Donedealers love German cars!

Toyotafanboi

http://blog.donedeal.ie/2013/11/donedealers-love-german-cars-seems/#xtor=CS1-5-58[FBPOST

It turns out that almost 6 in 10 Irish consumers (57%) have said that if they had to drive one car for the rest of their lives it would be one produced in Germany. The preference is backed up with four of the top five favourite car brands of those surveyed being German.

The survey found that 57% of respondents believe that Germany produces the best cars with Japan in second place on 31%.
The trust in German cars was expanded upon with 16% of respondents saying that Audi was the car they would pick if they had to drive one car brand for the rest of their life followed by BMW, Volkswagen and Mercedes all on 12%.
Toyota flew the flag for Japan with 14%. Figures from DoneDeal show that German cars are the most popular. The most searched for car brand in September was BMW and Volkswagen Golfs were the type of car that sold the most.

which makes me wonder. why do we love German cars so much? i know its my toyotafanboi-ism making me say this but i still have to ask it. are we all mad? what do the Germans do so right that the French/ Sweedish/ Japanese/ Italians and Koreans cant get right? or are the irish motorists just sheep who have been brainwashed by "Vorsprung durch Technik"

Anan1

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

what do the Germans do so right that the French/ Sweedish/ Japanese/ Italians and Koreans cant get right?

Marketing, and interiors that feel good.

S28382

I wouldnt care if my BMW was from Mongolia id continue to love it more than i love my girlfriend.

jayok

I'd say Honda at number 4 is probably because of my epic search for an unmolested S2000.

It turns out that almost 6 in 10 Irish consumers (57%) have said that if they had to drive one car for the rest of their lives it would be one produced in Germany. The preference is backed up with four of the top five favourite car brands of those surveyed being German.

Such a limited vision of the car world.

NIMAN

Maybe because their cars are well built and have the image of being reliable.

I owned a VW for about 10yrs and it gave very little bother.
I've owned a Ford for about 3yrs, again no bother so far, and a Honda for about 4 months, and love its build quality too.

Kenny Logins

The German cars I've owned have been between 10 and 50 years old. I wouldn't touch a French car past its first tax disc.

Chris_Heilong

Back in the 70s and early 80s German cars were the best, compared to what else was on offer they seemed very reliable(VW) and had a touch of Class to them(BMW,Audi,Merc). I think this idea has continued through the years even if the reality is somewhat different. For the everyday man to own one of the premium brands 2nd hand at a reasonable price counts for a lot too.

Anan1

Kenny Logins wrote: »

I wouldn't touch a French car past its first tax disc.

Your choice, but you're missing out on a lot of really good cars there.

Kenny Logins

Anan1 wrote: »

Your choice, but you're missing out on a lot of really good cars there.

I'm sure I am. ...but I just have bad memories of French cars. There's lots of really good German and Japanese cars I haven't owned or driven yet, and I'd go for those first.

jimgoose

Kenny Logins wrote: »

The German cars I've owned have been between 10 and 50 years old. I wouldn't touch a French car past its first tax disc.

I wouldn't buy a Renault to keep chickens in, but Citroen generally do a solid, reliable bus. Funny - I remember when the Ford Zephyr Six and Consul Granada were considered the real Gaffer's car. Mercedes-Benz was this oddball, overpriced Continental crowd and Volkswagens were strictly the preserve of hippies and hill-farmers with baling-twine around their britches.

tossy

the funny thing about it is i reckon 90% of the German cars being sold/bought and searched for on DD are the runt of the litter. I mean is a bog standard A4/3 series really any better than a bog standard Avensis/mondeo/Laguna?

Cleveland Hot Pocket

tossy wrote: »

the funny thing about it is i reckon 90% of the German cars being sold/bought and searched for on DD are the runt of the litter. I mean is a bog standard A4/3 series really any better than a bog standard Avensis/mondeo/Laguna?

I'd say the same could be said for all premium marques though. They are sold most of the time in Ireland with boggo spec, probably cloth seats and workout windows and a manual 'box.

How could the likes of an e60 be sold like this!

Celly Smunt

Anan1 wrote: »

Marketing, and interiors that feel good.

I wouldn't be looking German for the pinnacle of interiors in fairness

jimgoose

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

...cloth seats...manual 'box...

<Ahem> Some of us happen to like cloth seats and ordinary, daycint, Fordson tractor manual 'boxes.

