The new tax law is in!

KwackerJack

So what have you done?

colm_mcm

I took the day off work. It just didn't feel right to go in.
I'm gonna do a ceremonial burning of an rf100a form and might wallpaper the spare room if I can get enough rf150s from the tax office

KwackerJack

I don't think you will get any considering the ques outside Garda stations all weekend.

Never knew so many cars were already off the road :P

The queues in Galway were funny!

I knew a few lads that dodged tax every year doing this. It was a ridiculous loophole in fairness.

Taylor365

I have done nothing.


Why would i?






Car's always taxed

KwackerJack

rarnes1 wrote: »

The queues in Galway were funny!

I knew a few lads that dodged tax every year doing this. It was a ridiculous loophole in fairness.

I'm surprised the Guards did just say no to anyone who could not prove that their car was actually off the road by means of say a garage letter or such!

KwackerJack

Zubeneschamali

KwackerJack wrote: »

I'm surprised the Guards did just say no to anyone who could not prove that their car was actually off the road by means of say a garage letter or such!

The Guards were never certifying that your car was actually off the road.

They were just witnessing your declaration, so that if push came to shove and you were caught out, you couldn't say "I never made that declaration", and you could be charged with making a false declaration.

biko

I've always have car taxed so this was never an issue for me.

Stinicker

I wish they'd give those of us honest enough to pay our Motor tax a small cut and nail those who have been dodging it now. Also increase the charge for those who pay in the motor tax office and let those not living in the dark ages and pay their taxes online have a tiny saving. I'd even pre-pay my tax earlier if I got a small reduction.

About time the chancers got their commupance, I know one lad who scrambled yesterday to declare his car off the road and he has no driving licence, motor tax, insurance or NCT, he did not even have the log book for the car and the final icing on the cake is that his car never seen a drop of white road diesel in its life only ever green agri, and the same lad is drunk driving about 90% of the time.

colm_mcm

Stinicker wrote: »

About time the chancers got their commupance, I know one lad who scrambled yesterday to declare his car off the road and he has no driving licence, motor tax, insurance or NCT, he did not even have the log book for the car and the final icing on the cake is that his car never seen a drop of white road diesel in its life only ever green agri, and the same lad is drunk driving about 90% of the time.

Twink got off more than that in court.

numorouno

Stinicker wrote: »

I wish they'd give those of us honest enough to pay our Motor tax a small cut and nail those who have been dodging it now. Also increase the charge for those who pay in the motor tax office and let those not living in the dark ages and pay their taxes online have a tiny saving. I'd even pre-pay my tax earlier if I got a small reduction.

About time the chancers got their commupance, I know one lad who scrambled yesterday to declare his car off the road and he has no driving licence, motor tax, insurance or NCT, he did not even have the log book for the car and the final icing on the cake is that his car never seen a drop of white road diesel in its life only ever green agri, and the same lad is drunk driving about 90% of the time.

why not report him? He's costing everyone money with respect to revenue, motor insurance bureau and could cost someone their life with drink driving

Wexfordian

You missed "Made no difference to me one way or another as car was already taxed and was never off road"

the cats pajamas

Stinicker wrote: »

I wish they'd give those of us honest enough to pay our Motor tax a small cut and nail those who have been dodging it now. Also increase the charge for those who pay in the motor tax office and let those not living in the dark ages and pay their taxes online have a tiny saving. I'd even pre-pay my tax earlier if I got a small reduction.

About time the chancers got their commupance, I know one lad who scrambled yesterday to declare his car off the road and he has no driving licence, motor tax, insurance or NCT, he did not even have the log book for the car and the final icing on the cake is that his car never seen a drop of white road diesel in its life only ever green agri, and the same lad is drunk driving about 90% of the time.

Report him.
If you can keep a drunk driver of the road you really should.
Why wouldn't you?
If you sit and do nothing with the knowledge then the tragedy that is waiting to happen is on your conscience as well .

