AA: Annual car running cost €11,900

Mr Mike

Hi guys

What do you think of AA estimate for the annual running costs of a family car?

Seems ridiculously high to me.

Alanstrainor

Need more details.

Does that include depreciation? What car? How many miles will this family car cover in a year? Diesel petrol?

colm_mcm

€1000 a month?

Maybe in their office.

Mr Mike

Think it was a small car 1.2L petrol. Covering the average 16000km per year and including depreciation.

No wonder people are struggling with money ;(

OldmanMondeo

To be fair, probably not far off. Take car loan, servicing, tax, insurance, fuel into account your looking at the guts of a grand a month.

Valetta

Sounds way over the top.

I have calculated my running costs for a 21k 2.2 diesel car doing 10k miles per year at €6,000 including depreciation.

colm_mcm

Its nonsense to be fair, they have no way of calculating that.

OldmanMondeo

Valetta wrote: »

Sounds way over the top.

I have calculated my running costs for a 21k 2.2 diesel car doing 10k miles per year at €6,000 including depreciation.

Double your milage and see what you get. What loan are you working that on?

1.8 Diesel car, doing 40k klms per year

Per month
€320 plus on diesel
€40 €400 per year insurance
€24 €280 tax
€33 €400 servicing, based on 2 per year at dealer pricing
€42 €500 tyres
€17 €200 pads, discs, wipers, cleaning etc
€324 loan per month based on a €10k loan over 5 year ~(just pulled of a banking site)

€800 per month

Some of these figures are estimates, and I didn't factor in deprecation.

Valetta

I'll put up my calculations in the morning .

I'd say the AA are overdoing the depreciation... Probably working off a new price of 25k and trading in after 3 tears for 10k.

CiniO

Mr Mike wrote: »

Think it was a small car 1.2L petrol. Covering the average 16000km per year and including depreciation.

No wonder people are struggling with money ;(

I've had a 1.2 petrol car for the last 5 years. It's been doing around 16,000km per year on average.

And over those last 5 years, it cost me less than 12,000euro tincluding every single cost associated with car (cost to buy, depreciation, servicing, tax, insurance, fuel, tyes, screenwash, carwash, parking tickets, etc).

So either I can run a car 5 times cheaper than AA estimate, or their estimation is a bit wrong.

Scortho

Mr Mike wrote: »

Hi guys

What do you think of AA estimate for the annual running costs of a family car?

Seems ridiculously high to me.

It is complete and utter jack ****.
My car is an alfa 156 2.5v6.
Running costs as follows.
Tax 1080.
Insurance 1100 (21 3 years Ncb)
Petrol 2120. (8000 miles a year, 24mpg and price of 1.59)
As its an alfa and its 11 years old, maintenance is 1200 (tyres, service, 150 towards belt yearly for 4 years, and contingency)
Depreciation. Meh she's not for sale and when she is I should get 1800 back, maybe a little less but nothing to write home about.

Grand total of running a v6 for the year.
5500
The smile it puts on my face every time the busso revs over 3000. Priceless.

unkel

Like Alan said, we need more details of the examples / calculations the AA made

Most Irish people do not take into account some hidden costs of owning a car. They ignore what they paid for the car and they don't understand the opportunity cost of money. I.e. they buy a brand new Toyota Avensis diesel with a few options. In the first year their depreciation is €7k and the interest on the loan for the car is €2.5k. With tax and insurance that's already the guts of the €11.9k the AA is talking about. And that's without driving the car for a single mile

Scortho

unkel wrote: »

Like Alan said, we need more details of the examples / calculations the AA made

Most Irish people do not take into account some hidden costs of owning a car. They ignore what they paid for the car and they don't understand the opportunity cost of money. I.e. they buy a brand new Toyota Avensis diesel with a few options. In the first year their depreciation is €7k and the interest on the loan for the car is €2.5k. With tax and insurance that's already the guts of the €11.9k the AA is talking about. And that's without driving the car for a single mile

We can safely say most irish people are bonkers.
Imagine what kinda car you could get for 10 k.
Or even 2k (that jag xj8) and spend the other 8k on running it.

unkel

Scortho wrote: »

Or even 2k (that jag xj8) and spend the other 8k on running it.

