The next government

Engine No.9

Probably belongs better in politics but I'm interested to hear what the good folk of AH have to say about this.

It'll probably never happen but imagine for a second that Gerry sttod down from the leadership of Sinn Fein, would they actually have a chance at being a part of the next government?

wretcheddomain

pajopearl wrote: »

It'll probably never happen but imagine for a second that Gerry sttod down from the leadership of Sinn Fein, would they actually have a chance at being a part of the next government?

No.

TeddyTedson

The poles say yes:pac::pac:

stmol32

I've always been a Sinn Fein voter ever since I became an adult and I reckon they're the right men and women for the job.

But I've been an Irish citizen longer than that I can't help but have the depressing feeling that Irish voters will completely forget the horrible record of Fianna Fail and give them another go in the next election.

Engine No.9

wretcheddomain wrote: »

No.

Why not!? I mean, the face of the party is the gripe of the majority of folk in this country. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Sinn Fein sympathizer by any means. I voted FG in the last election, but I reckon I'll go FF in the next if Martin stays. Not that he'll be able to do any more than the current shambles given the restrictions they'll be hogtied with. But still, wouldn't SF do a whole lot better across the country if they didn't have an alleged, repeat... alleged, murderer at the helm?

kneemos

TeddyTedson wrote: »

The poles say yes:pac::pac:

They always do well in poles but never translates in elections for some reason.
Can't see any mainstream party touching them with a bargepole for many many decades,though given the amount of airtime they manage to get you would at times think they were running the country.

wretcheddomain

pajopearl wrote: »

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a Sinn Fein sympathizer by any means.

Yes, you are.

I voted FG in the last election, but I reckon I'll go FF in the next if Martin stays.

Shame on you.

kneemos

stmol32 wrote: »

I've always been a Sinn Fein voter ever since I became an adult and I reckon they're the right men and women for the job.

But I've been an Irish citizen longer than that I can't help but have the depressing feeling that Irish voters will completely forget the horrible record of Fianna Fail and give them another go in the next election.

Unlike yourself I suspect a lot of their supporters are not big on bothering to vote.

stmol32

pajopearl wrote: »

... but I reckon I'll go FF in the next if Martin stays.....

I can't in good conscience condone anything Fianna Fail have done (hypocritical I know, what with Sinn Fein and all the murders) but from a purely political-tactical standpoint Martin did the best thing he could for his party in the past few years, which was STFU while everyone else dealt with the fallout his party, but not him, caused.

That way he gets to take the moral high ground about why the government haven't sorted the problems.

That's why I think they'll get back in.

Engine No.9

wretcheddomain wrote: »

Yes, you are.

I believe I said I'm not, ergo I'm not.

BuilderPlumber

Taoiseach: Nigel Delaney.
Tanaiste: Francis Cooney.
Opposition: Daniel Loughman RIP.

Mr. Incognito

Sinn Fein are bigoted anti eu populist morons.

Their economic policies are ridiculous.

They are filling the vacuum left by labour who were the previous populist economic idiots.

God help us if that shower ever get in

We need to stop electing knuckle dusters teachers and publicans pulling local strokes

Independent pro active articulate people are too smart for politics as it stands

onemorechance

I think Sinn Féin will hold the balance of power in the next general election. Fine Gael and Labour will both lose seats, Fianna Fáil and Sinn Féin will gain seats. They should all do the right thing and form a unity Government.

The poll showed support for parties, when don’t knows had been excluded, as follows: Fine Gael 26%; Sinn Féin 23%; Fianna Fáil 22%; Labour 6%; and Independents 20%.


GRAND TOTAL

FG: 60
FF: 46
LB: 11
SF: 21
IO: 20

Irish Times

stmol32

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

...We need to stop electing knuckle dusters teachers and publicans pulling local strokes

Exactly, so you do like Sinn Fein.

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

...
Independent pro active articulate people are too smart for politics as it stands

These creatures you speak of don't exist in Ireland outside of After Hours (is this what populism means?)

Mr. Incognito

onemorechance wrote: »

I think Sinn Féin will hold the balance of power in the next general election. Fine Gael and Labour will both lose seats, Fianna Fáil and Sinn Féin will gain seats. They should all do the right thing and form a unity Government.



Irish Times

Finna fail and Finna Gael should form a unity government and clean out the waste in the public service drop this wage deflation scam bridge and start promoting targeted sectors for growth. We need a specialist economy. I saw nonsense about going back to agriculture and fishing during the week on rte. FFs. Talk about Stone Age.

kneemos

onemorechance wrote: »

I think Sinn Féin will hold the balance of power in the next general election. Fine Gael and Labour will both lose seats, Fianna Fáil and Sinn Féin will gain seats. They should all do the right thing and form a unity Government.



