Changing dog food - things to think about

Inexile

There has been quite a few threads looking for advice on what dog food to change onto.

I changed my lot awhile back and while quality of the product is obviously a key point here are the things I took into account when changing food.

1. Price
2. Could I get all three of my dogs onto one food
3. Availability of the product. I don't have a large pet store in my town so I wanted something I could get relatively easily and not have to rely on buying on line.
4. Special offers - the product I get regularly comes up on special offers in store.
5. Where it was made - and Irish product was a bonus.

Just something more to think about when choosing a food.

aonb

totally agree with your list Inexile. what did you finally choose for your dogs??

Nody

Sorry but the list I'd have in mind would be:

1) What's in the food? (i.e. meat derivates, beet pulp, corn flour/syrup, wheat etc. are all very telling that it's most likely at best a medium quality if not low quality food)
2) What can I afford to feed? (keeping in mind saved cost on vet bill and higher quality usually means less fed)
3) Based on the above two what's the best food I can afford? (Zoohit is a good price reference point, look at the per kilo price to compare them)
4) Where can I source it? (Internet tends to have a lot better selection and price over local stores assuming they even stock it)
5) What needs to be my replenishment cycle? (i.e. how long in advance do I need to order more to ensure I always got a week or two of dry stuff available at all time, this impacts when you need to pay for things)
6) Can I get sample packs? (Not all foods work with all dogs but you may be able to get a sample from the store/manufacturer/someone on boards)
7) When do I want to do the shift? (Makes no sense to change right after you open that 15kg bag of new food after all but you need some of it to mix in the change over period nor if you're about to go away for a while as you want to minimize changes for the dog in the time of change to monitor how it affects them)
8) How often and how does the poop look today? (I.e. solid/lose, often/once per day, color etc.)

After the food is there:
9) How is the poop changing? (If it's not changing that's not a bad thing per say)
10) How is my dog behaving differently? (i.e. is it calmer/more hyper, want longer/shorter walks, hoovering the bowl where as it did not want to eat earlier or vice versa etc.)
11) Where my feeding assumptions correct? (adjustments per dog always needed)
12) How does this affect the economy and replenishment? (i.e. can I afford this still?)
13) Final decision half way through the bag do I want to continue with this new food?

inocybe

Something else to think about - have I been manipulated into thinking the best way to feed my dog is with a bag of pellets labelled 'dog food'. Maybe spend some of that money on real, fresh food?

kylith

inocybe wrote: »

Something else to think about - have I been manipulated into thinking the best way to feed my dog is with a bag of pellets labelled 'dog food'. Maybe spend some of that money on real, fresh food?

Great idea. I'll just spend money I don't have on a new fridge and/or freezer to keep all that fresh food in. Then I'll just build an extension to my house to put this fridge/freezer in since my house is tiny. Then, when I'm away, I'll ask my dog minder to weigh out bloody offal and mince for my dogs.

I'm being a touch OTT perhaps, but BARF does not suit everyone's lifestyle and means. Please bear that in mind before making remarks about people trying to get the best nutrition for their dogs within their means.

inocybe

kylith wrote: »

Great idea. I'll just spend money I don't have on a new fridge and/or freezer to keep all that fresh food in. Then I'll just build an extension to my house to put this fridge/freezer in since my house is tiny. Then, when I'm away, I'll ask my dog minder to weigh out bloody offal and mince for my dogs.

I'm being a touch OTT perhaps, but BARF does not suit everyone's lifestyle and means. Please bear that in mind before making remarks about people trying to get the best nutrition for their dogs within their means.

A lot OTT actually. I don't have the money for those things either, you've assumed wrongly that I feed BARF too. I'm only suggesting the idea that you can feed your dog on healthy fresh food a lot of the time - it doesn't have to be either or. Why does a pet have to be fed only 'pet food', maybe it can be nearly as convenient to feed fresh food. It was quite a revolution when I realised I didn't have to buy into a brand, and how poor quality all dried food is.

kylith

inocybe wrote: »

A lot OTT actually. I don't have the money for those things either, you've assumed wrongly that I feed BARF too. I'm only suggesting the idea that you can feed your dog on healthy fresh food a lot of the time - it doesn't have to be either or. Why does a pet have to be fed only 'pet food', maybe it can be nearly as convenient to feed fresh food. It was quite a revolution when I realised I didn't have to buy into a brand, and how poor quality all dried food is.

Maybe for some people it's almost as convenient, but maybe for other people it isn't. Maybe, like me, having to buy a new fridge/freezer and find somewhere to put it is an issue. Maybe they've tried it and decided that it isn't for them. Maybe they do feed raw as well as dry, and want to make sure that the dry they're feeding is the best quality they can get. Maybe they're vegetarians and the thought of touching meat makes them vomit.

Whatever someone's reasons for choosing the food they do, coming on here suggesting that anyone who feeds dry food has been manipulated into it isn't very nice.

