Neighbour Issue - Clapped out banger landed on front garden

wgk

Hi

Have an issue with a neighbour. We bought the property at the start of the year and had our eyes wide open going into this.

Development is lovely (detached dormer bungalows built in early 90's). Each house has a driveway for two cars which is bordered by a square plot of grass to the right (there are no boundary walls between gardens).

My immediate next door neighbour's house is fairly shabby to say the least (look it helped at the time when it came to negotiating on the property) but we were willing to overlook that.

However after 9 months of quiet enjoyment of the property, my neighbour has, overnight, laid plastic sheeting on the front garden and plonked a clapped out banger on the grass, i.e. not on the driveway but on the front garden in front of his sitting room window.

This is very unsightly, the car doesn't look roadworthy, there are no insurance or tax discs and I would go far as to say it is an environmental hazard (the petrol cap is gone and has been replaced by a rag cloth stuck into the hole).

As I said the development is lovely, the neighbours are nice, the place is very well kept with the exception of this one property. I was willing to shut up and put up to an extent but this looks ridiculous when you are driving down the avenue.

Any advice, recourse, suggestions?

Paulw

Contact your local authority. The council will look in to it.

D3PO

if its not roadworthy he doesn't need to have it taxed. Its his property and unfortunately hes entitled to park it there for what I assume is a do it up job.

You don't have any real recourse unfortunately. Perhaps you should call in this evening and ask him about it what his plans are, how long its going to be there etc.

MarkR

If it's not on the road, it doesn't have to be insured. If they have contacted the motor tax office to mark it as being off the road, it doesn't need to be taxed. Awful, but I think you may be stuck with it.

Tramps Like Us

If he wants to lark his car on his garden then that isup to him, let him get on with it

Scortho

You used the unsightly next door neighbour next door as a factor for negotiating a lower price.
Did you expect that he'd change the minute you moved in?

foggy_lad

Contact the Council and ask them if it needs to be taxed or has been declared off the road. then get in touch with the litter warden and make a complaint to them about the property being an eyesore.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/environment/environmental_protection/litter_law.html

The Litter Pollution Act, 1997, as amended by the Waste Management (Amendment) Act 2001 and the Protection of the Environment Act 2003, introduced strong penalties in Ireland to help combat the problems of litter pollution more effectively. The definition of 'litter' under this legislation is quite wide and extends from casual pieces of paper or cigarette ends to anything large or small that is, or is likely to become, unsightly.

Your local authority is responsible for implementing the litter laws in your area. This means it is responsible for the prevention and control of litter and has the power to take enforcement action against people who break or ignore these laws.

<snip>

Litter and private property

The owner or occupier of property that can be seen from a public place, is also obliged to keep the property free of litter. This means that any outdoor area on your property visible from a public place must be kept free of litter. Failure to keep your property free of litter can result in a fine or prosecution by your local authority.

djimi

If its on his private property then local authority wont do anything about it. I dont think you are going to get much joy from this Im afraid.

Ray Palmer

Get in touch with the local environmental officer and ask them to address it. I think you are permitted to do this on a temporary basis.

djimi

foggy_lad wrote: »

Contact the Council and ask them if it needs to be taxed or has been declared off the road. then get in touch with the litter warden and make a complaint to them about the property being an eyesore.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/environment/environmental_protection/litter_law.html

How would one define litter as opposed to say a project? Surely if the neighbour shows some intent to work on the car then he can claim that it is not dumped there?

foggy_lad

djimi wrote: »

If its on his private property then local authority wont do anything about it. I dont think you are going to get much joy from this Im afraid.

if it can be seen from the street or any public place then it must be kept clean and tidy.

Litter and private property

The owner or occupier of property that can be seen from a public place, is also obliged to keep the property free of litter. This means that any outdoor area on your property visible from a public place must be kept free of litter. Failure to keep your property free of litter can result in a fine or prosecution by your local authority.

http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/act/pub/0012/sec0002.html#sec2

“litter” means a substance or object, whether or not intended as waste (other than waste within the meaning of the Waste Management Act, 1996, which is properly consigned for disposal) that, when deposited in a place other than a litter receptacle or other place lawfully designated for the deposit, is or is likely to become unsightly, deleterious, nauseous or unsanitary, whether by itself or with any other such substance or object, and regardless of its size or volume or the extent of the deposit;

foggy_lad

djimi wrote: »

How would one define litter as opposed to say a project? Surely if the neighbour shows some intent to work on the car then he can claim that it is not dumped there?

plainly put a project can be described as litter if it

is or is likely to become unsightly, deleterious, nauseous or unsanitary, whether by itself or with any other such substance or object, and regardless of its size or volume or the extent of the deposit;

pitachu

Have you spoken to him about it?