Celly Smunt wrote: »

I wouldn't be looking German for the pinnacle of interiors in fairness

No. Mind you, the new Opel Insignias have a very nice instrument binnacle. :cool:

Cleveland Hot Pocket

jimgoose wrote: »

<Ahem> Some of us happen to like cloth seats and ordinary, daycint, Fordson tractor manual 'boxes.


No. Mind you, the new Opel Insignias have a very nice instrument binnacle. :cool:

Yes but a premium car should have leather and auto surely.

bmstuff

Anan1 wrote: »

Your choice, but you're missing out on a lot of really good cars there.

You mean the ones with the indicators bulbs connected to the fob, reverse and parking lights so when they turn you really know they mean business as all the lights are flashing.
I noticed recent Nissan do that too.

Have to say my brothers new model A6, full leather, the works is one of the nicest cars I've ever had the pleasure to sit in or drive.

I loved the interior of the A5, And New model A4 both incredible cars, my brother gets the high spec full leather.

Sure it's a matter of opinion but if I had the cash there is no doubt in my mind that I'd have an A6.

I loved my old B6 2003 A4 multitronic, but I hated the TDI Rattle. The common rail is a lot smoother but still not smooth as a petrol. There is nice shove in the 2.0L 170 hp TDI.

Having said that I found a Nice 2003 Volvo S80 for my brother at the weekend, full leather, lovely interior all for 2100 Euro's 2.0L 5 cylinder 180 hp petrol lovely smooth car, I would be happy enough for the price. Nicer than any Diesel.

Would I spend 50K on an A6 ? never. Unless I could buy for cash and not miss it. I'd never get a loan for that amount and pay interest and then depreciation.

YbFocus

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

Yes but a premium car should have leather and auto surely.

God you really hate manuals
You cannot enjoy thrashing an auto

I would agree in the nice interiors on a premium make but the box choice is down to preference

colm_mcm

Sure when you put in 'passat golf toyota' into donedeal you get a 96 Corsa....

Eric Cartman

Interesting that vw is the most popular in all the felter counties

Cleveland Hot Pocket

YbFocus wrote: »

God you really hate manuals
You cannot enjoy thrashing an auto

I would agree in the nice interiors on a premium make but the box choice is down to preference

You cannot enjoy thrashing an auto? Did you not enjoy the spin in my car the other weekend? Was that not thrashing :P

The box choice is down to preference yes and on a 4k luxobarge that is fine but at a higher price level the market demands autos largely for that car segment.

Take any car like a 5 series or a 7 series (do they even come in manual actually) or an E or S class. The manuals (if they even exists) will be much cheaper than the equivalent auto with similar spec and condition.

I get that you like manual cars but I really think that a slush box suits the car and the "feel" of it much better in the executive sedan segment. Obviously the reverse is true for something like a hot hatch (but even then there is something to be said for a Golf GTI/R32 with a DSG)

Matt Simis

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

You cannot enjoy thrashing an auto?

Assume he means you can't thrash an auto as you have no direct input, you queue commands to the TCU and it makes an assessment on what it allows you do.. which isnt going to be something the warranty providing manufacturer would deem thrashing.

Even if it did, you still have an electronic middle man to sit between you and the gears.


Anyway this thread isnt about Autos.. why do people like German cars? Cos they are good cars. While it makes certain fanbois more "content" to come up with conspiracy theories.. sometimes things are successful cos they are just good at what they do or are the best/only option. Their popularity has the knock on effect of a huge range of Used cars available which is good and required for the auto enthusiast. Being a Lambo, Ferrari or Bentley fan must be rather boring for the average person.

To that end, in certain segments they are the only option; want a powerful RWD exec car? Want an AWD with a V10? Want a Twin/Triple turbo 6pot diesel? You got virtually no alternatives, as the Jap and other Euro makers target and chase far less interesting market segments as well as having little appetite for risk taking and a different perspective of what constitutes "halo" products. Which is a cultural difference between Germans (ie their domestic market) and everyone else (bar perhaps the Americans, though they have other issues). They pride engineering and technical dominance and express it via power. Its worth noting that the synergy between US and German auto interests plays out in German car makers primary and secondary markets, which flip flop between Germany and US with the UK a 3rd choice.


Be thankful we don't live in a world where the cheapest car is the one thats in volume, we would all be driving Tata's and other tripe.

georgefalls

Matt Simis wrote: »

Be thankful we don't live in a world where the cheapest car is the one thats in volume, we would all be driving Tata's and other tripe.

