South Africa fear genocide, White Afrikaner.

AllthingsCP

TREAD WARNING.

South Africa has been slipping into the past in last few years, and many fear Genocide at its 6 level now feared it could reach level 7 or 8 anyday now.

Its Moral wrong for this to happen, This people have as much right to that land, They helped built that country.

wretcheddomain

Let's blame the bankers!

AllthingsCP

wretcheddomain wrote: »

Let's blame the bankers!

I know this is off topic, But researching the above i found this

I mean the man is a marvel!! lol

sarkozy

'Genocide'? Hmm. Can't see it myself. I'm sure it must be hard for a white minority that once ruled a country through state-sanctioned racism, ghettoisation and ultra-violence to adjust to the new situation. Which obviously justifies racist fearmongering like this.

AllthingsCP

sarkozy wrote: »

Racist Fearmongering

Whether is whites here in Europe, America or Blacks in Africa its wrongs.

Racist Fear-mongering only go's so far till it becomes murder and state sanction murder 3000 dead farmers is not Racist Fear-mongering, Its murder, We are all aware of South African history and the tension that exist their, But why the step back into a bloody past.

woodoo

Yeah white man tied to the back of a pick up truck after being attacked by machetes and dragged to his death but i've never heard about it till now. We all heard about James Byrd Jnr.

woodoo

sarkozy wrote: »

'Genocide'? Hmm. Can't see it myself. I'm sure it must be hard for a white minority that once ruled a country through state-sanctioned racism, ghettoisation and ultra-violence to adjust to the new situation. Which obviously justifies racist fearmongering like this.

You almost sound like you are justifying it. Has that where we have ended up. You are an anti white racist.

JupiterKid

OP - can you provide any evidence as to this alleged genocide?

Femme_Fatale

"Genocide" means wiping out the white race, that's not gonna happen.

I fully believe white people are seriously persecuted against in parts of South Africa and it's a scary problem. But unfortunately a lot of people, instead of examining it from a constructive place, will just use it a stick to beat black people.

Clandestine

I have family in South Africa who are planning on moving because the country is beyond help. Basic services (clean running water, lighting etc.) are barely running, and most Government programs were better under apartheid funnily enough. What a shame. A race war will be the last nail in the coffin.

P_1

To be honest the worst of the Apartheid happened over a generation ago. It doesn't strike me as right that the current white generation of South Africans should be made to pay for the sins of their fathers.

JupiterKid

Any form of attack or persecution of a person based on race (and religion, creed etc.) is very wrong but you could be forgiven in the case of South Africa, given its Apartheid past for the phrase "what goes around comes around" to come to mind.

Violence and murder certainly seems to be a very serious problem in SA.

AllthingsCP

Femme_Fatale wrote: »

"Genocide" means wiping out the white race, that's not gonna happen.

I fully believe white people are seriously persecuted against in parts of South Africa and it's a scary problem. But unfortunately a lot of people, instead of examining it from a constructive place, will just use it a stick to beat black people.

Integration for Non-Europeans here has had it problems, But mainly we all seem to come together. Mass killings of whites in South Africa could really hinder relationship here to massive amount of mistrust and hated and could lead to a large amount of violence on both sides

The King of Moo

I can't find any reliable sources on google about this OP, just opinions by white South Africans recounted on websites with vested interests.

Without any credible indication that genocide will occur, this is nothing more than "we can't say anythin to them, but they can be racist to us Joe!"

Of course there's going to angry feelings about white South Africans, and a desire to redress past injustices, among some members of the black community.
But the best way to face such problems are by acknowledging the complexity of the country's history and attempting to forge a new, unified nation, not mass evacuations.

Thanks for the tread warning by the way, I'll keep my eyes open.

Clandestine

JupiterKid wrote: »

Any form of attack or persecution of a person based on race (and religion, creed etc.) is very wrong but you could be forgiven in the case of South Africa, given its Apartheid past for the phrase "what goes around comes around" to come to mind.

Seriously?

AllthingsCP

The King of Moo wrote: »

best way to face such problems are by acknowledging the complexity of the country's history and attempting to forge a new, unified nation, not mass evacuations..

Emm i bet if you live their you mite have a different way of thinking

P_1

JupiterKid wrote: »

Any form of attack or persecution of a person based on race (and religion, creed etc.) is very wrong but you could be forgiven in the case of South Africa, given its Apartheid past for the phrase "what goes around comes around" to come to mind.

Violence and murder certainly seems to be a very serious problem in SA.

Right so going by your logic, Germans born after WW2 should also have been persecuted, "what goes around comes around" afterall...

How about the children of IRA and UVF members who carried out the worst of actions during the Troubles?