If not then, as already D3PO suggested, this should be your immediate next step.

wgk

Thanks for the replies guys.

I have been looking out for the neighbour but he's a bit reclusive.

Re the car this is a 99 Daewoo Matiz we're talking about guys, not a ford mustang

In the interests of full disclosure I mentioned that the house relative to the others in the street was shabby. I'm willing to be reasonable here, I couldn't give a crap what goes on in the back of the house, no problem with the place needing a paint job and having torn curtains, I just think this is a bit of a stretch!

Scortho

Wouldn't blame you for not wanting to look at a matiz all day.

It's hard to know whether it's considered litter or not.
Is he dismantling it?
Is it in a shell like condition.

Or is it just a car that's a bit patchy from place to place?

foggy_lad

Scortho wrote: »

Wouldn't blame you for not wanting to look at a matiz all day.

It's hard to know whether it's considered litter or not.
Is he dismantling it?
Is it in a shell like condition.

Or is it just a car that's a bit patchy from place to place?

It is most definitely litter as per the definition of litter in the act.

is or is likely to become unsightly, deleterious, nauseous or unsanitary, whether by itself or with any other such substance or object, and regardless of its size or volume or the extent of the deposit;

djimi

foggy_lad wrote: »

It is most definitely litter as per the definition of litter in the act.

Ive known plenty of people who have had daily driver cars that could be considered litter if it was sufficient to call a clapped out banger unsightly...

I suspect the length of time that this car is left here will determine whether or not the local authority will get involved. Assuming its not literally scrap (ie doors hanging off, windows broken etc) then it looking a bit rough is not going to cut it if the OP wants to have it declared litter imo. However, if it sits there for a period of time and continues to deteriorate then I think a case could be made for having it removed.

foggy_lad

Also the fact that the `plastic was put down on the grass and the vehicle looks to be in need of repair, a garden is not an appropriate place for carrying out repairs, that should be done on the driveway or in a garage.

Henry Ford III

My next door neighbour is quite ugly.

Will the local authority rehouse her or pay for plastic surgery to make her less of a minger?

djimi

foggy_lad wrote: »

Also the fact that the `plastic was put down on the grass and the vehicle looks to be in need of repair, a garden is not an appropriate place for carrying out repairs, that should be done on the driveway or in a garage.

Its the neighbours property; surely its for them to decide where is appropriate to carry out the repairs? So long as the car is not causing a potential danger to others of course.

CuppaCocoa

"the petrol cap is gone and has been replaced by a rag cloth stuck into the hole"

All you need is some little scroat with a cigarette lighter to do some serious damage.

luketitz

Am I the only one who read the title and thought of little toerags launching dud fireworks in the buildup to Halloween and an elderly poster getting him/herself and their pet into annual into lock-up mode?

Rosier

lilybarlean wrote: »

"the petrol cap is gone and has been replaced by a rag cloth stuck into the hole"

All you need is some little scroat with a cigarette lighter to do some serious damage.

OUCH!

Maybe the local Fire Officer needs to know

flintash

Whats wrong with you people?!:eek: how about "mind your own bussiness"??
It is a car we're talking about on a private property, not a nuclear waste. Even if it is without doors and standing on a single brick its not like its gonna fall on you while walking your shih shu. and dont get started with a ticking time bomb tank of petrol! Go away from telle and something usufull- like help neighboor to fix his vehicle LOL

0ph0rce0

Ahhh i had a neighbor like you, always getting the council down to tell me to cut my grass when its above 3 inches.

Everyone's beneath you and all that and the neighborhood is loosing its value and looks tacky :rolleyes: Mind Your Business i think is the best thing here. Its his property he can put what he likes on it. and to be fair just like the neighbor i used to deal with if you approach i'm sure you'll be kindly told to f**k off.

Wellactually

Your seriously going to catch and ask your neighbour what he is doing with HIS car, in HIS garden, on HIS private property? LOL

I have also worked on a car in the garden away from anyone else over time and if someone had of told me to remove it I would have had the same opinion of what i have on this .......

Unless it directly interfering with you or your property mind your own business, should have thought into the bargaining a bit more

jmayo

foggy_lad wrote: »

if it can be seen from the street or any public place then it must be kept clean and tidy.


http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/act/pub/0012/sec0002.html#sec2

Have you ever driven around some of our towns and villages ?
There are loads of unsightly buildings, sheds, cars, vans, trucks, traveller halting sites, etc.
Not everywhere looks like Kenmare, Moynalty, Westport, Adare, etc.