Inexile

I ended up with Leader. I need a low protein food for my grey and it is suiting all of the dogs.

Nody I think we don't disagree that much at all. I should have inserted the word 'other' in this sentence "here are the things I took into account when changing food."

I couldn't afford to spend over €50 on 15kg bag of food so my choice works for me budget wise and while I know its not the top of the range food wise its still a decent food, and I can supplement with fish or other foods, where I need to.

Your 4 and 5 are what Im thinking about when I talk about availability. If I run out of food I cant always wait for an online delivery nor can I always afford to buy it in bulk at that moment so being able to source it locally, in a few places, and in various sizes helps me.

In relation to No. 8 - well Im very happy with the quality of the poop.

(I don't know how to do multiple quotes so hope you can follow my reply to Nody)

inocybe

kylith wrote: »

Maybe for some people it's almost as convenient, but maybe for other people it isn't. Maybe, like me, having to buy a new fridge/freezer and find somewhere to put it is an issue. Maybe they've tried it and decided that it isn't for them. Maybe they do feed raw as well as dry, and want to make sure that the dry they're feeding is the best quality they can get. Maybe they're vegetarians and the thought of touching meat makes them vomit.

Whatever someone's reasons for choosing the food they do, coming on here suggesting that anyone who feeds dry food has been manipulated into it isn't very nice.

Changing dog food - things to think about
I contributed something else to think about, I am many of the things you wrote above, I do feed some dry food, and I absolutely feel manipulated by petfood companies. I'm also nice

borderlinemeath

kylith wrote: »

Whatever someone's reasons for choosing the food they do, coming on here suggesting that anyone who feeds dry food has been manipulated into it isn't very nice.

In all fairness, marketing is manipulation of the mind. Having worked in retail for nearly 2 decades and getting marketing blurb drilled into you by companies trying to get you to sell their product as something that consumers NEEDED and that it was ESSENTIAL is what they do best. Having seen how marketing departments work first hand I tend to question the credibility of most items I buy, ie face creams, shampoos, cleaning products, mobile phones etc, not just dog food. Almost everything that consumers purchase on a daily basis has been subliminally planted in the mind by marketing in some form.

Thinking back to my late teens when we got a new family dog it was the first time I'd seen dry food yet not one person in my household questioned it. It was bought from a pet shop and the advice given was that this is what pets are eating now (it had been about 5 years since we had a household pet). Fast forward 14 years and my own first pet I did the same thing, went to the pet shop and believed the blurb that they came out with. I'm not saying that it's the pet shop at fault but the companies that produce the dry food do a lot of marketing and media to get the message out there that dry food is the best and the complete food for your dog. Not just with the retailers but through sponsorship/college grants for veterinary studies and then retailing through vet practices.

One thing that really annoys me about dry food marketing is that they had it so good for so long that most consumers thought there was no alternative. If it wasn't on the shelf in the pet shop then it didn't exist. Dry food had pretty much taken over the market for pet feeding and if you did something different you were in a tiny minority. There is a sway towards raw/fresh feeding and sometimes on this forum it can come across as a bit OTT but it's still a very small representation of the pet community.

kylith

borderlinemeath wrote: »

In all fairness, marketing is manipulation of the mind. Having worked in retail for nearly 2 decades and getting marketing blurb drilled into you by companies trying to get you to sell their product as something that consumers NEEDED and that it was ESSENTIAL is what they do best. Having seen how marketing departments work first hand I tend to question the credibility of most items I buy, ie face creams, shampoos, cleaning products, mobile phones etc, not just dog food. Almost everything that consumers purchase on a daily basis has been subliminally planted in the mind by marketing in some form.

Thinking back to my late teens when we got a new family dog it was the first time I'd seen dry food yet not one person in my household questioned it. It was bought from a pet shop and the advice given was that this is what pets are eating now (it had been about 5 years since we had a household pet). Fast forward 14 years and my own first pet I did the same thing, went to the pet shop and believed the blurb that they came out with. I'm not saying that it's the pet shop at fault but the companies that produce the dry food do a lot of marketing and media to get the message out there that dry food is the best and the complete food for your dog. Not just with the retailers but through sponsorship/college grants for veterinary studies and then retailing through vet practices.

One thing that really annoys me about dry food marketing is that they had it so good for so long that most consumers thought there was no alternative. If it wasn't on the shelf in the pet shop then it didn't exist. Dry food had pretty much taken over the market for pet feeding and if you did something different you were in a tiny minority. There is a sway towards raw/fresh feeding and sometimes on this forum it can come across as a bit OTT but it's still a very small representation of the pet community.

Yes, the entire of advertising and marketing is the applied science of manipulation, and many people do unquestioningly buy what they see advertised on television which is why people need to be educated about the various aspects of different types of dog food. Nody's post, for example, was very good an informative.

I'm all for people feeding raw if they decide to, it was the suggestion that if you feed dry it's because you have been manipulated, coupled with language suggesting that dry food wasn't 'real', that I took issue with.

