Dublin announce new Megabucks Sponsorship deal

freddiek

I don't think it is a great post, more of an emotional rant. The thread is about finance and the recent bump was relevant to that but as Leo has raised other questions, I'll address them.

" In some areas of Dublin where unemployment is very high the G.A.A is all the lifeline of the community and in many cases holding them together as some areas have zero facilities, serious crime and drug problems. They have to use pitchs not fit for purpose and no dressing rooms "

I don't accept that that is true. In fact I completely disagree. Dublin GAA is very middle-class actually as I see it. A lot of people in the areas you mention wouldn't be able to give you directions to the local club or know the name of it even. The GAA no matter where you go is family-oriented and thats why you have generations of fathers and sons on teams and this doesn't happen to any great extent in working class-areas. What strong GAA clubs are there in Dublin working-class areas?? and Ballymun Kickhams is an easy answer but its not true. That club is middle-class as well regardless of the name.

"Dublin have tried many things over the years to improve juvenile games and invested heavily in coaching. They have as has been pointed out been lucky to have Mick O'Grady, Humphrey Kelliher, Gerry Harrington work in Dublin, raise their families here, Gerry's son Dermot played senior football for Dublin. The GAA was their connection with home. I heard Michael O'Grady talk of coaching workshops 30 years ago and it was laughed. Brendan Harpur from Tyrone running courses with Brian Talty back in 1983/4. Quite a few who done that course are still involved with teams."

The huge contribution of outsiders to Dublin GAA success is not often mentioned by Dubs but I'm glad that you have done so. However this can be justifiably resented in other counties which lose these top-class people to Dublin because of the economic situation. If you looked at the Dublin hurling and football panels you would see that the lion's share of players have rural parents and this is where they get their grounding in GAA. They didn't just turn up at their local club some day and realised they were good at it. They were brought there weeknights and weekends by their parents who played the games growing up in their towns/villages.

Realt Dearg Sec

freddiek wrote: »

I don't think it is a great post, more of an emotional rant. The thread is about finance and the recent bump was relevant to that but as Leo has raised other questions, I'll address them.

" In some areas of Dublin where unemployment is very high the G.A.A is all the lifeline of the community and in many cases holding them together as some areas have zero facilities, serious crime and drug problems. They have to use pitchs not fit for purpose and no dressing rooms "

I don't accept that that is true. In fact I completely disagree. Dublin GAA is very middle-class actually as I see it. A lot of people in the areas you mention wouldn't be able to give you directions to the local club or know the name of it even. The GAA no matter where you go is family-oriented and thats why you have generations of fathers and sons on teams and this doesn't happen to any great extent in working class-areas. What strong GAA clubs are there in Dublin working-class areas?? and Ballymun Kickhams is an easy answer but its not true. That club is middle-class as well regardless of the name.

"Dublin have tried many things over the years to improve juvenile games and invested heavily in coaching. They have as has been pointed out been lucky to have Mick O'Grady, Humphrey Kelliher, Gerry Harrington work in Dublin, raise their families here, Gerry's son Dermot played senior football for Dublin. The GAA was their connection with home. I heard Michael O'Grady talk of coaching workshops 30 years ago and it was laughed. Brendan Harpur from Tyrone running courses with Brian Talty back in 1983/4. Quite a few who done that course are still involved with teams."

The huge contribution of outsiders to Dublin GAA success is not often mentioned by Dubs but I'm glad that you have done so. However this can be justifiably resented in other counties which lose these top-class people to Dublin because of the economic situation. If you looked at the Dublin hurling and football panels you would see that the lion's share of players have rural parents and this is where they get their grounding in GAA. They didn't just turn up at their local club some day and realised they were good at it. They were brought there weeknights and weekends by their parents who played the games growing up in their towns/villages.

Wow, you really have demonstrated incredibly effectively that you know absolutely nothing about Dublin GAA. To couch that ignorance in such absolute confidence in your assertions is really brilliant.

Pro Hoc Vice

BPKS wrote: »

Funny that a company who got an $85 billion bailout from the US government in 2008 can go around sponsoring Man Utd and Dublin GAA.

It would be the equivalent of Anglo Irish Bank sponsoring Swansea City and the Ospreys today.

Unlike Anglo AIG repaid all the money plus a profit to US so they can spend how they want.

corny

freddiek wrote: »

I don't think it is a great post, more of an emotional rant. The thread is about finance and the recent bump was relevant to that but as Leo has raised other questions, I'll address them.

" In some areas of Dublin where unemployment is very high the G.A.A is all the lifeline of the community and in many cases holding them together as some areas have zero facilities, serious crime and drug problems. They have to use pitchs not fit for purpose and no dressing rooms "

I don't accept that that is true. In fact I completely disagree. Dublin GAA is very middle-class actually as I see it. A lot of people in the areas you mention wouldn't be able to give you directions to the local club or know the name of it even. The GAA no matter where you go is family-oriented and thats why you have generations of fathers and sons on teams and this doesn't happen to any great extent in working class-areas. What strong GAA clubs are there in Dublin working-class areas?? and Ballymun Kickhams is an easy answer but its not true. That club is middle-class as well regardless of the name.

"Dublin have tried many things over the years to improve juvenile games and invested heavily in coaching. They have as has been pointed out been lucky to have Mick O'Grady, Humphrey Kelliher, Gerry Harrington work in Dublin, raise their families here, Gerry's son Dermot played senior football for Dublin. The GAA was their connection with home. I heard Michael O'Grady talk of coaching workshops 30 years ago and it was laughed. Brendan Harpur from Tyrone running courses with Brian Talty back in 1983/4. Quite a few who done that course are still involved with teams."

The huge contribution of outsiders to Dublin GAA success is not often mentioned by Dubs but I'm glad that you have done so. However this can be justifiably resented in other counties which lose these top-class people to Dublin because of the economic situation. If you looked at the Dublin hurling and football panels you would see that the lion's share of players have rural parents and this is where they get their grounding in GAA. They didn't just turn up at their local club some day and realised they were good at it. They were brought there weeknights and weekends by their parents who played the games growing up in their towns/villages.

I've heard you beat this drum many times but can i ask you, why does any of that matter?

GAA in Dublin is played by the middle classes, every Dublin players has country parents etc. Even if its true why do you care so much?

LeoB

freddiek wrote: »

I don't think it is a great post, more of an emotional rant. The thread is about finance and the recent bump was relevant to that but as Leo has raised other questions, I'll address them.

" In some areas of Dublin where unemployment is very high the G.A.A is all the lifeline of the community and in many cases holding them together as some areas have zero facilities, serious crime and drug problems. They have to use pitchs not fit for purpose and no dressing rooms "

I don't accept that that is true. In fact I completely disagree. Dublin GAA is very middle-class actually as I see it. A lot of people in the areas you mention wouldn't be able to give you directions to the local club or know the name of it even. The GAA no matter where you go is family-oriented and thats why you have generations of fathers and sons on teams and this doesn't happen to any great extent in working class-areas. What strong GAA clubs are there in Dublin working-class areas?? and Ballymun Kickhams is an easy answer but its not true. That club is middle-class as well regardless of the name.