Bought a lovely €4k 6-pot BMW 5-series today myself. It's mint

lomb

It doesnt bother me particularly but some people dont want someone elses used car. I dont either but I dont at this time want to shell out 60k for a new motor which would suit me. I cant see myself paying 25k for a bog spec run of the mill car.
I keep banging on that the cheapest csr to own is something like a 12 year old polo/yaris etc. Cheap to fix, reliable, no depreciation, good mpg , low tax. Can easily maintain ones mobility doing 15km for under 2k a year.

Idbatterim

Bought a lovely €4k 6-pot BMW 5-series today myself. It's mint

nice, congrats E39 or E60?

Alanstrainor

unkel wrote: »

Bought a lovely €4k 6-pot BMW 5-series today myself. It's mint

tobsey

CiniO wrote: »

I've had a 1.2 petrol car for the last 5 years. It's been doing around 16,000km per year on average.

And over those last 5 years, it cost me less than 12,000euro tincluding every single cost associated with car (cost to buy, depreciation, servicing, tax, insurance, fuel, tyes, screenwash, carwash, parking tickets, etc).

So either I can run a car 5 times cheaper than AA estimate, or their estimation is a bit wrong.

I doubt the 1.2 would be classified as family car for this purpose.

tobsey

tobsey wrote: »

I doubt the 1.2 would be classified as family car for this purpose.

Brava/o? Sounds like a family car to me.

tin79

Its a "how long is a piece of string" question really.

I have an 08 family car which I bought for cash at 10,500. Which I will keep for probably 5-6 years at which point it will be worth almost nothing really. Cost of car 1,750 per year. I spend 200 a month on fuel. 2,400 a year. Tax is 390. Servicing 400. Assuming the DMF goes over the 6 years 1500 (averaged out over 6 years) 250 per year. Insurance 700 a year.

So that's just short of 6 grand. But based on unkels post a while back you can easily see how high it could go. Really depending on the cost of purchase, loan cost, tax, insurance cost it could be higher.

I can see a range of anything from 3,000 to 15,000 or more at the top end.

However I would think the AAs figure would be higher than the average

monkeybutter

unkel wrote: »

Bought a lovely €4k 6-pot BMW 5-series today myself. It's mint

You flash Harry. What happened to the Saab?

unkel

monkeybutter wrote: »

What happened to the Saab?

It will go into the bangernomics thread today :cool:

CiniO

tobsey wrote: »

I doubt the 1.2 would be classified as family car for this purpose.

Persumable that's what AA based their calculation on

Mr Mike wrote: »

Think it was a small car 1.2L petrol. Covering the average 16000km per year and including depreciation.

CiniO

Scortho wrote: »

We can safely say most irish people are bonkers.
Imagine what kinda car you could get for 10 k.
Or even 2k (that jag xj8) and spend the other 8k on running it.

If everyone were buying old cars for 2k, and no one buying new ones, there would be no old ones after a while.

It's like - you buy second hand thing if you can't afford new one...

F.e most people buy new flat screen TV's, even though they could buy a second hand one for fraction of the price. They do it, because they can afford it, and don't want to go into the risk of buying second hand one which might stop working next day.
And same thing with cars - if someone can afford to buy new - they do.

Scortho

CiniO wrote: »

If everyone were buying old cars for 2k, and no one buying new ones, there would be no old ones after a while.

It's like - you buy second hand thing if you can't afford new one...

F.e most people buy new flat screen TV's, even though they could buy a second hand one for fraction of the price. They do it, because they can afford it, and don't want to go into the risk of buying second hand one which might stop working next day.
And same thing with cars - if someone can afford to buy new - they do.