Nody

Inexile wrote: »

(I don't know how to do multiple quotes so hope you can follow my reply to Nody)

I can The way I do it is simply copy the end qoute tag [/QOUTE] to break it up and remove the / as needed at the start of the qoute section.

Mr Whirly

Dry food will always be the most popular because people are not arsed feeding raw, me included.

If you go to buy dry food in a pet shop then you are at the mercy of the companies marketing. The bigger pet shop chains will have a deal with certain brands. The smaller ones won't and will be less biased.

borderlinemeath

kylith wrote: »

Yes, the entire of advertising and marketing is the applied science of manipulation, and many people do unquestioningly buy what they see advertised on television which is why people need to be educated about the various aspects of different types of dog food. Nody's post, for example, was very good an informative.

I'm all for people feeding raw if they decide to, it was the suggestion that if you feed dry it's because you have been manipulated, coupled with language suggesting that dry food wasn't 'real', that I took issue with.

In that particular post I imagine that the word 'real' would indicate 'whole' or 'not processed' rather than 'fake' or 'false' food, or perhaps 'real' in the sense that it's fit for humans to eat, rather than 'derivitives' that aren't fit for human (and animal) consumption. I don't think it was written to cause offence but to question the overwhelming stranglehold that dry food has in the pet food market. (well, that's how I took it up)

inocybe

I meant real as in fresh, and no offence to anyone was meant. I'm currently trying to improve my cats diet, and it's huge leap to get away from the idea that manufactured food is complete and that I might cause a nutrient deficiency by venturing away from it. It's actually quite scary to try to overcome that.

seanaway

I had this problem when our Sprollie decided to turn her nose up at Hill Science Puppy food. I based the decision on having fed two Guinea Pigs Burgess Guinea Pig food. They lived to be 6 and 7 years old so I thought -- maybe it can't be too bad. The moment I brought the Burgess Super Dog food in the dog went crazy for it. We've never had a problem with her eating it. It's a reasonably priced food at around €22 for a 15KG bag. She's fit, healthy and as mad as a Sprollie should be but loves her food and doesn't have any adverse reactions to it.

Nody

seanaway wrote: »

I had this problem when our Sprollie decided to turn her nose up at Hill Science Puppy food. I based the decision on having fed two Guinea Pigs Burgess Guinea Pig food. They lived to be 6 and 7 years old so I thought -- maybe it can't be too bad. The moment I brought the Burgess Super Dog food in the dog went crazy for it. We've never had a problem with her eating it. It's a reasonably priced food at around €22 for a 15KG bag. She's fit, healthy and as mad as a Sprollie should be but loves her food and doesn't have any adverse reactions to it.

It is that bad and it's cheap because going by the ingredient list it's about 75% wheat and that is in no way reasonable priced for any dog or cat food you buy from a manufacturer.

Burgess Supadog - Adult Dog Food with Chicken wrote:

Wheat, Chicken Meal (min 14%), Wheatfeed, Poultry Fat (4%), Beef Meal, Fresh Chicken (1%), Peas (1%), Digest, Salt, Limestone, Dicalcium Phosphate, Minerals.

Fibre 3%
Protein 18%

seanaway

Hang on Nody. Let's go back to your earlier post.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

After the food is there:
9) How is the poop changing? (If it's not changing that's not a bad thing per say)

It isn't changing and stays constant.

10) How is my dog behaving differently? (i.e. is it calmer/more hyper, want longer/shorter walks, hoovering the bowl where as it did not want to eat earlier or vice versa etc.)

She's just fine. Same energy as always. Loves walks. Wolfs the food.

11) Where my feeding assumptions correct? (adjustments per dog always needed)
Yep.

12) How does this affect the economy and replenishment? (i.e. can I afford this still?)
Yes. It is a little more than we can afford but it works well for her so we buy it.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
Now to your breakdown of Burgess SupaDog.

What you state is correct. However, more expensive foods have similar cereal content. Hills Science JD has the same cereal content (give or take a couple of %). In fact, I called them to ask what the exact percentage was and I was told it was not for public knowledge! Or to quote ' That would be proprietary information.' They also seem not to reveal the meat % on the packet and simply state 'meat and animal derivatives' That I find more worrying than the content and percentages clearly labelled on Burgess. Given that I have paid around €60 for Hills in the past I think I get more per Euro for Burgess.

I would have to disagree with you on Burgess but as a matter of interest, what do you feed dogs and how much do you spend on it?

Nody

seanaway wrote: »

Hang on Nody. Let's go back to your earlier post.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

After the food is there:
9) How is the poop changing? (If it's not changing that's not a bad thing per say)

It isn't changing and stays constant.

10) How is my dog behaving differently? (i.e. is it calmer/more hyper, want longer/shorter walks, hoovering the bowl where as it did not want to eat earlier or vice versa etc.)

She's just fine. Same energy as always. Loves walks. Wolfs the food.

11) Where my feeding assumptions correct? (adjustments per dog always needed)
Yep.