Red Kev

No real change here. Saab is still NCT'd but declared off the road the last month, haven't driven it properly since June, just driving the miserable Renault Modus at the moment. I still take the Saab for a spin up the boreen every couple of weeks to keep the moving bits moving, my insurance covers it so happy enoug hwith that.

Crazy the amount of people I know who used and abused that system on a permanent basis for years, I always wondered why it took the government so long to introduce such a simple measure.

While they're at it I'd be in favour of getting rid of NCT/Insurance/tax discs on window plates and putting them on number plates as a sticker as they do in Sweden and Germany, makes the dodgers easier to spot.

colm_mcm

Wexfordian wrote: »

You missed "Made no difference to me one way or another as car was already taxed and was never off road"

I took the "I won't be taxing it etc." one as that

KwackerJack

Wexfordian wrote: »

You missed "Made no difference to me one way or another as car was already taxed and was never off road"

True but not relevant

New law affects people with large cc car who struggle to pay or anyone with whatever cc car that struggles to pay.

If you can afford to pay your road tax without worry then this law means nothing really.

Zubeneschamali

KwackerJack wrote: »

New law affects people with large cc car who struggle to pay or anyone with whatever cc car that struggles to pay.

This law affects people who used to break the old law.

Wexfordian

KwackerJack wrote: »

True but not relevant

New law affects people with large cc car who struggle to pay or anyone with whatever cc car that struggles to pay.

If you can afford to pay your road tax without worry then this law means nothing really.

Not really. It doesn't make any difference to people who "struggle to pay", they will still struggle to pay regardless. It affects people who don't pay, whether because they can't, don't want to, or just don't see why they should.

Sam Kade

The dodgers can look at it this way you saved so much down through the years that you can afford to pay now.

They should also change the nonsense with pre 08 cars and tax by emissions like the UK. If you convert your car to lpg in the UK your motor tax will drop accordingly.

djimi

Sam Kade wrote: »

They should also change the nonsense with pre 08 cars and tax by emissions like the UK.

On a personal note I hope this doesnt happen as I would end up paying more... :pac:

discombobulate

I'd say there'll be an increase of 3 litre+ cars going on sale for peanuts now.

Sam Kade

djimi wrote: »

On a personal note I hope this doesnt happen as I would end up paying more... :pac:

It's a fairer system I doubt you would be paying more.

djimi

How much of an effect is this system change really going to have? I mean, if someone had enough of a brass neck to commit fraud under one system, what would stop them from declaring the car off the road now and committing fraud under the new system?

djimi

Sam Kade wrote: »

It's a fairer system I doubt you would be paying more.

I drive a Japanese import Type R; based on the figures that I found when I looked into it the last time Im fairly certain Id end up paying more than I am now.

Im only being largely tongue in cheek; I know that my car is a minority case and I dont disagree that this nonsense of having two tax systems with such a huge disparity between them needs to stop. There are some people however that it would not benefit to change.

Sam Kade

djimi wrote: »

How much of an effect is this system change really going to have? I mean, if someone had enough of a brass neck to commit fraud under one system, what would stop them from declaring the car off the road now and committing fraud under the new system?

If you're caught while you have your car declared off road you will get more than a slap on the wrist like was the case with the old system.

fletch

djimi wrote: »

How much of an effect is this system change really going to have? I mean, if someone had enough of a brass neck to commit fraud under one system, what would stop them from declaring the car off the road now and committing fraud under the new system?

ANPR

cletus

What is the punishment going to be if you are caught driving a car declared off the road?

djimi

Sam Kade wrote: »

If you're caught while you have your car declared off road you will get more than a slap on the wrist like was the case with the old system.

Well see. Frankly I have no faith whatsoever in the Gardai upholding this, or any other motoring law for that matter. Look at how many unlicensed drivers are allowed to drive unaccompanied with no consequence when caught...

discombobulate

Sam Kade wrote: »

If you're caught while you have your car declared off road you will get more than a slap on the wrist like was the case with the old system.

Plus a lot of what people used to do was 3 months on one month off. It'd also stop that.

