissism. The majority of people really NEED to impress others and have others believe they know their onions when it comes to any given subject. Speaking from a position of knowledge and authority gives you status. If you can't really do it for real, why not bluff, spoof and chance your arm, because you know most of the people you're talking to havent a féckin clue either.

Of course internet forums are this things spiritual home!

That and we live in an age where access to information--of varying degrees of veracity but that's a different discussion--is ubiquitous so there's pressure on people to at least pretend they know a lot. When you can just whip out a phone and look something up it's harder to justify ignorance.

lahalane

Carlos Roca wrote: »

Clint Eastwood is a shit actor.

Maybe but you must surely admire the sheer audacity of the man to try and succeed in making a 60 year career out of it then, yeah?

Agricola

Friend Computer wrote: »

That and we live in an age where access to information--of varying degrees of veracity but that's a different discussion--is ubiquitous so there's pressure on people to at least pretend they know a lot. When you can just whip out a phone and look something up it's harder to justify ignorance.

Yeah and of course the media is feeding it with the whole social media aspect of everything now. Everything has to have an "involve the viewer/reader/listener" angle. Radio stations devote almost as much time reading tweets and emails as they do playing ads. Comments sections below articles and videos are ubiquitous. Everything revolves around the crucial matter of the ordinary pleb's opinion. So you can't blame people for becoming more and more outspoken. Much of it drives me mad. When Im listening or watching a debate between a bunch of people who are qualified to actually participate in the debate, I do not want to know what Mary from Ballydehob thinks about it.

5p9arw38djv2b4

mutley18 wrote: »

Everyone jumps on the Ryanair are cúnts bandwagon, (in fairness they are from experience) but people who have never flown with them will still hop on the bandwagon.

But it's sooo cheap - environmental concerns aside I quite like Ryanair, fly with them regularly as it's affordable, and they are honest about treating customers like cattle so it's not like I'm expecting Ethiad. My opinion is based on my experience and reading about their business model plus hearing people's experienced - so I do think your opinion can be influenced but it's still your own, the difference is having an opinion or having an informed opinion. I think it's probably human nature to form opinions but lack of interest/ laziness means people adopt someone else's opinion as their own sometimes (or parrot the media - let's blame mass media!)

Maximus Alexander

LadyLabyrinth wrote: »

it's not like I'm expecting Ethiad.

I flew back from Australia with Etihad on Christmas Day last year. We were joking about how amazing it would be to get bumped up to business class and then... it happened! Divine is not the word.

On an unrelated note, I hate Ryanair.

Lingua Franca

There's a lot of things I hold no opinion on and will admit it if asked about the subject. People think it's weirder when you say that you have no opinion than when you hold a contrary one... in my opinion.

Lingua Franca

Carlos Roca wrote: »

Clint Eastwood is a shit actor.

How so? Can you expand on this?

5p9arw38djv2b4

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I flew back from Australia with Etihad on Christmas Day last year. We were joking about how amazing it would be to get bumped up to business class and then... it happened! Divine is not the word.

On an unrelated note, I hate Ryanair.

Aw wow. I NEVER get bumped when I fly, no matter the airline. Someday I will stop being cheapskate and fly Ethiad, or at least Cathay. On a BA flight from states last year boss was in business and asked them to bump me (I could see her) and they came and bumped girl beside me - I nearly cried. The joy of flying Ryanair once a month is when I fly with anyone else it's luxury as I have very low expectations - on Air France flight last week and there was free drinks and snacks and it blew my mind!!

Maximus Alexander

LadyLabyrinth wrote: »

Aw wow. I NEVER get bumped when I fly, no matter the airline. Someday I will stop being cheapskate and fly Ethiad, or at least Cathay. On a BA flight from states last year boss was in business and asked them to bump me (I could see her) and they came and bumped girl beside me - I nearly cried. The joy of flying Ryanair once a month is when I fly with anyone else it's luxury as I have very low expectations - on Air France flight last week and there was free drinks and snacks and it blew my mind!!

Yeah we really couldn't believe it. It's never happened us before and probably never will again, but it certainly made up for having to take a long haul flight on Christmas day!

We also took an internal flight in Thailand which was just a local airline, but the leg room was huge and they gave out free drinks and snacks like on your Air France flight. It's like a different world when you are used to low fares airlines!

Femme_Fatale

Opinions with "Typical Irish begrudgery", "Liberal"/"Leftie" as a perjorative, "PC brigade", likening Ireland to a third world country, extreme anti religion/anti atheist stuff, "the government are a shower of bastards just because they are the government"... all that generic shyte you find here (from both the Right and the Left) these might be the person's own opinion, but they involve little to no thought.

Karl Stein

lahalane wrote: »

Maybe but you must surely admire the sheer audacity of the man to try and succeed in making a 60 year career out of it then, yeah?

No.

Lingua Franca wrote: »

How so? Can you expand on this?

He plays a version of himself in every stupid filum he appears in. He's a shit actor. He acts in Clint Eastwood movies.

Lingua Franca

See, I'm not a fan of his either. I don't like cowboy movies. But then he's been incredibly successful his whole career and has won a ton of accolades from his peers. I liked Mystic River. I have no opinion on Clint Eastwood.

lahalane

Carlos Roca wrote: »

He plays a version of himself in every stupid filum he appears in. He's a shit actor. He acts in Clint Eastwood movies.

He doesn't appear to be very versatile. Whether that can be enough to label him a bad actor though is questionable. It just means that he can't be considered for the title of 'Best ever actor'. The great actors have played different characters and mastered each one but it doesn't mean you are a bad actor if you haven't achieved this. Maybe if he tried and failed you could say that but he hasn't.

Also, I'm sure that the directors demanded of Clint that he play the character as was specified on the script. If he had played Frankie Dunn as a goofball, comedic character, then I would find it easier to call him a bad actor.