12) How does this affect the economy and replenishment? (i.e. can I afford this still?)
Yes. It is a little more than we can afford but it works well for her so we buy it.

Which is good for you (and your dog) and if it works and you don't want to change I'm not here to force you (I'll try to convince you though ) that still don't make it a good food nor is that a price you should expect to pay for a decent dog food.

Also if you don't mind me asking but how do you expect to handle any future vet issues if that is borderline expensive for you? How would a 500+ EUR vet bill be dealt with? Reason I ask is beacuse while you hope nothing will ever happens accidents and age have a tendency to screw with those hopes

Now to your breakdown of Burgess SupaDog.

What you state is correct. However, more expensive foods have similar cereal content. Hills Science JD has the same cereal content (give or take a couple of %). In fact, I called them to ask what the exact percentage was and I was told it was not for public knowledge! Or to quote ' That would be proprietary information.' They also seem not to reveal the meat % on the packet and simply state 'meat and animal derivatives' That I find more worrying than the content and percentages clearly labelled on Burgess. Given that I have paid around €60 for Hills in the past I think I get more per Euro for Burgess.

If you excuse me for saying so but Hills (and Royal Canin) and several others are along with Whiskas, Felix etc. (for cats) premium branded low/medium quality foods that are grossly overpriced. They live on commercials and not on food content and quality so I'd fully support you leaving Hills if nothing else then to not pay for the commercial adds! Now if I'd turn around instead and suggest foods instead I'd list some of the below (all depends on your budget but 22EUR/15kg will never get you a decent quality food; sorry); the below cost the same as Hills (per kilo).

Applaws Adult Large Dog wrote:

Ingredients:
Chicken 66% (from Dried Chicken), Chicken Mince 8%, Peas 8% (from Dried Peas), Potato Starch 6%, Poultry Oil 2.5% (Source of Omega 6), Beet Pulp, Poultry Gravy, Whole Egg (from Dried Egg), Cellulose Plant Fibre, Minerals, Vitamins, Salmon Oil (source of omega 3), Tomato (from Dried Tomato), Carrot (from Dried Carrot) Chicory Extract (F.O.S), Alfalfa Meal, Seaweed/Kelp, Yeast Extract (Purified Beta Glucan 0.1%), Glucosamine, Methylsulfonylmethane, Chondroitin, Carrot, Peppermint, Paprika Meal, Turmeric, Thyme Extract, Citrus Extract, Taurine 1000 mg/kg, Yucca Extract, Cranberry, Fennel Extract, Carob Extract, Ginger, Rosehip Extract, Dandelion Extract, Rosemary Oil Extract, Oregano, Probiotic: Contains E1705 Enterococcus faecium cernelle 68 (SF68: NCIMB 10415) 1,000,000 cfu/kg as an aid in the establishment, maintenance and restoration of a balanced gut flora in dogs.

75% meat content, linky here.

Taste of the Wild - High Prairie Canine wrote:

Bison, dried lamb meat, dried chicken meat, eggs, sweet potatoes, peas, potatoes, canola oil, roasted bison, roasted game, natural flavourings, tomato puree, ocean fish meal, salt, choline chloride, dried chicory root, tomatoes, blueberries, raspberries, yucca schidigera extract, dried fermentation products of Enterococcus faecium, Lactobacillus acidophilus, Lactobacillus casei and Lactobacillus plantarum, dried Trichoderma longibrachiatum fermentation extract, quality vitamins (A, B1, B2, B6, B12, C, D, E),minerals (iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, manganese proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, manganese sulfate) potassium iodide, manganous oxide, biotin, calcium pantothenate, sodium selenite, folic acid.

TooW - Once again you don't see wheat or grains in there, lots of meat at the top like Applaws.

Now price alone is in no way to determine the quality of dog food as you learned; as an example of this is Yarrah Dog food which is sold as a "premium dog food" at about the same price as the above two.

Cereal* (corn*, wheat*), meat* and animal by-products* (23% chicken*), vegetable by-products* (sunflower seeds*, soybeans*, wheat greaves*), oils* and fats* (3.5% chicken fat*), minerals, yeast, eggs and egg by-products* (egg powder*).
* = from controlled biological cultivation, Skal 1301

Way way worse food (inc. animal by products which is a fancy way to say any meat, skin, feathers, feet etc. they could not sell on from ANY type of animal as it's not even specified to a type grinded down into the food).

Hence the only way to make an informed decision is to look at what's actually going into the food and not the market (or far to often vet ) sell in of how great it is.

I would have to disagree with you on Burgess but as a matter of interest, what do you feed dogs and how much do you spend on it?