"Dublin have tried many things over the years to improve juvenile games and invested heavily in coaching. They have as has been pointed out been lucky to have Mick O'Grady, Humphrey Kelliher, Gerry Harrington work in Dublin, raise their families here, Gerry's son Dermot played senior football for Dublin. The GAA was their connection with home. I heard Michael O'Grady talk of coaching workshops 30 years ago and it was laughed. Brendan Harpur from Tyrone running courses with Brian Talty back in 1983/4. Quite a few who done that course are still involved with teams."

The huge contribution of outsiders to Dublin GAA success is not often mentioned by Dubs but I'm glad that you have done so. However this can be justifiably resented in other counties which lose these top-class people to Dublin because of the economic situation. If you looked at the Dublin hurling and football panels you would see that the lion's share of players have rural parents and this is where they get their grounding in GAA. They didn't just turn up at their local club some day and realised they were good at it. They were brought there weeknights and weekends by their parents who played the games growing up in their towns/villages.

If I went on an emotional rant I would be banned fro here as I have been before. Its fact.
Any Dublin person on here can go to their local club and name country people who have made a huge contribution to their communities, nothing emotional there just fact. My club has numerous country folk involved and we would be lost without them.

I would not term the G.A.A in Dublin as middle class. It is played in some middle class areas but by and large it is a working mans game. Its late days really, the last 20 years that the middle class areas have come to the fore again showing your lack of knowledge of the scene and this was on the back of the development of big estates in South and west Dublin in the 60s and 70s. I didnt want to mention any particular clubs but as you mentioned Ballymun kickhams They do great work in some of the areas of Ballymun where there are serious problem. as have Setanta hurling club who have had a very positive effect around Ballymun. Add to the list of clubs in working class areas, Erins Isle in Finglas, St. Josephs O'Connell boys Dublin 1 to 3 , O'Tooles, formerly of Seville place, sheriff street but now Dublin 17 Darndale, Belcamp, Croi Ro Naoife, Thomas Davis in Tallaght, Kevin hurling club Dublin 8, Good Council Dublin 12 to name just a few.

You have little knowledge of the real scene in Dublin. Go to areas that were developed in the last 15 - 20 years in part of Dublin 15,17, 20, 22, 24 where massive sprawling estates with no facilities were built and you see what the G.A.A has done. I know team mentors who are in a few cases as close to social workers as you get. I might dislike them for the hour of a game but the admiration I would have for a lot of these guys far outweighs the hour I dislike.

The contribution made by country folk is quite often recognised by clubs and communities and I can point to instances where people from the country didnt want to be recognised or recieve awards as "outsiders" they wanted to be part of the local community and only wanted to be recognised as that. And I have not heard the role of these "outsiders" resented anywhere and I get around Ireland quite a bit. But there is a begrudging streak in some people? My mother god rest her always said begrudgery was the biggest killer in Ireland, she might have been right.

In my community which some would say is a well off area, (there are people around who are well healed) I see every day the hugely positive impact our G.A.A. club has had on our community. Without the G.A.A as the focal point of our community I have no doubt we would have more anti-social behaviour and the trouble this can bring were it not for our club where people put in huge time on a voluntary basis so I would say in some cases we are the community.

So back to the finance. Any cuts to Dublin G.A.A. funding is nothing only an attack on marginalised communities in certain areas of the capital where the GAA do more for the people than any government agency. Areas that were developed without facilities, FACT that turned to serious crime, FACT. These communities have no chance to raise finance to improve their appeal in their communities or even buy jerseys or footballs. Again Dublin people on here will know that and its vital this is recognised when funding is being allocated.

If the GAA want to look at funding they should put in place a building programme to provide basic dressing rooms in some areas or even a hall that can be used as dressing rooms and a centre for clubs to bring kids to. This would have a very positive knock on effect.

freddiek

LeoB wrote: »

If I went on an emotional rant I would be banned fro here as I have been before. Its fact.
Any Dublin person on here can go to their local club and name country people who have made a huge contribution to their communities, nothing emotional there just fact. My club has numerous country folk involved and we would be lost without them.

I would not term the G.A.A in Dublin as middle class. It is played in some middle class areas but by and large it is a working mans game. Its late days really, the last 20 years that the middle class areas have come to the fore again showing your lack of knowledge of the scene and this was on the back of the development of big estates in South and west Dublin in the 60s and 70s. I didnt want to mention any particular clubs but as you mentioned Ballymun kickhams They do great work in some of the areas of Ballymun where there are serious problem. as have Setanta hurling club who have had a very positive effect around Ballymun. Add to the list of clubs in working class areas, Erins Isle in Finglas, St. Josephs O'Connell boys Dublin 1 to 3 , O'Tooles, formerly of Seville place, sheriff street but now Dublin 17 Darndale, Belcamp, Croi Ro Naoife, Thomas Davis in Tallaght, Kevin hurling club Dublin 8, Good Council Dublin 12 to name just a few.

You have little knowledge of the real scene in Dublin. Go to areas that were developed in the last 15 - 20 years in part of Dublin 15,17, 20, 22, 24 where massive sprawling estates with no facilities were built and you see what the G.A.A has done. I know team mentors who are in a few cases as close to social workers as you get. I might dislike them for the hour of a game but the admiration I would have for a lot of these guys far outweighs the hour I dislike.

The contribution made by country folk is quite often recognised by clubs and communities and I can point to instances where people from the country didnt want to be recognised or recieve awards as "outsiders" they wanted to be part of the local community and only wanted to be recognised as that. And I have not heard the role of these "outsiders" resented anywhere and I get around Ireland quite a bit. But there is a begrudging streak in some people? My mother god rest her always said begrudgery was the biggest killer in Ireland, she might have been right.

In my community which some would say is a well off area, (there are people around who are well healed) I see every day the hugely positive impact our G.A.A. club has had on our community. Without the G.A.A as the focal point of our community I have no doubt we would have more anti-social behaviour and the trouble this can bring were it not for our club where people put in huge time on a voluntary basis so I would say in some cases we are the community.

So back to the finance. Any cuts to Dublin G.A.A. funding is nothing only an attack on marginalised communities in certain areas of the capital where the GAA do more for the people than any government agency. Areas that were developed without facilities, FACT that turned to serious crime, FACT. These communities have no chance to raise finance to improve their appeal in their communities or even buy jerseys or footballs. Again Dublin people on here will know that and its vital this is recognised when funding is being allocated.

If the GAA want to look at funding they should put in place a building programme to provide basic dressing rooms in some areas or even a hall that can be used as dressing rooms and a centre for clubs to bring kids to. This would have a very positive knock on effect.

Excellent post Leo. Not that i agree with everything you say though.

The first part of it which I have highlighted is interesting. This is the type of statement that has got me pelter's and dogs abuse from numerous posters in the past but i feel vindicated now on foot of your frank admission. Many of my adversaries downplay the extent of your country cousins' work in Dublin gaa but you have unashamedly highlighted it. good to see.

you mention a load of clubs in which good work is being done by volunteers but in fairness I did say "strong clubs" and none of these would appear to in that good health to me. I mistakenly overlooked Erins Isle in my earlier post. They'd have some great times in the 90s with the Barrs and Redmond et al but have done nothing in recent years.

