Crossing the Callan by pass

foxcoverteddy

I might need some help with this one: as most people who live off the Callan by Pass know: during the rush hours it takes a while to cross, many do it by car which is reasonably easy; however crossing on foot, tricky, dodgy and down right dangerous; if you are not from Callan you may wonder why; well there is no facility for pedestrians whatsoever.
You may ask what the reason for starting a thread, well today we watched a girl of maybe 8 or 9 trying to cross with her cycle, round about 4.45, I think after 10 minutes she just managed to get across.
We have three schools on the town side of the by-pass and there are many children who have to cross; many come by car, in truth they have to, and are collected in the afternoon, most parents would definitely ban any child from attempting to ride to school.
We have all these promotions for bike riding, but we have no one looking after road safety, they have built a walk section on the other side of the by-pass so town people can enjoy walking with the benefit of a crash barrier, the people on the other side can, choose your own saying.
We are not talking adults here, our future generation. it seems we have politicians and councillors who have not got the guts or the balls to stand up for children in Callan.
Come election time they will be round asking for votes, the council is at the moment strengthening bridges, money that could be used to provide safe crossing for our children.
This might be a long drawn out thread but your support is really important.
Thank you for reading, Foxy

Odyssey 2005

Tunnel for callan.

Dozen Wicked Words

Have there been any accidents on that stretch of road? Not that that should decide whether action is taken, but will probably have a bearing on whether the council are likely to do anything or not.

Doff

Maybe an Aldi or Tesco would sort it?

road_high

Is there residential areas on the other side of the Callan bypass

Thought it was mainly two industrial estates.

Odyssey 2005

Doff wrote: »

Maybe an Aldi or Tesco would sort it?

Have an Aldi. Didn't you hear!!?:eek:

Threadhead

I had to cross it on foot a few months back. The fear of God would be in you.

Odyssey 2005

, I think after 10 minutes she just managed to get across.
So you stopped and watched a kid trying to cross a busy road for 10 mins and didnt try to help ?

foxcoverteddy

Yes super suggestions, it is reckoned Callan is one of the fastest growing towns in Ireland.
So do we wait until some unfortunate human being is mowed down by a fast moving trucker; or a speed crazed car driver; or should we take action now.
The tunnel idea is good because bridges are a bind for older people, the zig zag ramp is okay at least kids can cycle up it and down.
If we had another supermarket without doubt someone would have to act fast.
Yes, people do live on the other side of the by-pass, in fact quite a lot, there is a village just past Brett's and further on there are more houses.
Try one of the other roads and you get to Mullinahone, so there are plenty of people who need some action, and for those who are not particularly religous the Edmond rice centre is on the other side.
I am sorry we have moved on from Aldi or any other supermarket, so if you see an elderly man or woman waiting to cross the road near Bretts give them a thought, or even better give them a lift.
Pleasant dreams Foxy

Odyssey 2005

"so if you see an elderly man or woman waiting to cross the road near Bretts give them a thought, or even better give them a lift."

Foxy you should take your own advice.:mad:

foxcoverteddy

Do you thinkl I am totally mad, of course we gave a helping hand, seeing we were on the other side of the road we had to cross the race track to get back, you cannot wave cars down for them to slow, they ignore you. One need to drive along round about 8.45 and witness the madness, you can imagine the traffic with three schools adjacent to one another.
One other aspect the Callan by-pass is not a straight road it is an arc, coming from Kilkenny one can suddenly find a car emerging from the side road, no slow down signs, nothing, further up there is a great paint job, does nothing for road safety.
Do yourselves a favour come out and see for yourselves, by the way Aldi opens at 9am.
Sweet dreams, Foxy

Daemos

How about building a skyscraper? Or a 70,000-seater stadium? Wait, I know, a zoo. Yes, let's build a zoo. Because anything can be built if you just talk enough about it :rolleyes:

foxcoverteddy

Isn't this a sad reflection on society today, a serious subject which to anyone living the otherside of the by-pass would be a daily hazard and all we get is some cuckoo post's.
I think most of you should really be ashamed of the comments you have written, so much so I think that for one I have no further wish to be associated with you.

