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Tenant poor on payment.

  • 26-08-2013 6:10pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭


    I've had a house rented out for about a year, and at least 5 times so far I've had to chase him for payment. He is supposed to pay into my account via the post office every Friday but there is always some excuse or something that crops up.

    He is on benefits and rent allowance etc, as well as single parent benefits.

    Is there any way that the rent can be paid directly from the welfare payment? Or do the post office offer any kind of direct payment like a standing order? Basically I want the payment to be automatic rather than him having to go and do it manually.

    The rent does come, but sometimes nearly a week late and it's a pain.

    He used to get his benefits paid into his bank account and had a standing order but since changing to collecting his benefits directly at the post office it's been nothing but hassle.


«1

Comments

  • Moderators, Education Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,986 Mod ✭✭✭✭Moonbeam


    Do rent allowance pay their portion directly to you and he pays the balance or does he pay you the full amount?
    I always deal with rent monthly.
    I think you just need to talk to him.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Next time it happens issue him with a 14 day written notice of arrears. It doesnt mean a whole lot in reality because if he pays up within the 14 days then you cant take it any further, but it might make him cop on a bit if he realises that there is a consequence to his late payment, especially if you tell him in no uncertain terms that if he ever exceeds the 14 days then he will be issued with a 28 day notice of termination and he will be evicted.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    It was originally monthly, but I agreed to weekly as it suited his benefits schedule.

    I'll look into the 14 day notice. I've talked to him a few times but he just seems too laid back about it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Question...

    If I issue the 14 day notice now, and the tenant pays up in time, is there nothing I can do?

    I mean if rent is constantly late, can I not still evict him based on that?

    Otherwise he essentially has a get out of jail free card to be 13 days late every time!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Question...

    If I issue the 14 day notice now, and the tenant pays up in time, is there nothing I can do?

    I mean if rent is constantly late, can I not still evict him based on that?

    Otherwise he essentially has a get out of jail free card to be 13 days late every time!
    Yes that is the system you can't do anything about it. The laws favour the tenant no matter what


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    :eek:

    What a pain in the arse! So my only chance of getting rid of the tenant is to hope that he misses the 14 day deadline?

    That said, I would prefer to have him just pay the damn rent and stay. But if this continues it will be more hassle than it's worth. It's a set 2 year lease. Can I decide not to renew it or are my hands tied there too?

    What happens if I ever decide to sell the house? Surely then I can evict them?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    :eek:

    What a pain in the arse! So my only chance of getting rid of the tenant is to hope that he misses the 14 day deadline?

    That said, I would prefer to have him just pay the damn rent and stay. But if this continues it will be more hassle than it's worth. It's a set 2 year lease. Can I decide not to renew it or are my hands tied there too?

    What happens if I ever decide to sell the house? Surely then I can evict them?


    It is worse than that. When you try to evict him he may stop paying rent and it could take a year easily enough. You will be very unlikely you will get the rent for that year even if given a order by the PRTB.

    On a two year lease you can't evict him by selling the property. You need to wait for the lease to expire or sell it with him as a sitting tenant.

    You could ask him to leave but he has no obligation to move. Given it is difficult to find LL that accept RA I doubt he will want to move.

    You are better off not issuing leases now as it is more restrictive and they have part 4 tenancy rights anyway.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Also, (and I suspect that this is a bit optimistic...)

    If I do issue a 14 day notice of arrears, is it specific to that particular payment or just a statement of arrears in general?

    In other words, given that the rent is being collected weekly, lets say that the rent days for a particular month are the 1st/8th/15th/22nd/29th.

    If he is late for the 1st and I issue a 14 day notice, then he needs to have that payment in for the 15th. But say he pays that amount on the 15th, but by that stage is also late on the payment for the 8th?

    Would I then have grounds for eviction based on him still being "in arrears" on the 15th, or is he off the hook because he did pay the missed amount from the 1st?

    If that scenario still plays out in his favour, then I may have to force him back onto monthly payments. The rental agreement states monthly, I've been allowing the weekly payments as a favour. It was never changed in the terms.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    It is worse than that. When you try to evict him he may stop paying rent and it could take a year easily enough. You will be very unlikely you will get the rent for that year even if given a order by the PRTB.

    On a two year lease you can't evict him by selling the property. You need to wait for the lease to expire or sell it with him as a sitting tenant.