"And I have not heard the role of these "outsiders" resented anywhere and I get around Ireland quite a bit"

This quote puzzles me as i would have thought it quite obvious that the importation of outsiders to Dublin clubs causes resentment both within and outside Dublin. I recently read Dessie Farrell's book and the section where he mentions that Na Fianna's decison to recruit top outsiders caused a fair bit of friction in the club interested me. They subsequently won i think 3 dublin SFCs as the "League of Nations" and qualified for an All-Ireland club final so he could stand over the decision in the end.
but the club members knew that the playing opportunities for locals and younger members would be curtailed and so they were. for a lot of people in the GAA the idea of bringing in outsiders is heresy but Na Fianna went even further and seemed to have a deliberate recruitment policy so its not altogether surprising that they attracted their fair share of knockers in that very successful period.

in relation to your appeal re. Finance, I simply can't believe that Dublin GAA clubs lack good facilities at least relative to what other counties have to put up with so i can't agree with you there. Could it be the case that the county board are not allocating their huge resources in the most fair and equitable fashion??

RoyalCelt

Leo I don't agree with a lot of what Freddie says but I strongly disagree with 1 thing you said. "Dublin need more funding and other counties need to buck up".

Why not let other counties with way less funding than Dublin get more funding and let Dublin with so many resources buck up and find the extra funds themselves?

Royal Legend

LeoB wrote: »

Some very good points made here apart from Freddick who posts are simply pathetic.

Dublin got a great deal with AIG and it is badly needed. I know this from being involved with the club scene in Dublin all my life. The amount of work being put in at underage level has to be seen to be believed, no one can do it justice here really. I am from a rural club and we think we have it tough but I work with a few lads from Dublin city clubs and the problems they have are on a different level and they need all the funding help they can get. In some areas of Dublin where unemployment is very high the G.A.A is all the lifeline of the community and in many cases holding them together as some areas have zero facilities, serious crime and drug problems. They have to use pitchs not fit for purpose and no dressing rooms. They have no means of fundraising and need help with hurleys and helmets and equipment. It would be disgraceful if funding to these clubs were cut. This problem is only getting worse.

There are lots of outside people helping with various sections of the GAA all over Ireland. The GAA is the lifeline for a lot of these people who have had to move for work. They can go down the road be welcomed into a club and feel part of a community. To me this is vital part of Irish life.

The level of begrudgery from some quarters here is unbelievable towards what Dublin has achieved. I have been involved on the outside of a few development squads and see what work is being done and its unreal the time and effort people are giving. There is no real reason why a number of other counties cant do the same but the inhouse fighting and back stabbing is unreal. Look at the mess Mayo have had in recent weeks, and most counties have have had crap at some stage to deal with. Iv seen lads at meetings in Dublin and in my club take stripes off each other but still working together. That is a huge part of the success Dublin have had. People will fight for what they believe is right and then move on, yes there have been a few internal rows that dragged on but by and large nothing like yarns Iv heard from other counties. Dublin have tried many things over the years to improve juvenile games and invested heavily in coaching. They have as has been pointed out been lucky to have Mick O'Grady, Humphrey Kelliher, Gerry Harrington work in Dublin, raise their families here, Gerry's son Dermot played senior football for Dublin. The GAA was their connection with home. I heard Michael O'Grady talk of coaching workshops 30 years ago and it was laughed. Brendan Harpur from Tyrone running courses with Brian Talty back in 1983/4. Quite a few who done that course are still involved with teams.
My own club have set standards on paper if you want to coach a team. You must do GAA coaching course at minimum every 2 years, child protection etc and you will get support from the club also. Were put in place various workshops a few times a year so mentors parents and players know we are serious about it and they buy into it. Dublin do the same just on a bigger scale

Dublin will get stronger but it will take another few years and then we will have the calls for split Dublin just like we have with Kerry for football and Kilkenny and Cork for hurling.

I would imagine when AIG or a big company like them come in and see what Andy Kettle, John Costello and various committees are doing in Dublin and the contribution they make to make Dublin a top sporting brand and all round better place it is good business to be involved.

Dublin needs an increase in funding and some other counties need to get up of their arse and put in the work instead of moaning about Dublin it would serve them better.Have proper juvenile leagues, set standards for coachs, run their club games properly and they will in time improve

As a Proud Meath Man, I have to agree with the comments above. I live down the country and am involved with underage hurling. For the last 20 years I have been watching Dublin underage clubs and underage county development squads and have watched their standard improve year on year.
This is not down to money, its down to coaching and people giving their time to learn how to coach to a high level and then implementing it.
Money does not make you a better hurler or footballer, yes it helps with facilities and preparation, but it does not make you more skilful, coaching and practice does that.
Also, there are 32 counties in Ireland, with a population of approx. 5m and one fifth (1/5th) of that population lives in Dublin, so of course it gets and deserves more money.

P.S. I will also be hoping that my own Royal County, will lower the Dublin colours over the next few years.

gaffer91

LeoB, the things you mention re GAA clubs in Dublin being the lifeblood of the community are not exclusive to Dublin. That's also the case in many other counties around the country.

Do Dublin get too much money? You bet your bottom dollar they do. They already have the massive inbuilt population advantage and the absurd level of funding they get simply rubs salt into the wounds. I'm personally in favour of splitting Dublin in two to help level the playing field.

LeoB

freddiek wrote: »

Excellent post Leo. Not that i agree with everything you say though.

The first part of it which I have highlighted is interesting. This is the type of statement that has got me pelter's and dogs abuse from numerous posters in the past but i feel vindicated now on foot of your frank admission. Many of my adversaries downplay the extent of your country cousins' work in Dublin gaa but you have unashamedly highlighted it. good to see.

you mention a load of clubs in which good work is being done by volunteers but in fairness I did say "strong clubs" and none of these would appear to in that good health to me. I mistakenly overlooked Erins Isle in my earlier post. They'd have some great times in the 90s with the Barrs and Redmond et al but have done nothing in recent years.

"And I have not heard the role of these "outsiders" resented anywhere and I get around Ireland quite a bit"

This quote puzzles me as i would have thought it quite obvious that the importation of outsiders to Dublin clubs causes resentment both within and outside Dublin. I recently read Dessie Farrell's book and the section where he mentions that Na Fianna's decison to recruit top outsiders caused a fair bit of friction in the club interested me. They subsequently won i think 3 dublin SFCs as the "League of Nations" and qualified for an All-Ireland club final so he could stand over the decision in the end.
but the club members knew that the playing opportunities for locals and younger members would be curtailed and so they were. for a lot of people in the GAA the idea of bringing in outsiders is heresy but Na Fianna went even further and seemed to have a deliberate recruitment policy so its not altogether surprising that they attracted their fair share of knockers in that very successful period.

in relation to your appeal re. Finance, I simply can't believe that Dublin GAA clubs lack good facilities at least relative to what other counties have to put up with so i can't agree with you there. Could it be the case that the county board are not allocating their huge resources in the most fair and equitable fashion??