I could have bought a new polo. But I figured why spend 16k plus on a 1.2 3 cyl when I could buy the alfa v6 for 1800 instead!

I suppose though its in my interest for Irish people to continue in my opinion being bonkers!

CiniO

Scortho wrote: »

I could have bought a new polo. But I figured why spend 16k plus on a 1.2 3 cyl when I could buy the alfa v6 for 1800 instead!

I suppose though its in my interest for Irish people to continue in my opinion being bonkers!

Yeah, but that's different thing.
If you need/want Alfa v6, then new one would cost you way more than 16k.
No point in thinking for how much could you buy a polo, if you want/need alfa v6.

But there are people out there, who don't need or want anything better than fiat panda, or dacia sandero, and if they can afford to get brand new one for 10k, then no point to buy a secondhand.

kippy

12K a year!
I hope not, would need to earn close enough to 20K to actually pay that out.

If they are factoring in depreciation I would assume they are bassing that figure off a relatively new car.

Scortho

CiniO wrote: »

Yeah, but that's different thing.
If you need/want Alfa v6, then new one would cost you way more than 16k.
No point in thinking for how much could you buy a polo, if you want/need alfa v6.

But there are people out there, who don't need or want anything better than fiat panda, or dacia sandero, and if they can afford to get brand new one for 10k, then no point to buy a secondhand.

You can't buy a new alfa v6 anyway as it is.

I suppose that's true. I know from when I bought it, the amount of people with new paddy specs asking me was I mad and it was going to cost me a fortune to run.
They didn't appreciate when it was pointed out how much their car would depreciate in the next three years!:)

Scortho

Scortho wrote: »

We can safely say most irish people are bonkers.
Imagine what kinda car you could get for 10 k.
Or even 2k (that jag xj8) and spend the other 8k on running it.

Anybody making the statement along the lines of "people are stupid to buy new cars" needs to take a long hard look at themselves. It's an absolutely ridiculous outlook.

Scortho

Kali Noisy Driver wrote: »

Anybody making the statement along the lines of "people are stupid to buy new cars" needs to take a long hard look at themselves. It's an absolutely ridiculous outlook.

Go on and explain.
My reasoning behind used.
Buy a bangernomic run it for 5 years and I'd be surprised if the new car after 5 years works out cheaper.

CiniO

Kali Noisy Driver wrote: »

Anybody making the statement along the lines of "people are stupid to buy new cars" needs to take a long hard look at themselves. It's an absolutely ridiculous outlook.

Having a new car is generally more expensive than having old one.

unkel

I don't understand why someone would buy a brand new middle of the road car for €20k

That person doesn't understand why I buy a much nicer, but 10 year old car that costs more to run for a only a couple of grand

But each to their own and all that, we'll never understand each other

monkeybutter wrote: »

You flash Harry. What happened to the Saab?

Gone now. To a boardsie

Idbatterim wrote: »

nice, congrats E39 or E60?

Apologies, should have specified. '04 E60 straight 6 520i 2.2l

Scortho

Scortho wrote: »

Go on and explain.
My reasoning behind used.
Buy a bangernomic run it for 5 years and I'd be surprised if the new car after 5 years works out cheaper.

CiniO wrote: »

Having a new car is generally more expensive than having old one.

I never said it would be cheaper to buy the new car and I'm not saying people shouldn't buy 2nd hand as of yet I've only ever bought 2nd hand cars. But the only reason anyone buys a 2nd hand car is because they can't afford the type of car they want new.

The reason the statement is stupid though is that if people take the advise where are 2nd hand cars going to come from and why is a person who can afford to and chooses to buy a new car stupid to do so?

kippy

There wouldn't be a second hand car market (indeed a car market at all) if someone somewhere didn't buy a car when new......

Some people have the money/need/requirement to buy cars new - let them off. The reduction in them has made second hand cars harder to come by.