I don't own dogs (atm) due to my living and working habits as it would be unfair to the dog (10+ hours, 6+ day weeks with a lot of business travel); I used to be a firm believer that Royal Canin was the bestest food EVA! and I've been kicking myself ever since I learned the truth about it. That's also why I'm a bit off a crusader about dog/cat food in this forum in general because there is a ton of misinformation and conceptions on what's good out there and the reality is very different (and we all want what's best for our four legged friends). I spent (imo) far to long before I found out so I'm doing my damndest to make sure people can find out faster instead . If you want to see what could happen for cases were the food has not gone down so well previously and changing to a real high quality food I can recommend this thread by ShaShaBear which simply makes me smile every time I read it.

seanaway

All good points Nody and well said. However, since loing our jobs the high priced alternative ..well simply isn't one.

I'm glad you mentioned vet bills. We would never have a dog without insurance. In fact, she is recovering from a cruciate ligament operation at the mo and doing well. Ought to be at €2,500 all in. (The premium this year will be loaded at around 250% of last year's but if we have to sell the car we will.)

The funny thing is, she turned her nose up at the vet's free bag of Hills and whined for the Burgess. We did get her on the Hills jsut for weight control but now she's back on Burgess from today and LOVES it.

It's good to see someone campaigning the way you are and informing people about this. One small point though.
It's clear to all who read your posts you mean the absolute best for animals, and that's to be applauded.

However, it may be worth taking a moment sometimes to think about the dog lovers who would like to be able to buy a €70 bag of dog food but just can't because of circumstances. No real dog owner would deliberately feed their best pal with bad food - but sometimes - just like with the owners - well ... steak can't be on the menu.

Keep up the good work Nody.

Nody

seanaway wrote: »

One small point though.
It's clear to all who read your posts you mean the absolute best for animals, and that's to be applauded.

However, it may be worth taking a moment sometimes to think about the dog lovers who would like to be able to buy a €70 bag of dog food but just can't because of circumstances. No real dog owner would deliberately feed their best pal with bad food - but sometimes - just like with the owners - well ... steak can't be on the menu.

Fully agreed; and I'll do my best to find a dog food possible at any price range if asked but I'll also nudge said people to consider going up in the future if their circumstances allow it because most brands are with in 1-2 EUR per kilo price difference from poor to high quality and in some cases (such as Hills or RC) it may even be cheaper!

arnold27

Nody wrote: »

Fully agreed; and I'll do my best to find a dog food possible at any price range if asked but I'll also nudge said people to consider going up in the future if their circumstances allow it because most brands are with in 1-2 EUR per kilo price difference from poor to high quality and in some cases (such as Hills or RC) it may even be cheaper!

Sometimes more expensive food is cheaper than "cheaper" food. Lots of low cost brand make dogs more scraps, more feeding etc.. that's finaly make same or more cost (loo bag, cleaning time). Also it is true 60-70 euro for a bag of food is more than expensive but it is for 5-6 weeks that means cost two pint of beer a week or a chinese meal for one person at night that lots of people eating evenings. However I agreed with that RC, Hills and many other big brand not that good but only marketing makes them favorite food for lots of pet owners while Nutram, Taste of The Wild, Bozita, Orijen much better quality. Alternatively I beleive everybody could fine a reasonably good quality food for cheaper price than big brands for ex. Burns, Arden grange, Gain

muddypaws

Nody wrote: »

If you excuse me for saying so but Hills (and Royal Canin) and several others are along with Whiskas, Felix etc. (for cats) premium branded low/medium quality foods that are grossly overpriced. They live on commercials and not on food content and quality so I'd fully support you leaving Hills if nothing else then to not pay for the commercial adds! Now if I'd turn around instead and suggest foods instead I'd list some of the below (all depends on your budget but 22EUR/15kg will never get you a decent quality food; sorry); the below cost the same as Hills (per kilo).

Nody, could you please tell me where you've seen commercial ads for Hills and Royal Canin, as I can honestly say I've never seen any. I've seen them sponsor events alright, so seen their branding, but never seen an ad for them on the TV or in the press etc.

Whispered

Nody wrote: »

Fully agreed; and I'll do my best to find a dog food possible at any price range if asked but I'll also nudge said people to consider going up in the future if their circumstances allow it because most brands are with in 1-2 EUR per kilo price difference from poor to high quality and in some cases (such as Hills or RC) it may even be cheaper!

Oh help me then.

I did raw feed, but found it hard to keep up all the time. So now I'm doing a combination of raw feeding when I get to the butchers, cooked at home food (rice, potato, veg, mince or tinned dog food mixed in) and dry feeding. I'm a big fan of variety in their diet.

The dry food, I'm sorry to say, is whatever is on the supermarket shelf when I run out of fresh ingredients - simply because it was never part of the feeding plan. It never really bothered me because it happened once or twice a month. Lately however it's had to be a bit more often so I'd like to get a good quality dry in. However - it must be less than €50 a bag.

Any suggestions?

Nody

Whispered wrote: »

Oh help me then.

I did raw feed, but found it hard to keep up all the time. So now I'm doing a combination of raw feeding when I get to the butchers, cooked at home food (rice, potato, veg, mince or tinned dog food mixed in) and dry feeding. I'm a big fan of variety in their diet.