Irish Times

Not a prayer of twenty one seats.
I think people tick SF in poles to throw a spanner in the works or to piss off the Government.

meoklmrk91

Gerry Adams would have to step down for me to even consider it, I think he is a liar. I am young enough that I don't really remember the troubles, but I have done some research, even if you don't accept that he was involved, which is fair enough it has never been proven, he comments, particularly in the cases of the disappeared were vile and unfeeling towards the families.

I would also be very worried about their experience or lack there of, they have never even been part of a coalition government. I would worry that because of this they would drive us even further into the abyss. I know every party has to start somewhere but this is no the time to be experimenting.

Anyone who votes for Fine Fail is the next election is, in my opinion, a complete and utter fool with a terribly short memory, had they been more competent when everything was about to come down around us then things may not have been as bad, if they had built a decent health service when things were good then maybe we wouldn't have people dying on trolleys. The only way I would consider it is of they said they would take Bertie's pensions from him, they should throw him and his ilk under the bus, where they belong. They have not shown me in any way, shape or form that they have changed, the country to be fair to FG/Lab was a complete and utter shambles by the time they got to it.

FG/Lab, this is a tough one, I agree with so many of their polices, I think they have done quite well with what they were given but the things they have done to my generation are hard to forgive. I left school in 2008 and from what I can see anyone who has left school since has been abandoned by the government. College contribution fees gone up and up and up, grant cut, back to education cut, dole for under 26's cut, 12 lessons to get a full driving license, the whole college grants/household charge debacle and Ruari Quinns comments on it, jobsbridge taking away jobs that would have traditionally been done by the young, Tesco etc. I could go on. Everything this government has done has said that we are not wanted. That we have to pay for the mistakes of those who came before us. No wonder we are leaving in droves, I wonder what they will do in 10 years time when we are all paying our taxes in Aus/UK/Canada and they have no one to pay for their old age pension?

I have no faith in the political system, I feel like I am an unwanted burden, that they just want me to **** off.

TL;DR: They are all they ****ing same.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

onemorechance

kneemos wrote: »

Not a prayer of twenty one seats.
I think people tick SF in poles to throw a spanner in the works or to piss off the Government.

1 in 1997, 5 in 2002, 4 in 2007, 14 in 2011. Very likely they will increase their 14, but probably not to 21.

kneemos

onemorechance wrote: »

1 in 1997, 5 in 2002, 4 in 2007, 14 in 2011. Very likely they will increase their 14, but probably not to 21.

2011 was an anti FF vote.

onemorechance

Mr. Incognito wrote: »

Finna fail and Finna Gael should form a unity government and clean out the waste in the public service drop this wage deflation scam bridge and start promoting targeted sectors for growth. We need a specialist economy. I saw nonsense about going back to agriculture and fishing during the week on rte. FFs. Talk about Stone Age.

Ireland is already a specialist in argriculture and there is potential for growth; organic and all that craic! Ireland does have a good rep for food, beef, lamb, etc.

There is huge potential to make use of the large sea area to create marine research and preservation areas. Other countries have done this to great effect.

onemorechance

kneemos wrote: »

2011 was an anti FF vote.

2016 will be anti Labour! :pac:

Engine No.9

The action on their policies is the worrying thing though. They promised a children's referendum... Passed. They promised to abolish the Seanad... Defeated. The Constitutional Convention has only been mentioned in passing as far as I'm concerned and Universal Health Care by 2016 is only a pipe dream at this stage. I'm not sure that this government has a mandate anymore and should we be looking for a new government already???

tim3000

I am no expert in Irish politics by any means but what it seems to me is that we need a fourth party. A party free from recent scandals, free from austerity and free from the Troubles. Some from of semi-liberal youth orientated party, but I don't see this happening soon enough for the next election.

I usually don't post in politicised threads due having no particular loyalty to any of the Big Three Irish parties. In the last election I voted for Independents and maybe FG if memory serves this was just to keep FF out. I hope they don't get in again but I could see a coalition between them and FF to keep SF out.

onemorechance

pajopearl wrote: »

The action on their policies is the worrying thing though. They promised a children's referendum... Passed. They promised to abolish the Seanad... Defeated. The Constitutional Convention has only been mentioned in passing as far as I'm concerned and Universal Health Care by 2016 is only a pipe dream at this stage. I'm not sure that this government has a mandate anymore and should we be looking for a new government already???

It's easy enough having a referendum compared to running the economy.

New Government, old Government, doesn't matter, same civil service.