It's only a matter of time

Cleveland Hot Pocket

georgefalls wrote: »

It's only a matter of time

Never

Scortho

Anan1 wrote: »

Marketing, and interiors that feel good.

Marketing is definitely the reason.
I wouldn't call german cars reliable. Yes they probably are more reliable than Italians, but no where near as reliable as Japanese. Likewise interiors aren't as good as italians (comparing mothers W 164 to my alfa which is five years older, the alfa wins hands down).

The same can be seen in the beer industry.
I can think of 20 craft beers that are brewed in Ireland, that are infinitely tastier than the marketed macros, yet the macros are more popular.

Kenny Logins

Scortho wrote: »

Marketing is definitely the reason.
I wouldn't call german cars reliable. Yes they probably are more reliable than Italians, but no where near as reliable as Japanese. Likewise interiors aren't as good as italians (comparing mothers W 164 to my alfa which is five years older, the alfa wins hands down).

The same can be seen in the beer industry.
I can think of 20 craft beers that are brewed in Ireland, that are infinitely tastier than the marketed macros, yet the macros are more popular.

So German car reliability lies somewhere between Italian and Japanese? But you wouldn't call them reliable.

...and you have compared two cars to reach this conclusion? Not two marques, or even models? Two cars.

Have you had any coffee this morning? :pac:

Scortho

Kenny Logins wrote: »

So German car reliability lies somewhere between Italian and Japanese? But you wouldn't call them reliable.

...and you have compared two cars to reach this conclusion? Not two marques, or even models? Two cars.

Have you had any coffee this morning? :pac:

Yep a nice kieni bean brewed with my aeropress.:D

In general japanese cars are more reliable than german cars.
German cars are more reliable than french and italian cars. Having owned german cars prior to Italians, I wouldn't call them miles ahead reliability wise. Reliable to an extent yes (all cars are though with proper maintenance). More reliable than Japs though? Nope.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

Scortho wrote: »

Yep a nice kieni bean brewed with my aeropress.:D

In general japanese cars are more reliable than german cars.
German cars are more reliable than french and italian cars. Having owned german cars prior to Italians, I wouldn't call them miles ahead reliability wise. Reliable to an extent yes (all cars are though with proper maintenance). More reliable than Japs though? Nope.

Wow that is a post strewn with generalizations
All of them are wrong (see what I did there)

Scortho

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

Wow that is a post strewn with generalizations
All of them are wrong (see what I did there)

What generalisations?
Are the majority of german cars more reliable than italians?
Yes...unfortunately:mad:

Are the majority of japanese cars more reliable than germans?
Yes...unfortunately:mad:


If i could get the lucks of Alfa and the reliability of Japanese, Id be very very happy. But when they did that, they did it in reverse:rolleyes:

stimpson

Scortho wrote: »

What generalisations?
Are the majority of german cars more reliable than italians?
Yes...unfortunately:mad:

Are the majority of japanese cars more reliable than germans?
Yes...unfortunately:mad:


If i could get the lucks of Alfa and the reliability of Japanese, Id be very very happy. But when they did that, they did it in reverse:rolleyes:

Warranty Direct seem to agree with you:

http://www.whatcar.com/car-news/honda-tops-reliability-survey/1202107

Top 10 are all far eastern. Best "German" marque are Skoda in 12th.

VW 21st
BMW 26th
Merc 30th
Audi 31st

HAHA even fiat comes 12th !

Honda maybe good but their parts are ridiculously over priced.

stimpson

Deleted User wrote: »

HAHA even fiat comes 12th !

Honda maybe good but their parts are ridiculously over priced.

Which is made up for by the fact that you don't have to replace them as often.

Stella Virgo

jimgoose wrote: »

I wouldn't buy a Renault to keep chickens in, but Citroen generally do a solid, reliable bus. Funny - I remember when the Ford Zephyr Six and Consul Granada were considered the real Gaffer's car. Mercedes-Benz was this oddball, overpriced Continental crowd and Volkswagens were strictly the preserve of hippies and hill-farmers with baling-twine around their britches.

in some parts of the country,they still are......inc the mondeo...loving referred as "farmers cars" :pac::pac:

YbFocus

Yep Cleveland you must agree that bmw's ain't that reliable, or own engines are good in fairness but the 4 cylinder bmw's cause nothing only hassle!
Bmw taken as a marque ain't too reliable

I don't think you can get more reliable than a late 90's passat
The thing my poor one endured while in college.

jimgoose

Stella Virgo wrote: »

in some parts of the country,they still are......inc the mondeo...loving referred as "farmers cars" :pac::pac:

Don't forget the mighty Nissan Bluebird!