I should have been clearer in my post above when I say "outsiders". I was talking about people who come in join a club not these mercenaries who who go glory hunting. I would say when Na Fianna were bringing in the outsiders they got very little respect from anyone in the Dublin club scene. I am totally opposed to going chasing players to that extent, as was alleged back then.

RoyalCelt wrote: »

Leo I don't agree with a lot of what Freddie says but I strongly disagree with 1 thing you said. "Dublin need more funding and other counties need to buck up".

Why not let other counties with way less funding than Dublin get more funding and let Dublin with so many resources buck up and find the extra funds themselves?

Firstly I didnt mean my comment to be condescending. I have witnessed first hand the sh1t that goes on in other counties. People need to leave their egos outside when they get involved in coaching and games development especially when it comes to juvenile games promotion. It is well know in some counties the politics that goes on at all levels. You would not get away with that in Dublin but some Dubs would disagree, I'm not involved at committee level as a delegate so that could have changed. But other counties have the people well qualified to coach at a decent level but for some reason they don't. Other counties would also be much better able to compete if the club was not king. In some counties the club scene is more important that the county team. The club scene is strong in Dublin but lads are queuing up for a chance to play with any county team.

Royal Legend wrote: »

As a Proud Meath Man, I have to agree with the comments above. I live down the country and am involved with underage hurling. For the last 20 years I have been watching Dublin underage clubs and underage county development squads and have watched their standard improve year on year.
This is not down to money, its down to coaching and people giving their time to learn how to coach to a high level and then implementing it.
Money does not make you a better hurler or footballer, yes it helps with facilities and preparation, but it does not make you more skilful, coaching and practice does that.
Also, there are 32 counties in Ireland, with a population of approx. 5m and one fifth (1/5th) of that population lives in Dublin, so of course it gets and deserves more money.

P.S. I will also be hoping that my own Royal County, will lower the Dublin colours over the next few years.

This is the real point of it. My club gets very little funding, we dont look for much anyway but our relative success is down to people who are totally focused on coaching. Its their buzz where others get it being on committees. They spend hours with kids developing the basic skills. My daughter is on a camogie development squad and the time the coachs put in amazing. I thought my 3 nights coaching was a lot but these people with little resources are amazing in what are doing and none of what they do is down to money.

The way clubs like Kiltale, Killoyon, Trim Kilmessen and others are going Hurling will improve in the Royal county and it would be great to see.

gaffer91 wrote: »

LeoB, the things you mention re GAA clubs in Dublin being the lifeblood of the community are not exclusive to Dublin. That's also the case in many other counties around the country.

Do Dublin get too much money? You bet your bottom dollar they do. They already have the massive inbuilt population advantage and the absurd level of funding they get simply rubs salt into the wounds. I'm personally in favour of splitting Dublin in two to help level the playing field.

I take it then you are in favour of Kerry being split in 2 for football? Kilkenny, Tipperary and Cork in the hurling? Cork into about 10 in ladies football;)

No one is saying the problems are exclusive to Dublin but the problems encountered in some areas of Dublin are simply horrendous, There is no other county or clubs that encounter what some Dublin clubs have to encounter. Pitchs wrecked by joyriders, broken glass, left overs from drinks parties, they walk the grounds to ensure no of the paraphernalia from drugs are left for kids to pick up.
These clubs need serious financial support and any cuts to funding for Dublin will have a serious effect on these clubs and no one but a begrudger would look for a cut that would harm club like these.

BonnieSituation

Reading through this thread is gas. I love how having a huge population is seen as an overwhelming advantage without most where who criticise Dublin considering how much money it costs to service all the clubs that ore required. There's a huge overall population in Dublin but are all 1.3m or whatever inrterested in GAA? No they're not. On that basis we Antrim would be tearing it up in Ulster. And we all know why that's not the case.

Level the playing field? 3 All-Irelands in 30 years? Some of you guys need a reality check. The Meath lad above called it.

LeoB

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Reading through this thread is gas. I love how having a huge population is seen as an overwhelming advantage without most where who criticise Dublin considering how much money it costs to service all the clubs that ore required. There's a huge overall population in Dublin but are all 1.3m or whatever inrterested in GAA? No they're not. On that basis we Antrim would be tearing it up in Ulster. And we all know why that's not the case.

Level the playing field? 3 All-Irelands in 30 years? Some of you guys need a reality check. The Meath lad above called it.

Good post. I never mentioned the competition around Dublin for kids to play. There is serious pressure on clubs to provide a good service and in fairness most respond well.

On reflection of my own clubs challenges, like many others I hasten to add.
We have serious competition from other sports but our focus has been to work with what we have and maximise it. We have another club in our town which won 2 all Ireland juvenile titles in their game this year, we have local lads playing league of Ireland, we have had lads over with premiership clubs in UK and Scotland, we have a strong local golf club, quite a few playing Rugby etc all pulling from the one pool and from what I can come up with we are in competition with 22 other clubs in our parish.

In G.A.A. terms we are doing well in all codes without big money or sponsors. We won our first Senior B football championship on Monday night, have minor hurling s/f this weekend, a camogie championship final and a football final this week also, all achieved without a big sponsor and all achieved with our own kids. But not all clubs are as lucky as us. There are clubs not to far from us who need serious funding and I for one hope they get it.

BonnieSituation

But this is the thing. Dublin is atypical in almost every way in Irish life. There is now way it is comparable or easy to just judge everything on a pure monetary basis.

If it was then we would have won all and sundry over the last 130 years. That being said, if we had to get out of Munster since 1884 we would have won a hape more Sams and Liams.

LeoB

BonnieSituation wrote: »

But this is the thing. Dublin is atypical in almost every way in Irish life. There is now way it is comparable or easy to just judge everything on a pure monetary basis.

If it was then we would have won all and sundry over the last 130 years. That being said, if we had to get out of Munster since 1884 we would have won a hape more Sams and Liams.

And just look at what evil money has done to our country over the last 20 years and the lack of it this 6 years.

Atha Cliath abú

freddiek

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Reading through this thread is gas. I love how having a huge population is seen as an overwhelming advantage without most where who criticise Dublin considering how much money it costs to service all the clubs that ore required. There's a huge overall population in Dublin but are all 1.3m or whatever inrterested in GAA? No they're not. On that basis we Antrim would be tearing it up in Ulster. And we all know why that's not the case.

Level the playing field? 3 All-Irelands in 30 years? Some of you guys need a reality check. The Meath lad above called it.

You mention Antrim there Bonnie. If as many country people had gone there in search of work over the years instead of Dublin then maybe Antrim would be one of our top counties. Like Dublin is.

because that consistent topping-up generation after generation of country immigrants has kept the club scene in Dublin very strong.

Dublin GAA people sometimes adopt the mantra of "31 v 1" during the championship but this is fundamentally flawed. it ignores the fact that without the country input Dublin football would have died on its arse years ago. Dublin would be down with the also-rans and getting knocked out of the Championship very early on an annual basis.

if anyone needs proof of this go find one of the tons of articles on the web about some Dublin panellist talking about how he got started in the game and the inevitable mention of his Donegal or Laois or insert whatever u like Father or Mother who took him down the club as soon as he could stand up straight.

Hurlers too.