Scortho

Kali Noisy Driver wrote: »

I never said it would be cheaper to buy the new car and I'm not saying people shouldn't buy 2nd hand as of yet I've only ever bought 2nd hand cars. But the only reason anyone buys a 2nd hand car is because they can't afford the type of car they want new.

The reason the statement is stupid though is that if people take the advise where are 2nd hand cars going to come from and why is a person who can afford to and chooses to buy a new car stupid to do so?

I want my fellow irish people to keep buying cars in their droves. And if they don't ill just head to the uk.

I could afford to buy new, it just so happens that cars I want, they can't be bought anymore.
You can't buy a new alfa with a busso engine.
You can't buy a new 8 series.
You can't buy a e34 m5 new.
Personally I'd rather a Sud than a mito.

Scortho

Scortho wrote: »

I want my fellow irish people to keep buying cars in their droves. And if they don't ill just head to the uk.


I could afford to buy new, it just so happens that cars I want, they can't be bought anymore.
You can't buy a new alfa with a busso engine.
You can't buy a new 8 series.
You can't buy a e34 m5 new.
Personally I'd rather a Sud than a mito.

It's a bit condescending to say you want them to keep buying cars yet calling them fools for doing so.

You could buy the far better in every possible way new M5 though if you have 100k+ lying around.

You have to remember a lot of people just want a nice comfortable economical car that's new, under warranty and won't leave them stuck at the side of the road.

I'm not one of them myself at the moment I can't afford the cars I want to drive new but hopefully I will eventually and then I will buy new. What could be nicer than a brand new completely untouched car, no wear and tear, perfect paint work etc etc.

Tea 1000

Scortho wrote: »

I want my fellow irish people to keep buying cars in their droves. And if they don't ill just head to the uk.

I could afford to buy new, it just so happens that cars I want, they can't be bought anymore.
You can't buy a new alfa with a busso engine.
You can't buy a new 8 series.
You can't buy a e34 m5 new.
Personally I'd rather a Sud than a mito.

You could afford to buy a new M5?

NuckingFacker

err, I buy €600 bangers and drive them till the nct expires, usually a year if I get it right - then get another... I dig bangers. The missus, not so much..she hates bangers. Her cars more AA stylee.

Scortho

Tea 1000 wrote: »

You could afford to buy a new M5?

I wish. I meant as in I could afford a new corolla. I'd rather spend it elsewhere.

Scortho

Scortho wrote: »

I wish. I meant as in I could afford a new corolla. I'd rather spend it elsewhere.

Well that's the point, the only reason anybody buys 2nd hand is they cant afford what they want new. Some people have 20k to spend on a car and have no interest in anything special they just want a new, realiable and economical car. They can afford to buy the car they want new, others of us can't.

If I had 20k to spend I wouldn't buy a new car as I would have no interest in the type of car 20k would buy new, I'd spend the 20k on something though if i had it and not make do with something for 10k.

If I was spending 30k to 40k though it would be different, I wouldn't be looking for something 2nd hand I'd be most likely looking at buying something like a new golf GTI or GTD as these are the types of car I would like.

Scortho

Kali Noisy Driver wrote: »

Well that's the point, the only reason anybody buys 2nd hand is they cant afford what they want new. Some people have 20k to spend on a car and have no interest in anything special they just want a new, realiable and economical car. They can afford to buy the car they want new, others of us can't.

If I had 20k to spend I wouldn't buy a new car as I would have no interest in the type of car 20k would buy new, I'd spend the 20k on something though if i had it and not make do with something for 10k.

If I was spending 30k to 40k though it would be different, I wouldn't be looking for something 2nd hand I'd be most likely looking at buying something like a new golf GTI or GTD as these are the types of car I would like.

I'd be totally opposite.
I'd buy about 5 different cars rather than spend 30 or 40 k on a new golf.