    To clarify, I have no intention of selling for the forseeable future.

    Regarding the end of the lease, would I then be able to evict without any hassle? Or does the end of the lease mean he has to go, unless I offer an extension? Even if I'm not selling.

    By the sounds of things, I basically have to roll over and bend to this guy's unreliability. Because if I piss him off he can make my life hell!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    To clarify, I have no intention of selling for the forseeable future.

    Regarding the end of the lease, would I then be able to evict without any hassle? Or does the end of the lease mean he has to go, unless I offer an extension? Even if I'm not selling.

    By the sounds of things, I basically have to roll over and bend to this guy's unreliability. Because if I piss him off he can make my life hell!

    You could try ringing the local community welfare officer he deals with and telling them he is late on the rent regularly. Or, if you have to sign monthly forms for rent allowance like my old landlord did, just refuse to sign them if he has been late at any point in the previous month. He'll then get suspended.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Regarding the end of the lease, would I then be able to evict without any hassle? Or does the end of the lease mean he has to go, unless I offer an extension? Even if I'm not selling.

    Assuming the lease is longer than 6 months, he will get part 4 tenancy rights once it expires. This means that he is entitled to stay for up to 4 years, and you can only terminate the tenancy for a specific number of reasons (need the property for yourself/a family member, need to sell, do extensive rennovations being the main ones). At the start of the next 4 year cycle you are then entitled to terminate the tenancy without needing a specific reason.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    ShaShaBear wrote: »
    You could try ringing the local community welfare officer he deals with and telling them he is late on the rent regularly. Or, if you have to sign monthly forms for rent allowance like my old landlord did, just refuse to sign them if he has been late at any point in the previous month. He'll then get suspended.

    If the OP is having trouble getting rent paid as it is then having the tenants RA payment suspended is not going help matters!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    djimi wrote: »
    If the OP is having trouble getting rent paid as it is then having the tenants RA payment suspended is not going help matters!

    It would, since the tenant would likely not be able to afford to pay the rent within the 14 days once the notice of arrears has been given, and the OP would then have reason to give notice for eviction.

    I have absolutely no time for people who claim taxpayers hard earned money and are not even willing to put it to good use. I had to claim rent supplement before, and my rent was always the first priority, even over bills and food, no matter how broke I was that week.

    Given that the tenant is in receipt of RA, he must only have to lodge about €35 a week for the OP out of his own pocket, and the rest is given to him. I wouldn't muck about OP, if you have to sign stuff for him, stop signing it, and if he manages to come up with the money, I imagine he will learn a solid lesson. If he doesn't, you will have reason to evict him.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    ShaShaBear wrote: »
    It would, since the tenant would likely not be able to afford to pay the rent within the 14 days once the notice of arrears has been given, and the OP would then have reason to give notice for eviction.

    I have absolutely no time for people who claim taxpayers hard earned money and are not even willing to put it to good use. I had to claim rent supplement before, and my rent was always the first priority, even over bills and food, no matter how broke I was that week.

    Given that the tenant is in receipt of RA, he must only have to lodge about €35 a week for the OP out of his own pocket, and the rest is given to him. I wouldn't muck about OP, if you have to sign stuff for him, stop signing it, and if he manages to come up with the money, I imagine he will learn a solid lesson. If he doesn't, you will have reason to evict him.

    And if the OP tries to evict and the tenant digs their heals in the OP gets no rent for maybe a year or more while the case is being sorted out. The OP needs to play this carefully; its not in their interest to make it harder for the tenant to pay the rent as its nowhere near as straightforward as saying if they dont pay in the 14 days they are out on their ear.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 505 ✭✭✭Koptain Liverpool


    DrPhilG wrote: »

    By the sounds of things, I basically have to roll over and bend to this guy's unreliability. Because if I piss him off he can make my life hell!

    By the sounds of things also you're operating as a landlord without a bloody clue as to the rights and obligations of tenants and landlords.

    Go and read the relevant guides and legislation before coming on here and wasting people's time with questions for which the answers are readily available


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    By the sounds of things also you're operating as a landlord without a bloody clue as to the rights and obligations of tenants and landlords.

    Go and read the relevant guides and legislation before coming on here and wasting people's time with questions for which the answers are readily available


    As was pointed out to me what is wrong with asking for information?