Drummerboy2

freddiek wrote: »

You mention Antrim there Bonnie. If as many country people had gone there in search of work over the years instead of Dublin then maybe Antrim would be one of our top counties. Like Dublin is.

because that consistent topping-up generation after generation of country immigrants has kept the club scene in Dublin very strong.

Dublin GAA people sometimes adopt the mantra of "31 v 1" during the championship but this is fundamentally flawed. it ignores the fact that without the country input Dublin football would have died on its arse years ago. Dublin would be down with the also-rans and getting knocked out of the Championship very early on an annual basis.

if anyone needs proof of this go find one of the tons of articles on the web about some Dublin panellist talking about how he got started in the game and the inevitable mention of his Donegal or Laois or insert whatever u like Father or Mother who took him down the club as soon as he could stand up straight.

Hurlers too.

Is that not proof enough that the games need promoting in the capital? Or perhaps some people don't want the game to be popular in all parts of the city.

LeoB

Drummerboy2 wrote: »

Is that not proof enough that the games need promoting in the capital? Or perhaps some people don't want the game to be popular in all parts of the city.

You could be right, some dont want G.A.A. to be popular in Dublin, I can think of no other reason why some begrudge the money allocated. However the G.A.A. despite all its flaws recognised that a successful Dublin structure would be good for the game and rightly earmarked funds to help.

I would suggest counties like Kildare, Meath, Louth and Wicklow have benefited from Dubs moving out over the last 15 - 20 years.

LeoB

freddiek wrote: »

You mention Antrim there Bonnie. If as many country people had gone there in search of work over the years instead of Dublin then maybe Antrim would be one of our top counties. Like Dublin is.

because that consistent topping-up generation after generation of country immigrants has kept the club scene in Dublin very strong.

Dublin GAA people sometimes adopt the mantra of "31 v 1" during the championship but this is fundamentally flawed. it ignores the fact that without the country input Dublin football would have died on its arse years ago. Dublin would be down with the also-rans and getting knocked out of the Championship very early on an annual basis.

if anyone needs proof of this go find one of the tons of articles on the web about some Dublin panellist talking about how he got started in the game and the inevitable mention of his Donegal or Laois or insert whatever u like Father or Mother who took him down the club as soon as he could stand up straight.

Hurlers too.

Your arguments are getting silly. To suggest Dublin G.A.A would have died on its arse is stupid and you have nothing only your obvious bias against Dublin to back this up, totally hypothetical and clutching at straws.

There are players from every county panel with parents from other counties not just Dublin but Dublin being the capital has more. Thats logical I think, dont you? That child probably had a Dub coaching him though.........

You failed to answer previous points would you have Kerry split in 2 for football? Kilkenny, Tipperary and Cork in hurling? It would give, Donegal, Meath, Armagh, Longford, Leitrim, Fermanagh and the likes a chance to compete in Liam McCarthy cup. I look forward to your response

Hammer Archer

LeoB wrote: »

I would suggest counties like Kildare, Meath, Louth and Wicklow have benefited from Dubs moving out over the last 15 - 20 years.

To an extent, yes. However, the proximity of these counties to Dublin mean that a large number of Dubs that moved there were close enough to their clubs to continue playing for them. Darren Daly, for example, lives in Ratoath at the moment but still plays with Fingallians. Two of Dublin's Leinster minor winners this year played for Ratoath up until a few years ago before transferring to their parents' clubs. Mick Deegan plays club football for Donaghmore/Ashbourne but togs out for Dublin. I'm sure there are more examples from those other counties.
So you could argue that Dublin have also benefitted from people moving outside of Dublin.

klairondavis

LeoB wrote: »

I would suggest counties like Kildare, Meath, Louth and Wicklow have benefited from Dubs moving out over the last 15 - 20 years.

I'd agree with Hammer Archer's post above - they have, up to a point.

One problem is that many clubs in the outlying areas are now overwhelmed by the sheer numbers. What were once small sleepy rural villages not so long ago, are now sprawling suburban dormitory towns. The population of these towns has trebled in the space of two decades. The GAA clubs in many of these places have simply not been able to keep apace with this population boom. There are not enough pitches, dressing rooms, coaches etc to support the number of underage teams that these clubs are trying to support. This becomes an issue when young players in these towns turn away from gaelic games to soccer or rugby.

In Kildare, I see this happening in Leixlip and Naas. The St Mary's club in Leixlip was one of the traditionally stronger clubs back in the 1980s and 1990s (they did the football & hurling double in 1986). Since then the club has struggled to cope with the boom that the town has experienced since Intel and Hewlett Packard opened. Meanwhile the local rugby club at Barnhall goes from strength to strength. It's a similar story in Naas which has huge potential as a GAA club. Naas won the national feile division 1 football this year. However the town seems to have outgrown the GAA club and soccer and rugby continue to make inroads. There was a good debate in the local paper recently over whether a second GAA club should be established in the town.

The GAA's motives for such massive investment in Dublin are sound. That's where the largest population is, so the more money invested in Dublin, the more young people we'll get playing the games. The question does need to be asked about why the commuter belt outside of Dublin is not benefiting from similar investment given that all these clubs face the same challenges as those across the border in the capital. If anything the challenges facing these clubs is greater given that the rate of population growth has been much more dramatic in North East Kildare and South East Meath in recent years. Why should a young player starting off with Lucan Sarsfields have more advantages over his friend five minutes over the road in Leixlip?

LeoB

Hammer Archer wrote: »

To an extent, yes. However, the proximity of these counties to Dublin mean that a large number of Dubs that moved there were close enough to their clubs to continue playing for them. Darren Daly, for example, lives in Ratoath at the moment but still plays with Fingallians. Two of Dublin's Leinster minor winners this year played for Ratoath up until a few years ago before transferring to their parents' clubs. Mick Deegan plays club football for Donaghmore/Ashbourne but togs out for Dublin. I'm sure there are more examples from those other counties.
So you could argue that Dublin have also benefitted from people moving outside of Dublin.

There a large number Meath, Kildare, Wicklow Wexford, Loth and many more beyond who still travel home every weekend to play games but in some cases the travelling becomes to much so they join another club.
One of the problems is the clubs dont have a sound structure in terms of a coaching policy to develop their juvenile sections, they might on paper but someone strong enough to impliment it is another story. That is a policy that goes from U/8 up to minor. This is an area within Dublin that is quite strong where only do one job either on a committtee or an area of coaching they have been identified as been good at. Within a lot of clubs lads take on teams who should not be near a team but they could be great committee men and vice versa.
Dont let Darren Daly hear you say he play for Fingallians;) Fingal Ravens is is home club and people from that area who I work with would often go to Ashbourne or Ratoath as a first choice for shopping/ socialising

klairondavis wrote: »

I'd agree with Hammer Archer's post above - they have, up to a point.

One problem is that many clubs in the outlying areas are now overwhelmed by the sheer numbers. What were once small sleepy rural villages not so long ago, are now sprawling suburban dormitory towns. The population of these towns has trebled in the space of two decades. The GAA clubs in many of these places have simply not been able to keep apace with this population boom. There are not enough pitches, dressing rooms, coaches etc to support the number of underage teams that these clubs are trying to support. This becomes an issue when young players in these towns turn away from gaelic games to soccer or rugby.