Also the cars I want, can't be bought new anyway.
They don't hand build m5s anymore and I prefer the look of the e34 over the f10.
They don't use busso engines in alfas either. Now the 1750 tbi engine has more bhp than the 2.5 v6, but most alfa fans and even non alfa fans would choose the v6.

I used to be a new car only type of person. Until I discovered how much better value there is at the lower end of the market. Once the reg plate doesn't bother you, it's happy days.


Is love a golf by the way. A gti as well. But it'd be a mk1.

Even if I had 1 million to spend, it'd still be used.

unkel

Kali Noisy Driver wrote: »

If I had 20k to spend I wouldn't buy a new car as I would have no interest in the type of car 20k would buy new

I think we all agree in this thread after all

Most Irish people are different though. They just want to buy as new as possible, even if that means owning a sh1tbox (in our eyes) as long as the tax is low

Look at the number of new cheapo low emissions crap superminis that are being sold!

Even the people that do have quite a lot of money to spend, they buy the entry level 4 pot diesel versions of what used to be nice cars

I think something like 95% or more of BMW 5-series sold are 4 pot diesels!

unkel

unkel wrote: »

I think we all agree in this thread after all

Most Irish people are different though. They just want to buy as new as possible, even if that means owning a sh1tbox (in our eyes) as long as the tax is low

Look at the number of new cheapo low emissions crap superminis that are being sold!

Even the people that do have quite a lot of money to spend, they buy the entry level 4 pot diesel versions of what used to be nice cars

I think something like 95% or more of BMW 5-series sold are 4 pot diesels!

I completely understand people who buy a new super mini though. My mother for instance has no interest in spec or power or anything like that. She wants a nice new car for herself that all she has to do is service it when required and never worry about it having any problem or leaving her stuck, she wants it economical and fairly cheap to tax. Then after a few years trade it in for another new one and repeat.

Same exact thing with my aunt, she likes to have a new car again not bothered with spec just wants something that won't required anyone other than servicing and filling with diesel etc.

Even buying the entry level diesel BMW's makes since for a lot of people. They don't need power they just want a nice comfortable and economical car, would be a waste of money buying something with a bigger engine for them.

Scortho wrote: »

Is love a golf by the way. A gti as well. But it'd be a mk1.
.

The MK1 gti's are a classic, still wouldn't swap my mk5 GTI for one though but would absolutely love a brand new GTI.

MuppetCheck

unkel wrote: »

Even the people that do have quite a lot of money to spend, they buy the entry level 4 pot diesel versions of what used to be nice cars

I think something like 95% or more of BMW 5-series sold are 4 pot diesels!

To be fair, I think they are a lot better than you make them out to be. I had my first drive off an f10 520d recently and you're only ever aware it's a diesel when you really drive it to the admittedly shorter red line. The way people go on in here sometimes you'd swear they were revving the guts out of their "smoother" older petrols constantly when in fact in certain circumstances the diesel would out perform the petrol equivalent.

I'm not being a diesel fanboi or anything, I drive a 4 cylinder diesel and I'm acutely aware that it's not the sort of engine you rev for the craic or to hear a roar - I'd go for a petrol myself if I had the choice and didn't need to travel that much - but there isn't the gulf between a decent modern diesel and "what used be nice cars".

unkel

MuppetCheck wrote: »

To be fair, I think they are a lot better than you make them out to be. I had my first drive off an f10 520d recently

I know they are a very good car. I suppose I'm just lamenting the demise of the powerful petrol car. Pretty much none are sold new in this country now.

MuppetCheck

unkel wrote: »

I know they are a very good car. I suppose I'm just lamenting the demise of the powerful petrol car. Pretty much none are sold new in this country now.

You can't even buy a decent 6 cylinder diesel version either a couple of years old! I tried in vein before giving in myself...I looked at it as the lesser of two evils:D

Mick ah

The thing about Irish people buying new cars, is that they don't need to, ever.

Japanese people however, thanks to emissions laws in Japan, practically have to.