    It is hard for people to understand a system that is so obviously bias.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    By the sounds of things also you're operating as a landlord without a bloody clue as to the rights and obligations of tenants and landlords.

    Go and read the relevant guides and legislation before coming on here and wasting people's time with questions for which the answers are readily available

    Feel free to bugger off if you have nothing constructive to add. This forum and many others would be dead and buried if everyone just went and searched themselves for the relevant info.

    The reason for coming here is to get people's real experience of similar situations and understand the realities and options. Thankfully most people are more helpful than you.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Back in topic, I haven't signed anything for the tenant. He told me he was getting rent allowance but has never asked me to sign anything.

    I'm starting to wonder how much of what I've been told is true and what is waffle...

    A call to the local welfare office may be next on my to do list.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Back in topic, I haven't signed anything for the tenant. He told me he was getting rent allowance but has never asked me to sign anything.

    I'm starting to wonder how much of what I've been told is true and what is waffle...

    A call to the local welfare office may be next on my to do list.

    He cant get rent allowance unless you sign a form originally. You might not have to sign them monthly, but you do have to sign one at the start, giving tax and PPS numbers. If you have not done this, then he is not getting rent supplement


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    ShaShaBear wrote: »
    He cant get rent allowance unless you sign a form originally. You might not have to sign them monthly, but you do have to sign one at the start, giving tax and PPS numbers. If you have not done this, then he is not getting rent supplement

    Pretty sure that never happened, so definitely some porkies being told.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Pretty sure that never happened, so definitely some porkies being told.

    Think its a SWA1 form - there is a section for the landlord. If you go in and ask to see one (not a social welfare office, a community welfare office) I'm sure you will recognise the back. I cant imagine why he would say he is getting it if he isnt - unless he is still claiming for a previous residence which got him more money and has moved to your cheaper residence and continued to collect the higher rate.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    ShaShaBear wrote: »
    unless he is still claiming for a previous residence which got him more money and has moved to your cheaper residence and continued to collect the higher rate.

    Lol, bingo.

    His previous address was at a much higher rate, bigger house etc.

    One of the reasons given for a late payment recently, was that his benefits had been frozen as the welfare department sent out a letter, but it went to the old address.

    From what you've just told me, it sounds like he has moved to my place for cheaper rent, but has still been claiming the higher rate of allowance on the old place.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Lol, bingo.

    His previous address was at a much higher rate, bigger house etc.

    One of the reasons given for a late payment recently, was that his benefits had been frozen as the welfare department sent out a letter, but it went to the old address.

    From what you've just told me, it sounds like he has moved to my place for cheaper rent, but has still been claiming the higher rate of allowance on the old place.


    Big problem with this and in one local office when they just sent out letters to verify addresses they managed to cut 25% off the local live register.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    Big problem with this and in one local office when they just sent out letters to verify addresses they managed to cut 25% off the local live register.

    Should surely make life easier for me if I need to evict too.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Should surely make life easier for me if I need to evict too.
    Sorry to inform you it may be worse. If they find out he owe them money and cut his RA he may just stop paying rent. Then you have to go through the full eviction process which can take over a year without any rent and no chance of payment.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,085 ✭✭✭✭neris


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    By the sounds of things, I basically have to roll over and bend to this guy's unreliability. Because if I piss him off he can make my life hell!

    Basically yes. Dont forget your "the big bad money grabbing landlord" and hes only a poor innocent defenseless individual. Tennants have all the rights no matter much it affects you, your bank account or your mortgage. Tennants can really screw up your relationship with the bank if you rely on the rent to meet repayments but hey who cares cause your a landlord rolling in cash causing these poor unfortnatues to live in filth & squalor (might be a slight exageration but you get the point)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    Sorry to inform you it may be worse. If they find out he owe them money and cut his RA he may just stop paying rent. Then you have to go through the full eviction process which can take over a year without any rent and no chance of payment.

    Lol.

    I give up.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,513 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Lol.

    I give up.


    The laws and the process is truly not fit for purpose. The government would be much happier with big business running all rental so they don't have to ever sort out the laws.