I'd say anyone with a decent car won't risk it but you'll still have loads of cheap cars chancing it where the money saved is worth the risk of the car being taken and scrapped.

galwaytt

It'll be interesting to see what all the numbers are like when the dust settles, e.g:

a) How many vehicles were SORD'd ?
b) How many vehicles were taxed, above that (expected) the norm, in the month ?
c) How many vehicles had to be added to the NVDB - i.e. those they thought were 'dead & buried'

And finally, the Real Question:
d) was it worth the hassle/panic/palaver, financially ? I mean, once all the above are known, how much of that fictional €55m Bully Phil was going on about is actually recouped ? (if all the 'non-taxed' cars were SORD'd for instance, he'd have collected a big fat € Zero. And then add in the cost of the admin of the whole thing.... ). In the same vein, how much it cost the State to run this exercise ?

working fool

I always have my car & van taxed
But I've another car I'm working on in yard without tax on it
Suppose I better trundle in and declare it off the road now
I won't be driving it till the new year anyway

KwackerJack

discombobulate wrote: »

I'd say there'll be an increase of 3 litre+ cars going on sale for peanuts now.

2.0 plus.....tax is 200 every 3 months for a 2.0 so its pretty hefty

cerastes

Red Kev wrote: »

While they're at it I'd be in favour of getting rid of NCT/Insurance/tax discs on window plates and putting them on number plates as a sticker as they do in Sweden and Germany, makes the dodgers easier to spot.

I cant see how thats any better, stickers on number plates? discs are visible inside the window and will stop people trying to swipe them or just ripping them off out of badness, which might not happen in Germany or Sweden, but Id think it would here.

How does it make them easier to spot, its as easy for someone to look at the windscreen, easier Id say than crouching down to look at a disc in detail on the plate which is nearer the ground.

Deise Vu

Anyone know what happens if you buy a car privately that is not taxed? Are you only liable from the date of transfer or does the liability attach to the car rather than the owner?

corktina

working fool wrote: »

I always have my car & van taxed
But I've another car I'm working on in yard without tax on it
Suppose I better trundle in and declare it off the road now
I won't be driving it till the new year anyway

if you do, you'll have to pay the back tax if it's in your name.

Cleveland Hot Pocket

No effect to me, cars always taxed in time.


Makes me more wary now when buying any project car that I anticipate being off the road though.

corktina

your OK buying something as the arrears are wiped out (at present, no doubt that will be the first change when they see all the name changes coming through)

working fool

corktina wrote: »

if you do, you'll have to pay the back tax if it's in your name.

Ahh I'll just sell it to my mate so

Supergurrier

Main car is taxed regardless im not a loophole jockey.

Just declared old car off the road that was parked up and cleared back tax.

Red Kev

galwaytt wrote: »

In the same vein, how much it cost the State to run this exercise ?

Can't see how it cost them anything, the staff are already working there, offices exist and it's just an extra form that gets put into a computer. I did mine in Roscommon about 6 weeks ago, nobody there. Sure there was a rush on the last couple pf days, but apart from that I can't see how it cost anything, unless I'm missing something.

cerastes wrote: »

I cant see how thats any better, stickers on number plates? discs are visible inside the window and will stop people trying to swipe them or just ripping them off out of badness, which might not happen in Germany or Sweden, but Id think it would here.

How does it make them easier to spot, its as easy for someone to look at the windscreen, easier Id say than crouching down to look at a disc in detail on the plate which is nearer the ground.

Here's a Swedish car with the old style plates..........



Colour represents the year, say for arguments sake yellow is 2014, number represents the month, so you could introduce it here with a combined sticker so you can see that the (e.g.) tax/NCT runs out in May 2014. It's easier for a garda car to spot it in trafffic than a disk on the window that's only possible to read when it's stopped. It increases the chances of being caught and thus encourages people to insure/tax the car or at least stay off the road with an untaxed or uninsured car.

djimi

Red Kev wrote: »

Can't see how it cost them anything, the staff are already working there, offices exist and it's just an extra form that gets put into a computer. I did mine in Roscommon about 6 weeks ago, nobody there. Sure there was a rush on the last couple pf days, but apart from that I can't see how it cost anything, unless I'm missing something.