Anyone waiting for or expecting the Government to help them out will be sorely disappointed or at best, waiting a long time.

onemorechance

tim3000 wrote: »

I am no expert in Irish politics by any means but what it seems to me is that we need a fourth party. A party free from recent scandals, free from austerity and free from the Troubles. Some from of quasi liberal youth orientated party, but I don't see this happening soon enough for the next election.

Not possible for at least several generations. The student movement is typically the biggest force for real political change in society. The Celtic tiger generation of Irish students simply don't have the interest or sobriety to form any such movement.

tim3000

onemorechance wrote: »

Not possible for at least several generations. The student movement is typically the biggest force for real political change in society. The Celtic tiger generation of Irish students simply don't have the interest or sobriety to form any such movement.

Thats my thinking too. If they were to mobilise the best time to do so would have been in response to the fees hike proposal.I think they would need time to establish political clout but by then a new set of circumstance will have arisen. But I do think a large fourth party is needed.

Sunnyisland

The next general election is in 2016, there will be huge coverage of the centenary of the 1916 rising and with that a massive rise in nationalism sweeping the country,With labour becoming the fall guy from this coalition and FF on the rise,It wouldn't surprise me if there was a FF/SF government next time.

Personally I am very cynical about the whole lot of them nowadays and not one party jumps out at me at the present time and nor do I expect that to change.

I just woke up to post this, now I am going back to sleep, night.

onemorechance

realies wrote: »

The next general election is in 2016, there will be huge coverage of the centenary of the 1916 rising and with that a massive rise in nationalism sweeping the country,With labour becoming the fall guy from this coalition and FF on the rise,It wouldn't surprise me if there was a FF/SF government next time.

Personally I am very cynical about the whole lot of them nowadays and not one party jumps out at me at the present time and nor do I expect that to change.

I just woke up to post this, now I am going back to sleep, night.

Oiche mhaith!

onemorechance

Latest student movement:

SOFIA, Bulgaria (AP) — Several hundred students blocked access to Bulgaria's largest university on Monday, demanding the dissolution of Parliament, calling for new elections and bemoaning a lack of "moral values" at high levels. University administrators pleaded with them to re-open the campus and allow classes to resume.

The protest at Kliment Ochridsky University in the capital, Sofia, will likely energize an anti-government movement that has spent four months protesting the country's leadership. The demonstrators' unhappiness stems from allegations that government leaders have ties with shady businessmen and other claims of official corruption.

The Socialist-backed Bulgarian government took office after early elections in May, following the resignation of the previous Cabinet amid anti-austerity protests. The government commands only 120 seats in the 240-seat Parliament and has to rely on the support from a nationalist party.

...

Washington Post

Uaru

I have never voted for Sinn Fein, neither has anyone in my family. Me and my brother will most likely both vote that way in the next election assuming the candidate in my area isn't a complete cretin. I would like to see Pearse Doherty lead the party.

Banjo String

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I would also be very worried about their experience or lack there of, they have never even been part of a coalition government. I would worry that because of this they would drive us even further into the abyss. I know every party has to start somewhere but this is no the time to be experimenting.

They've been in coalition now, (very successfully too) since 2007.
So successful in govt, that the other nationalist party in the north (SDLP) has pretty much been voted into irrelevance.

kneemos wrote: »

2011 was an anti FF vote.

FG got in on the back of an anti FF vote. 2016 will be an anti FG/Lab vote. If they make it that far.

Phoebas

stmol32 wrote: »

I've always been a Sinn Fein voter ever since I became an adult and I reckon they're the right men and women for the job.

But I've been an Irish citizen longer than that I can't help but have the depressing feeling that Irish voters will completely forget the horrible record of Fianna Fail and give them another go in the next election.

We shouldn't forget FFs ruinous past. Check.
We should forget SFs murderous past. Check.

Richard Hillman

Sinn Fein are just Fianna Fail 2.0. They will be involved in a few bonanza budgets and when it all goes to ****, Fine Gael will have to pick up the pieces.

Remember, at the height of the boom Sinn Fein wanted the dole to be €300.

Banjo String

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Sinn Fein are just Fianna Fail 2.0. They will be involved in a few bonanza budgets and when it all goes to ****, Fine Gael will have to pick up the pieces.

Plenty probably remember Enda Kenny and co whinging after every 'bonanza budget' that the then govt did not give away enough.

By that logic, if they'd have been in power instead of FF the country would be in a bigger mess.

Why do so many ignore this fact?

Richard Hillman

Banjo String wrote: »

Plenty probably remember Enda Kenny and co whinging after every 'bonanza budget' that the then govt did not give away enough.

By that logic, if they'd have been in power instead of FF the country would be in a bigger mess.

Why do so many ignore this fact?