Every year there's a glut of (exceptionally well spec'd) cars coming out of Japan. Cars that are probably many times better than what Irish people buy new, but "we" don't want them because they don't have a new plate.

Personally I'd never buy a new car, Even if I had the money. I'll let someone else be the guinea pig.

Shame.

Mick ah

Mick ah wrote: »

Personally I'd never buy a new car, Even if I had the money. I'll let someone else be the guinea pig.

Shame.

On the other hand no matter how good the 2nd hand car is you will never have the pleasure of having a brand new car, you can make sure its run in correctly, gets all its services on time (no worrying did the previous owner look after it) not a single dent, not a single tear or bit of wear on the interior etc etc.

I really dont like the tone some are talking towards new car buyers though. People calling them "bonkers" or guinea pigs" its extremely condescending and almost like people are suggesting someone buying a new car is lacking intelligence or something. Yet they expect them to buy the cars new so they can buy them 2nd hand.

Tea 1000

MuppetCheck wrote: »

To be fair, I think they are a lot better than you make them out to be. I had my first drive off an f10 520d recently and you're only ever aware it's a diesel when you really drive it to the admittedly shorter red line. The way people go on in here sometimes you'd swear they were revving the guts out of their "smoother" older petrols constantly when in fact in certain circumstances the diesel would out perform the petrol equivalent.

I'm not being a diesel fanboi or anything, I drive a 4 cylinder diesel and I'm acutely aware that it's not the sort of engine you rev for the craic or to hear a roar - I'd go for a petrol myself if I had the choice and didn't need to travel that much - but there isn't the gulf between a decent modern diesel and "what used be nice cars".

I agree. With more and more clamp-down on speed, more and more regular folk can't see the need in spending thousands on buying a quicker version of a car that's too quick to use fully in this country anyway.
We car nuts will know when and where to use a decent engine, but most people just don't.

unkel wrote: »

I know they are a very good car. I suppose I'm just lamenting the demise of the powerful petrol car. Pretty much none are sold new in this country now.

To be honest though, maybe there were never that many around to begin with. One of the biggest disappointing drives I've had was an E60 530i. So much promise, so little delivered. Completely underwhelming. Granted it was an earlier 231bhp version, but it wasn't anything like as nice as an E39 523i that I had driven shortly before. The 523i hadn't power in abundance either, just the overall character of the car helped. But the E60 530i was a moderately brisk comfortable saloon and nothing more really. And that's a sad thing to say about a 3 litre 6 cylinder petrol with well over 200bhp.
In fact I think you'd be better off with a 520d for the daily family runs and an E36 325i coupe for yourself with the difference!

galwaytt

I hear everyone. Both of you are all right. And both of you are all wrong.

Consider: I'm a petrolhead. I've had the good fortune to own a fair amount of nice cars, some new, most not. If they were investments, more were bad ones rather than good ones - but probably not in the order you think....

The most 'special' ones, the ones with the immediate emotive attraction..........were all used. Even when I had the cash for my then-dream car........I bought it used. Granted it was only 11 months old. But there again owner #1 took the big hit. But there was no fantastic money-saving idea behind it: it was just a cool colour.

Now, 13 years and (probably, too) many cars later my stable has settled down and the cars in the drive are all older than I'd ever thought they would be: 1990, 2001 and 2005. The '05 - our trustly old 2.2 Saab estate - I've tried to unload with no success, and we did a period of bangernomics. But when you get into the premium car - smell the leather, the comfort, the silence...........'twas easy to sell the bangernomic and sink some €€ into taxing it for a while instead.

But it's still an 'old' car, and this was brought home to me yesterday.

I had cause to go Galway - Cork - Galway for work, and was given the MD's new 132-reg Octavia Combi. Nothing like the sense of driving a new car. The newness is palpable, exciting.