The dry food, I'm sorry to say, is whatever is on the supermarket shelf when I run out of fresh ingredients - simply because it was never part of the feeding plan. It never really bothered me because it happened once or twice a month. Lately however it's had to be a bit more often so I'd like to get a good quality dry in. However - it must be less than €50 a bag.

Any suggestions?

Well as a reference also add a weight to the bag because there's plenty of smaller bags for less then 50 EUR :P.

Anyway I'll assume 10 kilo bag so 5 EUR / kilo and 15 kilo bag so 3.33 EUR / kilo and as I'm lazy I'm only using Zooplus.

Applaws has multiple bags for 4.6 EUR per kilo as does Taste of the Wild at 4.77 EUR per kilo. Can't really go wrong with either for the below 5 EUR option. You also have Nutrivet (4.5 EUR) if you wanted further variety; alternative that's close to the 15kg bag price would be Almo Nature at 3.55 EUR.

Below 3.33 EUR we're getting a bit more limited for selection; I'll start off with Lukullus Beef & Trout; the economy option come in exactly at 3.33 EUR and while the rice is relatively high vs. top brand the rest of the list is good and we've gone down from top of the line at this price range. You also have Markus Muhle at 2.99 EUR (15 kg bag) while still having an impressive list and if you want to go even cheaper you're looking at Bozita at 2.46 EUR (15kg bag). By going to that price level how ever (Bozita) means walking into not having meat as first ingredient in the list but being Swedish made and controlled I'll still have some faith in them. Below Bozita's level I'm really not comfortable to go as we're entering into the price level of localized brands (which may be better then the above) and/or very low meat quality/content level.

Whispered

I would be hoping for 15kg bag. What sort of expert are you at all :P

Nody

Whispered wrote: »

I would be hoping for 15kg bag. What sort of expert are you at all :P

I'm not an expert; I simply spent a lot of time on Zooplus and similar sites :P

tk123

Whispered wrote: »

I would be hoping for 15kg bag. What sort of expert are you at all :P

Remember the shelf life for dry food if you're buying a big bag and only using it now and again. I buy small bags now after throwing our half a bag of TOTW Also zooplus.co.uk has a bigger range than .ie

seanaway

Thanks Nody. Your posts have made me take a 2nd look at the foods. I've checked out the Bozita brand and I have to say I like it. € per kilo Vs Burgess it does look promising as a better alternative.

Having lived in Sweden I can say your trust in their quality is well placed.

I think we will try it if we can and see how it goes.

Thanks again

I'll post once I have ffedback (pardon the semi-pun)

arnold27

But you can get Burgess in Ireland and Bozita as much as I know only ordered. I talked I few people and one of them got his order after 6 weeks from zooplus (royal Canin) another one almost two weeks. Better to find some food that locals can supply.
However it is a fact Bozita are good.

maggiepip

arnold27 wrote: »

But you can get Burgess in Ireland and Bozita as much as I know only ordered. I talked I few people and one of them got his order after 6 weeks from zooplus (royal Canin) another one almost two weeks. Better to find some food that locals can supply.
However it is a fact Bozita are good.

Ive been using zooplus monthly for my dog and cat food for ages now and I always get my order within 5 working days. They are an excellent company with great customer service. Only once did an order go missing and it was replaced (free of charge obviously) quickly and hassle free by zooplus. Id be lost without them.

tk123

maggiepip wrote: »

Ive been using zooplus monthly for my dog and cat food for ages now and I always get my order within 5 working days. They are an excellent company with great customer service. Only once did an order go missing and it was replaced (free of charge obviously) quickly and hassle free by zooplus. Id be lost without them.

+1 never any problems using GLS as the courier although I had one or two go missing with DHL - but they were resent no probs.

Inexile

Confession time after all our musing re what dog food to go one we have decided to try Skinners. I looked at the cost of it on Amazon, prompted by other threads on this site, and the price was just too good not to try out.

So so much for Irish made, convenient to pick up locally, etc, etc.

Hope it works out now for them all. If it doesn't work with the grey I will leave her on leader.

boomerang

In exile, my grey has been on Skinners at least a year now and has done very well on it - the duck, salmon and turkey varieties

lazeedaisy

Hi All,

Hoping for help here, Long story boring so be careful.

We have 3 dogs:

10 YO F greyhound ; 5 YO M spaniel/setter mix ; 3 yo M terrier mix

greyhound is a good eater, spaniel is borderline underweight - forgets to eat regularly and the terrier is a holy terror and overweight.

I want to change their food - in particular I want to start buying a good quality dry food.

I currently buy greyhound mince from my butcher and cook it with rice and feed it with Tesco complete - they wont eat pedigree and love the Tesco chicken and rice.

The greyhound will not under any circumstances eat raw meat, the other two love it and as a treat I would buy them a lambs heart. Her digestive system can be tricky if she eats anything like tinned dog food.