Cabaal

Dozen Wicked Words wrote: »

Have there been any accidents on that stretch of road? Not that that should decide whether action is taken, but will probably have a bearing on whether the council are likely to do anything or not.

Not that I'm aware of and certainly not with a person crossing the road yet as far as I'm aware.

I cross the road almost daily at Bretts, the old West Street road junction or at the start of the Bypass on the Clonmel road.

Have to say I've had to wait no more then 2-40sec's for a space to cross, foxy is taking the piss claiming a person had to wait 10min.

Autosport

Most areas around schools are going to be busy at school times maybe there should be the flashing lights with the slow down during school hours.

catbear

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

so much so I think that for one I have no further wish to be associated with you.

You've promised that a few times but you keep coming back!

We're family now, admit it foxy.

foxcoverteddy

I see we have not moved on, sorry Cabaal but your comment was out of order, and if you were old enough you might change your mind about walking across the by pass during the rush hour

road_high

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

I see we have not moved on, sorry Cabaal but your comment was out of order, and if you were old enough you might change your mind about walking across the by pass during the rush hour

He's right though? 10 mins to cross the Callan bypass does sound far fetched. Hardly the M50 is it?

foxcoverteddy

Well I have a friend who cannot run, he will not attempt to cross during the rush hour, where do you go, there is no centre island. It is fine after the mad rush, not a problem, perhaps a subway might help.
Hi Catbear, bruff?
Not being nasty on this but traffic will increase with our new found wealth and the by pass will get even worse, no one has died, probably can't afford it now, and truth is we don't even want an injury.
So to push for some sort of crossing makes sense, with a car it is not a problem, neither is it for normal grown ups.
If you don't reckon it come and have a look and try it, I might be very pro but your sincere and honest help might be just the thing.
As I said I would appreciate a genuine opinion.

road_high

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

Well I have a friend who cannot run, he will not attempt to cross during the rush hour, where do you go, there is no centre island. It is fine after the mad rush, not a problem, perhaps a subway might help.
Hi Catbear, bruff?
Not being nasty on this but traffic will increase with our new found wealth and the by pass will get even worse, no one has died, probably can't afford it now, and truth is we don't even want an injury.
So to push for some sort of crossing makes sense, with a car it is not a problem, neither is it for normal grown ups.
If you don't reckon it come and have a look and try it, I might be very pro but your sincere and honest help might be just the thing.
As I said I would appreciate a genuine opinion.

It's a national route that's a bypass. To stick a crossing on it would make a mockery of its main function. If it's as bad as you describe then an underground tunnel or footbridge for pedestrians is what's needed.

Cabaal

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

Not being nasty on this but traffic will increase with our new found wealth and the by pass will get even worse, no one has died, probably can't afford it now, and truth is we don't even want an injury.

Hang on, our new found wealth?

So you are expecting traffic on the bypass to somehow surpass the traffic we had during the celtic tiger years....remember, all that extra traffic from people working, builders, builder supplys etc.

Got any stats that show or support that traffic now is either higher or due to surpass the boom years on the N76?

Unless you do then in all honesty suggesting traffic will increase has no basis and expecting the council to spend money based on speculation only is a very very big ask.

So to push for some sort of crossing makes sense, with a car it is not a problem, neither is it for normal grown ups.

Unless the crossing is a bridge or tunnel it defeats the actual use of the bypass, as lights or a zebra crossing would affect traffic flow in a big way.

The amount of foot traffic any bridge or tunnel would get would never justify the construction costs, very few people that live on the other side of any of those roads walk.

In addition very few people walk to the westcourt industrial estate, most of the people that do walk are working in Callan Bacon.