There is always going to be a cost in implementing a new system; existing systems have to be updated, software has to be written/purchased, staff have to be trained etc.

TheBoffin

Red Kev wrote: »

Can't see how it cost them anything, the staff are already working there, offices exist and it's just an extra form that gets put into a computer. I did mine in Roscommon about 6 weeks ago, nobody there. Sure there was a rush on the last couple pf days, but apart from that I can't see how it cost anything, unless I'm missing something.



Here's a Swedish car with the old style plates..........



Colour represents the year, say for arguments sake yellow is 2014, number represents the month, so you could introduce it here with a combined sticker so you can see that the (e.g.) tax/NCT runs out in May 2014. It's easier for a garda car to spot it in trafffic than a disk on the window that's only possible to read when it's stopped. It increases the chances of being caught and thus encourages people to insure/tax the car or at least stay off the road with an untaxed or uninsured car.

Its easy to roll out a sticker type disk on the number plate when people can afford to renew their tax annually

Here's the current setup in Sweden

The annual circulation tax for cars meeting at least Euro 4 exhaust emission standards is based on CO2 emissions. The tax
consists of a basic rate (360 Swedish Kroner) plus SEK20 for each gram of CO2 emitted above 117g/km. This sum is multiplied
by 2.33 for diesel cars. Diesel cars registered for the first time in 2008 or later pay an additional SEK250 and those registered earlier an additional SEK500. For alternative fuel vehicles, the tax is SEK10 for every gram emitted above 117g/km.

Ireland need to fix the actual problem and merge the old engine based system into the new CO2 system using the NCT reports.

cletus

TheBoffin wrote: »

Its easy to roll out a sticker type disk on the number plate when people can afford to renew their tax annually

Here's the current setup in Sweden


Ireland need to fix the actual problem and merge the old engine based system into the new CO2 system using the NCT reports.

So thats a base rate of about €41, plus about 2.30 per gram of CO2 above 117g/km for petrol cars

Drummerboy08

Major pain in the hole for anyone with a weekend or classic car.

Personally I think if they put the effort thats been shown here into everything else thats wrong with this country, we'd be back to the good times fairly quickly.

Thankfully ive a company car, so Phil's gonna have to find anotger way to inconvenience me.

corktina

Major pain? filling in a form once in a while and posting it? really?

Drummerboy08

corktina wrote: »

Major pain? filling in a form once in a while and posting it? really?

What happens when you find yourself thinking "its a nive weekend this weekend, lets take the MG out for a spin. Oh wait, its signed off the road".

djimi

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

What happens when you find yourself thinking "its a nive weekend this weekend, lets take the MG out for a spin. Oh wait, its signed off the road".

How is that any worse than having to go into a Garda station to get it declared off the road, then having to tax it before you take it out for a spin?

Zubeneschamali

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

What happens when you find yourself thinking "its a nive weekend this weekend, lets take the MG out for a spin. Oh wait, its signed off the road".

Q11. What if I want to put the vehicle back on the road before the period specified in the declaration expires?

A11. You can cancel the declaration at any time by renewing your tax in your local motor tax office – the validity of the tax disc will commence from the first day of the month in which you tax the vehicle.

Renegade Mechanic

Did nothing, saw the que and went to Mc Donalds, then home again to enjoy my day off. When I sell the Punto, the new owner will still only be liable for tax from date of sale, And as for my Jeep, Ill just "sell" it to a new owner, Declare it off the road under the new system indefinitely (keep renewing RF150) and "buy it" when its ready to drive again.

corktina

Drummerboy08 wrote: »

What happens when you find yourself thinking "its a nive weekend this weekend, lets take the MG out for a spin. Oh wait, its signed off the road".

well, what would you normally do? drive it without tax? There's just two choices now to be within the law :Tax it or SORD.