    There are serial renters who do this intentionally and then insist on a payment to move out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,017 ✭✭✭lomb


    Never do a lease for more than a year. I would actually suggest 6 months now looking at it. Fixed term lease here http://www.topfloor.ie/freebies/lease

    Yes , dont rock the boat, let the lease come to a natural end and then tell him a family member or you is moving in(just to ease his mind). I personally if I wanted to evict a tenant would issue a 14 day notice, then the 28 day notice then I would go down and remove his stuff from the house or move in myself with him saying youve no where else to go/start removing furniture/ cutting utilities physically if necessary etc . I wouldnt bother with going furthur through the PRTB which is a waste of time. Youve fullfilled every reasonable legal obligation at the 28 day point. (Dont rent to any intimidating people)

    If they want to sue you let them, I doubt they would get far with the above.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 543 ✭✭✭nightster1


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    I've had a house rented out for about a year, and at least 5 times so far I've had to chase him for payment. He is supposed to pay into my account via the post office every Friday but there is always some excuse or something that crops up.

    He is on benefits and rent allowance etc, as well as single parent benefits.

    Is there any way that the rent can be paid directly from the welfare payment? Or do the post office offer any kind of direct payment like a standing order? Basically I want the payment to be automatic rather than him having to go and do it manually.

    The rent does come, but sometimes nearly a week late and it's a pain.

    He used to get his benefits paid into his bank account and had a standing order but since changing to collecting his benefits directly at the post office it's been nothing but hassle.

    OP, Get tenant to write to welfare officer to request payment to your bank account.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,017 ✭✭✭lomb


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    You are better off not issuing leases now as it is more restrictive and they have part 4 tenancy rights anyway.

    Do they though with a fixed term tenancy?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    nightster1 wrote: »
    OP, Get tenant to write to welfare officer to request payment to your bank account.

    That was my original thought when I started the thread, wasn't sure if this was possible.

    But does the rent allowance cover all the rent or only part? Would still leave me having to chase him for the rest!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,528 ✭✭✭ShaShaBear


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    That was my original thought when I started the thread, wasn't sure if this was possible.

    But does the rent allowance cover all the rent or only part? Would still leave me having to chase him for the rest!

    All of it (if the rent is under limits) apart from around 30 or 40 quid that he has to pay himself.

    But I think I might be right, he hasnt changed his address. Do you mind me asking how much is the rent per week, and where the property is?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,580 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    By the sounds of things also you're operating as a landlord without a bloody clue as to the rights and obligations of tenants and landlords.

    Go and read the relevant guides and legislation before coming on here and wasting people's time with questions for which the answers are readily available
    DrPhilG wrote: »
    Feel free to bugger off if you have nothing constructive to add. This forum and many others would be dead and buried if everyone just went and searched themselves for the relevant info.

    The reason for coming here is to get people's real experience of similar situations and understand the realities and options. Thankfully most people are more helpful than you.
    Knock it off, both of you

    Moderator


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,286 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    :eek:

    What a pain in the arse! So my only chance of getting rid of the tenant is to hope that he misses the 14 day deadline?

    That said, I would prefer to have him just pay the damn rent and stay. But if this continues it will be more hassle than it's worth. It's a set 2 year lease. Can I decide not to renew it or are my hands tied there too?

    What happens if I ever decide to sell the house? Surely then I can evict them?

    If you gave him a 2 year lease- he has a 2 year lease.
    Unless the lease has break provisions- it remains valid for the term of 2 years.
    If you decide to move back into the property- or sell it, within those 2 years- and you do not have these events written into the lease- you will likely have to compensate him for breaking his lease (only if he is amenable to it).

    At the end of the 2 years- you give notice prior to the end of the lease- with the appropriate notice period (as defined by the 2004 Act- as he has been there over 6 months, he has the protection of a Part 4 Tenancy), that you are not renewing the lease- and you legitimately use one of the listed reasons in the Act for this reason (e.g. selling the property, moving back in yourself or needed by a family member etc). It must be a legitimate reason though- you can't say you're selling the property- and then not put it on the market etc.