As for the local authority doing anything, I don't think so unless someone locally is connected enough to put pressure on someone.

If anything the local authorities have gotten much worse at caring for areas or has anyone failed to notice the lack of hedge and border cutting along our roads where you now have jungles of noxious weeds, and protruding hedgerows, etc.

foggy_lad

djimi wrote: »

Its the neighbours property; surely its for them to decide where is appropriate to carry out the repairs? So long as the car is not causing a potential danger to others of course.

Yes, but only when it can't be seen from a public place. When it can be seen by all the neighbours it becomes litter.

toc2012

build a high wall! then you can live in your own little wonderland! I had 2 cars sitting on my drive, one was there for over a year before I done anything with it, made a tidy profit from them too. Local tidy towns busy body came to give out, with little joy. (wouldn't mind but she was the first to say I lived outside the town when it cam to a footpath and lighting issues).

mind your business just like your neighbor minds his

Wellactually

I missed the rag in petrol cap post, in fairness yes you should expess your concerns there, especially with Halloween soon, although if you say nothing it might also get rid of your problem D

ted1

Plant a hedge between you guys and forget it about it

camphor

There is a breach of planning permission if he has created a third parking space. The plastic sheeting will have to come up if the enforcement section of the planning department get onto it.

Scortho

camphor wrote: »

There is a breach of planning permission if he has created a third parking space. The plastic sheeting will have to come up if the enforcement section of the planning department get onto it.

It's a breach of planning permission to park on your front grass?

God some of the people in the motors forum are ****ed.

camphor

Scortho wrote: »

It's a breach of planning permission to park on your front grass?

God some of the people in the motors forum are ****ed.

Look at the exempt development regulations. Up to two planning spaces can be provided without planning permission in front of a house. A boat or a caravan can only be stored in a front garden for part of the year. Sheds etc cannot be put in front of a house. Front gardens may be private property but quite a lot of law restricts their use.

Scortho

camphor wrote: »

Look at the exempt development regulations. Up to two planning spaces can be provided without planning permission in front of a house. A boat or a caravan can only be stored in a front garden for part of the year. Sheds etc cannot be put in front of a house. Front gardens may be private property but quite a lot of law restricts their use.

Even if it's there for say 8 months.

So you can't lift grass at the front of your house to add an extra space with planning?

zenno

The OP only recently moves in to a new neighbourhood and tries to dictate to the other neighbours about their private business.

The OP should mind his/her own business as the car is more than likely going to be repaired/upgraded, because i can't imagine a sane person moving a dead heap of scrap into their garden just to use as an ornament.

OP, why don't you keep you're business to yourself and stop being a nosy dictating neighbour. Leave the man in peace to do up his car.

athtrasna

Am I right in thinking this is a shared lawn between two houses with an "invisible wall" down the middle? If so then the OP has every right to be annoyed. Plastic or no plastic, fuel and other chemicals will leech into the soil and could kill the grass in front of both houses.

zenno

athtrasna wrote: »

Am I right in thinking this is a shared lawn between two houses with an "invisible wall" down the middle? If so then the OP has every right to be annoyed. Plastic or no plastic, fuel and other chemicals will leech into the soil and could kill the grass in front of both houses.

Who says the car has a leak of any kind ? you are adding things yourself that are not known, you are assuming this to be the case.

jack1000

If it was my car and the neighbour complained about what i was doing on my property. I would leave it there I might even go and get another one to sit beside it and tell them to go to the council and see how they get on with getting them moved. As for planning for more than 2 cars, half the houses that got cobblelock done have space for more than 2 cars. Are they going to chase them all up.

athtrasna

zenno wrote: »

Who says the car has a leak of any kind ? you are adding things yourself that are not known, you are assuming this to be the case.

Have you ever seen the ground under a car that hasn't been moved in a while, there are almost always stains on the ground?

zenno

athtrasna wrote: »

Have you ever seen the ground under a car that hasn't been moved in a while, there are almost always stains on the ground?

A bit of rust stain from the rain washing over the car, but this wouldn't be sufficient enough to cause damage to both gardens at all. No-one here knows if there is any oil/petrol/other fluids leaking from the car so it's a moot point.

Wellactually

My thoughts exactly zenno and was going to add that but thought id posted enough already, possible the neighbour has lived there for years and now 9 months in its actually him getting grief from the newcomer.