HandsomeDan

I see also from that list that Peugeot and Citroen sit comfortably ahead of Volkswagen, BMW, Audi & Mercedes.

Mycroft H

Stella Virgo wrote: »

in some parts of the country,they still are......inc the mondeo...loving referred as "farmers cars" :pac::pac:

Your forgetting the smelly TD Avensis with steel wheels and the boot held down with bailing twine.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

YbFocus wrote: »

Yep Cleveland you must agree that bmw's ain't that reliable, or own engines are good in fairness but the 4 cylinder bmw's cause nothing only hassle!
Bmw taken as a marque ain't too reliable

I don't think you can get more reliable than a late 90's passat
The thing my poor one endured while in college.

Yeah I think they (BM) dropped the ball on the infamous timing chain specials.
The 6-pots have always been reliable, and to compare like with like, a late 90's bmw will be as reliable as a late 90's vw. It was after that that the reliability issues came into play
Sure vw now are not as reliable as they used to be. Same for toyota (AKA recalls R us):p

Sometimes I am tempted to guy a late 80's straight diesel 1.6 vw golf as my daily. So there must be something in the "reliable vw" myth.!:P

YbFocus

I had a 1.9 straight mk3 golf, once left it 17000 miles between services, was held to 103mph the whole way on the motorway, almost limited in fifth ( that's exactly what it would do )
It never gave an ounce of trouble

Tea 1000

YbFocus wrote: »

Yep Cleveland you must agree that bmw's ain't that reliable, or own engines are good in fairness but the 4 cylinder bmw's cause nothing only hassle!
Bmw taken as a marque ain't too reliable

I don't think you can get more reliable than a late 90's passat
The thing my poor one endured while in college.

Late 90's Passats were far from reliable. Plenty of electrical gremlins, sticky door locks, and crappy front suspension that seemed to like breaking on people.
Late 90's Accord would be as good as you can get.

tossy

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Late 90's Passats were far from reliable. Plenty of electrical gremlins, sticky door locks, and crappy front suspension that seemed to like breaking on people.
Late 90's Accord would be as good as you can get.

Nothing wrong with the suspension if people fitted genuine arms,the problem was so many people fitted fitted **** spurious arms and thus the passat/A4 got a bad name for failing suspension when in fact the parts failing were not made by either VW or Audi,that's a little bug bear of mine, its typical Irish motor-nomics - it's up there with i bought a car.... treated it like ****... it broke.... X car is a piece of crap i'd never buy one again :rolleyes:

As for VAG reliability my2000 S3 160k never missed a beat apart from wear and tear items,i challenge anyone to find any interior from a present day Korean/Japanese car to match it in quality or even condition. Or indeed find a current day Korean/Japanese car that will look the same as it does today in 13 years and 160k time.

EDIT: of course weather the interior looks better or not is a matter of opinion

Tea 1000

tossy wrote: »

Nothing wrong with the suspension if people fitted genuine arms,the problem was so many people fitted fitted **** spurious arms and thus the passat/A4 got a bad name for failing suspension when in fact the parts failing were not made by either VW or Audi,that's a little bug bear of mine, its typical Irish motor-nomics - it's up there with i bought a car.... treated it like ****... it broke.... X car is a piece of crap i'd never buy one again :rolleyes:

As for VAG reliability my2000 S3 160k never missed a beat apart from wear and tear items,i challenge anyone to find any interior from a present day Korean/Japanese car to match it in quality or even condition. Or indeed find a current day Korean/Japanese car that will look the same as it does today in 13 years and 160k time.

EDIT: of course weather the interior looks better or not is a matter of opinion

I'm talking about the arms that were fitted from factory. They shouldn't just break below 100k miles. Or better again, they shouldn't break.
And your nonsense about Japanese cars not looking the same, it's just that - nonsense. If you're looking for interiors that wear beyond their years/use you need to look towards Ford.

tossy

Tea 1000 wrote: »

I'm talking about the arms that were fitted from factory. They shouldn't just break below 100k miles. Or better again, they shouldn't break.
And your nonsense about Japanese cars not looking the same, it's just that - nonsense. If you're looking for interiors that wear beyond their years/use you need to look towards Ford.

You think suspension components should be good for the life of the car? Would you have leaf springs all round ?

Tea 1000

tossy wrote: »

You think suspension components should be good for the life of the car? Would you have leaf springs all round ?