    Right now- I'd issue him with the 14 day notice- as suggested earlier in this thread- and when he does pay uptodate- then suggest the rent is paid directly into your bank account. Chasing him every single week would be a nightmare- I know I certainly wouldn't have the time to do something like this.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,316 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    From what you've just told me, it sounds like he has moved to my place for cheaper rent, but has still been claiming the higher rate of allowance on the old place.
    If you find this is true (annual rent review), raise the rent, and watch him scurry to a cheaper place? Once he's gone, report him.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    lomb wrote: »
    I personally if I wanted to evict a tenant would issue a 14 day notice, then the 28 day notice then I would go down and remove his stuff from the house or move in myself with him saying youve no where else to go/start removing furniture/ cutting utilities physically if necessary etc . I wouldnt bother with going furthur through the PRTB which is a waste of time. Youve fullfilled every reasonable legal obligation at the 28 day point. (Dont rent to any intimidating people)

    If they want to sue you let them, I doubt they would get far with the above.

    They would most likely get very far. What you are suggesting is an illegal eviction and the PRTB would come down on you like a ton of bricks, regardless of whether the tenant is in rent arrears or not. The law does not cease to apply just because the notice period has expired, and any tenant who is playing the sly waiting game is surely only looking for you to slip up so they can pounce.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,017 ✭✭✭lomb


    How about a break clause in every lease that the landlord can end the lease with 2 weeks notice in order to sell it/ move in / whatever. Break the lease and chuck them out!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 998 ✭✭✭dharma200


    He cannot get rent allowance for your property unless you sign a form, provide proof that you own the property , such as a copy of your house insurance, your prtb membership or nnpr.... Also you have to provide your tax number in the rent allowance form. If you have not given him any of this then he is certainly not receiving rent allowance for you property, there are also forms that you need to fill in every few months, I think quarterly, to allow him to continue receiving rent allowance.

    I would definately get in touch with him, sort something out with him, ask him why you have not had any if the forms, tell him you need to give his welfare officer your tax number expect and see what the reaction is, perhaps this will hurry him into getting the rent to you and getti ng everything above board.

    If I were you I would try to sort it out with tenant first, in a amicable manner, before dog g anything drastic. And if I were you I would seriously read up on letti g to tenants as you don't seem to know the basics which in the end could cause you serious hassle and money.. Hths


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 202 ✭✭camphor


    lomb wrote: »
    How about a break clause in every lease that the landlord can end the lease with 2 weeks notice in order to sell it/ move in / whatever. Break the lease and chuck them out!

    It wouldn't be lawful. How about doing proper research and knowing the law before starting?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    lomb wrote: »
    How about a break clause in every lease that the landlord can end the lease with 2 weeks notice in order to sell it/ move in / whatever. Break the lease and chuck them out!

    You cannot write anything into a lease that seeks to reduce the rights afforded to the tenant under the RTA 2004. Even if they signed a lease with such a clause included it would not be legally binding.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,017 ✭✭✭lomb


    Some of the information in this thread is highly misleading.
    Firstly Part 4 tenancy is only afforded to those NOT on fixed term contracts. To get onto Part 4 a fixed term contract cannot be in place or towards the end of the contract between 3 months and 1 month they have to give notice that a renewal would be on Part 4 grounds. Therefore it is better to keep them on fixed term so the poster suggesting no contract is crazy.

    Secondly, the PRTB will only fine a landlord upto 20k. The average is 5k , and probably much less if I gave them 2 weeks notice and then a 28days to break the lease. After this they are in cowboy country and so are you. Overholding and not paying rent for a year while one secures an eviction will cost circa 12k in lost rents.
    Therefore as I said I would issue them the 2 weeks, then the 4 and physically remove them and let them sue me and wish them the best of luck with it. I doubt they will get far to be honest and anyone thinking they would is living in their books of laws rather than reality.

    Thirdly I will be putting into future contracts that breakage of the lease , issuance of 2 week and 28 day notices will mean breach of contract meaning a cost of 20k in breach of contract+ legal fees. This would offset any suing and a solicitor is unlikely to take it on.

    Frankly someone doing that can go swing.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    seriously Lomb please stop posting until you actually know what your posting about.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,017 ✭✭✭lomb


    D3PO wrote: »
    seriously Lomb please stop posting until you actually know what your posting about.

    In what sense? Loss of 1 years rent is 12k in Dublin. Therefore simple logic dictates the tenancy per the Tenancy act is terminated with the 14 day, and 28 day notice . Therefore there is NO tenancy after this 28 day period . This means that they are in cowboy country and so are you. The only way this can be appealed is if they claim they did not receive notice. This means it would have to be by registered post, email and text message.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 202 ✭✭camphor


    lomb wrote: »
    Firstly Part 4 tenancy is only afforded to those NOT on fixed term contracts.