Getting interesting now, OP can you tell us is there a wall separating your gardens or do you 'share' the same?

Ray Palmer

Wellactually wrote: »

My thoughts exactly zenno and was going to add that but thought id posted enough already, possible the neighbour has lived there for years and now 9 months in its actually him getting grief from the newcomer.

Getting interesting now, OP can you tell us is there a wall separating your gardens or do you 'share' the same?

Just because you live somewhere a long time and did something doesn't mean you are allowed do it. It doesn't matter if the neighbour is new or not. You are not entitled to do as you please.

Do band practice in your garage beside some deaf old person and a new family move in to the house they have every right to complain about the noise for example.

zenno

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Just because you live somewhere a long time and did something doesn't mean you are allowed do it. It doesn't matter if the neighbour is new or not. You are not entitled to do as you please.

Do band practice in your garage beside some deaf old person and a new family move in to the house they have every right to complain about the noise for example.

You make it sound like this person is doing something illegal of which he isn't, it's his private property so he can put the car there if he so wishes.

camphor

zenno wrote: »

You make it sound like this person is doing something illegal of which he isn't, it's his private property so he can put the car there if he so wishes.

He may well be doing something illegal. Just because he is on private property does not mean he can do what he likes.

wgk

Hi all

Thanks for the replies - emotive subject!

There are no walls between any of the houses and they are all fairly uniform outside the front, i.e. all the houses are the same colour, people don't have hedging etc...so if you are standing at the top of the road, you can see right down to the bottom, that is until you see a car strewn diagonally across one of the lawns.

Ray Palmer

zenno wrote: »

You make it sound like this person is doing something illegal of which he isn't, it's his private property so he can put the car there if he so wishes.

Just because something is private property doesn't mean you can do what you like on it.

There are laws and by-laws about use of land so he very well may be breaking them. AFAIK you can have something like this temporarily after that you can be fined and compelled to sort it out.

djimi

camphor wrote: »

He may well be doing something illegal. Just because he is on private property does not mean he can do what he likes.

The problem here is that the definition of litter that would make it illegal is very ambiguous and entirely subjective. For example, I could argue that my neighbours Fiat Multipla is unsightly and nauseating, which by the legal definition would make it litter if parked where it can be seen from a public place. Of course it isnt, but to me it certainly fits the definition. Can I then argue that it should be parked where I cannot see it?

The same applies here. Unless the car is literally scrap (doors hanging off, windows broken, empty shell etc) then the fact that the OP considers it to be a "clapped out banger" does not mean that the neighbour cannot park it on their property. The fact that it is parked on grass as opposed to tarmac is neither here nor there. I dont think the neighbour would have too hard a time arguing that it is their car and that they have a right to park it as they please on their own property; certainly initially anyway (if it is left there to deteriorate over a period of time then perhaps the OP would have more of a case).

Wellactually

If theres no divider then i think getting one would be a good idea, am sure you could approach that, maybe yous could even split the cost if it makes you happier and leaves him in peace.

If you think of it from a visual point then it might even make your place look more attactive if his is not painted shabby and neglected looking.


I think thats your best bet at the moment, if he says no to splitting then either do it yourself or get proper legal advice, personally id just to the wall and leave him to it.


Good luck with it anyway

Ray Palmer

djimi wrote: »

The same applies here. Unless the car is literally scrap (doors hanging off, windows broken, empty shell etc) then the fact that the OP considers it to be a "clapped out banger" does not mean that the neighbour cannot park it on their property. The fact that it is parked on grass as opposed to tarmac is neither here nor there. I dont think the neighbour would have too hard a time arguing that it is their car and that they have a right to park it as they please on their own property; certainly initially anyway (if it is left there to deteriorate over a period of time then perhaps the OP would have more of a case).

You are just wrong on this. You can't use for grass as a drive way legally. The car can be deemed to be scrap or litter by the council. Just because it is private property doesn't mean you can do what you like. This is something you can choose not to believe but it doesn't make your belief fact.

The same way you cannot start using your home as a business premises.

There was a guy running a repair business on our road. He parked clapped out cars around his house. The council came along told him to move all the cars including the ones in his drive and fined him when he put one back in his driveway a month later. It wasn't on the grass either.

djimi

Define clapped out cars? I have already said that if it is in obvious scrap state then it shouldnt be there, but if its running under its own power then its not clapped out; no matter how unsightly a neighbour might perceive it to be. Or have the councils now got the power to tell people what car they should be driving?

Fair enough if it cant be parked on grass then all the neighbour will do is move it to the tarmac area of the drive.