I've never seen any of them wait more then a few seconds to cross so again it would be a awful waste.

foxcoverteddy

As you can see there is very little support from those living the other side of the by pass, is this because there is not anyone who reads Boards; or those that do have cars; and this is not an issue.
Yes the cost; it would be greater than the amount of use, if you treat the numbers as a priority?
As for statistics, no doubt somewhere there maybe an expectation of vehicular usage, it would in all probability be as reliable as the amount of traffic using Aldi, reason for the one way system in and out of the store.
You state about Callan bacon, if you had a crossing that far up in all honesty it would be useless to someone wanting to cross by Bretts.
Sorry about this but for the Waterford Motorway, subways were put in for farmers so that stock could move freely, fair comment but there was no guarantee the farmer was going to continue keeping stock?
No doubt one could cite stock was more important than people.
There is comment about this being a National Road, yes; and that any obstruction would be against the purpose of such a road, so what does the speed limit at Killamery, Ninemilehouse and Grangemocklar do, at Poulacaple there is a speed restriction when the school opens and closes,does this cause problems, we will go even further there is a speed restriction in West St for the school.
Now we already have a 50 limit and it is further reduced to 30 in West St
what we do not know is the usage from Bretts across the by-pass.
It is presumed that virtually all movements are by vehicles and the number of pedestrians is almost nil.
Are we therefore bound to accept that any minority cannot expect the council to spend any amount of money to safeguard them? Will their council tax be spent on the majority or are they entitled to a reduction for the lack of service.
As I have said perhaps Boards does not necessary reflect every aspect of a community, one last plea, what happens when the SLF factory site is put back into use and the window firm re-starts operations, will anyone shout for a crossing.
With no support then there is little point continuing, we will remain the deprived community outside Callan.
Foxy

Doff

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

With no support then there is little point continuing, we will remain the deprived community outside Callan.

This part is the best imo.

God forbid they reduce the speed limits in area's with homes or schools when a National road goes through them, would you be happier if they just had a flat 100 limit until the road ends? :rolleyes:

foxcoverteddy

Doff, not sure what you are saying, we have the 100 speed through the by-pass, even though it is a feeder road from schools to other parts of Callan, someone will say Bridge st, yes okay it becomes one way congested during the peak school times, the West St and mill st crossing equally, put a couple of artics or Bus eireann and it is fun, if you are not in a hurry. They did try stop cars parking in Bridge st, didn't work.
Do you remember when the, all traffic came down Bridge st and the whole place would come to a grinding halt, ah those were the days.

road_high

Doff wrote: »

This part is the best imo.

God forbid they reduce the speed limits in area's with homes or schools when a National road goes through them, would you be happier if they just had a flat 100 limit until the road ends? :rolleyes:

That's the whole point of National roads though. To get people from A to B as efficiently as possible. Putting speed limits everywhere destroys this. The Callan bypass was built to alleviate congestion, doesn't make sense to undo this by sticking limits and crossings everywhere. If it's a major problem for people then don't buy your house beside or in the path of a busy road.
An overpass or underground tunnel is a solution that would not impact on traffic flow.

foxcoverteddy

Is the N76 really a national road, come on from Kilkenny to Clonmel it is a nightmare road, the Callan by Pass adds very little to the argument A to B, though in fairness it has relieved the problem one had with Callan. However when it was built, remember who opened it, none other than the Cowan himself, no one gave a toss about those living the otherside of the road.
Build it as quickly as possible, apart from the top end the road is an arc, the Aldi turn off being particularly nasty during peak traffic.
The council have spent a great deal painting lines to help with the traffic flow, it does nothing for helping those who choose to cross this highway on foot.
Yes a tunnel at two places would alleviate any problem for sometime, if I say subway someone might add what about O'Briens. Joke, just in case
Foxy

road_high

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

Is the N76 really a national road, come on from Kilkenny to Clonmel it is a nightmare road, the Callan by Pass adds very little to the argument A to B, though in fairness it has relieved the problem one had with Callan. However when it was built, remember who opened it, none other than the Cowan himself, no one gave a toss about those living the otherside of the road.
Build it as quickly as possible, apart from the top end the road is an arc, the Aldi turn off being particularly nasty during peak traffic.
The council have spent a great deal painting lines to help with the traffic flow, it does nothing for helping those who choose to cross this highway on foot.
Yes a tunnel at two places would alleviate any problem for sometime, if I say subway someone might add what about O'Briens. Joke, just in case
Foxy

You reckon? Callan was a nightmare with it's narrow streets/bridge. If there was no bypass today the town would be absolutely gridlocked. Of course it's a major component of this route.