No. But I do think nothing should break to the point of seriously affecting the stability of the car.

YbFocus

But surely you need to keep an eye on your suspension before you reach 100k miles?
I had to redo the suspension arms in my Passat once and it was the only hassle I got, I wouldn't really call it hassle as any car needs it's suspension sorted now and again.

They are fantastic cars to drive because of that setup and I don't mind an extra couple of hundred every couple of years.

In fact what I'd save in buying oil for the Honda it'd probably work out the same

Tea 1000

YbFocus wrote: »

But surely you need to keep an eye on your suspension before you reach 100k miles?
I had to redo the suspension arms in my Passat once and it was the only hassle I got, I wouldn't really call it hassle as any car needs it's suspension sorted now and again.

They are fantastic cars to drive because of that setup and I don't mind an extra couple of hundred every couple of years.

In fact what I'd save in buying oil for the Honda it'd probably work out the same

Keep an eye on your soft suspension in case it breaks? No... properly built cars just wear, so you know from sounds and feel when something needs replacing rather than keep visually checking for signs of it about to snap!
And as for the roly-poly handling of the Passat, coupled with it's over-firm slow speed ride over broken surfaces? You're welcome to it!
Oil in a Honda? This from the owner of a car from a company that claimed a litre every thousand miles is "normal"?
No Honda myself or anyone I know have owned burned oil, but maybe we know how to find minded cars!! :P

Cleveland Hot Pocket

That crap about cars are worthless after 100k miles really irritates me. It is the typical throwaway nature with which a lot of people view their cars.

Only "service" them when it fails the NCT, don't spend any money unless unavoidable etc. Cars will last hundreds of thousands of miles if maintained correctly. Hell, even some cars without proper maintanence (Carina E, old Mercs/Bmws, old hondas etc) will last that long.

I cannot see a 1.2 TSI skoda superb lasting that long, especially with the paddy servicing.

Tea 1000

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

That crap about cars are worthless after 100k miles really irritates me. It is the typical throwaway nature with which a lot of people view their cars.

Only "service" them when it fails the NCT, don't spend any money unless unavoidable etc. Cars will last hundreds of thousands of miles if maintained correctly. Hell, even some cars without proper maintanence (Carina E, old Mercs/Bmws, old hondas etc) will last that long.

I cannot see a 1.2 TSI skoda superb lasting that long, especially with the paddy servicing.

It's an Irish thing alright. They consider you mad to be spending money on looking after something! The other thing is they leave something broken on their car until it comes to trying to sell it, then they fix it cause they know they won't be able to sell it like that. Fix it for someone else, rather than fix it and enjoy the working item yourself on your own car.

YbFocus

Tea 1000 wrote: »

Keep an eye on your soft suspension in case it breaks? No... properly built cars just wear, so you know from sounds and feel when something needs replacing rather than keep visually checking for signs of it about to snap!
And as for the roly-poly handling of the Passat, coupled with it's over-firm slow speed ride over broken surfaces? You're welcome to it!
Oil in a Honda? This from the owner of a car from a company that claimed a litre every thousand miles is "normal"?
No Honda myself or anyone I know have owned burned oil, but maybe we know how to find minded cars!! :P

My suspension arms were fine for 2 years and wore as any other car. Then they knocked for about 3 months before I changed them out, as an earlier poster said if there not replaced with oem or oem spec then thats where some cheapskate says " Oh they aren't worth anything, always breaking". When in fact they are fine and give months of warning.
As for the oil, I or my friends never have lost a drop in all the passats and golfs that were bought over the years

I'm not getting into a silly argument over our own preferences anyway man, each to their own. We'll be the ones to close the thread

Tea 1000

YbFocus wrote: »

My suspension arms were fine for 2 years and wore as any other car. Then they knocked for about 3 months before I changed them out, as an earlier poster said if there not replaced with oem or oem spec then thats where some cheapskate says " Oh they aren't worth anything, always breaking". When in fact they are fine and give months of warning.
As for the oil, I or my friends never have lost a drop in all the passats and golfs that were bought over the years

I'm not getting into a silly argument over our own preferences anyway man, each to their own. We'll be the ones to close the thread

Each to their own is right, but there's no point in saying a car is reliable when it's not really.

Scortho

Cleveland Hot Pocket wrote: »

That crap about cars are worthless after 100k miles really irritates me. It is the typical throwaway nature with which a lot of people view their cars.

Long may it last. Reason why a 166 v6 can be bought for €450 when its worth more than that in parts.