    Wrong! No need to comment further.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    lomb wrote: »
    Firstly Part 4 tenancy is only afforded to those NOT on fixed term contracts. To get onto Part 4 a fixed term contract cannot be in place or towards the end of the contract between 3 months and 1 month they have to give notice that a renewal would be on Part 4 grounds. Therefore it is better to keep them on fixed term so the poster suggesting no contract is crazy.

    Part 4 rights run alongside the fixed term lease and forms the minimum rights afforded to a tenant. Anything that you write into a lease that looks to reduce these minimum rights is not legally binding.

    You do not have to request a part 4 either. Legally you must inform the landlord of your intention to remain on a part 4 if you wish to avoid being held liable for any costs incurred in readvertising etc, but a landlord cannot deny part 4 rights, and a tenant does not have to request them.
    lomb wrote: »
    Secondly, the PRTB will only fine a landlord upto 20k. The average is 5k , and probably much less if I gave them 2 weeks notice and then a 28days to break the lease. After this they are in cowboy country and so are you. Overholding and not paying rent for a year while one secures an eviction will cost circa 12k in lost rents.
    Therefore as I said I would issue them the 2 weeks, then the 4 and physically remove them and let them sue me and wish them the best of luck with it. I doubt they will get far to be honest and anyone thinking they would is living in their books of laws rather than reality.

    There are a lot of tenants out there who know the law inside and out, and make a living from screwing over landlords who dont act 100% legally. Thats the reality. Its up to you as to how much of a risk you wish to take, but you will end up severely out of pocket either way.
    lomb wrote: »
    Thirdly I will be putting into future contracts that breakage of the lease , issuance of 2 week and 28 day notices will mean breach of contract meaning a cost of 20k in breach of contract+ legal fees. This would offset any suing and a solicitor is unlikely to take it on.

    You may as well save yourself the ink and not bother; it would just make you look like a clown who hasnt a clue about the legality of being a landlord.
    lomb wrote: »
    Some of the information in this thread is highly misleading.

    Oh the irony...


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,126 ✭✭✭Santa Cruz


    DrPhilG wrote: »
    I've had a house rented out for about a year, and at least 5 times so far I've had to chase him for payment. He is supposed to pay into my account via the post office every Friday but there is always some excuse or something that crops up.

    He is on benefits and rent allowance etc, as well as single parent benefits.

    Is there any way that the rent can be paid directly from the welfare payment? Or do the post office offer any kind of direct payment like a standing order? Basically I want the payment to be automatic rather than him having to go and do it manually.

    The rent does come, but sometimes nearly a week late and it's a pain.

    He used to get his benefits paid into his bank account and had a standing order but since changing to collecting his benefits directly at the post office it's been nothing but hassle.

    And people wonder why letting ads say "No rent allowance"
    Are you running a business or a charity
    Final warning and get rid if not paying on time.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,316 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Send the 14 day notice today for him to pay up.

    In light of constant late payments, revise the rents up to meet local rents of a similar house (introduce the fear).

    In light of him saying that he gets social payment, ask for all the forms so that you can sign them to ensure they're up to date (instil the panic if he's not doing this legit).

    If he cannot get the forms, you'll advise the local welfare office that the tenant is living here, so that he gets what is due (he may even start sweating).

    If he does pay, send a letter out to him each time he's late, and maybe include the documentation that he needs to fill out.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,494 ✭✭✭Sala


    If the house is rented out for about a year, and OP has contacted him 5 times so far, that's one in in every 10 payments late, by a week or so. I think OP could be a lot worse off. If you have a tenant who refuses to pay and refuses to leave it can take ages to get them out while you are losing money. Annoying it may be, but you are getting paid


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,616 ✭✭✭✭DrPhilG


    Well...

    Things have taken a twist. On the same day I was going to call and deliver a 14 day arrears notice, he calls me up and says he is moving out. So I might just be lucky.

    Am I right in thinking that I should still issue the 14 day notice? Just in case his agreed departure date comes and goes and he lingers on? Or does the fact that he has confirmed a date to move (I have confirmation in a text message) mean that I can insist that he sticks to that date?

    I don't want to wait 10 days (thats when he said he'll be gone) and then find that he is still sticking around giving me excuses.


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