In Kildare, I see this happening in Leixlip and Naas. The St Mary's club in Leixlip was one of the traditionally stronger clubs back in the 1980s and 1990s (they did the football & hurling double in 1986). Since then the club has struggled to cope with the boom that the town has experienced since Intel and Hewlett Packard opened. Meanwhile the local rugby club at Barnhall goes from strength to strength. It's a similar story in Naas which has huge potential as a GAA club. Naas won the national feile division 1 football this year. However the town seems to have outgrown the GAA club and soccer and rugby continue to make inroads. There was a good debate in the local paper recently over whether a second GAA club should be established in the town.

The GAA's motives for such massive investment in Dublin are sound. That's where the largest population is, so the more money invested in Dublin, the more young people we'll get playing the games. The question does need to be asked about why the commuter belt outside of Dublin is not benefiting from similar investment given that all these clubs face the same challenges as those across the border in the capital. If anything the challenges facing these clubs is greater given that the rate of population growth has been much more dramatic in North East Kildare and South East Meath in recent years. Why should a young player starting off with Lucan Sarsfields have more advantages over his friend five minutes over the road in Leixlip?

Good post.

I think it can come down to county boards developing a coaching policy for these areas. One that they can look for funding for and get the clubs to buy into it. It is not as easy sell The challenge is massive facing these clubs.

Lucan would I think be a good example of a club who have a solid structure in terms of coaching, especially hurling and Camogie. They benefited from a boom back in 70s and 80s but it still took them time to make an impact. Leixlip could easily do the same in time but I dont think Lucan would get any more funding than Leixlip if they both sent in a coaching plan.

bruschi

LeoB wrote: »

There a large number Meath, Kildare, Wicklow Wexford, Loth and many more beyond who still travel home every weekend to play games but in some cases the travelling becomes to much so they join another club.
One of the problems is the clubs dont have a sound structure in terms of a coaching policy to develop their juvenile sections, they might on paper but someone strong enough to impliment it is another story. That is a policy that goes from U/8 up to minor. This is an area within Dublin that is quite strong where only do one job either on a committtee or an area of coaching they have been identified as been good at. Within a lot of clubs lads take on teams who should not be near a team but they could be great committee men and vice versa.
Dont let Darren Daly hear you say he play for Fingallians;) Fingal Ravens is is home club and people from that area who I work with would often go to Ashbourne or Ratoath as a first choice for shopping/ socialising



Good post.

I think it can come down to county boards developing a coaching policy for these areas. One that they can look for funding for and get the clubs to buy into it. It is not as easy sell The challenge is massive facing these clubs.

Lucan would I think be a good example of a club who have a solid structure in terms of coaching, especially hurling and Camogie. They benefited from a boom back in 70s and 80s but it still took them time to make an impact. Leixlip could easily do the same in time but I dont think Lucan would get any more funding than Leixlip if they both sent in a coaching plan.

Just in regards to some points you make Leo, in particular to the point that you would get funding for sending in a coaching plan, where is this info coming from? I know not of any grant available from Croke Park that if you propose a coaching plan that you can get funding for it. I have seen this mentioned a few times, that Dublin submitted some wonderful coaching plan and that is the reason they got the millions and that it was up to other counties to do their own coaching plan and get this money. Please, and honestly not meaning it as a dig or anything, but are there any sources at all to back up this point of view.

I have been involved in a very detailed coaching plan and strategic movement for development, and it was very clear that that despite it having to be approved and agreed with central council, there would never be any additional funding, coaching or resources, and that it was a plan based on the utilities and resources to hand. There was never any way of getting money for the development and progress of this, nor was there any made available. There is a fairly set funding program in place for counties that doesnt differ too much, depending on teams you enter for provincial tournaments and the development officers and coaches in the county set up.

There are development plans in pretty much every county, and this thing of saying other counties need to get off their arse and do something is a misgiven thought. They are doing things, and yes, I agree money does not buy success, but if you can afford to send coaches to one school 3 or 4 times a week, surely that is better than only being able to send one coach to a school once a fortnight? By having the resources there to have top level coaching courses being done more frequent due to being able to afford it and also having the coaches available to do these. It cannot be understated that more top quality coaches improves the playing ability of players.

Same goes for clubs. I know not of any grant available for clubs that if they develop a plan, they can apply for funds. Again, not wanting to dismiss you, I'm just looking to see where this is available as maybe I've been missing out on something pretty major.

nice_guy80

These clubs and county boards outside Dublin don't bother putting together requests for extra coaching funding as they know there is none there.

Boom__Boom

bruschi wrote: »

Just in regards to some points you make Leo, in particular to the point that you would get funding for sending in a coaching plan, where is this info coming from? I know not of any grant available from Croke Park that if you propose a coaching plan that you can get funding for it. I have seen this mentioned a few times, that Dublin submitted some wonderful coaching plan and that is the reason they got the millions and that it was up to other counties to do their own coaching plan and get this money. Please, and honestly not meaning it as a dig or anything, but are there any sources at all to back up this point of view.

I have been involved in a very detailed coaching plan and strategic movement for development, and it was very clear that that despite it having to be approved and agreed with central council, there would never be any additional funding, coaching or resources, and that it was a plan based on the utilities and resources to hand. There was never any way of getting money for the development and progress of this, nor was there any made available. There is a fairly set funding program in place for counties that doesnt differ too much, depending on teams you enter for provincial tournaments and the development officers and coaches in the county set up.

There are development plans in pretty much every county, and this thing of saying other counties need to get off their arse and do something is a misgiven thought. They are doing things, and yes, I agree money does not buy success, but if you can afford to send coaches to one school 3 or 4 times a week, surely that is better than only being able to send one coach to a school once a fortnight? By having the resources there to have top level coaching courses being done more frequent due to being able to afford it and also having the coaches available to do these. It cannot be understated that more top quality coaches improves the playing ability of players.

Same goes for clubs. I know not of any grant available for clubs that if they develop a plan, they can apply for funds. Again, not wanting to dismiss you, I'm just looking to see where this is available as maybe I've been missing out on something pretty major.

I have an notion of having read somewhere that the Dublin County Board applied to the Irish Sports Council for money at one stage. Can't remember where I read it so not 100% sure of it's accuracy.

On funding I did hear that in the six counties, there is money available from Stormont under various different initiatives - I think there is money for cultural activities which is why a lot of clubs have cultural officers. Anyone know anything about funding sources in the 6 counties?

I wonder if there is any way money could be got from EU funds, especially if its to an area which is economically disadvantaged. I have a vague notion of seeing an application for what I think were EU leader funds, but that's nearly 20 years ago now for a community hall.

Gotten a bit of topic here but just thinking about some unusual sources of funding besides Croke Park or County board or the usual fundraising options for a club. Lottery funds and maybe there are some schemes you can apply to the Dept of Sports directly??

Does anyone know anything about people leaving something in wills to clubs?
I've a vague notion of hearing something about a row about land being left to a club before. Wouldn't think it was common but maybe if the GAA lobbied the government to make it as tax-friendly and as easy as possible it could be something which would catch on.