So, all day I played with the touch-screen, the Bluetooth phone and Bluetooth audio. I played with the cruise and the crisp sharp climate control. I wondered at the sheer silence of the thing at 120kph. It has stop-start and wondrous dash. The door handles are damped and the doors clunk with that lovely airtight clunk...........the gas shocks on the rear hatch have that suction effect of brand new seals on impeccably chromed stanchions that you can actually ....hear...working !

Outside it had lovely 18" wheels that are bigger in diameter and width than any of my 3 Porsches ever were. It has brakes that would bounce you off the windscreen. It has mirrors that work and could pass as TV's....

It even had faux maple-wood effect in places, punctuated by Audi-esque polished alu trim. It had a dash in a so-called 'economy' car that would have been the wonder of the car shows when Audi launched my beloved TT 15 years ago. Even a Merc of that age would pale in comparison if I'm being honest - and I had a very new 01 E200K at one time............. All in all, it was a lovely place to be.

And it got me to thinking.....: isn't that 'just new' feeling fabulous ? Is that the 'hit' that a certain amount of people crave - as much as ladies oogling handbags or shoes on BT's window on a Saturday - and which they keep going back for ? A motoring........'addiction-to-new', if you like ? And who amongst us really, hasn't sat in a new anything and breathed it in and thought.........yeah, this would be lovely.... ?

And then I drove my Saab later that eve. It's still a peach of a car. And when new it must have been truly amazing. But I'd be lying if I didn't say when I got back in that the car was noisier than I remembered............that the a/c / climate wasn't as crisp or as quick to respond....that there was a squeak or three from....somewhere.....and whilst mine is always clean and uncluttered inside.......there was no whiff of newly-minted rubber and pvc still outgassing........and generally it was well.........well, it's not new, is it ?


And anyone who thinks new cars - even 'ordinary' ones have made no progress, or are somehow the equivalent of a 10 yr old Micra is really in denial. The fact of the matter is that cars - no, especially cars - make, and continue to make, progress. It is as assured and as predictable as the tide. And you cannot spoon that back out - no matter how big the teaspoon.

Mentally, I did the maths: I actually COULD buy one new - especially on 0% finance. But 26k is still a lot of money, and I'd be a bit daft to do that in the current climate - I have a few other priorities to look after, first. Looking at a friends 964 in the rain yesterday, or a 4k Boxster didn't help the argument either......especially at the knock-down prices they can be bought for now.

But, they'd still be.....'old' too.

So, I, we, need people like my boss to keep buying things new, so we can get them used, eventually. If we're lucky they'll be well-kept and we get a peach.

But I will get back behind the wheel of a new car again one day: dunno if it'll be big or small, expensive or cheap - but just not...........now.

I didn't even get to tell you the Octy averaged 49mpg and averaged 90kph over the day and probably cost a mere 1/3 of what my Saab does to tax.........

Tea 1000

galwaytt wrote: »

I hear everyone. Both of you are all right. And both of you are all wrong.

Consider: I'm a petrolhead. I've had the good fortune to own a fair amount of nice cars, some new, most not. If they were investments, more were bad ones rather than good ones - but probably not in the order you think....

The most 'special' ones, the ones with the immediate emotive attraction..........were all used. Even when I had the cash for my then-dream car........I bought it used. Granted it was only 11 months old. But there again owner #1 took the big hit. But there was no fantastic money-saving idea behind it: it was just a cool colour.

Now, 13 years and (probably, too) many cars later my stable has settled down and the cars in the drive are all older than I'd ever thought they would be: 1990, 2001 and 2005. The '05 - our trustly old 2.2 Saab estate - I've tried to unload with no success, and we did a period of bangernomics. But when you get into the premium car - smell the leather, the comfort, the silence...........'twas easy to sell the bangernomic and sink some €€ into taxing it for a while instead.

But it's still an 'old' car, and this was brought home to me yesterday.

I had cause to go Galway - Cork - Galway for work, and was given the MD's new 132-reg Octavia Combi. Nothing like the sense of driving a new car. The newness is palpable, exciting.

