Revenue Tax Forms 12, 11, 11E - Smallholder

fearrchair

Neighbors received a tax form 12 earlier this year however their farm is very small and the income would be low and there is no requirement for an accountant etc. Also both husband and wife are pensioners.

At the moment they are concerned as the closing date is approaching at the end of the month.

The form seemed to be not for them so I printed out a form 11e and brought it over to them however we had to stop when it came to the incoming and outgoing section.

I am wondering is there some way of getting a wavier when the household income is low and the assets value are low (no slatted sheds or much machinery etc). I am wondering does this form need to be filled out at all.
Seems strange to be liable to pay self assessment tax on a low income household. Maybe they were just a sample or spot check.

Any one else get these forms and what did you do....I'm not sure if this is the correct forum I was going to post it in the taxation but as this is farming area people here might have had to face the same issue this year.

Oldtree

is there a phone number on the form? if not contact your local tax office asap to sort this out before the deadline passes. They are helpful on the phone. Have your neighbours never filled out or received a tax form in the past? very odd.

viztopia

do your neighbours receive any single farm payments etc? in the past there were a lot of farmers exempt from having to make returns as there income was so low but in the last number of years revenue have been sending out tax returns to a lot of old people who are in receipt of department payments

sandydan

The form seemed to be not for them so I printed out a form 11e and brought it over to them however we had to stop when it came to the incoming and outgoing section. Quote
Revenue make the destinations of forms very clear with prsi numbers and full title etc.So make sure it's theirs first.
it may have nothing to do with farm income, but if they have a farm income and haven't declared it some professional help may be advisable regardless to engage with revenue ASAP, I may be wrong, but revenue or social welfare are checking all pensioners to verify their entitlements, just in case have they another income such as private pension that will bring into tax net etc. similarly their entitlement to medical cards , that was announced before Xmas, in my opinion they may be looking for further funds with which to bail out their banker and investor friends and impress angel merciless with their ability to impoverish the old as well as,,,,,,,,,,,
As Oldtree said revenue officials are helpful

TomOnBoard

Oldtree wrote: »

is there a phone number on the form? if not contact your local tax office asap to sort this out before the deadline passes. They are helpful on the phone. Have your neighbours never filled out or received a tax form in the past? very odd.

There will be a phone number on the form. RING THEM!

DO NOT let this go beyond an expiry date without contacting Revenue. Otherwise, a €1500 fine will be AUTOMATICALLY sought by the local State Solicitor. Outrageous I know- and the kicker is that, the Judge cannot even hear your argument as a defendant- regardless of what you say, the Judge MUST impose the penalty if the proceedings have got that far. I know, coz I'm down €3000 already!!

lakill Farm

TomOnBoard wrote: »

There will be a phone number on the form. RING THEM!

DO NOT let this go beyond an expiry date without contacting Revenue. Otherwise, a €1500 fine will be AUTOMATICALLY sought by the local State Solicitor. Outrageous I know- and the kicker is that, the Judge cannot even hear your argument as a defendant- regardless of what you say, the Judge MUST impose the penalty if the proceedings have got that far. I know, coz I'm down €3000 already!!

Thats good advice. Call your local tax office and look to speak to someone in the Income tax section. They are normally very helpful

And once your talking to them, they normally wount start any legal actions

fearrchair

Just an update as what actually happened here in the end was that a visit to the citizens Advice people the man was unable to help. They called into the revenue office in Galway and I am told that the attitude was we don't fill out the forms or can't advise you. You need an accountant.
However we thought as the smallholding was so small it was hardly necessary.
Maybe they had a point if anything was wrong they you couldn't say they said anything.

In the end they left some of it blank and sent it, I thought it wasn't going to work and sure enough it arrived out again however this time there was a 14 day window and it had to be sent to Shannon / Limerick I think.
The revenue admin noted on the form a number of boxes (numbers ) what to fill in and put pensions here and equipment here, expenses etc.
I think a cover letter was sent with it explaining the couples circumstances.

Before they did anything more they just went to an Accountant who after an hour just filled out a number of sections, and send it from his office. Much relief was had coming home -)

I suppose it had some substance coming form an accountant office. He was also familiar with the terminology and what allowances and guideline figures could be put in different places.
I think there was also some confusion where the line was drawn between the household expenses and farm expenses without them losing out etc

Anyway letter arrived last week saying they are exempt from paying tax.
If another comes next year they won't be waiting until 31st Oct to sent it in tho...

No fine tho. I think that was one of the worries.

Keeping receipts better as well although the silage contractor has a preference for cash but we'll see.