I have space and a large freezer to store food and meat and buy online - wilst I now live in a very rural area _ I would be happy to order online.

What would you recommend in the way of good quality dry food - is there one that would fit all three?

Also - a friend recommended a joint aid she gets from her vet for the greyhound - she cannot remember the name of it - says it comes like an oxo but jelly like.

we had a dog die of cancer and we used to cook a chicken and feed them chicken and rice also,

need some good advice and recommendations please,

tk123

Whispered wrote: »

Oh help me then.

I did raw feed, but found it hard to keep up all the time. So now I'm doing a combination of raw feeding when I get to the butchers, cooked at home food (rice, potato, veg, mince or tinned dog food mixed in) and dry feeding. I'm a big fan of variety in their diet.

The dry food, I'm sorry to say, is whatever is on the supermarket shelf when I run out of fresh ingredients - simply because it was never part of the feeding plan. It never really bothered me because it happened once or twice a month. Lately however it's had to be a bit more often so I'd like to get a good quality dry in. However - it must be less than €50 a bag.

Any suggestions?

If you're still looking and assuming its just for every now again (so you don't break the bank!) have you thought of Naturediet? I've been feeding it to the puppy to bulk out her raw food and get some weight on her - she's growing like a weed so not easy lol! It's not that expensive - you can get it for less than €1 a tray and ingrediants are pretty good. Also it doesn't take up space in the fridge/freezer and won't go off in a few months like an opened bag of dry food.

aonb

Lazeedaisy, I use ARTHRIAID from nutri-science.net (an Irish company, you could call them for stockists near you, or use their online shop) - my elderly dog with very difficult gastric & allergy problemS has been taking it for over a year. I definately see an improvement in the arthritis in his shoulder.

The other questions re food - you will get some more expert advice from the more knowledgable, but TASTE OF THE WILD, JAMES WELLBELOVED, ARDEN GRANGE are all good. There is a response earlier in this thread, from Nody had lots of suggestions - let us know what you choose/pick

muddypaws

I'm just changing some of my dogs onto Royal Canin 4300, which is a high energy food not available in shops, but through a Mushers Scheme, 17kg bags delivered. I'm putting the dogs that work hard onto it, the rest will be staying on Massbrook, which I am happy with, but feel that the hard working dogs just need something extra, and having won a few bags of the RC at previous rallies, I really liked the effect it had on the dogs. I've been feeding Massbrook Trial and Working Dog, the price is great, the dogs always eat it, and the poos are great.

Nody, not sure if you didn't see my question, but was wondering where you have seen commercials for RC, as I have honestly never seen one on TV etc.

Nody

muddypaws wrote: »

Nody, not sure if you didn't see my question, but was wondering where you have seen commercials for RC, as I have honestly never seen one on TV etc.

Walked in to any vet recently? Plastered on every wall, pamplets in the sitting area and even in vaccination card we got was from RC. Walked in on a cat show (not attended a dog show in ages so can't speak for dogs or other animals) and were greeted with Free RC sample packages, RC banners at all prominent locations. That's all advertising.

As a side note on the RC4300 food content:

COMPOSITION: rice, dehydrated poultry meat, animal fats, vegetable protein isolate*, maize gluten, minerals, hydrolysed animal proteins, vegetable fibres, beet pulp, fish oil, soya oil, copra oil, psyllium husks and seeds, fructo-oligo-saccharides, hydrolysed yeast (source of manno-oligo-saccharides), hydrolysed crustaceans (source of glucosamine), marigold extract (source of lutein), hydrolysed cartilage (source of chondroitin).

ANALYTICAL CONSTITUENTS: Protein: 28% - Fat content: 21% - Crude ash: 7.6% - Crude fibres: 2.7%

Applaws run at:
protein fat fibre
37.0% 19.0% 4.5%

ToTW
protein fat fibre
33.6% 18.0% 2.5%

muddypaws

Nody wrote: »

Walked in to any vet recently? Plastered on every wall, pamplets in the sitting area and even in vaccination card we got was from RC. Walked in on a cat show (not attended a dog show in ages so can't speak for dogs or other animals) and were greeted with Free RC sample packages, RC banners at all prominent locations. That's all advertising.

As a side note on the RC4300 food content:


Applaws run at:
protein fat fibre
37.0% 19.0% 4.5%

ToTW
protein fat fibre
33.6% 18.0% 2.5%

I don't have an issue with rice as a main ingredient, knowing a bit about nutrition, and the digestive system of the dog, sibes in particular, and knowing lots of people who own sled dogs that feed this particular food and have done for years, with very healthy, fit dogs.

Yes, the brands are in vets etc, although having been at my vet this morning, I didn't see RC anywhere on any of the walls, they do have Hills and some others. And, without the kind of promotion you mention, i.e. the banners at shows, those shows wouldn't be able to run, they cost money to put on, and sponsorship is key. Personally I'd rather have companies putting their money into those kind of events, being part of the national microchipping month etc, than not see them run at all due to lack of money, but that's just my point of view. Massbrook are heavily involved in field trials in Ireland, sponsoring events and obviously have their name displayed around those events, they're not a large company. Maybe we should take this to pm, as I'd love to know why you hate RC as much as you do.