So, all day I played with the touch-screen, the Bluetooth phone and Bluetooth audio. I played with the cruise and the crisp sharp climate control. I wondered at the sheer silence of the thing at 120kph. It has stop-start and wondrous dash. The door handles are damped and the doors clunk with that lovely airtight clunk...........the gas shocks on the rear hatch have that suction effect of brand new seals on impeccably chromed stanchions that you can actually ....hear...working !

Outside it had lovely 18" wheels that are bigger in diameter and width than any of my 3 Porsches ever were. It has brakes that would bounce you off the windscreen. It has mirrors that work and could pass as TV's....

It even had faux maple-wood effect in places, punctuated by Audi-esque polished alu trim. It had a dash in a so-called 'economy' car that would have been the wonder of the car shows when Audi launched my beloved TT 15 years ago. Even a Merc of that age would pale in comparison if I'm being honest - and I had a very new 01 E200K at one time............. All in all, it was a lovely place to be.

And it got me to thinking.....: isn't that 'just new' feeling fabulous ? Is that the 'hit' that a certain amount of people crave - as much as ladies oogling handbags or shoes on BT's window on a Saturday - and which they keep going back for ? A motoring........'addiction-to-new', if you like ? And who amongst us really, hasn't sat in a new anything and breathed it in and thought.........yeah, this would be lovely.... ?

And then I drove my Saab later that eve. It's still a peach of a car. And when new it must have been truly amazing. But I'd be lying if I didn't say when I got back in that the car was noisier than I remembered............that the a/c / climate wasn't as crisp or as quick to respond....that there was a squeak or three from....somewhere.....and whilst mine is always clean and uncluttered inside.......there was no whiff of newly-minted rubber and pvc still outgassing........and generally it was well.........well, it's not new, is it ?


And anyone who thinks new cars - even 'ordinary' ones have made no progress, or are somehow the equivalent of a 10 yr old Micra is really in denial. The fact of the matter is that cars - no, especially cars - make, and continue to make, progress. It is as assured and as predictable as the tide. And you cannot spoon that back out - no matter how big the teaspoon.

Mentally, I did the maths: I actually COULD buy one new - especially on 0% finance. But 26k is still a lot of money, and I'd be a bit daft to do that in the current climate - I have a few other priorities to look after, first. Looking at a friends 964 in the rain yesterday, or a 4k Boxster didn't help the argument either......especially at the knock-down prices they can be bought for now.

But, they'd still be.....'old' too.

So, I, we, need people like my boss to keep buying things new, so we can get them used, eventually. If we're lucky they'll be well-kept and we get a peach.

But I will get back behind the wheel of a new car again one day: dunno if it'll be big or small, expensive or cheap - but just not...........now.

I didn't even get to tell you the Octy averaged 49mpg and averaged 90kph over the day and probably cost a mere 1/3 of what my Saab does to tax.........

Good post... just ease up on the Octy lovin'... Feeling queasy here.
Anyhoo, I get what you mean totally.
And I get what others are saying. There's something massively satisfying about finding a peach of a thirteen year old car for less than a grand that's great to drive and you can feel all smug in your bargain, knowing that you get what most people miss that makes that car special.
And there's nothing like that feeling of opening the door of a car in a showroom that no one has owned before you, no history to check, no wear and tear to worry about, and every squeak means take it back to sort it out hassle free. The smell, the "how far they've come" feeling, everything.
There's also everything in between. Something for everyone you might say!!

I'll say this though, there was an M5 for sale on carzone, 8 months old or something, 3k kms or there abouts for 140k roughly. No friggin way am I going to fork out 140k on some performance car that 10 sales guy, 15 mechanics, and all their friends have had a burn in. I'll stump up the extra 15 or 20k for brand new, and collect from Munich. Or, I'll save myself 100k and wait for a 3 year old one. Either way, there's that threshold that I could never justify! The between two stools category!