Horrible as Jobbridge is as a scheme, I wonder if it would be possible to use it in GAA clubs for someone to do coaching with kids?

nice_guy80

Boom__Boom wrote: »

I have an notion of having read somewhere that the Dublin County Board applied to the Irish Sports Council for money at one stage. Can't remember where I read it so not 100% sure of it's accuracy.

On funding I did hear that in the six counties, there is money available from Stormont under various different initiatives - I think there is money for cultural activities which is why a lot of clubs have cultural officers. Anyone know anything about funding sources in the 6 counties?

I wonder if there is any way money could be got from EU funds, especially if its to an area which is economically disadvantaged. I have a vague notion of seeing an application for what I think were EU leader funds, but that's nearly 20 years ago now for a community hall.

Gotten a bit of topic here but just thinking about some unusual sources of funding besides Croke Park or County board or the usual fundraising options for a club. Lottery funds and maybe there are some schemes you can apply to the Dept of Sports directly??

Does anyone know anything about people leaving something in wills to clubs?
I've a vague notion of hearing something about a row about land being left to a club before. Wouldn't think it was common but maybe if the GAA lobbied the government to make it as tax-friendly and as easy as possible it could be something which would catch on.

Horrible as Jobbridge is as a scheme, I wonder if it would be possible to use it in GAA clubs for someone to do coaching with kids?

jobbridge is a pain to set up and run
plus, you have to have full hours for the candidate.
very, very hard to get any applicant of a decent standard for these roles due to the non-existant renumeration
same issue with local employment schemes that many clubs use to help with basic grounds keeping on club grounds

bruschi

Boom__Boom wrote: »

I have an notion of having read somewhere that the Dublin County Board applied to the Irish Sports Council for money at one stage. Can't remember where I read it so not 100% sure of it's accuracy.

On funding I did hear that in the six counties, there is money available from Stormont under various different initiatives - I think there is money for cultural activities which is why a lot of clubs have cultural officers. Anyone know anything about funding sources in the 6 counties?

I wonder if there is any way money could be got from EU funds, especially if its to an area which is economically disadvantaged. I have a vague notion of seeing an application for what I think were EU leader funds, but that's nearly 20 years ago now for a community hall.

Gotten a bit of topic here but just thinking about some unusual sources of funding besides Croke Park or County board or the usual fundraising options for a club. Lottery funds and maybe there are some schemes you can apply to the Dept of Sports directly??

Does anyone know anything about people leaving something in wills to clubs?
I've a vague notion of hearing something about a row about land being left to a club before. Wouldn't think it was common but maybe if the GAA lobbied the government to make it as tax-friendly and as easy as possible it could be something which would catch on.

Horrible as Jobbridge is as a scheme, I wonder if it would be possible to use it in GAA clubs for someone to do coaching with kids?

most of the sports/lotto grants available are for infrastructure, so actual physical developments rather than employment.

Most places have CE schemes for coaching, so through the FAS scheme you have coaches working with schools and clubs. Its through the social welfare office and available throughout. Clubs would avail of this by employing somone as a groundskeeper. There are, or at least used to be, initiatvies for college students to do work during the summer under a similar CE scheme which would have included coaching too.

LeoB

bruschi wrote: »

Just in regards to some points you make Leo, in particular to the point that you would get funding for sending in a coaching plan, where is this info coming from? I know not of any grant available from Croke Park that if you propose a coaching plan that you can get funding for it. I have seen this mentioned a few times, that Dublin submitted some wonderful coaching plan and that is the reason they got the millions and that it was up to other counties to do their own coaching plan and get this money. Please, and honestly not meaning it as a dig or anything, but are there any sources at all to back up this point of view.

I have been involved in a very detailed coaching plan and strategic movement for development, and it was very clear that that despite it having to be approved and agreed with central council, there would never be any additional funding, coaching or resources, and that it was a plan based on the utilities and resources to hand. There was never any way of getting money for the development and progress of this, nor was there any made available. There is a fairly set funding program in place for counties that doesnt differ too much, depending on teams you enter for provincial tournaments and the development officers and coaches in the county set up.

There are development plans in pretty much every county, and this thing of saying other counties need to get off their arse and do something is a misgiven thought.
They are doing things, and yes, I agree money does not buy success, but if you can afford to send coaches to one school 3 or 4 times a week, surely that is better than only being able to send one coach to a school once a fortnight? By having the resources there to have top level coaching courses being done more frequent due to being able to afford it and also having the coaches available to do these. It cannot be understated that more top quality coaches improves the playing ability of players.

Coaching needs to be prioritised in some counties might have been a better way for to put it. There are some developments going on which are just stupid. We need to divert money away from m Grounds development and into coaching structures. Some county boards embarked on developments when they should have been investing in G.P.Os and training coach's

The funding that came to Dublin back was from numerous government departments, sports, social welfare, community grants that type of thing. It was more than sports it was going to have a very positive impact on the social infrastructure as far as I can remember but if I am not mistaken some came from G.A.A (matching funds or providing a percentage) for some clubs who would not have access to sponsorship or the means to funraise, this is the part of the funding argument that makes me fully support Dublin money from the "kitty". This was developed through the county board

bruschi wrote: »

Same goes for clubs. I know not of any grant available for clubs that if they develop a plan, they can apply for funds. Again, not wanting to dismiss you, I'm just looking to see where this is available as maybe I've been missing out on something pretty major.

We have in the past got help from Dublin county board and I will try and find out where/how the funding is allocated.
In our last development plan for our club c2007/8 when I was chairman the presentation we submitted was like a professional production. It included feasibility studies, incorporated local development plan (LDP) projected growth based on stats we got from CSO, social impact of our development and combined with what we could put into the "pot" in terms of €uro. They left no stone unturned. I had to step down on health grounds from the committee and did not see it through but we also made submissions to large private companies and we got good money from them, €80,000. We then had the crash and money dried up from a lot of sources

I hasten to add we had 3/4 very professional people who looked after this for our club. They were experienced in finance, P.R and Civil service structures (form filling) They had kids playing and offered their services and we went through a few meetings with them but once they were up and running they done everything.
I will enquire further over weekend and post on Sunday night

nice_guy80 wrote: »

These clubs and county boards outside Dublin don't bother putting together requests for extra coaching funding as they know there is none there.

I would think the money is there but county board need to put pressure on Central council and provincial councils to earmark funding every year for coaching and game sdevelopment

Boom__Boom wrote: »

I have an notion of having read somewhere that the Dublin County Board applied to the Irish Sports Council for money at one stage. Can't remember where I read it so not 100% sure of it's accuracy.

On funding I did hear that in the six counties, there is money available from Stormont under various different initiatives - I think there is money for cultural activities which is why a lot of clubs have cultural officers. Anyone know anything about funding sources in the 6 counties?

I wonder if there is any way money could be got from EU funds, especially if its to an area which is economically disadvantaged. I have a vague notion of seeing an application for what I think were EU leader funds, but that's nearly 20 years ago now for a community hall./QUOTE]

Sports capital grants were available to anyone to apply for and Im sure D.C.B would have applied

I dont know about Ulster but do know clubs and county boards get money from Stormont for infrastructural work, grounds and facilities upgrades.