The fat in those other two foods you've put up wouldn't be enough for hard working sled dogs. And as far as Applaws goes, I won't buy it, I did buy some treats, but they came from Thailand, and then when I went back to the pet shop, I looked at all of their Applaws products, and so did every one of them. I have to wonder about the animal welfare aspect, the miles of transport etc.

inocybe

RC have 'nutritionists' giving advice in pet shops at the moment

lazeedaisy

Hi guys,

thanks for the advice,

got samples from Red Mills, and the dogs adore it - plus its local to me.

SO its the Engage Salmon and rice for us for now,

thanks

lazeedaisy

ok scrap that "local" ****

Its 45 euro a bag and I can buy it on Amazon for 25 stg!

ZiabR

lazeedaisy wrote: »

ok scrap that "local" ****

Its 45 euro a bag and I can buy it on Amazon for 25 stg!

Link please, I see plenty of Red Mills on Amazon but its 45 sterling which is more than I pay here.

Vel

Inexile wrote: »

Confession time after all our musing re what dog food to go one we have decided to try Skinners. I looked at the cost of it on Amazon, prompted by other threads on this site, and the price was just too good not to try out.

So so much for Irish made, convenient to pick up locally, etc, etc.

Hope it works out now for them all. If it doesn't work with the grey I will leave her on leader.

How are you getting on with the Skinners? I want to change the food we use for our greyhound and lurcher and this seems to tick the boxes for us. I'm just wondering is it only available online for Ireland or can it be purchased in shops here? Thanks!

Lemlin

Vel wrote: »

How are you getting on with the Skinners? I want to change the food we use for our greyhound and lurcher and this seems to tick the boxes for us. I'm just wondering is it only available online for Ireland or can it be purchased in shops here? Thanks!

Depends on your definition of "Ireland". It can be purchased on this island in Northern Ireland. I've never seen it in a Republic of Ireland store.

Jollyes stock it and have shops in Enniskillen and Newry along the border. The price is the exact same as Amazon (£26.41) and they had limited stock when I was in their Enniskillen store two weeks ago. And by limited I mean two to three bags on the shelf.

Inexile

Vel wrote: »

How are you getting on with the Skinners? I want to change the food we use for our greyhound and lurcher and this seems to tick the boxes for us. I'm just wondering is it only available online for Ireland or can it be purchased in shops here? Thanks!

All doing well on it and we even switch flavours without proper change over. The first one we got was the duck and rice and on the second order for some reason the OH ordered the Salmon and Rice. The salmon and rice I think has a stronger odour but the dogs don't seem to care and it is suiting the grey too.

I tried it ages ago on the grey but it didn't agree with her but maybe that was due to the fact that I had only got her and probably didn't give her enough time to adjust. We get it through Amazaon. Price is generally about €36 for 15 KG bag. Brilliant value and delivery time is good too.

Millem

Inexile wrote: »

All doing well on it and we even switch flavours without proper change over. The first one we got was the duck and rice and on the second order for some reason the OH ordered the Salmon and Rice. The salmon and rice I think has a stronger odour but the dogs don't seem to care and it is suiting the grey too.

I tried it ages ago on the grey but it didn't agree with her but maybe that was due to the fact that I had only got her and probably didn't give her enough time to adjust. We get it through Amazaon. Price is generally about €36 for 15 KG bag. Brilliant value and delivery time is good too.

I only paid €20 on amazon for duck and rice last month with subscribe and save it was £18. I have seen it for sale in that big pet shop in newtownmountkennedy in Wicklow pet bliss I think they are called. It was a good €35 per bag!

lazeedaisy

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/B008EHRPU4/ref=dp_olp_new_mbc?ie=UTF8&condition=new&qid=1384434107&sr=8-1

I use the BT11AA and get free uk delivery usually - but only to folks house in Dublin as never gets redirected otherwise.

Waiting to see what they can do on the delivery prices -

Vel

Thanks for the feedback on Skinners! I'd prefer to be able to buy my food from a shop rather than online as more often than not we aren't home when the delivery is attempted and I don't drive and my partner works the hours when the product is then made available for collection so it makes it harder to pick up. Anything similar to Skinners (quality and price) that is available for purchase in shops in the Republic of Ireland? Must be low protein

Lemlin

Vel wrote: »

Thanks for the feedback on Skinners! I'd prefer to be able to buy my food from a shop rather than online as more often than not we aren't home when the delivery is attempted and I don't drive and my partner works the hours when the product is then made available for collection so it makes it harder to pick up. Anything similar to Skinners (quality and price) that is available for purchase in shops in the Republic of Ireland? Must be low protein

Why not get it delivered to one of your workplaces? That's what I do.

Or what if you got it delivered via Parcel Motel?