The King of Moo

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Emm i bet if you live their you mite have a different way of thinking

Of course I would. I wouldn't have the objectivity I have as an external observer.
And that's why we should take talk about genocide and exodus with a pinch of salt.

JupiterKid

I didn't mean that persecution by SA whites by blacks was in any way justified,
But if there is anti-white sentiment in SA it is understandable given the country's apartheid past where blacks were treated as inferior people and where a disproportionate share of wealth was and still is in white hands.

sarkozy

AllthingsCP wrote:

Whether is whites here in Europe, America or Blacks in Africa its wrongs.

Racist Fear-mongering only go's so far till it becomes murder and state sanction murder 3000 dead is not Racist Fear-mongering, Its murder.

Did I say anywhere that I condoned any unlawful killings?

I simply pointed out a historical fact and made comment.

I actually know a little about this. I lived in Lesotho, an independent country surrounded entirely by South Africa. As such, I spent a lot of time in South Africa and got to know people. I was there during the time Malema was making his firey speeches. I was also there when a prominent South African white supremacist, Eugene Terre'blanche was murdered.

The Western media sensationalised the story as a racist killing. The South African press was much less keen to sensationalise it this way. The killing was roundly condemned by the ANC, government, etc. They waited for the facts to come in. It turned out that Terre'blanche was murdered by a man who worked on his farm; Terre'blanche had not paid this poor black man for some time; there later came some evidence that it may have been a passion killing as Terre'blanche had also been accused of molesting this man's son, but this is unproven.

My point is this: of these alleged 3,000 murders of white people in South Africa, how many of those have been racially motivated? The motive in the Terre'blanche case - the unlawful killing of a prominent racist - was driven by poverty and social injustice. A very poor man had not been paid at a particularly expensive time of the year. As most (not all) white South Africans are relatively better off than South Africa's poor (who are mostly black and coloured), and that a huge amount of economic power is still owned by white people, it follows that they might be targets for crime.

Let's put this in perspective. In 2010, the year in which Terre'blanche was murdered, there were around 17,000 murders in South Africa in total. That means 15,000 of those people were not white. Or, to put it another way, in an already radically unequal and economically unjust situation, it's mostly poor black and coloured people who are victims of murder - in their own communities, which are mostly the old townships that continue to exist a minimum of three miles from any town (by original Apartheid law).

I do not deny that South Africa is an unsafe place to live compared to Ireland, for example. But to make false claims, out of context, to perpetuate racism is not a topic to be taken lightly. It's important to make a clear point about who are actually the victims of murder and what drives that. That is poverty, inequality and social injustice And to put things this way is also not to condone murder or any kind of violence.

It's also important to say that, under the South African constitution, all nations are equal - the Constitution even more formally recognises LGBT rights than Ireland does. Therefore all South Africans should have equal rights to live there in freedom and dignity. Legally, the do, but not all in reality. I agree that the post-Apartheid generation should not be blamed for their predecessors' actions, but they should also be aware of their social privilege relative to the majority. South Africa is very politically complex, its social problems are huge, and to think that they can be solved in one generation is simply not realistic. Even Ireland, which threw off sectarianism and colonialism in 1937 is not fully there yet.

sarkozy

Clandestine wrote: »

I have family in South Africa who are planning on moving because the country is beyond help. Basic services (clean running water, lighting etc.) are barely running, and most Government programs were better under apartheid funnily enough. What a shame. A race war will be the last nail in the coffin.

Better for WHOM? I found services very good in Free State.

P_1

JupiterKid wrote: »

I didn't mean that persecution by SA whites by blacks was in any way justified,
But if there is anti-white sentiment in SA it is understandable given the country's apartheid past where blacks were treated as inferior people and where a disproportionate share of wealth was and still is in white hands.

True but you can't really be going around punishing people for the actions of those who were there before them though.

Having said that you do get the sense that when Mandela dies the place could get very unstable indeed, particularly when you look at the current leadership of the country

sarkozy

woodoo wrote: »

You almost sound like you are justifying it. Has that where we have ended up. You are an anti white racist.

Thoroughly reject this false assertion.

AllthingsCP

The King of Moo wrote: »

Of course I would. I wouldn't have the objectivity I have as an external observer.
And that's why we should take talk about genocide and exodus with a pinch of salt.

That way of thinking ended up with Rwanda genocide. External thinker's

South Africa main problem isn't a pending white genocide, it's the fact that it's a new(ish) democracy. History has shown us that new democracies have all shared similar problems with effective administration, lawlessness and wealth distribution. The long established system of Apartheid has exacerbated these issues in SA, it takes time to recover political trust, or to establish new political trust and civil order.