Callanutd

Have to agree with Road High. The bypass has had a huge impact. Previously it could have taken 30 minutes or more to get through callan between 4 and 5 each evening. If two lorries met in Bridge street then forget about going anywhere fast. Personally I dont see that there is a huge need for a crossing but then again I am on the town side of the bypass.

Cabaal

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

There is comment about this being a National Road, yes; and that any obstruction would be against the purpose of such a road, so what does the speed limit at Killamery, Ninemilehouse and Grangemocklar do, at Poulacaple there is a speed restriction when the school opens and closes,does this cause problems, we will go even further there is a speed restriction in West St for the school.
Now we already have a 50 limit and it is further reduced to 30 in West St
what we do not know is the usage from Bretts across the by-pass.
It is presumed that virtually all movements are by vehicles and the number of pedestrians is almost nil.
Foxy

What??

The reason for the n76 Callan bypass was to avoid Callan and traffic jams or slow downs, the ONLY reason why traffic has to slow down at any of the locations you've mentioned is because they don't have any bypass.

If they had a bypass then the bypass would have a limit of 100km and the places in question would keep the low speed limit.

Cabaal

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

They did try stop cars parking in Bridge st, didn't work.
Do you remember when the, all traffic came down Bridge st and the whole place would come to a grinding halt, ah those were the days.

After the bypass was built they council never completed Bridge Street like it was planned, they were due to put lined parking spaces (one or two) and a lined parking bay across from Powers, but they never did this.

Instead they coped out and double yellow lined the street, these lines were then later removed during the filming of breakfast on pluto and were never put back.

If anything people have become awful lazy in bridge street when it comes to parking, one example of this is the complete tools that park on the bridge. Something that never ever would have happened before the bypass was built.

The other issue here being that Gardai have never enforced proper parking in Callan, you've only to look outside Supervalue, the bus stop and outside St Mary's for examples of people that just don't give a monkeys about anyone else.

In relation to the comment that the bypass adds very little to the argument A to B then you really need to check back and remember what the traffic was like in Callan and especially Bridge Street.

Without the bypass people would still be adding 10min+ to their journey time and we'd still be looking at this almost every few minutes

foxcoverteddy

Yes, you are right, well nearly, a neighbour of ours got a ticket for parking in the bus stop the other day, it is quite a problem for the Gardi, again Bridge St is a council cop out.
I understand what everyone is saying about the traffic etc; however this is about providing a facility for pedestrians to walk across the by-pass during the peak hours, yes there many be very few but is our society about providing for the majority and ignore all the other's.
Now give you a problem, we have a cycle path round the ring road, well what there is of it, how many cyclist use it during the week days and does this alter at weekends?
They had a be tter lobby than Callan perhaps, given the population of Kilkenny was it built for the few?
Perhaps we need a lobby for the few? In reality it is more about social conscience, if it does not affect you, so what one or two people are irrevelent.
Disabled parking in Callan, joke perhaps?
But thanks at least we might not achieve anything.
Foxy

Meathlass

Rush hour in Callan ... I've heard it all now :rolleyes:

I commute on the Callan bypass twice a day, 5 days a week for the last 7 years. I think I've only ever seen someone cross the road once and they were a jogger. It would be ridiculous to reduce the speed limit from 100kph. There's no houses or shops on the bypass compared with ninemilehouse and grangemockler which is why they have restricted limits.

I presume that 10 year old took so long to cross as she was too cautious and couldn't judge the traffic speed properly. Seems a young age to let someone negotiate a main road like that.

catbear

What next, a campaign for a bypass to bypass the bypass?

foxcoverteddy

I ask if the Callan by pass is safe to do 100k during the rush hour, my limited driving ability is such that I doubt if I have exceeded 80k's, I would have thought the turn off's create dilemma's for fast moving traffic.
If one is happy at that speed then so be it, but there is not a lot of space.
As for the other places with limits, Poulacapple is trying to slow down traffic for the children, if this was on the by pass for say three quarters of an hour it is not going to delay anyone is it.
I just think that because no one see's anyone attempting to cross the by pass it is okay, even animals keep away, the word is out.
Yes I think the road is too dangerous for a youngster to cross, and speed is difficult to judge.
I don't think my little fiat will do 100k.

foxcoverteddy

just a quickie, have you clocked some of the artics from the north, scarey.
Despite the restrictions there have been accidents in Grangemockler, remember the two truckers who drowned on the bridge there is a plaque to their memory RIP and the schoolgirl on the crossing RIP. Just drive safely and look out for Catbears pussy.