I would say yes to money from E.U could well be available again it is a mine field

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Gotten a bit of topic here but just thinking about some unusual sources of funding besides Croke Park or County board or the usual fundraising options for a club. Lottery funds and maybe there are some schemes you can apply to the Dept of Sports directly??

Does anyone know anything about people leaving something in wills to clubs?
I've a vague notion of hearing something about a row about land being left to a club before. Wouldn't think it was common but maybe if the GAA lobbied the government to make it as tax-friendly and as easy as possible it could be something which would catch on.

Horrible as Jobbridge is as a scheme, I wonder if it would be possible to use it in GAA clubs for someone to do coaching with kids?

Big semi state companies are good to tap but want detailed info on what you are trying to do and how the money will be spent.
The idea of clubs being left ground is good idea and Im sure it could be a runner for many clubs around Ireland

bruschi

Think you misunderstood when I said development plan Leo, I didn't mean physical infrastructure, but overall development of the whole set up, where the majority of the plans include coaching and games development, but some would also include ground and infrastructure. You'll see the kilkenny one produced in 2010 online as an example.

But my point being, there is no fund where you apply to get it. The Gaa made a conscious decision to fund Dublin Gaa over and above other counties. There was a number of reasons for this, the return on investment for greater player numbers and supporters in the capital would certainly be one. But to hand over a million per year for hurling development, over and above their allocated allowance, when other counties are struggling only spending a fraction of that really doesn't help

I've no real issue with this, as it clearly has worked. But let's see the Gaa make the same investment elsewhere, and not like the token gesture to the midlands development fund they've created.

LeoB

bruschi wrote: »

But my point being, there is no fund where you apply to get it. The Gaa made a conscious decision to fund Dublin Gaa over and above other counties. There was a number of reasons for this, the return on investment for greater player numbers and supporters in the capital would certainly be one. But to hand over a million per year for hurling development, over and above their allocated allowance, when other counties are struggling only spending a fraction of that really doesn't help

I've no real issue with this, as it clearly has worked. But let's see the Gaa make the same investment elsewhere, and not like the token gesture to the midlands development fund they've created.

I cant comment on the Midlands development plan as I know nothing about it. (I am not on any committees anymore even club committees I just help with juvenile teams now) But are they going to invest €1,000,000 where there might not be a population to justify it?

I think money should be diverted from a few areas to coaching and the main one is ground development. Do we need every county to have a "big" ground? I dont think so. But I would be in favour of school of excellence where the G.A.A might build 4 or 5 pitchs and for example Carlow and Laois Or Dublin and Meath or Sligo and Leitrim would share the facilities and these pitchs could be used for Senior club games and NFL games. Some NFL games might get under 1,000 at them so why invest millions in grounds all over the country?

I dont think the investment in Dublin was purely based on the sporting side of things. Dublin G.A.A more than any other sporting or cultural organisation was a gateway to communities and I think was the ace in the pack for the funding and it has worked on a number of fronts, especially socially. And I am sure politics played a huge role. Up to recent years Dublin struggled to get out of Leinster with Meath, Kildare, Wexford, and Laois all winning titles in Football. In the capital the worry from the GA.A. was Dublin not doing well was not good for them. Dublin could show easier than any other county that strategic investment would benefit the G.A.A in general and it has.

I do think it is only right and fair that counties that have a good coaching plan in place get funding to see it through. My club has a GPO and we have to raise finance to keep it place. Clubs in rural areas might not be able to sustain a GPO but a GPO appointed to work with first and second year student through a secondary school could be the best way to as you might have 3 or 4 clubs funding it.

A lot of hurling people would say hurling way literally dying apart from Munster you had pockets of hurling. Take Kilkenny out of Leinster and you might have had Wexford and Offaly win a token title. If the G.A.A could get Hurling on the agenda in Dublin it would be a major boost for the game. This in itself I think is good for Hurling elsewhere as there will be hopefully a spin-off to Wexford, Laois, Offaly, Westmeath, Carlow.

But because Dublin land a big deal with a sponsor does not mean they should be treated any differently by G.A.A. when it comes to allocating funding which is what the title of this thread is dealing with

bruschi

LeoB wrote: »

I cant comment on the Midlands development plan as I know nothing about it. (I am not on any committees anymore even club committees I just help with juvenile teams now) But are they going to invest €1,000,000 where there might not be a population to justify it?

I think money should be diverted from a few areas to coaching and the main one is ground development. Do we need every county to have a "big" ground? I dont think so. But I would be in favour of school of excellence where the G.A.A might build 4 or 5 pitchs and for example Carlow and Laois Or Dublin and Meath or Sligo and Leitrim would share the facilities and these pitchs could be used for Senior club games and NFL games. Some NFL games might get under 1,000 at them so why invest millions in grounds all over the country?

I dont think the investment in Dublin was purely based on the sporting side of things. Dublin G.A.A more than any other sporting or cultural organisation was a gateway to communities and I think was the ace in the pack for the funding and it has worked on a number of fronts, especially socially. And I am sure politics played a huge role. Up to recent years Dublin struggled to get out of Leinster with Meath, Kildare, Wexford, and Laois all winning titles in Football. In the capital the worry from the GA.A. was Dublin not doing well was not good for them. Dublin could show easier than any other county that strategic investment would benefit the G.A.A in general and it has.

I do think it is only right and fair that counties that have a good coaching plan in place get funding to see it through. My club has a GPO and we have to raise finance to keep it place. Clubs in rural areas might not be able to sustain a GPO but a GPO appointed to work with first and second year student through a secondary school could be the best way to as you might have 3 or 4 clubs funding it.

A lot of hurling people would say hurling way literally dying apart from Munster you had pockets of hurling. Take Kilkenny out of Leinster and you might have had Wexford and Offaly win a token title. If the G.A.A could get Hurling on the agenda in Dublin it would be a major boost for the game. This in itself I think is good for Hurling elsewhere as there will be hopefully a spin-off to Wexford, Laois, Offaly, Westmeath, Carlow.

But because Dublin land a big deal with a sponsor does not mean they should be treated any differently by G.A.A. when it comes to allocating funding which is what the title of this thread is dealing with

I fully agree with your last point, and I know the thread has deviated away from the initial point, as if a county can get whatever they can get, then more power to them.

I'm not sure then if you are fully aware of the investment made in Dublin hurling over the past few years. Dublin received €6 million spread over 6 years. That is an enormous amount of money, and a portion of which would have been a huge boost in other counties. Obviously throwing money at a county is not the solution, there has to be a back up to it, but my point being that this money wasnt there as a prize, or a fund that anyone could get, it was specifically set up and given to Dublin hurling.

That fund, which was extraordinary in its set up and amount, was not driven by Dublin GAA, again, my point being that it wasnt Dublin GAA going with a plan and getting money available. It was a hurling development committee who felt the investment in Dublin would generate a good return. And to an extent, it has worked, but I would still see the number of players choosing football over hurling as being a kick in the teeth to that. And now its time to see a similar investment made to other areas who desperately need the resources for coaching. As I said, there is a massive difference if a county can afford to send a coach to a school 3 or 4 times a week, instead of only being able to go to a school once a fortnight.