Countries of the Russian Federation and Eastern Europe have all faced civil issues - on a smaller scale - after the fall of the Soviet Union, and if anyone studied American History they can see the parallels. It's an issue of wealth distribution much more so than it is of race.

AllthingsCP

The King of Moo wrote: »

I can't find any reliable sources on google about this OP, just opinions by white South Africans recounted on websites with vested interests.

Without any credible indication that genocide will occur, this is nothing more than "we can't say anythin to them, but they can be racist to us Joe!"

Of course there's going to angry feelings about white South Africans, and a desire to redress past injustices, among some members of the black community.
But the best way to face such problems are by acknowledging the complexity of the country's history and attempting to forge a new, unified nation, not mass evacuations.

Thanks for the tread warning by the way, I'll keep my eyes open.

I said Fear genocide did not say it was going to happen, Trust me that's not taking lightly, No i have no huge evidence i discovered it and decided to post here to see what boards think on the matter. This is a discussion format yes or am i wrong in thinking that?.

MonaPizza

AllthingsCP wrote: »

TREAD WARNING.

South Africa has been slipping into the past in last few years, and many fear Genocide at its 6 level now feared it could reach level 7 or 8 anyday now.

Its Moral wrong for this to happen, This people have as much right to that land, They helped built that country.

Yeah, pimps have as much right to the hookers they own and beat.

riffmongous

P_1 wrote: »

True but you can't really be going around punishing people for the actions of those who were there before them though.

Having said that you do get the sense that when Mandela dies the place could get very unstable indeed, particularly when you look at the current leadership of the country

What is the solution for the colonial legacy though? 'You are rich because your great-grandfather came here and killed my great-grandfather and took his land, since then your family has been wealthy because of that land and my family poor." We saw the disaster that was the Mugabe land reclamations in Zimbabwe that destroyed the country's economy and led to the emigration of most of the white community. Is there any other way to address the 'injustice' or does it even really exist?

AllthingsCP

MonaPizza wrote: »

Yeah, pimps have as much right to the hookers they own and beat.

Stupid statement.

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Whether is whites here in Europe, America or Blacks in Africa its wrongs.

Racist Fear-mongering only go's so far till it becomes murder and state sanction murder 3000 dead farmers is not Racist Fear-mongering, Its murder, We are all aware of South African history and the tension that exist their, But why the step back into a bloody past.

...you realise that there is a murder rate of around 16,000 people per year in SA?

Who is going to carry out this genocide, might I ask?

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

...you realise that there is a murder rate of around 16,000 people per year in SA?

Your point?

the_syco

I have no problem with replacing a qualified white man with a qualified black man to win the hearts of the people.

However, from reading about the ongoing crap, it seems the white farmer is being replaced with the black farmer, and the farm suddenly goes to ****, as no-one knows how to manage it correctly.

I know of a couple of white people from SA, and although it's safe enough, walking to the shops, or to a friends a few streets away is viewed as an silly risk...!

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Your point?

3,000 dead farmers over a period is hardly that suprising, given such a high murder rate.

Again - who is supposedly going to carry out this genocide?

MonaPizza

Clandestine wrote: »

I have family in South Africa who are planning on moving because the country is beyond help. Basic services (clean running water, lighting etc.) are barely running, and most Government programs were better under apartheid funnily enough. What a shame. A race war will be the last nail in the coffin.

Bollocks. There are a lot of fools who say that Iraq is better now than it was under Saddam Hussein. Well it isn't. Millions dead, wounded or in foreign refugee camps. Hundreds still being blown to pieces each month. Schools, universities, hospitals, energy plants, factories wrecked.
But hey Saddam is dead so life is fcuking peachy.

The whites in South Africa don't run the show anymore. It's now one man one vote....you know....DEMOCRACY and they don't like it. Tough being a minority, ain't it? Their ancestors caused this problem and now they don't like the results. FCUK 'EM!

MonaPizza

MonaPizza wrote: »

Bollocks. There are a lot of fools who say that Iraq is better now than it was under Saddam Hussein. Well it isn't. Millions dead, wounded or in foreign refugee camps. Hundreds still being blown to pieces each month. Schools, universities, hospitals, energy plants, factories wrecked.
But hey Saddam is dead so life is fcuking peachy.

The whites in South Africa don't run the show anymore. It's now one man one vote....you know....DEMOCRACY and they don't like it. Tough being a minority, ain't it? Their ancestors caused this problem and now they don't like the results. FCUK 'EM!

Okay. Lets make 'em pay for the sins of their forebears. Let's nuke Germany while we're at it.

That'll teach 'em.

the_syco

MonaPizza wrote: »

The whites in South Africa don't run the show anymore. It's now one man one vote....you know....DEMOCRACY and they don't like it. Tough being a minority, ain't it? Their ancestors caused this problem and now they don't like the results. FCUK 'EM!