Cabaal

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

I ask if the Callan by pass is safe to do 100k during the rush hour, my limited driving ability is such that I doubt if I have exceeded 80k's, I would have thought the turn off's create dilemma's for fast moving traffic.
If one is happy at that speed then so be it, but there is not a lot of space.

Road is more then suitable for the 100km speedlimit,
Turn offs could be abit better, but they work fine provided people use them correctly.

Of course the standard of many people's driving in this country leaves alot to be desired so more often then not you have people that don't indicate etc, but thats another matter.

As for the other places with limits, Poulacapple is trying to slow down traffic for the children, if this was on the by pass for say three quarters of an hour it is not going to delay anyone is it.
.

I think we've covered this already,
Poulacapple and the likes are not bypassed and as such they will have speed limits for this reason.

The same as the N76 would if it still went through Bridge Street and Green Street.

The Callan Bypass portion of the N76 has no direct entrances to houses, schools or businesses onto it for this reason, infact nothing will get planning from the council if they request this.

The only exception to this are entrances to fields, but traffic comes from these only once every so often so they are not an issue.

This is to ensure that traffic can flow smoothly without it dropping down to a 60 or 50km zone, putting in a crossing of any sort across the road that isn't a bridge or tunnel would mean that there would have to be a 50 or 60km zone put in on the bypass.

In all honesty you need to look at this realistically and i don't think you are, the costs associated with land purchase etc for a tunnel would be just silly to make even one crossing.

If you installed one at Bretts odds are it would also be susceptible to flooding as there's actually a small river/stream running under that road just beside the junction.

The costs associated with a bridge again would just be silly especially considering the usage it would receive. You try to use Kilkenny as an example as to something that you "believe" doesn't get much usage. But in all honesty lets look at population.

Callan:
Population (2006)[1]
• Town 1,771
• Urban 1,489
• Rural 281

Kilkenny City
Population (2011)[1]
• Total 24,423
• Borough 8,711
• Environs 15,712

Now Callan has likely gone up abit since 2006 but its still no where near as much as Kilkenny would be. stuff at the end of the day has to be cost affective and it has to make sense usage wise.

foxcoverteddy

Yes, of course you are correct in every aspect of your post, even down to the stream by Bretts. On a cost basis it most certainly would not make economic sense.
From what one can tell the amount of usage would be negligible; I guess in this financial turmoil money might be better spent on other projects.
You quote the standard of driving, legislation has improved the standard, okay there are jokers who still use mobile phones, the worst being those who find it difficult to drive at the speed limit appropriate to the road, though; my belief is that it might be within the law to drive at say 100k's it is not necessarily compatible with the prevailing traffic conditions.
But so be it for me to tell people to suck eggs.
Rest my case and will conclude the thread, but thank you all, it was good fun
Foxy

Wimbago

Cabaal wrote: »

Reminds me of being stuck in one of the doorways on Bridge for nearly 3 hours one day after school while a bus and a lorry tried to check which one what made of a denser material.

Saying the by-pass doesn't add anything to the journey past or through the town is just wrong on so many levels it renders the validity of some of the other points raised something to aimless rambling. Shame really there probably is some merit to it, just not on the scale talked about.

The known accidents that have occurred were mainly down to the line markings at Haggartsgreen which were amended ~8 years ago. Speeding and bad driving can't be attributed a fault of any road.

Sure we'd have no Aldi without our lovely by-pass :pac: The exit there is likely to be more dangerous than anywhere with the changes to the line markings coming in from the Kilkenny side. Time will tell in that regard

foxcoverteddy

No I am not digging under the by pass, and no I am not taking whatever cabaal thinks, around the three schools there are no traffic regulations of 30kmh, it is 50 standard.
There has not been a major accident on the by pass thank goodness, some good near misses, but they do not count.
The truth is that the by pass is badly planned, plenty of paint.
Sorry