You may remember remember Fine Gael describing one of FFs budgets as auction politics.

spank_inferno

Do SF have enough quality candidates to reflect their national poll numbers?

Taking my own constituancy - Wicklow.
The SF candidate came close last time to being elected... But he doesnt seem to over furnished with smarts..... Its hard to see him being elected again with Stephen Donnelly being the only TD in Wicklow with a voice & half a brain.

the groutch

spank_inferno wrote: »

Stephen Donnelly being the only TD in Wicklow the country with a voice & half a brain.

the more Stephen Donnellys we get into the Dail the better.

Banjo String

the groutch wrote: »

the more Stephen Donnellys we get into the Dail the better.

Agreed

Sir Humphrey Appleby

pajopearl wrote: »

Probably belongs better in politics but I'm interested to hear what the good folk of AH have to say about this.

It'll probably never happen but imagine for a second that Gerry sttod down from the leadership of Sinn Fein, would they actually have a chance at being a part of the next government?

Hopefully not.

Ghost Buster

stmol32 wrote: »

I've always been a Sinn Fein voter ever since I became an adult and I reckon they're the right men and women for the job.

But I've been an Irish citizen longer than that I can't help but have the depressing feeling that Irish voters will completely forget the horrible record of Fianna Fail and give them another go in the next election.

I wont forget the horrible record of FF but then again neither will i forget the horrible record of SF and Adams and McGuinness in particular. Once the people who killed people are gone i might consider SF but until then......

Happyman42

Ghost Buster wrote: »

I wont forget the horrible record of FF but then again neither will i forget the horrible record of SF and Adams and McGuinness in particular. Once the people who killed people are gone i might consider SF but until then......

....you'll stay up on your moral high ground selectively choosing what to forget?

LeinsterDub

TeddyTedson wrote: »

The poles say yes:pac::pac:

I didn't think they were allowed vote in General elections only Presidential and European .

Mint Aero

Absolutely disgusting to read some of the comments about Sinn Fein here. Interesting to see who these posters are anyway. Gerry for president.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Mint Aero

Fred Swanson wrote: »

Why is it disgusting? The party is lead by what right minded people would class as criminals.

Oh for god sake

BuilderPlumber

Ghost Buster wrote: »

I wont forget the horrible record of FF but then again neither will i forget the horrible record of SF and Adams and McGuinness in particular. Once the people who killed people are gone i might consider SF but until then......

Irish politics stinks to high heavens to be honest. All parties and most individuals are either outright corrupt, lazy or incompetent. Very few have the skills to engage with the people and show very poor leadership.

FF presided over a a reckless building boom that gave people a false sense of security. The current government promised they'd implement fairer policies and reverse a lot of the draconian cutbacks only to assume power and continue the same as FF were and arguably worse. SF is full of dodgy characters from the 1979-1998 Northern Ireland war period I just don't trust. Other parties/would be parties like Direct Democracy or Reform Alliance may mean well but are too small to be taken seriously. Independents are often just FF/FG/Labour rejects who side with their traditional allegiances when the chips are down.

To be honest, voting is therefore a waste of time. The people's voice was not listened to by this current government and it is undemocratic that they went back on their commitment to change. FF were ousted because of their cutbacks policies and the current regime was elected to do away with these policies. That our vote only changed faces and not policies does well and truly mean we are living under a dictatorship: maybe not quite North Korea or Eritrea but not a healthy democracy where governments reflect the people's will either.

There should be a clause in there to render any government who does not implement what they promised voters irrelevant. The 2011 election was pointless and did not move Ireland any closer to democracy. Instead, Enda Kenny is on some kind of ego trip and Mario Rosenstock's portrayal of him as Hitler-lite is not that terribly far off the map!

TwoShedsJackson

Mint Aero wrote: »

Absolutely disgusting to read some of the comments about Sinn Fein here. Interesting to see who these posters are anyway. Gerry for president.

Watch out, anyone who won't vote SF is now on Mint Aero's 'list'.

Maximus Alexander

I don't like any of the parties at this stage. Independents will be getting my vote going forward.

harryr711

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

I don't like any of the parties at this stage. Independents will be getting my vote going forward.

Which is even more pointless because unless independents team up with parties, like the Healy-Rae's and FF, they'll get nothing done. We could do with less Ming Flanagan types in the Dáil.

Maximus Alexander

harryr711 wrote: »

Which is even more pointless because unless independents team up with parties, like the Healy-Rae's and FF, they'll get nothing done. We could do with less Ming Flanagan types in the Dáil.

I'd be fine with more Ming Flanagan types if its at the expense of the sort of people who come up with schemes like JobBridge.

Regardless of whether they subsequently team up with parties, I won't be directly complicit in voting for those clowns.