When you say "The whites in South Africa don't run the show anymore", which country are you referring to?

Hammar

MonaPizza wrote: »

Bollocks. There are a lot of fools who say that Iraq is better now than it was under Saddam Hussein. Well it isn't. Millions dead, wounded or in foreign refugee camps. Hundreds still being blown to pieces each month. Schools, universities, hospitals, energy plants, factories wrecked.
But hey Saddam is dead so life is fcuking peachy.

The whites in South Africa don't run the show anymore. It's now one man one vote....you know....DEMOCRACY and they don't like it. Tough being a minority, ain't it? Their ancestors caused this problem and now they don't like the results. FCUK 'EM!

Banned

You're a f**king idiot.

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

3,000 dead farmers over a period is hardly that suprising, given such a high murder rate.

Again - who is supposedly going to carry out this genocide?

Well Gaba {ANC} quoted When Mandela die's we will kill you whites like flies

“They can continue to whinge until they are blue in the face. They can continue to be as negative as they want to, or... they (whites) can simply leave this country...”
Charles Nqakula. 2006 ANC SA Minister of Safety & Security.

“My Machine gun".Kill the Boers" Jacob Zuma. 2006

People like this in power i would not feel to secure.

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Well Gaba {ANC} quoted When Mandela die's we will kill you whites like flies

A quote that seems to date back to 1997 from some gobshite?

More selective quotes?

They've been in power for over twenty years and that's the best you can do?

Dear o dear.

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

A quote that seems to date back to 1997 from some gobshite?

Trust me their more newer ones just google.

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Trust me their more newer ones just google.

Well funny enough this has come up before and - odd thing - all these quotes tend to be on white power, racist and/or Afrikaaner separatist sites. The other thing is that the one definite nasty piece of work who was most certainly worrying (Malema) was expelled from the ANC.

P_1

Nodin wrote: »

Well funny enough this has come up before and - odd thing - all these quotes tend to be on white power, racist and/or Afrikaaner separatist sites. The other thing is that the one definite nasty piece of work who was most certainly worrying (Malema) was expelled from the ANC.

Aye the moderate side of the ANC seem to be on top for now but the real wildcard is what will happen after the death of Mandela

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

Well funny enough this has come up before and - odd thing - all these quotes tend to be on white power, racist and/or Afrikaaner separatist sites. The other thing is that the one definite nasty piece of work who was most certainly worrying (Malema) was expelled from the ANC.

Who is this Guy?

Nodin

P_1 wrote: »

Aye the moderate side of the ANC seem to be on top for now but the real wildcard is what will happen after the death of Mandela

....I don't see why his death would make any difference. He's housebound, ill....he's 95 years old. If they wanted to ignore him they could.

And - taking the cynical view - the ANC and the rest know full well that state sponsored violence against the minority would leave them out in the cold for decades. Considering they've have had good economic growth over the last few years, I don't think they're going to jeopardise that.

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Who is this Guy?

SA president, singing a song.

When I hum the national anthem, or maybe sing it, does that mean I'm off to slaughter a few English?

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

SA president, singing a song.

When I hum the national anthem, or maybe sing it, does that mean I'm off to slaughter a few English?

Its inappropriate song coming from the leader, I don't believe the Irish National anthem mentions killing anyone.

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

AllthingsCP

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

wont help when the Government is promoting it either.

Nodin

AllthingsCP wrote: »

Its inappropriate song coming from the leader, I don't believe the Irish National anthem mentions killing anyone.

Well it goes on about being soldiers, fighting and 'out yonder the saxon foe'. We might be about to march out and give them taytos and hugs but the context doesn't really point to that.

You're digging up SA 'rebel' songs to try to point to genocide....you realise how weak that is?

MonaPizza

P_1 wrote: »

To be honest the worst of the Apartheid happened over a generation ago. It doesn't strike me as right that the current white generation of South Africans should be made to pay for the sins of their fathers.

Germans are still paying to Israel though, no?

These payments are coming from the Exchequer, i.e. the taxes of workers who weren't even born at the time of the Holocaust and that was THREE generations ago.

And Americans aren't paying a dime to the Vietnamese.

If you're going to cry "let bygones be bygones" then be consistent.

AllthingsCP

Nodin wrote: »

Well it goes on about being soldiers, fighting and 'out yonder the saxon foe'. We might be about to march out and give them taytos and hugs but the context doesn't really point to that.

You're digging up SA 'rebel' songs to try to point to genocide....you realise how weak that is?

God i hope i am wrong, But looking and reading and having a chat with people from SA and honestly when people have that much fear something must be up.